HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Philadelphia Flyers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Zherdev

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-24-2011, 03:13 PM
  #101
HoverCarle*
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,859
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to HoverCarle*
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cartsiephan View Post
If you have to trade his cap space to get "that guy" who would put the Flyers in a position to roll Nodl-Richards-????? as a 3rd line who would match up against any other top line I would think Homer would have to get it done.

It is like the depth on the blueline, they did not necessarily need the scoring from a 3rd pair, just a couple guys who could sustain regular shifts aginst other teams so Pronger and Timonen could take advantage of possible mismatches along the way.
How much money does "That guy" make? We have a bit of cap space, and Carcillo could also easily be dealt for another 1 mil, plus he is a RFA not UFA like Zherdev making non playoff teams more likely to trade for him

HoverCarle* is offline  
Old
01-24-2011, 03:22 PM
  #102
Cartsiephan*
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,488
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hovercraft View Post
How much money does "That guy" make? We have a bit of cap space, and Carcillo could also easily be dealt for another 1 mil, plus he is a RFA not UFA like Zherdev making non playoff teams more likely to trade for him
It would have to match the obvious prorated salary of Zherdev and Leighton most likely. So if I am playing the cap game correctly with the extra $300,000 cap space available they could find a guy for @$2.5-3mill max. That is why a guy like Glencross is so interesting @$1.2mill.

Cartsiephan* is offline  
Old
01-24-2011, 03:25 PM
  #103
HoverCarle*
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,859
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to HoverCarle*
Glencross can pretty much be covered salary wise by just Carcillo, which makes him even more interesting.

HoverCarle* is offline  
Old
01-24-2011, 03:33 PM
  #104
Cartsiephan*
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,488
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hovercraft View Post
Glencross can pretty much be covered salary wise by just Carcillo, which makes him even more interesting.
Honestly, I am not ready to be rid of Carcillo as of yet. He is a perfect guy to have on a 4th line wing.

Cartsiephan* is offline  
Old
01-24-2011, 03:39 PM
  #105
HoverCarle*
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,859
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to HoverCarle*
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cartsiephan View Post
Honestly, I am not ready to be rid of Carcillo as of yet. He is a perfect guy to have on a 4th line wing.
He is too weak defensively for me. He just runs around doing nothing constructive most of the time, and it seems Laviolette feels the same lately.

Obviously I would rather Carcillo than Shelley, but Shelley is not going to be traded or waived or anything and we'll have to live with that

HoverCarle* is offline  
Old
01-24-2011, 03:47 PM
  #106
Jester
Registered User
 
Jester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: St. Andrews
Country: Scotland
Posts: 34,075
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cartsiephan View Post
Honestly, I am not ready to be rid of Carcillo as of yet. He is a perfect guy to have on a 4th line wing.
Not really. There's a reason he was a healthy scratch in the playoffs at times last year.

Jester is offline  
Old
01-24-2011, 03:48 PM
  #107
phillyfanatic
Registered User
 
phillyfanatic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Ottawa, ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,631
vCash: 500
I am not in favour of turning the Richards line into a pure shutdown line with two "defensive guys". I think if we got rid of our three scoring lines that we have now (With Zherdev) you take away our advantage. If you want to build a pure energy line/shutdown line - look to the fourth line. Glencross-Betts-Powe or something like that. Hell, if you really want to roll four lines Glencross-Madden-Powe works for me

Hartnell-Briere-Leino
Giroux-Carter-JVR
Zherdev-Richards-Nodl
Glencross-Madden-Powe

I think Madden and Glencross can be had for cheap and are available. Madden ups our FO % plus our PK. Glencross can score and replace anyone on the top 3 lines if needed. Betts becomes your scratch and Carcillo is gone, Walker is in the minors and this easily fits under the cap.

phillyfanatic is offline  
Old
01-24-2011, 04:03 PM
  #108
DrinkFightFlyers
Grave Before Shave
 
DrinkFightFlyers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 12,728
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to DrinkFightFlyers
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hovercraft View Post
Glencross can pretty much be covered salary wise by just Carcillo, which makes him even more interesting.
If I am reading capgeek correctly, the maximum cap hit the Flyers can take on without shedding any salary is almost $2 mil, so there is potential to acquire Glencross without losing anyone on the roster, though I'm not sure what type of picks/prospects would be wanted if no roster player were going out West.

EDIT: Someone would be getting waived in that scenario though because it would put us over the limit. So either way, cap space is not an issue in considering Glencross.

DrinkFightFlyers is offline  
Old
01-24-2011, 04:40 PM
  #109
Spongolium*
Potato Magician
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Bridgend,UK
Country: Wales
Posts: 8,653
vCash: 500
I wouldn't be so hasty to get rid of betts. Thats not the way the organisation works. The guy gives his all, every night of the week

Spongolium* is offline  
Old
01-24-2011, 04:47 PM
  #110
LI Fly Guy
Registered User
 
LI Fly Guy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Long Island
Country: United States
Posts: 496
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by phillyfanatic View Post
Betts becomes your scratch
NOPE

LI Fly Guy is offline  
Old
01-24-2011, 05:45 PM
  #111
esuhock22
Registered User
 
esuhock22's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Country: United States
Posts: 117
vCash: 500
I am a fan of don't fix something that isn't broken. Mess with the chemistry of this team at your own risk. Nodl can be frustrating at times, but who even knows if he goes on a little streak and ends up being a 15+ goals scorer, which isn't that unlikely, especially if he continues to play with Richards. As for Zherdev I don't get all the complaining. I wasn't expecting the hardest working guy on the team and he certainly isn't, but I feel he gets watched under a microscope while others get away with being lazy some nights. He has been back checking a lot more recently and one thing I don't think he gets any credit for is how skillfully he handles the puck along the boards during a breakout. Right now I'd like to see the Z-C-G line stick together for a couple of games and see what they can do. I also wouldn't mind seeing him on our struggling PP more often. All in all though I really can't complain.

esuhock22 is offline  
Old
01-24-2011, 06:13 PM
  #112
dingbathero
No Jam? How about PB
 
dingbathero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: St. John's, NL
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,772
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spongolium View Post
I wouldn't be so hasty to get rid of betts. Thats not the way the organisation works. The guy gives his all, every night of the week
Couple of weeks ago I mentioned getting rid of Betts b/c of his shoulder. Madden is older but better @ FO's - Glencross would be a good fit, I think he'd excel here.

Carbomb most likely wont get used in the playoffs. So he is 'expendable' in a sense - altho it seems when the teams needs some energy he is instant. Almost like a snort of ****.

HBL
JVR-Roo-Carter
Nodl - Cannon - Z
Larose?Torres?Fiddler?Carbomb?Glencross? - Madden/Betts - Powe

Keep Z
Walker in the AHL


Last edited by dingbathero: 01-24-2011 at 06:28 PM.
dingbathero is offline  
Old
01-24-2011, 06:20 PM
  #113
Amateur Hour
Registered User
 
Amateur Hour's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Negadelphia
Posts: 6,507
vCash: 500
Do not trade Zherdev (especially not to an Eastern Conference team in the playoff hunt). That is all.

Amateur Hour is offline  
Old
01-24-2011, 06:29 PM
  #114
HoverCarle*
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,859
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to HoverCarle*
Betts wont be going anywhere, but he can shift to LW if we get a better faceoff option on the 4th line

HoverCarle* is offline  
Old
01-24-2011, 10:56 PM
  #115
phlocky
Registered User
 
phlocky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 6,157
vCash: 500
Unless we are making a move to improve our team for this playoff run, we won't be trading Zherdev. A 3rd or 4th rnd pick (hell, even a 2nd TBH) isn't valuable enough for us to hurt our current team and lessen our chances of winning the cup.

phlocky is offline  
Old
01-25-2011, 06:42 AM
  #116
JDinkalage Morgoone
U of South Flurrida
 
JDinkalage Morgoone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: 308 Negra Arroyo Ln.
Country: Uzbekistan
Posts: 12,218
vCash: 500
Trade Betts? Dude is a stud defensively and a prime PKer. He's like Lappy without the edge.

__________________
"Help was not promised, lovely girl. Only death."
JDinkalage Morgoone is offline  
Old
01-25-2011, 07:40 AM
  #117
Bob Clarke Fan Club
Registered User
 
Bob Clarke Fan Club's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,985
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Not really. There's a reason he was a healthy scratch in the playoffs at times last year.


Yeah from what I understood, he wasn't healthy. He would be a perfect 4th liner on this team IMO.

Bob Clarke Fan Club is offline  
Old
01-25-2011, 07:47 AM
  #118
Bob Clarke Fan Club
Registered User
 
Bob Clarke Fan Club's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,985
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by phlocky View Post
Unless we are making a move to improve our team for this playoff run, we won't be trading Zherdev. A 3rd or 4th rnd pick (hell, even a 2nd TBH) isn't valuable enough for us to hurt our current team and lessen our chances of winning the cup.



Writers that talk about us losing him for nothing and Homer wanting to gain an asset at the break for him are writing out of their *****. We gave up nothing for him, the asset is a Stanley Cup. Can't replace this kind of skill at the deadline for under 2 million. This guy has one of the highest skill levels on this team and he's getting better and better as he meshes with his new teammates. I don't care what he's done in the past, he's way too good to dish off for a pick when we aren't in rebuild.

Bob Clarke Fan Club is offline  
Old
01-25-2011, 07:56 AM
  #119
Valhoun*
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: West Chester, PA
Posts: 10,311
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Valhoun*
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Clarke Fan Club View Post
Can't replace this kind of skill at the deadline for under 2 million.
Why do you think that this team would only be able to affoard a 2M dollar contract at the deadline?

You know that the Cap is calculated daily, right?

Valhoun* is offline  
Old
01-25-2011, 08:40 AM
  #120
Bob Clarke Fan Club
Registered User
 
Bob Clarke Fan Club's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,985
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Valhoun View Post
Why do you think that this team would only be able to affoard a 2M dollar contract at the deadline?

You know that the Cap is calculated daily, right?



Yeah I've been here way too long not to Val, I hear what you're saying though. Should have worded differently. I don't see us replacing him with a better player, let alone at that price. The guy can finish and he's a depth luxury on a good expiring deal. If we wanted to trade him and ramp up the dollars for a better player I could live with it but I really don't see it happening.

Bob Clarke Fan Club is offline  
Old
01-25-2011, 08:47 AM
  #121
Cartsiephan*
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,488
vCash: 500
Not sure why everyone is so infatuated with Zherdev, nice player but for his career including in the KHL he has 1 career playoff point. Let's just assume that Carter does not show up in the playoffs, now if both Carter and Zherdev are not scoring what else are they bringing?

Carter has done better so my hope is that he will step up in the playoffs this year with Giroux, but playoffs are won with guys who bring more to the table. Nodl in less games has 18pts to Zherdev's 19pts and is more evenly dispersed with 9goals and 9 assists. I by no means am saying that Nodl is a better goal scorer or as talented as Zherdev in his skills, but sometimes we put too much stock in the flash and forget that playoff games are won with guys who will do anything to win and play solid two-way hockey.

This is why a guy like Glencross is such a nice fit or someone who is a similar mold. He is a PK guy who plays a more playoffs style of hockey and is more willing to grind each shift much like Nodl and Richards. He is also a defensively minded forward who if Laviolette is going to start matching up lines is going to be important that each player on that line knows his job.

For all those who are going to claim that we need three scoring lines, blah, blah, blah, blah.....how many times have the Caps made it into the SCF's after leading the league in goals over the last couple years? None. Why? Because they are not a good defensive team. If you can keep Zherdev for emergency purposes or if JvR goes cold, fine, but otherwise he is not a player who should be kept for sentimental purposes or because people are afraid we will lose the scoring punch.


So:
HBL line: proven it can play against anyone and has been successful in the playoffs.

JvR-Carter-Giroux:has shown some real promise. JvR has been really strong on the boards, started scoring, and has amped up his physical game. Carter has improved with Giroux, these guys should be kept on this line to see how it plays out.

Nodl-Richards-Glencross:While people may look at this as a defensive line, it is also a line that can score some goals. The grit that a line like this can provide supercedes the theory of skill with more playoff like hard work which is needed in a long series when skill lines dry up.

Carcillo-Betts-Powe: Obviously a 4th line with two guys who take on some PK minutes and Carcillo to add 4th line energy.

Cartsiephan* is offline  
Old
01-25-2011, 08:51 AM
  #122
jb**
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Planet Lovetron
Country: Italy
Posts: 8,556
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spongolium View Post
I wouldn't be so hasty to get rid of betts. Thats not the way the organisation works. The guy gives his all, every night of the week
yes he gives his all but sometimes your all isnt good enough. His game has not been good imo. Whatever the reason i woud like an improvment on the 4th lien center. Either move betts to wing or as someone said he can be an extra guy since he makes peanuts.

Madden would be good as he has the capability to move up on the other lines short term. No one on the 4th line imo has that capability. It will be hard to do but if they can somehow acquire a guy who is 4th line on this team but can move up that would be a bonus. You cant anticipate injuries. Having no depth on the farm makes it important to acquire a players who is cpabale of playing several roles.

jb** is offline  
Old
01-25-2011, 09:02 AM
  #123
chimrichalds18
the key
 
chimrichalds18's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 2,773
vCash: 500
We can talk about what we want, but Betts isn't going anywhere. He's got his spot in the lineup, they're not going to change that. He plays tough minutes, he's a good 4th liner...at the most he'll be changed to wing. He's defensively responsible, smart, and big...you want/need a guy like that on your team.

chimrichalds18 is offline  
Old
01-25-2011, 09:06 AM
  #124
jb**
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Planet Lovetron
Country: Italy
Posts: 8,556
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Clarke Fan Club View Post
Writers that talk about us losing him for nothing and Homer wanting to gain an asset at the break for him are writing out of their *****. We gave up nothing for him, the asset is a Stanley Cup. Can't replace this kind of skill at the deadline for under 2 million. This guy has one of the highest skill levels on this team and he's getting better and better as he meshes with his new teammates. I don't care what he's done in the past, he's way too good to dish off for a pick when we aren't in rebuild.
agreed. They really have nothing to gain by moving him unless it was part of a bigger deal. If they were not a legit cup contending team, fine move him. Injuries will happen, you need guys who can score. While a long shot i wouldnt be shocked to see him back, depending on how it plays out the rest of the year. I cant see a team giving him a big deal.

I am telling you Kaberle is going to be a flyer.

jb** is offline  
Old
01-25-2011, 10:06 AM
  #125
phillyfanatic
Registered User
 
phillyfanatic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Ottawa, ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,631
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cartsiephan View Post
Not sure why everyone is so infatuated with Zherdev, nice player but for his career including in the KHL he has 1 career playoff point. Let's just assume that Carter does not show up in the playoffs, now if both Carter and Zherdev are not scoring what else are they bringing?
No offense, but I stopped reading here. I just can't go through another Carter sucks discussion.

phillyfanatic is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:10 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.