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Rob Ray: Melnyk upset that Murray unwilling to go behind the bench

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Old
01-27-2011, 02:52 PM
  #176
wilfred
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Originally Posted by Urkie View Post
We'll just have to agree to disagree. I feel like the shutdown D pairing was more important. Especially since Karlsson was already starting to really breakout last year.

You're probably right though. It really wouldn't matter either way. We'd still be in a ****** spot right now...
It's funny that NJ biggest need is a PMD. How about a trade.

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Old
01-27-2011, 02:53 PM
  #177
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I swear I could leave these boards for 6 months come back and not miss a beat. It's the same arguments again and again...

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Old
01-27-2011, 02:57 PM
  #178
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Originally Posted by Kickabrat View Post
But can you not see that fixing it with a cupboard full of prospects that are actually worth something and cap space to spare will make the next GM's job that much easier to build a team from than if the new GM stepped in with Brian Lee as the team's top prospect?
If I drafted #9 overall and #15 overall, I'd have some pretty good prospects as well.

This team could also be a lot younger and faster if it still had Vermette, Meszaros, Eaves and Corvo (over Gonchar).

Drafting has always been the key to Senators sucess, but so has been building with young, skilled, fast players who are coachcable and team oriented, guys like Alfie, Redden, Hossa, Phillips, Fisher, Neil.

We don't have that now, this is the biggest culture change this team needs and is the #1 reason we need to get rid of Murray.

Remember his "we want good people here" speeches after Emery, and he goes out and signs Kovalev, Kuba and Leclaire...great team players and real quality people he has there.

Murray's been a bomb. Thank you for Karlsson, but after that he's been a bomb

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01-27-2011, 02:58 PM
  #179
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Originally Posted by Kickabrat View Post
But can you not see that fixing it with a cupboard full of prospects that are actually worth something and cap space to spare will make the next GM's job that much easier to build a team from than if the new GM stepped in with Brian Lee as the team's top prospect?
Well, it wasn't really Murray's job to do that though. His job wasn't to rebuild and restock, it was to win and he hasn't done it. Yeah, maybe he was always set up to be the fall guy but I think more people would support a new GM that was given the task of rebuilding this team.

Do the prospects and cap space help? Sure, but he also had a semi decent core to work with when he took over and failed to get them a good coach and he failed to surround them with a good supporting cast.

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Old
01-27-2011, 03:03 PM
  #180
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Originally Posted by wilfred View Post
It's funny that NJ biggest need is a PMD. How about a trade.


Yeah it is kind of funny isn't it?

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Old
01-27-2011, 03:03 PM
  #181
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuna99 View Post
If I drafted #9 overall and #15 overall, I'd have some pretty good prospects as well.

This team could also be a lot younger and faster if it still had Vermette, Meszaros, Eaves and Corvo (over Gonchar).

Drafting has always been the key to Senators sucess, but so has been building with young, skilled, fast players who are coachcable and team oriented, guys like Alfie, Redden, Hossa, Phillips, Fisher, Neil.

We don't have that now, this is the biggest culture change this team needs and is the #1 reason we need to get rid of Murray.

Remember his "we want good people here" speeches after Emery, and he goes out and signs Kovalev, Kuba and Leclaire...great team players and real quality people he has there.

Murray's been a bomb. Thank you for Karlsson, but after that he's been a bomb
You got to be kidding me...blaming Murray for poor drafting?

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Old
01-27-2011, 03:09 PM
  #182
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Originally Posted by guyzeur View Post
You got to be kidding me...blaming Murray for poor drafting?
"we are a playoff team for sure, a top 5 team in the East"

Murray is a failure, look at our record. He has completly turned this team over from Muckler's days, starting with trading away our great young players and good cap hits like Vermette, Corvo, Eaves and Meszaros.

Now we are stuck with old players with bloated contracts to replace these guys.

Vermette = Kovalev
Corvo = Gonchar
Kuba = Meszaros

Every single one of these moves was a failure, it's that simple

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Old
01-27-2011, 03:14 PM
  #183
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Originally Posted by Tuna99 View Post
"we are a playoff team for sure, a top 5 team in the East"

Murray is a failure, look at our record. He has completly turned this team over from Muckler's days, starting with trading away our great young players and good cap hits like Vermette, Corvo, Eaves and Meszaros.

Now we are stuck with old players with bloated contracts to replace these guys.

Vermette = Kovalev
Corvo = Gonchar
Kuba = Meszaros

Every single one of these moves was a failure, it's that simple
Yikes!

As if you hadn't been doing enough before to make yourself look clueless and uninformed...

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Old
01-27-2011, 03:52 PM
  #184
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Tuna, making sense is frowned upon in these parts.

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Old
01-27-2011, 04:19 PM
  #185
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuna99 View Post
If I drafted #9 overall and #15 overall, I'd have some pretty good prospects as well.

This team could also be a lot younger and faster if it still had Vermette, Meszaros, Eaves and Corvo (over Gonchar).

Drafting has always been the key to Senators sucess, but so has been building with young, skilled, fast players who are coachcable and team oriented, guys like Alfie, Redden, Hossa, Phillips, Fisher, Neil.

We don't have that now, this is the biggest culture change this team needs and is the #1 reason we need to get rid of Murray.

Remember his "we want good people here" speeches after Emery, and he goes out and signs Kovalev, Kuba and Leclaire...great team players and real quality people he has there.

Murray's been a bomb. Thank you for Karlsson, but after that he's been a bomb
Muckler got to pick 9th overall and yet failed.

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Old
01-27-2011, 04:23 PM
  #186
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuna99 View Post
If I drafted #9 overall and #15 overall, I'd have some pretty good prospects as well.

This team could also be a lot younger and faster if it still had Vermette, Meszaros, Eaves and Corvo (over Gonchar).

Drafting has always been the key to Senators sucess, but so has been building with young, skilled, fast players who are coachcable and team oriented, guys like Alfie, Redden, Hossa, Phillips, Fisher, Neil.

We don't have that now, this is the biggest culture change this team needs and is the #1 reason we need to get rid of Murray.

Remember his "we want good people here" speeches after Emery, and he goes out and signs Kovalev, Kuba and Leclaire...great team players and real quality people he has there.

Murray's been a bomb. Thank you for Karlsson, but after that he's been a bomb
Glad you could, Muckler couldn't manage it.

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Old
01-27-2011, 04:24 PM
  #187
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Originally Posted by Tuna99 View Post
If I drafted #9 overall and #15 overall, I'd have some pretty good prospects as well.
He drafted 9th and 18th.

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Old
01-27-2011, 04:25 PM
  #188
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuna99 View Post
"we are a playoff team for sure, a top 5 team in the East"

Murray is a failure, look at our record. He has completly turned this team over from Muckler's days, starting with trading away our great young players and good cap hits like Vermette, Corvo, Eaves and Meszaros.

Now we are stuck with old players with bloated contracts to replace these guys.

Vermette = Kovalev
Corvo = Gonchar
Kuba = Meszaros

Every single one of these moves was a failure, it's that simple
Anyone know of a Hockey forum where people actually know what they're talking about? The more the Sens lose the dumber some fans get.

I hate being condescending but some of this stuff is so far off from making sense its crazy.

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Old
01-27-2011, 04:41 PM
  #189
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuna99 View Post
If I drafted #9 overall and #15 overall, I'd have some pretty good prospects as well.

This team could also be a lot younger and faster if it still had Vermette, Meszaros, Eaves and Corvo (over Gonchar).

Drafting has always been the key to Senators sucess, but so has been building with young, skilled, fast players who are coachcable and team oriented, guys like Alfie, Redden, Hossa, Phillips, Fisher, Neil.

We don't have that now, this is the biggest culture change this team needs and is the #1 reason we need to get rid of Murray.

Remember his "we want good people here" speeches after Emery, and he goes out and signs Kovalev, Kuba and Leclaire...great team players and real quality people he has there.

Murray's been a bomb. Thank you for Karlsson, but after that he's been a bomb
Vermette sucks this year

Meszaros was lazy and and still overpaid by far.

Eaves is a drunk underacheiver

and Corvo wanted out and no where near equals Gonchar

Murray a bomb drafting?

You sir have no credibility

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Old
01-27-2011, 04:42 PM
  #190
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Originally Posted by Urkie View Post
Well, to be fair, the salary cap forced guys like Chara and Havlat out of Ottawa but Muckler still put a team together the very next year that got to the finals. Murray failed to put a team together that could even make the playoffs 2 out of the 4 years.

And the thing about Murray is that he didn't become GM to just restock the shelves. He became GM because he told us he could get us a cup unlike his predecesor. I understand things happen and circumstances change but there's really no excuse for what we've seen 2 out of the last 4 years.
correction, 2 of 3 years

obviously you can't understand.

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Old
01-27-2011, 04:57 PM
  #191
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Originally Posted by Holdurbreathe View Post
correction, 2 of 3 years

obviously you can't understand.
Oh yeah...we're going to somehow make the playoffs this year? Good to know...

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Old
01-27-2011, 07:51 PM
  #192
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuna99 View Post
If I drafted #9 overall and #15 overall, I'd have some pretty good prospects as well.

This team could also be a lot younger and faster if it still had Vermette, Meszaros, Eaves and Corvo (over Gonchar).

Drafting has always been the key to Senators sucess, but so has been building with young, skilled, fast players who are coachcable and team oriented, guys like Alfie, Redden, Hossa, Phillips, Fisher, Neil.

We don't have that now, this is the biggest culture change this team needs and is the #1 reason we need to get rid of Murray.

Remember his "we want good people here" speeches after Emery, and he goes out and signs Kovalev, Kuba and Leclaire...great team players and real quality people he has there.

Murray's been a bomb. Thank you for Karlsson, but after that he's been a bomb
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuna99 View Post
"we are a playoff team for sure, a top 5 team in the East"

Murray is a failure, look at our record. He has completly turned this team over from Muckler's days, starting with trading away our great young players and good cap hits like Vermette, Corvo, Eaves and Meszaros.

Now we are stuck with old players with bloated contracts to replace these guys.

Vermette = Kovalev
Corvo = Gonchar
Kuba = Meszaros

Every single one of these moves was a failure, it's that simple
I'm very confident to say that you are probably the person who understand the less this business of hockey on this board. Ouch. So much wrong again in your posts. Not even worth starting to fix all that crap, would take too much time

Vermette, Corvo, Eaves and Meszaros, are you freaking kidding me? Those players have been replaced by Regin, Karlsson, Foligno and Campoli (although they are mis-used for the most part)

The difference is that before we had players like Heatley, Alfredsson (in his prime), Chara, Redden, Havlat, Hasek/Emery, and a coach like Murray... to make those Vermette-Corvo-Eaves-Meszaros look better. Now, Regin, Karlsson, Foligno and Campoli simply don't have as much in front of them to make them look better.

You want to know exactly what happened to this team?

http://hfboards.com/showpost.php?p=3...5&postcount=12


Last edited by Xspyrit: 01-27-2011 at 08:02 PM.
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Old
01-27-2011, 08:57 PM
  #193
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Originally Posted by pt_mck View Post
]Vermette sucks this year
Meszaros was lazy and and still overpaid by far.

Eaves is a drunk underacheiver

and Corvo wanted out and no where near equals Gonchar

Murray a bomb drafting?

You sir have no credibility
Vermette sure sucks ,mind you if he were with the Sens he would be 2nd over all in points with 27 , just behind Alfie and Karlsson, tied for 1st with 28 points each.

And what's all this about Eaves being a drunk? Thats a new one,anything to put him down I guess, but anyway with 13 goals, on the Sens he would be 2nd in goals tied with Fisher and 1 behind Alfie who has 14.

And Meszaros, at +28 leads the entire league in plus/minus.

Yeah,thankfully we dont have these worthless bums anymore.

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Old
01-27-2011, 11:22 PM
  #194
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Originally Posted by Xspyrit View Post
I'm very confident to say that you are probably the person who understand the less this business of hockey on this board. Ouch. So much wrong again in your posts. Not even worth starting to fix all that crap, would take too much time
What now you don't have time to make the same empty arguments you've been making for the past few months?

Quote:
Vermette, Corvo, Eaves and Meszaros, are you freaking kidding me? Those players have been replaced by Regin, Karlsson, Foligno and Campoli (although they are mis-used for the most part)
Replaced by and worse than. Aside from the fact that Karlsson was a draft pick and was not brought in to fill any hole left by someone else. Nice try though.

Quote:
The difference is that before we had players like Heatley, Alfredsson (in his prime), Chara, Redden, Havlat, Hasek/Emery, and a coach like Murray... to make those Vermette-Corvo-Eaves-Meszaros look better. Now, Regin, Karlsson, Foligno and Campoli simply don't have as much in front of them to make them look better.
What? Vermette put up better numbers in Columbus than he ever did here. Those players looked better because they ARE better. They still are too. Again, leave Karlsson out of the discussion. Nobody was moved to make room for Karlsson.

Quote:
You want to know exactly what happened to this team?

http://hfboards.com/showpost.php?p=3...5&postcount=12
Maybe I'll read your link some other time. What happened to this team is quite clear to me, and apparently a couple of other people as well. Muckler did his damage, and Murray has done his.

Why can't you people just accept that Murray has been a gigantic failure?

There is no business in the world where you would look at a "company" that has maxed out revenues, and is 27th in a 30 business market and call it a success.

Even if you promise your boss at McDonalds that you have some real good potatoes and cows coming along in the next few years, which is a promise you can't really make anyway, when you take a product, and you drive it from mediocre to abysmal, you have failed at your job, and you will get fired.

Like telling Apu at the Quikee Mart that the ice we have now may be a bit salty, and well...maybe has some piss in it, but don't worry, the ice in a few years will be ok...so let's just forget about today.

Life / business doesn't work that way. It is a result driven industry, and Bryan Murray has taken a playoff team and mismanaged it into a joke that should be in a lottery position by the end of the year.

He needs to go. Any CEO in any industry that produced these kinds of results would be turfed instantly, and rightfully so.

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Old
01-27-2011, 11:26 PM
  #195
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Originally Posted by pepty View Post
Vermette sure sucks ,mind you if he were with the Sens he would be 2nd over all in points with 27 , just behind Alfie and Karlsson, tied for 1st with 28 points each.

And what's all this about Eaves being a drunk? Thats a new one,anything to put him down I guess, but anyway with 13 goals, on the Sens he would be 2nd in goals tied with Fisher and 1 behind Alfie who has 14.

And Meszaros, at +28 leads the entire league in plus/minus.

Yeah,thankfully we dont have these worthless bums anymore.
I love when people take player's statistics from other teams and compare them to players in Ottawa...it's such a fallacious argument that pointing it out is enough of an embarrassment for the poster, let alone compounding on it.

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Old
01-27-2011, 11:38 PM
  #196
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I disagree. People that try to gloss over a former player's current stats as insignificant when they are sorely missed on the other hand...

Weak sauce.

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Old
01-27-2011, 11:42 PM
  #197
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Originally Posted by John Holmes View Post
I disagree. People that try to gloss over a former player's current stats as insignificant when they are sorely missed on the other hand...

Weak sauce.
You're reading comprehension is so low I don't even know how you can properly navigate the internet...

What I said: ... saying "Vermette sure sucks ,mind you if he were with the Sens he would be 2nd over all in points with 27 , just behind Alfie and Karlsson, tied for 1st with 28 points each." is ridiculous because you can't know for sure how many points Vermette would have if he were with the team.

Comparing players who are in vastly different situations to the current team isn't just ridiculous, it's a fallacious argument through and through.

Hope you can understand now.

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Old
01-27-2011, 11:52 PM
  #198
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Vermette would probably have 15 points right about now in Ottawa.

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Old
01-27-2011, 11:53 PM
  #199
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Originally Posted by John Holmes View Post

Why can't you people just accept that Murray has been a gigantic failure?
The combination of the deck that Muckler left for Murray to deal, the Heatley cluftersuck, and Emery's xxxl fitted hat size understandably garner a little empathy. For the same reason that the world didn't blame Hirohito for a nuclear attack, some choose not to put Murray alone in front of the firing squad.

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Old
01-28-2011, 12:07 AM
  #200
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I can't wait until the Sens fan base grows up.

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