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Friday Face-Offs, 2/4- Nashville @ the Trade Deadline

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02-04-2011, 06:20 AM
  #1
David Singleton
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Friday Face-Offs, 2/4- Nashville @ the Trade Deadline

A look at the Predators needs and their ability to address them come trade deadline time.

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02-04-2011, 09:41 AM
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Originally Posted by David Singleton View Post
A look at the Predators needs and their ability to address them come trade deadline time.
I think we're in a good position to make a helpful move at the dl, and I think we have expendable assets in our system in order to improve the team.

With that said, Poile is more of a "add some depth for Trotz to scratch" deadline dealer. I'll be surprised if we make any moves, given that we're handcuffed by Lombardi's contract at this point.

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02-04-2011, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by barrytrotzsneck View Post
I think we're in a good position to make a helpful move at the dl, and I think we have expendable assets in our system in order to improve the team.

With that said, Poile is more of a "add some depth for Trotz to scratch" deadline dealer. I'll be surprised if we make any moves, given that we're handcuffed by Lombardi's contract at this point.
My point is that Nashville is certainly not hampered by Lombardi's contract presuming the budget is the midpoint of the cap.

If they wanted to acquire Tim Connolly, or someone in that price range, it would not be an issue even if they dealt no one from the current roster.

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02-04-2011, 11:26 AM
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Nashville has quite a bit of cap space to make a move. Currently they have 892,070 under the cap which does not include rookie bonuses which have not been met. 70% of the season has passed thus 70% of the contracts out there have been paid for.

$892,070 * 1.7 = 1,516,519. Then you add on what ever contracts you trade or send down to Milwaukee and that's the level of contract you can pick up that salary for a trade.

Currently, Nashville has as many anchors as Milwaukee has on the shoulders of their jerseys.

Dumont is a 4th liner who needs a change and a NTC

Lombardi could go on LTIR and doesn't have a NTC

If Dumont was willing to waive the NTC that's 4 million. (Which we were expecting to put on Suter)

Lombardi if he's done could be traded to a cap max team so they can LTIR him for cap space.

There are too many defenseman prospects in the system. Too many goalies in the system.

Dekanich could be a chip simply because he's a UFA who needs a home.

I'm not worried. I will worry after the trade deadline.

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02-04-2011, 11:39 AM
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Originally Posted by BigFatCat999 View Post
Nashville has quite a bit of cap space to make a move. Currently they have 892,070 under the cap which does not include rookie bonuses which have not been met. 70% of the season has passed thus 70% of the contracts out there have been paid for.

$892,070 * 1.7 = 1,516,519.
I think you have the math wrong. If $892,070 is equal to the 30% of the season remaining, then the annual amount we could afford is $2.97 million. (Think of it this way, 30% of the season remaining. 30% of $2.97 million equals $891,000.)

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02-04-2011, 11:59 AM
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Lombardi could go on LTIR and doesn't have a NTC

Lombardi if he's done could be traded to a cap max team so they can LTIR him for cap space.
I remember seeing an article not too long ago stating that due to Lombardi's previous concussion history, he was not eligible for insurance. Meaning, the team would have to absorb the full cost of his salary while he is out. Basically, the 3+ million we are spending on him away from the ice is hampering us (our team's own internal budget). It is real money that ownership can not afford to spend again on another player...

Make sense? Or am I full of poo?

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02-04-2011, 12:34 PM
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Originally Posted by BigFatCat999 View Post
Nashville has quite a bit of cap space to make a move. Currently they have 892,070 under the cap which does not include rookie bonuses which have not been met. 70% of the season has passed thus 70% of the contracts out there have been paid for.
BFC, instead of dealing with these percentages, you really want to head to CapGeek's Daily Cap Tracker. There you will find the daily cap hit for every player as well as being able to "pick the date of the trade" which will tell you how many days left the Predators will be responsible for.

Using your binky Iginla as an example, if Nashville were to acquire him the day of the trade deadline, Nashville would be responsible for 41 days of his contract.

Iginla get's paid $37,634 per day, so Nashville would ultimately pay for $1,542,994 of his $7 million contract this season in that scenario.

Nashville could actually afford that (for this season) with no other roster moves beyond demoting Meuller and Halischuk, but it's not happening for lots of reasons.

You get the idea.

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$892,070 * 1.7 = 1,516,519. Then you add on what ever contracts you trade or send down to Milwaukee and that's the level of contract you can pick up that salary for a trade.

Currently, Nashville has as many anchors as Milwaukee has on the shoulders of their jerseys.

Dumont is a 4th liner who needs a change and a NTC

Lombardi could go on LTIR and doesn't have a NTC

If Dumont was willing to waive the NTC that's 4 million. (Which we were expecting to put on Suter)

Lombardi if he's done could be traded to a cap max team so they can LTIR him for cap space.
I don't think there's any chance that Dumont's moved and there is no budgetary reason to do so for this season.

Lombardi (or anyone else) going on LTIR will have zero effect on Nashville's ability to bring additional players in at the deadline or in the off season. LTIR will only provide benefits for those teams that are going to exceed the cap ceiling- not the midpoint.

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There are too many defenseman prospects in the system. Too many goalies in the system.

Dekanich could be a chip simply because he's a UFA who needs a home.

I'm not worried. I will worry after the trade deadline.
Poile certainly has trade chips at his disposal as well as money. He's got a mess right now. This four game losing streak is especially bad timing given who they lost to (Calgary x2) and with the Wings looming (x2).

Tough decisions ahead for Poile.

If Nashville squeaks into the playoffs and loses in the first round again with horrible results on the PP, he and Trotz will have a lot of explaining to do.

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02-04-2011, 12:38 PM
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I remember seeing an article not too long ago stating that due to Lombardi's previous concussion history, he was not eligible for insurance. Meaning, the team would have to absorb the full cost of his salary while he is out. Basically, the 3+ million we are spending on him away from the ice is hampering us (our team's own internal budget). It is real money that ownership can not afford to spend again on another player...

Make sense? Or am I full of poo?
You're correct. We have to PRAY that Lombardi plays again, or else we're on the hook for every penny of that 3 year contract, unless he were to retire(unlikely), and we're unable to "replace" him, because contractually, he's still on the roster and payroll.

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02-04-2011, 12:38 PM
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I know someone mentioned Rivet the other day as an additions but Steve Montador might be a better fit. Discuss.

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02-04-2011, 12:39 PM
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I know someone mentioned Rivet the other day as an additions but Steve Montador might be a better fit. Discuss.
Assuming Bouillon comes back healthy, I think we've got bigger fish to fry. I'd like to add a veteran D, but we have too much of an issue up front, IMO. Without turning over too many components, I don't see how we could do it. Ideally, we need two scoring forwards. We're not going to get them, but we at least need one.

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02-04-2011, 01:13 PM
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Assuming Bouillon comes back healthy, I think we've got bigger fish to fry. I'd like to add a veteran D, but we have too much of an issue up front, IMO. Without turning over too many components, I don't see how we could do it. Ideally, we need two scoring forwards. We're not going to get them, but we at least need one.
I agree. I should've quantified that with, if Bouillon isn't coming back this year.

If O'Reilly and Sullivan are able to come back, would a line of them with Dumont be enough of a line to get it done come playoff time? If not, who is out there that would be a good fit for us? Arnott isn't coming back. Connolly is going to go to the highest bidder.

This is what I would do. I would go after Weiss big time. He's on a very affordable deal. He's young. He produces. Has some good wheels. Florida is looking to rebuild. We have some very attractive pieces that would help them. Vokoun is a free agent at seasons end. We could send them a goalie, one of Ellis or Blum, maybe another prospect as well plus a 2nd or 3rd round pick.

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02-04-2011, 01:14 PM
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Originally Posted by barrytrotzsneck View Post
Assuming Bouillon comes back healthy, I think we've got bigger fish to fry. I'd like to add a veteran D, but we have too much of an issue up front, IMO. Without turning over too many components, I don't see how we could do it. Ideally, we need two scoring forwards. We're not going to get them, but we at least need one.
I don't even think we NEED cube back to set priorities; the priority - given the injury situation, should be a center. A sniper is nice, but we're playing JP on the 4th line with Mueller already and Sully is destined for that other wing *if* he ever comes back (unless Trotz puts Wilson there cause he's an untrustworthy kid or some other goofy reason). We got wings that can get the job done, we need a C so we can put Goc between JP and Sully, or at least an Offensive upgrade from Mueller to center them.

Or, we need a winning streak, a little luck, and Orly ready to roll with 7-10 games left to get his skates under him.

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02-04-2011, 01:45 PM
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I don't even think we NEED cube back to set priorities; the priority - given the injury situation, should be a center. A sniper is nice, but we're playing JP on the 4th line with Mueller already and Sully is destined for that other wing *if* he ever comes back (unless Trotz puts Wilson there cause he's an untrustworthy kid or some other goofy reason). We got wings that can get the job done, we need a C so we can put Goc between JP and Sully, or at least an Offensive upgrade from Mueller to center them.

Or, we need a winning streak, a little luck, and Orly ready to roll with 7-10 games left to get his skates under him.
I like your thoughts here. Improve upon Goc, move him down, more depth lower down the roster. Very smart. Gives Sully and Dumont a good veteran center to play with as well. Throw that in with my earlier comments about Weiss and I'd be very happy.

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02-04-2011, 03:12 PM
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I like your thoughts here. Improve upon Goc, move him down, more depth lower down the roster. Very smart. Gives Sully and Dumont a good veteran center to play with as well. Throw that in with my earlier comments about Weiss and I'd be very happy.
That would be amazing BUT I just can't see ownership adding another big salaried center while the Lombardi situation is in limbo. Weiss's cap hit is only 3.1 for the next two years. That is a great number but in real money he is due 4 million for next year and 4.1 for the year after.

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02-04-2011, 05:58 PM
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You're correct. We have to PRAY that Lombardi plays again, or else we're on the hook for every penny of that 3 year contract, unless he were to retire(unlikely), and we're unable to "replace" him, because contractually, he's still on the roster and payroll.
"Retirement" isn't even an option here. If Lombardi is in fact unable to keep playing due to his concussion(s) then he would file for Career Ending Disability (brain injury) and he would be entitled to his remaining contract. I'm a little unsure as to whether this is counted as a cap hit or a one time payment separate from the cap structure and I can't find the answer in the CBA. He's going to get his full contract money no matter what and the Preds don't have any recourse since it's a non-insurable injury for him. Whether it's the cap hit or "real money" for a disability payout it's still not a good situation.

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02-04-2011, 10:49 PM
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I like your thoughts here. Improve upon Goc, move him down, more depth lower down the roster. Very smart. Gives Sully and Dumont a good veteran center to play with as well. Throw that in with my earlier comments about Weiss and I'd be very happy.
If we got Weiss this would solve a lot problems ...The Legwand on a offensive line hasn't worked. Move him back to the checking line. Weiss would take his place. You could even put Legwand to the Dumont/Sully line. Sully won't be back before the deadline I don't see O'Reilly being a factor. I don't see him back this year. Maybe by the playoffs maybe.

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02-05-2011, 06:06 AM
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If we got Weiss this would solve a lot problems ...The Legwand on a offensive line hasn't worked. Move him back to the checking line. Weiss would take his place. You could even put Legwand to the Dumont/Sully line. Sully won't be back before the deadline I don't see O'Reilly being a factor. I don't see him back this year. Maybe by the playoffs maybe.
I forget where I saw it but I think Singleton did an analysis on Legwand, his production and his linemates production, Hornqvist and Wilson, last week maybe. All their numbers are better since they've been playing together. Take your personal opinions of a player and back it up with facts before making a statement like Legwand on an offensive line hasn't worked. We had gone something like 10-4 with him on an offensive line before this current skid where no one is producing it seems so to say Legwand in an offensive role hasn't worked is off.

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02-05-2011, 06:57 AM
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Originally Posted by glenngineer View Post
I forget where I saw it but I think Singleton did an analysis on Legwand, his production and his linemates production, Hornqvist and Wilson, last week maybe. All their numbers are better since they've been playing together. Take your personal opinions of a player and back it up with facts before making a statement like Legwand on an offensive line hasn't worked. We had gone something like 10-4 with him on an offensive line before this current skid where no one is producing it seems so to say Legwand in an offensive role hasn't worked is off.
Yes, it was last week's Friday Face-Offs.

Legwand, Wilson and Hornqvist were having a very significant impact offensively.

Thanks!

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02-05-2011, 10:27 AM
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I forget where I saw it but I think Singleton did an analysis on Legwand, his production and his linemates production, Hornqvist and Wilson, last week maybe. All their numbers are better since they've been playing together. Take your personal opinions of a player and back it up with facts before making a statement like Legwand on an offensive line hasn't worked. We had gone something like 10-4 with him on an offensive line before this current skid where no one is producing it seems so to say Legwand in an offensive role hasn't worked is off.
So he scores two goals and now he's an offensive juggarnaut. The last two games Legwand has had two chances in front of the net all alone and can't bury them. He's a curse we won't win with him and soon as we realize what he is a checking line center that is overpaid. Smithson does even a better job on the checking than Legwand does. If you put Goc or even Smithson...well maybe not him on that same line his stats would be the same or better analysis his production would go up. The Flyer game with the pass from Wilson ..that puck should have been in the net. He paniced and just shot it when he had time to make a deke or move but no You love him. Your stats doesn't even make sense

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02-05-2011, 10:40 AM
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So he scores two goals and now he's an offensive juggarnaut. The last two games Legwand has had two chances in front of the net all alone and can't bury them. He's a curse we won't win with him and soon as we realize what he is a checking line center that is overpaid. Smithson does even a better job on the checking than Legwand does. If you put Goc or even Smithson...well maybe not him on that same line his stats would be the same or better analysis his production would go up. The Flyer game with the pass from Wilson ..that puck should have been in the net. He paniced and just shot it when he had time to make a deke or move but no You love him. Your stats doesn't even make sense
The guy isn't an offensive juggernaut by any stretch of the imagination; he's just producing more. That's a good thing. It's possible to do better with other people's players, sure, but to say "it's not working" is a bit disingenuous.

(And how would you be planning on getting Weiss, anyways? Florida really wants to keep him, last I checked...)

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02-05-2011, 11:00 AM
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Observe how the truly dedicated hater will let no statistics or analysis or banal facts stand in the way of their hate. Fascinating!

The guy isn't an offensive juggernaut by any stretch of the imagination; he's just producing more. That's a good thing. It's possible to do better with other people's players, sure, but to say "it's not working" is a bit disingenuous.

(And how would you be planning on getting Weiss, anyways? Florida really wants to keep him, last I checked...)
It is a bit disingenuous that one of your top salaried player is just producing more when he supposed to be producing a lot according to his pay scale. So Dumont who is not on a top line has more goals on the 4th line than on the top line. Is there a stat for that. By the way there is not hate involved here. Because I see a differing opinion therefore you put negative connotation on it. Florida is in the rebuilding mode last time I checked and Glen is the one who first suggested. I just reinterated his point. Do you even know who Florida's GM is? For the record it is called a trade that is how we could get him and we would have to send commodities such as players from the minors or picks. By the way Jim McKensie with Willie was on the radio postgame show stated that Legwand's offensive game was not his forte and that for most part in the game with the Flyers he was invisible. I guess he's a hater too

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02-05-2011, 11:09 AM
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It is a bit disingenuous that one of your top salaried player is just producing more when he supposed to be producing a lot according to his pay scale. So Dumont who is not on a top line has more goals on the 4th line than on the top line. Is there a stat for that. By the way there is not hate involved here. Because I see a differing opinion therefore you put negative connotation on it. Florida is in the rebuilding mode last time I checked and Glen is the one who first suggested. I just reinterated his point. Do you even know who Florida's GM is? For the record it is called a trade that is how we could get him and we would have to send commodities such as players from the minors or picks. By the way Jim McKensie with Willie was on the radio postgame show stated that Legwand's offensive game was not his forte and that for most part in the game with the Flyers he was invisible. I guess he's a hater too
If trades are that easy, then I'd like to trade for Ryan Suter. I suspect I would have to spend "commodities such as players from the minors or picks". Surely it won't be much.

Weiss is the sort of player that you keep when you're rebuilding. I'm pretty sure he's in Mr. Tallon's plans for the future, seeing as though he kind of already surveyed everyone asking if they want to stay; that's why Horton was traded to Boston.

Also, the "OMG payscale therefore get rid of him" argument is getting a little old. The guy is what he is. Any improvement is a good thing. Removing him does not automatically mean you'll magically get an offensive force in his place.

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02-05-2011, 11:11 AM
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The problem is Legwand was the #2 pick in his draft. He has not turned out to be the offensive weapon he was projected to be. He has become a shut down center, that's fine you need that. But if he can't pot 20 goals and double digit assists along with that, he is overpaid. And for us as offensively challenged as we are, we can't afford that. So this is a reflection on management more than anything else.

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02-05-2011, 11:20 AM
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If trades are that easy, then I'd like to trade for Ryan Suter. I suspect I would have to spend "commodities such as players from the minors or picks". Surely it won't be much.

Weiss is the sort of player that you keep when you're rebuilding. I'm pretty sure he's in Mr. Tallon's plans for the future, seeing as though he kind of already surveyed everyone asking if they want to stay; that's why Horton was traded to Boston.

Also, the "OMG payscale therefore get rid of him" argument is getting a little old. The guy is what he is. Any improvement is a good thing. Removing him does not automatically mean you'll magically get an offensive force in his place.
For the record

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=551713

Panthers GM Tallon says he'll listen to all offers

Panthers GM Tallon says he'll listen to all offersSaturday, 02.05.2011 / 12:20 AM / NHL Insider By Dan Rosen - NHL.com Senior Writer
8
Share NEWARK, N.J. -- If you're a general manager interested in acquiring any player in the Florida Panthers organization, don't hesitate to call because GM Dale Tallon is willing to listen.

Tallon, who figures to be a busy man between now and the Feb. 28 trade deadline, told NHL.com Friday that no Panther is untouchable -- not even prized goalie prospect Jacob Markstrom.

"It depends on the deal, but I doubt that's going to happen," Tallon said of Markstrom.

He's probably right on that one. Tallon would have to be blown away by an offer to consider trading Markstrom, who is considered the Panthers' cornerstone goalie of the future, but he'll listen anyway.

"Yeah, why not?" Tallon said. "This team hasn't done anything in 10 years, so why wouldn't I? It's not like we're a championship team. We've got to get better in every area."

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02-05-2011, 11:24 AM
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If trades are that easy, then I'd like to trade for Ryan Suter. I suspect I would have to spend "commodities such as players from the minors or picks". Surely it won't be much.

Weiss is the sort of player that you keep when you're rebuilding. I'm pretty sure he's in Mr. Tallon's plans for the future, seeing as though he kind of already surveyed everyone asking if they want to stay; that's why Horton was traded to Boston.

Also, the "OMG payscale therefore get rid of him" argument is getting a little old. The guy is what he is. Any improvement is a good thing. Removing him does not automatically mean you'll magically get an offensive force in his place.
We can't get rid of him. Nobody wants him at that price for that length of a contract. We are stuck with him

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