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The Official Ex-Habs Thread Part II(All Former Habs Players Discussed Here!)

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Old
02-06-2011, 09:58 AM
  #326
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Originally Posted by Koseegin View Post
Because my original post had nothing to do with their talent in the first place, so if anything you responded uselessly in the first place.

Just like Sergei, Andrei will be runned out of town and perform elsewhere because of dumb ****ing fans and media. Then Andrei will tear it up. No he doesn't play the same game as Sergei, two different players, but that doesn't mean squat. Andrei's offensive game eats up Sergei's, Sergei is the better all around player.

Grabovski is a different player from all three as well and he's doing extremely well too. He too had the fans on his case for a couple of incidents and was then shipped as he was made to look like the bad guy because all he wanted to do was play. Like Sergei.

The situations are similar and it has nothing to do with their talent. Andrei Kostitsyn gets unwarranted flack from too many people when he is no worse than guys like Cammalleri, Pouliot etc, but Andrei gets most of it. Andrei moves he will be a better player, just like people said of Latendresse, Sergei, Grabovski etc.

And no the bold isn't pathetic. Attitudes about Andrei Kostitsyn took a complete 360 after the stupid mob story which was completely ridiculous. Both Kostitsyns went from heros to zeros in the matter of days.
I didn't talk about their talent, I talked about their personnalities. It's because of his personnality that Sergei (or Ribeiro) can flourish elsewhere.

If it was only a question of fans "driving out the players", how come Chipchura, Lapierre, Higgins, etc. don't succeed better away from Mtl.

You just can't compare the situation of both players, because they're too different from each other on and OFF the ice.

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02-06-2011, 10:09 AM
  #327
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Originally Posted by RE-HABS View Post
Habs tried, he was a distraction and needed to be moved. We and the Habs knew he could be a player, but it wasn't going to happen here. And in all reality SK had the Habs hands tied in any deal as the league knew the Habs were looking to trade the distraction and the asking price would be low.

This deal doesn't haunt us, he is in the West and Habs are doing fine without him.
How did they try!? He was 19 years old and living by himself. I don't even think management knew what he was doing off the ice. FFS, Crosby's like 25 and living with Mario. Giroux's like 23 and living with Briere. Cam Fowler's living with Niedermayer.

S.Kost was living with mobsters! He didn't even speak the language and was left by himself. And out of all the places - Montreal. Management should be embarrassed.

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02-06-2011, 11:16 AM
  #328
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Originally Posted by RE-HABS View Post
Habs tried, he was a distraction and needed to be moved. We and the Habs knew he could be a player, but it wasn't going to happen here. And in all reality SK had the Habs hands tied in any deal as the league knew the Habs were looking to trade the distraction and the asking price would be low.

This deal doesn't haunt us, he is in the West and Habs are doing fine without him.
Habs didn't try crap, the only time they seem to try was when he refused to go down and they had no choice but to pay attention to him. That didn't last very long though as they tried to move him but couldn't because they weren't getting proper value back. So they kept him down in AHL for a bit, hope to cool things off, called him back up but Martin still wanted nothing with him. He was tossed to the side, and traded after the season. Ya, they tried real real hard.

Dale Hunter never said anything about him being a problem. Kane and Gagner only had good things to say about him. He was great under Lever and when he got called up Carbo praised him on his two way game. Everything went well until that Darkest Day crap, he became a villain from then on. Martin comes in, even though MaxPac, D'Ago, Chipchura, Lats, Laps, are all having rather ordinary camps to say the least, SK gets sent down. In the AHL, Boucher doesn't say anything bad about his attitude. On the contrary, he says he's working well. Get called up, plays well, get 12min, keeps playing well, doesn't get compensated, makes a mistake, gets benched, makes another one, gets scratched. He is now the new cancer in the room.
Gets traded to Nashville, starts the year slow as a 4th liner with limited ice time. Injuries happen, he gets a shot, takes it and is now the leading scoring forward. He's also the most productive via ice time. No attitude problems whatsoever.

Yea, certainly looks like we didn't screw up...It's all his fault and the other teams, Hunter's, Lever's, Carbo's, Boucher's, Trotz's are all lucky.

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Old
02-06-2011, 01:00 PM
  #329
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I mean, when we look bad in a trade, we look so bad, it's incredible. Even the greatest recent trade in Gorges +1st for Rivet, you still gave an Okay NHL d-man in return.

But in the Ribeiro trade...the SKost trade and the Grabovski trade, you got absolutely NOTHING. Oh yeah...let's all hope and pray that Conboy and Pateryn becomes something...the only thing left on those trades....

Pathetic how we run away from guys who might slightly need a little more coaching than the milk drinkers we have....

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Old
02-06-2011, 01:05 PM
  #330
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Originally Posted by Stradale View Post
Another waste talent because if the mismanagement/development.

I've defended AK a lot here but between AK and SK, SK would fit the Habs system better. With a better management of the brothers, a AK-Plek-SK would have been one hell of a line.
If anybody "mismanged" that talent it was SK. You can lead a horse to water but can't make him drink.

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02-06-2011, 01:16 PM
  #331
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Leaving our talent to manage themselves is the first mistake.

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Old
02-06-2011, 01:18 PM
  #332
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Originally Posted by RE-HABS View Post
Habs tried, he was a distraction and needed to be moved. We and the Habs knew he could be a player, but it wasn't going to happen here. And in all reality SK had the Habs hands tied in any deal as the league knew the Habs were looking to trade the distraction and the asking price would be low.

This deal doesn't haunt us, he is in the West and Habs are doing fine without him.
Both SKost and Grabs were handling themselves the way they did because they KNEW they were better than what we had. They lacked the maturity but were immensely confident in their ability and couldn't understand the decisions that were made. They needed the confidence that other players were getting without even always deserving it. So it's all fine to believe that those guys were immatured punks who thought they'd be better than they actually were but thing is....they were TOTALLY RIGHT. They were better and didn't get the chance. Oh right....SKost got another chance in the playoffs and blew it...'cause clearly GETTING THE CHANCES means you have 1 game and if you don't score 3 goals, you blew it. There's more in getting the chance than to actually be tried for 1 game.

Both guys but mostly Sergei had ALREADY proved their worth. When you see what a guy can do and he stops doing it, you know that it's confidence talking. I mean, if we trade a guy like Pyatt, do you seriously believed he'll start scoring? No, 'cause he never proved it. But SKost was once seen as a better player than his bro. He had an attitude...so what. Chances are those "cancers" we let go once are all of sudden not a cancer anymore. Strange. See, when a guy like Avery jumps from team to team, he's known as a jackass EVERYWHERE. You can't go from cancer to great man in an instant. You can't go from immature total punk, to logicable and sensible man in 1 trade. Oh yes, the infamous "players needs a trade to realize it..."Well, sometimes it could be right...strangely, almost ALL of our players that we let go lately SUDDENLY GOT IT....Could it be because nobody was able to teached them how to GET IT? And what would it had anything to do with Grabs or SKost anyway? Weren't they suppose to moved to the KHL? Why would they care for the NHL anyway?

But then, the other great reason "Well, they weren't liked with 3 coaches, so about they are the problem not the org?...". Yet again, nobody mentions that it's NOT their fault. They have their own share. But HOW ABOUT WORKING WITH THAT? Do we happen to be the only team in the league to work with cancers? Who else was traded, let go for nothing for being cancers? And if you happen to find 1, not named Avery, can you find 2, 3, or 4 FROM THE SAME TEAM. 'Cause that's what happened with us.

And then going back to the 3 coaches....we are talking about Gainey, Carbo and Martin right? Gainey who's not a coach...Carbo who clearly was not ready enough to be a coach, and Martin who had to go back to coaching after being away from that job for a couple of years now.....And we are also talking that while it's 3 coaches...it's TOTALLY the 1 same mentality and same type of approach. They couldn't care less about communication. From the players themselves, they learn what's going on with them through the newspapers etc. How about recognizing that some might need more? Isn't it what the new brand of coaches dictates? That each and every one player might need their own type of approach? That if you believe in them, it's worth it? No matter how you got them, no matter if it's a 1st rounder or a 7th rounder? Why would you give more chances to a 1st rounder than a 7th? If in the end the 7th rounder ends up a better player....wouldn't you prefer having the best player? Or the higher pick?

Anyway, we looked stupid in another deal once again. All and all, Timmins should be so frustrated by this team....still wondering how he's still working with us....Drafting all these guys, and seeing them flourish elsewhere. Though he knows it.....to a journalist who was speaking out loud saying that Grabovski was finally a good player after all...Timmins to respond "Well, I did draft him...". I guess the salary has to be good.....I mean, let's hope we're not becoming the farm team of the rest of the league. I know something though.....we should try to use that as a bargaining chip......Highest numbers players playing in the league since 2003....just not all with us.

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Old
02-06-2011, 01:19 PM
  #333
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
I mean, when we look bad in a trade, we look so bad, it's incredible. Even the greatest recent trade in Gorges +1st for Rivet, you still gave an Okay NHL d-man in return.

But in the Ribeiro trade...the SKost trade and the Grabovski trade, you got absolutely NOTHING. Oh yeah...let's all hope and pray that Conboy and Pateryn becomes something...the only thing left on those trades....

Pathetic how we run away from guys who might slightly need a little more coaching than the milk drinkers we have....
Grabovski trade you got a 2nd round pick which they parlayed into Lang who was having the best year out of our forwards until he went down with an acl injury. It was a good trade idea at the time as we were coming off a first place finish. Selling a bit of the future at the time for some present. But yea the other trades we look really bad on.

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Old
02-06-2011, 01:23 PM
  #334
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
If anybody "mismanged" that talent it was SK. You can lead a horse to water but can't make him drink.
Thank god a human being is not a horse. You can actually talk to the human and explain him the benefit of the water. Seems that he finally understood the good of it....But I guess only the trade made him open his ears....Strange though that when he went back in the AHL, even after his little immature reaction, HE actually drank all that water he needed with Guy Boucher. During the same immature moments he was in, HE asked Boucher HIMSELF to see some videos to see what he could improve and all. Boucher HIMSELF describing him as a hard worker and a true desire to learn....

But hey, Boucher didn't fit in the great scheme of what this organization wants to see in a coach so I guess his opinion was not needed.

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02-06-2011, 01:36 PM
  #335
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Thank god a human being is not a horse. You can actually talk to the human and explain him the benefit of the water. Seems that he finally understood the good of it....But I guess only the trade made him open his ears....Strange though that when he went back in the AHL, even after his little immature reaction, HE actually drank all that water he needed with Guy Boucher. During the same immature moments he was in, HE asked Boucher HIMSELF to see some videos to see what he could improve and all. Boucher HIMSELF describing him as a hard worker and a true desire to learn....

But hey, Boucher didn't fit in the great scheme of what this organization wants to see in a coach so I guess his opinion was not needed.
Just a friendly warning Whitesnake, connecting the dots will lead to certain conclusions about management that an army of keyboards will rail against.

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Old
02-06-2011, 01:42 PM
  #336
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Originally Posted by Stradale View Post
Another waste talent because if the mismanagement/development.

I've defended AK a lot here but between AK and SK, SK would fit the Habs system better. With a better management of the brothers, a AK-Plek-SK would have been one hell of a line.
that is alright cause we have darche and pyatt playing for us. pyatt has almost a point per game and darche is such a complete player, he can score with his knee, elbow, ankle, and maybe with his head too, skates like the wind, and kills penalties too.

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Old
02-06-2011, 02:52 PM
  #337
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Originally Posted by TheBuriedHab View Post
Grabovski trade you got a 2nd round pick which they parlayed into Lang who was having the best year out of our forwards until he went down with an acl injury. It was a good trade idea at the time as we were coming off a first place finish. Selling a bit of the future at the time for some present. But yea the other trades we look really bad on.
Not sure how having one of the best stats of the 08-09 team is such a great trait in an organization. That's the year who saw Kovalev as our 1st scorer. Pleks with 39 points. A d-man as our 2nd best scorer. I mean, Lang was doing fine....for that year. Where is he this year and what is he doing? And that's for a guy who will rack some points for at least the next 5-7 years. But that goes with the patching we've been doing for the past 15 years now. Some patching were better than others, Lang wasn't bad. Yet, another year of a vet who didn't amount to anything, yeah he was unlucky due to that freakin injury, still the end result is that it didn't amount to anything. We have continuously been patching, with no great results, and a prospect pool who "might" not be in great shape for the years to come due to the lack of picks and suspect 1st rounders.

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02-06-2011, 04:53 PM
  #338
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MAB with 2 pts tonight

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Old
02-06-2011, 07:08 PM
  #339
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Not sure how having one of the best stats of the 08-09 team is such a great trait in an organization. That's the year who saw Kovalev as our 1st scorer. Pleks with 39 points. A d-man as our 2nd best scorer. I mean, Lang was doing fine....for that year. Where is he this year and what is he doing? And that's for a guy who will rack some points for at least the next 5-7 years. But that goes with the patching we've been doing for the past 15 years now. Some patching were better than others, Lang wasn't bad. Yet, another year of a vet who didn't amount to anything, yeah he was unlucky due to that freakin injury, still the end result is that it didn't amount to anything. We have continuously been patching, with no great results, and a prospect pool who "might" not be in great shape for the years to come due to the lack of picks and suspect 1st rounders.
We were coming off a first place finish in the conference. We were adding pieces to put us over the top. Lang was a great acquisition till he went down. Theres always a risk of injury. It wasn't a patch job. It was adding a legit top 6 forward to a contending team. Contending teams do it all the time. Unfortunately it didn't work out but thats the risk you take. If he doesn't have that injury who knows how the rest of the season would have gone and who knows how many other years he would have played with us. I loved the move then and I still support it now. You can look in hindsight all you want, but a team coming off a first place finish, trading some future for some present and a better shot at the cup was completely logical.

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Old
02-06-2011, 07:47 PM
  #340
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Originally Posted by TheBuriedHab View Post
We were coming off a first place finish in the conference. We were adding pieces to put us over the top. Lang was a great acquisition till he went down. Theres always a risk of injury. It wasn't a patch job. It was adding a legit top 6 forward to a contending team. Contending teams do it all the time. Unfortunately it didn't work out but thats the risk you take. If he doesn't have that injury who knows how the rest of the season would have gone and who knows how many other years he would have played with us. I loved the move then and I still support it now. You can look in hindsight all you want, but a team coming off a first place finish, trading some future for some present and a better shot at the cup was completely logical.
Lang was coming off a team who had missed the playoffs. Had a fine season but even as finishing as the 4th scorer of his team, they let him go for a 2nd round pick. Chicago was headed to be a real contender team and yet, believed he was not needed in their team. We were indeed coming out of 1st place in the conference, yet, I don't personnally see us as a contending team solely based on their rank we finish in. 'Cause when you dig deeper, we did only finish 10 points ahead of 8th place. All that while every team had a lot of injuries and we didn't have a whole lot of. Not trying to discredit the team, we finished where we did. Just trying to put everything in perspective as to how a contender we really are.

Again, it was not a bad acquisition. Just that, here's another example that lasted 1 year with not a whole lot of result to it. Yes, it is sometimes a question of hindsight. See, every end of the year press conference looks back to what happened. And they mostly used the hindsight to explain how a year went. Pretty tough to say how great a season was when you ended up losing in the 1st round.Yet, every single move is ALWAYS to improve your team.

Anyway, I guess the Grabs deal cannot be compared to the SKost one or Ribeiro one. But to this day, it we are at the same point. Nothing to show for. And in a cap era, the younger and cheaper you are, the better. If it applies to Price, Subban and MaxPac, it has to apply to SKost, Grabs, Lats, O'Byrne....

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Old
02-06-2011, 08:04 PM
  #341
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
If anybody "mismanged" that talent it was SK. You can lead a horse to water but can't make him drink.
Contrary to the mythology, SK did pretty well here. He finished last season as one of the top few Habs in Molson Cup points. But every mistake led to Martin benching him. I will never understand why Martin took such an instant dislike to SK. He seemed determined to get rid of SK all along.

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02-06-2011, 11:36 PM
  #342
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Love to read you Snake.

You have to give the press a little credit for the SK trade though.

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02-07-2011, 12:43 AM
  #343
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If anybody "mismanged" that talent it was SK. You can lead a horse to water but can't make him drink.

Tsss... I knew since day one that Sergei was amazing. He's now opening peoples eyes... showing his immense skills that I love and showing how wrong you guys were.

Who's laughing now huh ?!?! Me, Sergei Kostitsyn, all of his supporters & probably his brother too.

You can say whatever you want about Sergei being a cancer in the locker room and bla bla bla...

The thing is, Sergei >>> Gionta, A.Kostitsyn, Pouliot, Cammalleri, Darche, Pyatt, Pacioretty, Gomez, Halpern, Desharnais & Eller

The only guy that might be equal to Sergei is Plekanec but Sergei will probably surpass him in a year or two.

But okay, if it makes you feel better: SERGEI STILL SUCKS and this team is better without him !!

A fact remains, the habs got owned... you know it, I know it, all the fans knows it and the management as well.

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02-07-2011, 12:54 AM
  #344
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Originally Posted by Slick Nick View Post
Love to read you Snake.

You have to give the press a little credit for the SK trade though.
Yup they deserve a ton of credits. Especially since the "darkest day in Habs history" saga.

This was a luxury the Habs failed to develop properly.






Too bad they didn't have the chance to play one the same line over 5 straight games with us.

Good news for the haters is that AK will probably be dealt too since we don't like to keep our drafted forwards.

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Old
02-07-2011, 01:13 AM
  #345
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Originally Posted by TheBuriedHab View Post
We were coming off a first place finish in the conference. We were adding pieces to put us over the top. Lang was a great acquisition till he went down. Theres always a risk of injury. It wasn't a patch job. It was adding a legit top 6 forward to a contending team. Contending teams do it all the time. Unfortunately it didn't work out but thats the risk you take. If he doesn't have that injury who knows how the rest of the season would have gone and who knows how many other years he would have played with us. I loved the move then and I still support it now. You can look in hindsight all you want, but a team coming off a first place finish, trading some future for some present and a better shot at the cup was completely logical.
Point wasn't that the Lang deal was alright, the issue is that it is yet another prospect that we gave up on, one that is doing well, and got nothing back in return.
If you want to focus solely on the fact that we got a 2nd, that turned into Lang, then ya, it's not so bad. But basically, it was Grabo for Lang.
If this deal was an exception, than there would be no issue. But this isn't the only time.
Instead of eliminating problems by sending them away, we should try to fix them.

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02-07-2011, 09:49 AM
  #346
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BTW, where is Robert Lang?

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Old
02-07-2011, 10:56 AM
  #347
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Love to read you Snake.

You have to give the press a little credit for the SK trade though.
I'll give the Habs the credit for not surrounding their young players that "might" be more problematic in a better way. I also believe that THE MAJORITY of the people laugh at the press for what started as the darkest days into...."What? That's it?" Sorry, but the people, with a good on-ice showing, would have had no problem accepting SKost. See, AKost was in this darkest day episode....same with Hamrlik. Pretty sure nobody talks about that now. And if AKost goes, it won't have anything to do with it.

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02-07-2011, 11:14 AM
  #348
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BTW, where is Robert Lang?
Good question, I thought maybe he'd be playing in Europe. I just looked though and can't see him listed as playing anywhere.

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02-07-2011, 11:16 AM
  #349
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Tsss... I knew since day one that Sergei was amazing. He's now opening peoples eyes... showing his immense skills that I love and showing how wrong you guys were.

Who's laughing now huh ?!?! Me, Sergei Kostitsyn, all of his supporters & probably his brother too.

You can say whatever you want about Sergei being a cancer in the locker room and bla bla bla...

The thing is, Sergei >>> Gionta, A.Kostitsyn, Pouliot, Cammalleri, Darche, Pyatt, Pacioretty, Gomez, Halpern, Desharnais & Eller

The only guy that might be equal to Sergei is Plekanec but Sergei will probably surpass him in a year or two.

But okay, if it makes you feel better: SERGEI STILL SUCKS and this team is better without him !!

A fact remains, the habs got owned... you know it, I know it, all the fans knows it and the management as well.
Not that you don't have the right to brag... you were right about Sergei and people need to eat crow for it...

Come on... Sergei might become, one day as good if not better than Plekanec, but right now, he's miles away from him.

And he's still not better than Cammy, Gionta and his brother.

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02-07-2011, 12:53 PM
  #350
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If anybody "mismanged" that talent it was SK. You can lead a horse to water but can't make him drink.
... Unless it was an alcoholic beverage...

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