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Spezza to edmonton

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Old
02-07-2011, 04:43 PM
  #51
SpezDispenser
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Originally Posted by Legionnaire View Post
Want to make an Avatar bet? Come October, I'd be surprised to see him there. If they're talking rebuild, and Alfie is staying put, what tradeable assets do they have to rebuild with? Who would net the most?
The most? Karlsson and Spezza, but I just cannot imagine we'd trade a 27 year old top line center and Karlsson's not going. Trade bait is Fisher, Phillips, Ruutu, maybe Kelly, maybe Gonchar (don't all knock down the door at once!), Kuba (hahaha), Campoli, maybe Neil, Elliott (ha), maybe Regin, maybe Foligno (doubtful, unless the offer's good).

But the main attraction is Kovalev leaving (5 million), Leclaire leaving (3.8), Phillips being traded (3.5) which opens up a lot of room to possibly start adding young players via trade. Or to stand pat I guess and let the 1st round pick play and get used to NHL life, ditto Lehner (bad idea though), buy a goalie etc. This is more of a re-tool than a rebuild IMO.

So...the Spezza avatar bet...what would I have to put as an avatar?

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02-07-2011, 04:44 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Wondercarrot View Post
hey look everyone! its someone who has no clue what they're talking about!
nice!
His faceoff % is pretty good this year but you can't tell me that Ottawa leans on him defensively? Looking at career numbers he's typically around 50% on the dot, which is good don't get me wrong but he also takes a lot less face offs then most number 1 centers because he doesn't PK and he doesn't take a lot of defensive zone face-offs. The Oilers are dead last in PK and dead last in face off, we need a franchise center who excels in the defensive aspects of the game, hopefully Couturier pans out

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Old
02-07-2011, 04:44 PM
  #53
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So we get spezza and gaborik for Souray and a first! Nice love this blogger and his Dad!

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02-07-2011, 04:50 PM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeus3007 View Post
I don't think anyone expected Keith and Seabrook to end up as good as they are, but for arguments sake, Petry and Marincin are looking like they could be. Keith and Seabrook looked no better than Petry does right now then, and Marincin has a ton of upside. In 05/06 or 06/07, if you asked anyone if Keith and Seabrook would end up as two of Canada's defensemen at the Olympics, you would have been laughed at.

And who is to say that Taylor Hall doesn't end up a top 5 or 10 player in the NHL? Remember that Ovechkin was a year older in that rookie season, and Crosby had Lemieux, where Hall has...Horcoff? And how can they be equal in "endless crappy seasons" when all three of those teams didn't have "endless" crappy seasons, and Edmonton, so far, hasn't had near the streak of garbage seasons those teams did?
If these are your expectations you are only setting yourself up for disappointment.

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02-07-2011, 04:52 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpezDispenser View Post
The most? Karlsson and Spezza, but I just cannot imagine we'd trade a 27 year old top line center and Karlsson's not going. Trade bait is Fisher, Phillips, Ruutu, maybe Kelly, maybe Gonchar (don't all knock down the door at once!), Kuba (hahaha), Campoli, maybe Neil, Elliott (ha), maybe Regin, maybe Foligno (doubtful, unless the offer's good).

But the main attraction is Kovalev leaving (5 million), Leclaire leaving (3.8), Phillips being traded (3.5) which opens up a lot of room to possibly start adding young players via trade. Or to stand pat I guess and let the 1st round pick play and get used to NHL life, ditto Lehner (bad idea though), buy a goalie etc. This is more of a re-tool than a rebuild IMO.

So...the Spezza avatar bet...what would I have to put as an avatar?
Eh, just my stupid Avy, and I'd assume I'd get some "Spezza is the RoXors" type in exchange if I'm wrong. Nothing naked though please.

Well at least we can agree that Karlsson isn't going anywhere. See, it's Spezza's age, contract, and skill level that keep him from being a part of the future. How old is is going to be when the Sens are done rebuilding? 30? 31? 32? Is he going to help you when it comes to tanking (yes, it is my opinion that it is a very smart move) and collecting the highest pick possible? No. He's a good player, he's only going to help the team short term.

Look at how the Sens were built. They didn't keep all their players that they picked, but they did parlay those picks into other assets, and right now, and for the near future, the Sens are running short of assets.

Yeah, everyone would want a Fisher, Phillips or Neil on their team but at what price? 3 mil for Neil? 5 for Fish? Phillips is the only one who is possibly worth his cash.

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02-07-2011, 04:56 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by bam83 View Post
His faceoff % is pretty good this year but you can't tell me that Ottawa leans on him defensively? Looking at career numbers he's typically around 50% on the dot, which is good don't get me wrong but he also takes a lot less face offs then most number 1 centers because he doesn't PK and he doesn't take a lot of defensive zone face-offs. The Oilers are dead last in PK and dead last in face off, we need a franchise center who excels in the defensive aspects of the game, hopefully Couturier pans out
Spezza has been playing on the PK this year and has done a pretty good job with it.

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Old
02-07-2011, 04:57 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by oXo Cube View Post
If these are your expectations you are only setting yourself up for disappointment.
Even you are entitled to be wrong occasionally. Its okay.

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02-07-2011, 05:08 PM
  #58
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Nothing like a bad team and a bad team making a bad trade from a bad source.

The common denominator is.

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Old
02-07-2011, 05:09 PM
  #59
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from an oilers perspective i could see a 1st overall, penner, smid, 2nd round pick for spezza and say the third overall, i could not see them dealing the first pick for spezza straight up...

if spezza is ever dealt to the oilers eklund is going to look very good, until then he is an idiot...

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Old
02-07-2011, 05:24 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Legionnaire View Post
Oh. So the majority of HF was wrong? Okay. Still wrong I guess. Yeah, so in essence you're saying that people who said that Chara, at his size could really still develop were wrong and I'm just making this all up. Damn dude, I need to lay off the crack.
yeah he was big but norris trophy winning. come on

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Old
02-07-2011, 05:29 PM
  #61
Killem Dafoe
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This isn't even the best/funniest/worst rumor in that post, that would be Sheldon Souray to the Rangers for one of

Wade Redden (Which he says is unlikely)
Chris Drury (Except it would be Souray/Cogliano for Drury...which makes no sense)
Marian Gaborik (and something else from the Oilers)
was just about to say this.

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Old
02-07-2011, 05:30 PM
  #62
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yeah he was big but norris trophy winning. come on
Yeah, you don't trade Norris winners for that package do you? That would be totally stupid. Chara's progression and potential due to his size and toughness were reason enough to think twice about trading him for $ashin - let alone the 2nd overall.

Milbury wanted to go down in history as THE WORST. Little know fact.

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02-07-2011, 05:31 PM
  #63
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02-07-2011, 05:33 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Legionnaire View Post
Yeah, sure. And that fat chick I slept with COULD have become a 10 once she got naked. But the cold reality is that once she got naked, she was still Petry and Marincin.
Obviously you know nothing of Petry or Marincin. Marincin is looking like one of the best steals of the draft last year, and is a top 5 defender in the WHL right now. Petry turned pro this year, and already looks comfortable as a second pair guy, its not a stretch to think he could be a first guy.

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02-07-2011, 05:42 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by zeus3007 View Post
Obviously you know nothing of Petry or Marincin. Marincin is looking like one of the best steals of the draft last year, and is a top 5 defender in the WHL right now. Petry turned pro this year, and already looks comfortable as a second pair guy, its not a stretch to think he could be a first guy.
Clearly I am foolish for underestimating their abilities. What team do they play for again?

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02-07-2011, 05:45 PM
  #66
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About 98% of HF could care less about Hockey Buzz rumors. Stop posting them cause it won't turn out to be much.

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Old
02-07-2011, 05:46 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Legionnaire View Post
Clearly I am foolish for underestimating their abilities. What team do they play for again?
Its not even their current abilities, its their potential. Petry has been an NHL'er for less than a month, he turned pro this year after finishing his NCAA career, and he has been very good. Marincin plays for Prince George in the WHL, and has a high upside. You make it sound like the Oilers have no decent defensive prospects, when honestly, these guys should be very good NHL'ers sooner than later.

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02-07-2011, 05:47 PM
  #68
SpezDispenser
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Originally Posted by Legionnaire View Post
Eh, just my stupid Avy, and I'd assume I'd get some "Spezza is the RoXors" type in exchange if I'm wrong. Nothing naked though please.

Well at least we can agree that Karlsson isn't going anywhere. See, it's Spezza's age, contract, and skill level that keep him from being a part of the future. How old is is going to be when the Sens are done rebuilding? 30? 31? 32? Is he going to help you when it comes to tanking (yes, it is my opinion that it is a very smart move) and collecting the highest pick possible? No. He's a good player, he's only going to help the team short term.

Look at how the Sens were built. They didn't keep all their players that they picked, but they did parlay those picks into other assets, and right now, and for the near future, the Sens are running short of assets.

Yeah, everyone would want a Fisher, Phillips or Neil on their team but at what price? 3 mil for Neil? 5 for Fish? Phillips is the only one who is possibly worth his cash.
Neil is making 2, Fisher 4.2, but yes, they make a lot of loot.

How old is Spezza gonna be when we start to compete? I'll say it'll take 2 1/2 season for the Sens to start seeing some change to the competitive, so he'll be 29 going on 30 when we start to hopefully challenge again. That's still doable IMO, and he'll have 2 more years on his contract + hopefully, like the Kings, the Sens can do some good drafting and astute trading to up the skill level around him. Right now we have Karlsson, Rundblad, Cowen, Wiercioch and Lehner all coming up - and who's to say they work out, I realize that, but they form the nucleus of the core in the next few years.

Now comes the drafting of forwards that can hopefully make an impact this year (the 1st rounder) and then be indoctrinated into the lineup in the years after that for the lower picks. Plus, with the cap space coming, we can hold onto it and wait for a player to come available via a team that is at or near the cap.

Naturally, I think people in Ottawa are scared out of their minds that Murray will do something to mess it up, but he's fairly shrewd. His trades have been decent, they just haven't worked out for the Sens (with the exception of the Heatley trade, but that is what it is).

I think the Sens org. focuses on acquiring an elite level talent to play with Spezza - soon and they'll also bring in a real goalie - which will start to accelerate the re-tooling as we call it - because a rebuild would require much bigger changes than I think are coming.

I would do the avatar bet with you just for fun. How long do we have to keep it?

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02-07-2011, 05:51 PM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpezDispenser View Post
Neil is making 2, Fisher 4.2, but yes, they make a lot of loot.

How old is Spezza gonna be when we start to compete? I'll say it'll take 2 1/2 season for the Sens to start seeing some change to the competitive, so he'll be 29 going on 30 when we start to hopefully challenge again. That's still doable IMO, and he'll have 2 more years on his contract + hopefully, like the Kings, the Sens can do some good drafting and astute trading to up the skill level around him. Right now we have Karlsson, Rundblad, Cowen, Wiercioch and Lehner all coming up - and who's to say they work out, I realize that, but they form the nucleus of the core in the next few years.

Now comes the drafting of forwards that can hopefully make an impact this year (the 1st rounder) and then be indoctrinated into the lineup in the years after that for the lower picks. Plus, with the cap space coming, we can hold onto it and wait for a player to come available via a team that is at or near the cap.

Naturally, I think people in Ottawa are scared out of their minds that Murray will do something to mess it up, but he's fairly shrewd. His trades have been decent, they just haven't worked out for the Sens (with the exception of the Heatley trade, but that is what it is).

I think the Sens org. focuses on acquiring an elite level talent to play with Spezza - soon and they'll also bring in a real goalie - which will start to accelerate the re-tooling as we call it - because a rebuild would require much bigger changes than I think are coming.

I would do the avatar bet with you just for fun. How long do we have to keep it?
I am very pro build from within, so I am not buying into this whole "add a few players" thing. That is LA in a nutshell since I've been a fan. Get this guy, he'll make so and so a star. It just doesn't work that way. Chemistry is a mother.

Your call. I mean it's just for fun, right? I would have made you have a picture of my face to stare at constantly if it was (with and angry face no less!) serious.

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02-07-2011, 05:55 PM
  #70
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Clearly I am foolish for underestimating their abilities. What team do they play for again?
How old are they again?

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02-07-2011, 05:58 PM
  #71
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How old are they again?

I heard that Petry's father is bout ready to shoot him out....into a petry dish no less.

Hey, but once that happens, all of the Oilers problems will be solved. That kid had skills all the way up into righty. He was dominant. Still don't know how he beat out lefty, but hey that's how it works sometime.

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02-07-2011, 06:00 PM
  #72
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I heard that Petry's father is bout ready to shoot him out....into a petry dish no less.

Hey, but once that happens, all of the Oilers problems will be solved. That kid had skills all the way up into righty. He was dominant. Still don't know how he beat out lefty, but hey that's how it works sometime.
Are you high?

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02-07-2011, 06:03 PM
  #73
SpezDispenser
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Originally Posted by Legionnaire View Post
I am very pro build from within, so I am not buying into this whole "add a few players" thing. That is LA in a nutshell since I've been a fan. Get this guy, he'll make so and so a star. It just doesn't work that way. Chemistry is a mother.

Your call. I mean it's just for fun, right? I would have made you have a picture of my face to stare at constantly if it was (with and angry face no less!) serious.
Agreed, I'm a huge proponent of a build from within as well, but the Sens might have to look at acquiring a winger at some point and not just hoping they can draft one or two or more. The reason is...we have those young D coming up and we'll want to at least make some noise before their ELCs or 2nd contracts are up. I think we'll acquire one winger and one big time goaltender - and it could be this summer. Hard to say though, that's what I would do, not sure if Murray feels the same (or the new GM).

As for the avatar bet, we'll make it for a couple of months? October - Christmas? Up to you.

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02-07-2011, 06:04 PM
  #74
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from an oilers perspective i could see a 1st overall, penner, smid, 2nd round pick for spezza and say the third overall, i could not see them dealing the first pick for spezza straight up...

if spezza is ever dealt to the oilers eklund is going to look very good, until then he is an idiot...
Please when hall or eberle are included with your first then you might get murray to listen to an offer for just spezza

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Old
02-07-2011, 06:08 PM
  #75
Legionnaire
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Originally Posted by SpezDispenser View Post
Agreed, I'm a huge proponent of a build from within as well, but the Sens might have to look at acquiring a winger at some point and not just hoping they can draft one or two or more. The reason is...we have those young D coming up and we'll want to at least make some noise before their ELCs or 2nd contracts are up. I think we'll acquire one winger and one big time goaltender - and it could be this summer. Hard to say though, that's what I would do, not sure if Murray feels the same (or the new GM).

As for the avatar bet, we'll make it for a couple of months? October - Christmas? Up to you.

Yeah true, but wingers are the easiest position to find. I could be very wrong, but you know, it takes most teams 4 years. Spezza = gone the Sens have 4 years of development into kids who can step in and become the future. The future of the Sens does not lie with Spezza, can we agree on that at least? Cause that's where I'm coming from. 4 years from now what will the Sens look like? I bet they'll be good if they don't muck it up.

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