HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk
Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

Pittsburgh - Ottawa

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-07-2011, 05:16 PM
  #26
The Fuhr
Registered User
 
The Fuhr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Hamilton,Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 34,463
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent By Design View Post
I'd love to add Milan, but I wouldn't be interested in moving a roster player like Jeffrey who has been great thus far.

What about something based around our 1st?

1st+Kuhnhackl?
I'd pass since I prefer Jeffrey to the 1st

The Fuhr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-07-2011, 06:43 PM
  #27
The Latvian
#rooster #classless
 
The Latvian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,984
vCash: 500
I really dont see ottawa moving Michalek. The price is going to be expensive if he does get moved. Although this has been a horribel season. I dont think a complete rebuild is in store. Michalek would be a great 2nd liner if the Sens can find a 1st line winger for Spezza like they have stated that they want to and have an oppurtunity to do so with Kovalev and Leclaire leaving soon.

The Latvian is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-07-2011, 06:44 PM
  #28
66-29-33
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Victoria, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 28,183
vCash: 500
If Pens trade with Sens i would want Philips on this team if we decided to trade Gogo to some team for a top line winger.

66-29-33 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-07-2011, 06:48 PM
  #29
Sidney the Kidney
Selke BylsmAdams
 
Sidney the Kidney's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,728
vCash: 80
Considering the biggest thing plaguing the Pens is the long-term injuries to our two biggest stars, adding a forward who is also quite the injury risk doesn't seem like a smart move.

Also, at this point I think I'm actually less interested in giving up Kuhnhackl than I am Jeffrey. Mainly it's because the Pens, when everyone is healthy, is fine at center and thus Jeffrey's more expendable. Whereas Kuhnhackl, though an outside shot right now, has the makings of a potential answer to the Pens' top six wing situation in about 4 or 5 years.

Sidney the Kidney is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-07-2011, 06:50 PM
  #30
JTG
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Country: Sierra Leone
Posts: 38,209
vCash: 500
Michalek is way too risky for my liking. I like him when he's in the lineup though.

JTG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-07-2011, 06:52 PM
  #31
Hale The Villain
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,935
vCash: 50
We have 13M in cap space to re-sign Phillips. Everything else is gravy. There is no reason for us to trade a top line/top 6 two-way forward for prospects that could become as good as Michalek.

I can understand Pens fans refusing the deal as Jeffrey is a nice piece.

Hale The Villain is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-07-2011, 07:31 PM
  #32
trentmccleary
Registered User
 
trentmccleary's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Alfie-Ville
Posts: 18,668
vCash: 500
Ottawa has lots of secondary, depth prospects already. We could use Michalek a lot more than those pieces.

For frame of reference... in it's first 15 years of drafting, Ottawa turned only two 2nd rounders into anything close to Michalek (Fisher & Vermette). The rest never made it and a couple played parts of 2-3 seasons. Ottawa was considering very good at drafting for approximately the first 10 of those years.

trentmccleary is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-07-2011, 07:45 PM
  #33
Hale The Villain
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,935
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by trentmccleary View Post
For frame of reference... in it's first 15 years of drafting, Ottawa turned only two 2nd rounders into anything close to Michalek (Fisher & Vermette). The rest never made it and a couple played parts of 2-3 seasons. Ottawa was considering very good at drafting for approximately the first 10 of those years.
2nds generally have a higher chance of turning into something nowaways compared to the late 90s and early 2000s.

Want proof? It's looking likely that Silfverberg, Lehner and Wiercioch will turn into players for us.

Hale The Villain is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-07-2011, 08:00 PM
  #34
trentmccleary
Registered User
 
trentmccleary's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Alfie-Ville
Posts: 18,668
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hale The Villain View Post
2nds generally have a higher chance of turning into something nowaways compared to the late 90s and early 2000s.

Want proof? It's looking likely that Silfverberg, Lehner and Wiercioch will turn into players for us.
I've seen a lot of prospects come and go over the years; lots of them were 2nd rounders. The only pick Ottawa has consistently put into the NHL are 1st rounders.

trentmccleary is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-07-2011, 08:16 PM
  #35
DG
Registered User
 
DG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 18,667
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hale The Villain View Post
2nds generally have a higher chance of turning into something nowaways compared to the late 90s and early 2000s.

Want proof? It's looking likely that Silfverberg, Lehner and Wiercioch will turn into players for us.
Your proof is use to examples of players who have done nothing in the NHL, and may never do anything in the NHL who are promising?

Just like many of our former 2nd rounders?

DG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-07-2011, 08:18 PM
  #36
Big McLargehuge
Moderator
Diving in Head First
 
Big McLargehuge's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Los Angeles
Country: Finland
Posts: 51,789
vCash: 422
While I like the guy, I really don't want to be trading for a guy with legitimate injury concerns on an overpriced deal.


We can handle a bad contract or two this year...but next year Michalek would cost us too much.

Big McLargehuge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-07-2011, 08:25 PM
  #37
pghsportsfan3392
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 12
vCash: 500
I like Jeffrey a lot, he has too much upside. Michalek has never scored 30 goals in his career. We should dump Goligoski instead.

pghsportsfan3392 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-07-2011, 08:33 PM
  #38
PensFreak
Registered User
 
PensFreak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,234
vCash: 500
Michalek only has 22 points in 49 games this year. Goligoski has 28 in 54. I take Gogo all day. Kuhn has a shot at being a very good scoring winger in the future, Jeffrey has been looking fantastic in the time he's been up, and our first round pick, if moved, is going to be moved for a better asset than Michalek.

PensFreak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-07-2011, 08:45 PM
  #39
The Fuhr
Registered User
 
The Fuhr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Hamilton,Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 34,463
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by trentmccleary View Post
Ottawa has lots of secondary, depth prospects already. We could use Michalek a lot more than those pieces.

For frame of reference... in it's first 15 years of drafting, Ottawa turned only two 2nd rounders into anything close to Michalek (Fisher & Vermette). The rest never made it and a couple played parts of 2-3 seasons. Ottawa was considering very good at drafting for approximately the first 10 of those years.
As the Sens are rebuilding they should be looking to create as much depth and open up as much cap space as they can.

I see no issue building a forward group that has one 1st line, two second lines and a third line in terms of depth and talent. Maybe that's just me though.

The Fuhr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-07-2011, 09:25 PM
  #40
Skk82
Registered User
 
Skk82's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Arlington, VA
Country: United States
Posts: 4,107
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent By Design View Post
I'd love to add Milan, but I wouldn't be interested in moving a roster player like Jeffrey who has been great thus far.

What about something based around our 1st?

1st+Kuhnhackl?
If Shero moves his 1st round pick, it'll be for a game-changer like Hossa. Don't think he's going to deal a 1st for a Michalek-caliber player. Not meant to be a knock on Michalek, it's just the Pens strategy to usually keep their first rounders.

Skk82 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-07-2011, 11:30 PM
  #41
trentmccleary
Registered User
 
trentmccleary's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Alfie-Ville
Posts: 18,668
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fuhr View Post
As the Sens are rebuilding they should be looking to create as much depth and open up as much cap space as they can.

I see no issue building a forward group that has one 1st line, two second lines and a third line in terms of depth and talent. Maybe that's just me though.
Teams don't rebuild "in one year". Ottawa is re-tooling.

Cap space is irrelevant to Ottawa in the near future. Cowen, Rundblad and Lottery pick will drive down the cost of the team.

Your proposal has nothing to do with adding any potential 1st line calibre prospects. You're merely adding 3 mediocre pieces and we'd be damn lucky if any of them turned into Michalek in the next 5 years. We can get pieces like that for UFA's this year and next.... while maintaining a decent team for the prospects to join.

trentmccleary is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-07-2011, 11:48 PM
  #42
4thliner*
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 6,135
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skk82 View Post
If Shero moves his 1st round pick, it'll be for a game-changer like Hossa. Don't think he's going to deal a 1st for a Michalek-caliber player. Not meant to be a knock on Michalek, it's just the Pens strategy to usually keep their first rounders.
Pens 1st = Ottawa 2nd

Why would Ottawa be even remotely interested in moving Michalek for a late 1st??? And you are even saying you wanna get an impact star player for that? lollllll

4thliner* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-07-2011, 11:50 PM
  #43
AugustBurnsRed*
Invisible Calls
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: 'Peg
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,488
vCash: 500
Nah.. I'd rather get Kovalev for nothing. Pens aren't trading those prospects unless it's part of a better.. less injury prone package.

AugustBurnsRed* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-08-2011, 12:09 AM
  #44
senatoilers*
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 415
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hale The Villain View Post
2nds generally have a higher chance of turning into something nowaways compared to the late 90s and early 2000s.

Want proof? It's looking likely that Silfverberg, Lehner and Wiercioch will turn into players for us.

senatoilers* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-08-2011, 12:28 AM
  #45
The Fuhr
Registered User
 
The Fuhr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Hamilton,Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 34,463
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by trentmccleary View Post
Teams don't rebuild "in one year". Ottawa is re-tooling.

Cap space is irrelevant to Ottawa in the near future. Cowen, Rundblad and Lottery pick will drive down the cost of the team.

Your proposal has nothing to do with adding any potential 1st line calibre prospects. You're merely adding 3 mediocre pieces and we'd be damn lucky if any of them turned into Michalek in the next 5 years. We can get pieces like that for UFA's this year and next.... while maintaining a decent team for the prospects to join.
If the goal is to win a cup it's simply not going to happen trying to plug holes with a lack of depth behind it.

If you think Jeffrey is mediocre then you can't possibly think we have anything of substance 25 or younger among forwards.

I think the Sens should be dropping as much money as they can, adding tons of young depth and see what sticks. Then they can buy talent when the youth has matured and it's ready.

You said so yourself
Quote:
I've seen a lot of prospects come and go over the years; lots of them were 2nd rounders.
Would it not make sense to load up on as much youth as possible? We have those young D... it would be nice to develop 10-15 young forwards with them and see what blooms.

That to me sounds promising

The Fuhr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-08-2011, 12:30 AM
  #46
Jules Winnfield
I gives no ****s!!!
 
Jules Winnfield's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,266
vCash: 500
Before Sens fans think I'm crazy, but I'd rather have Kovalev on the Pens than Michalek and here's why.

The Pens forwards are a bunch of grinders that put pressure in the offensive zone through forechecking under Bylsma's system. With Malkin hurt, Crosby is the only other forward on the team who can effectively carry the puck in the offensive zone. On the defensive side, Letang is slick and is great at carrying the puck in.

Take Crosby out of the equation and the Pens then become a dump/chase team. Adding Kovalev to the mix gives them another option for someone who can carry the puck in the zone. Plus he loved playing in Pittsburgh and Lemieux likes him a lot, so maybe it would light a fire under his ass.

Jules Winnfield is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-08-2011, 12:33 AM
  #47
Zen Arcade
eat the record cover
 
Zen Arcade's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Pittsburgh
Country: United States
Posts: 13,374
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4thliner View Post
Pens 1st = Ottawa 2nd

Why would Ottawa be even remotely interested in moving Michalek for a late 1st??? And you are even saying you wanna get an impact star player for that? lollllll
He never said it would be a 1st for an impact player straight up.

He even referenced the Hossa trade where a first was part of a bigger package.

Zen Arcade is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-08-2011, 12:55 AM
  #48
trentmccleary
Registered User
 
trentmccleary's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Alfie-Ville
Posts: 18,668
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fuhr View Post
If the goal is to win a cup it's simply not going to happen trying to plug holes with a lack of depth behind it.

If you think Jeffrey is mediocre then you can't possibly think we have anything of substance 25 or younger among forwards.

I think the Sens should be dropping as much money as they can, adding tons of young depth and see what sticks. Then they can buy talent when the youth has matured and it's ready.

You said so yourself


Would it not make sense to load up on as much youth as possible? We have those young D... it would be nice to develop 10-15 young forwards with them and see what blooms.

That to me sounds promising
Ottawa has depth, on the team and in the prospect pool. The key areas to address are #1 goalie and upwards of two 1st line calibre offensive forwards. That's top end talent, not depth.

Perennial losers with no contributing veteran leadership produce some very flawed players who never lead their teams anywhere and never have any concept of what it takes to win. Actively stripping down the cap instead of just trading expiring salaries as they come or prospects actually prove they can replace vets is a terrible idea.

Recent Cup winners have had a mix of vets and youngsters, typically gaining great value on the youngsters' low ELC's to build teams that are better value than the cap.

trentmccleary is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-08-2011, 06:31 AM
  #49
Skk82
Registered User
 
Skk82's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Arlington, VA
Country: United States
Posts: 4,107
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4thliner View Post
Pens 1st = Ottawa 2nd

Why would Ottawa be even remotely interested in moving Michalek for a late 1st??? And you are even saying you wanna get an impact star player for that? lollllll
No, I'm saying the Pens acquiring a Despres/Bennett caliber prospect is more valuable to a team like Pittsburgh- especially for an organization that's relatively light in terms of the caliber of prospects in the system right now.

Skk82 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-08-2011, 09:27 AM
  #50
The Fuhr
Registered User
 
The Fuhr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Hamilton,Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 34,463
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by trentmccleary View Post
Ottawa has depth, on the team and in the prospect pool. The key areas to address are #1 goalie and upwards of two 1st line calibre offensive forwards. That's top end talent, not depth.

Perennial losers with no contributing veteran leadership produce some very flawed players who never lead their teams anywhere and never have any concept of what it takes to win. Actively stripping down the cap instead of just trading expiring salaries as they come or prospects actually prove they can replace vets is a terrible idea.

Recent Cup winners have had a mix of vets and youngsters, typically gaining great value on the youngsters' low ELC's to build teams that are better value than the cap.
Sens players not set to hit UFA within two years
Spezza, Alfredsson, Michalek, Fisher
+
Youth
Regin, Foligno, Butler, Regin, Smith, Silfverberg, O'Brien and the 2011 first

You honestly think that there will be a forward core capable of winning a cup?

1. It's not good enough
2. The Sens will not attract prime UFA aged players for the first line... only 1-2 hit UFA anyways

So how does one go about finding top line talent? Need to build the depth up, open cap space and then see what sticks and trade the excess depth in packages for top end talent.

What you want the Sens to do is not possible. The Sens will not attract the UFAs you think they will...

The Fuhr is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:39 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.