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Leafs and Oilers Part 2

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Old
02-13-2011, 09:18 AM
  #1
LEAFANFORLIFE23
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Leafs and Oilers Part 2

To Leafs Dustin Penner

To oilers Versteeg + gunnarson or another young D man.

Why Edmonton does this they get a young winger and a proven playoff Performer to teach the guys like Hall Eberle and MPS whst it takes to win a stanley cup. Also he's only 24 his best years are ahead of him.

Why Toronto does this.

They complete what would be a VERY deep set of wingers it allows them to put Penner with Kessel Kuliemin back with Macarthur Armstrong with Lupul and Brown with Orr. Thats some serious depth right there.

I don't think it's that far off what do you think? if Gunnarson doesn'tdo it who would we have to add to Versteeg? be realistic that means DON'T say Schenn + versteeg

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02-13-2011, 09:21 AM
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Not giving up Versteeg, liking a future 3rd line of Versteeg - Bozak - Armstrong. Our wingers should be:

Penner-Kessel
Kule-Mac
Versteeg-Armstrong
Brown - Brent/Sjos/Hanson


I'd give up a package of picks and prospects for Penner. Or a deal around Kaberle but I doubt edmonton has interest in that.

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02-13-2011, 09:24 AM
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Oilers don't need another midget.

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Old
02-13-2011, 09:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Outrageous Leafs Fan View Post
I'd give up a package of picks and prospects for Penner.
OK. We'll trade Penner for your first... phone Chiarelli and let him know.

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02-13-2011, 09:49 AM
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Edmonton is not trading Penner for a winger. There's a possibility that they might trade Penner for a package that includes a tough as nails checking line center...but no way are we dealing for a guy we'd likely put on the wing.

Edmonton is interested in defensemen, high end defensive prospects and draft picks.

Yes, I can read Tambolini's mind.

With Horcoff playing decent hockey when healthy, he's without a doubt penciled in as a top 2 center with Edmonton.

As long as Gagner is with the Oilers, he's in the same boat.

We might end up drafting someone who could take away Gagner or Horcoff's minutes, but we're not going to trade for a guy who'd be as good as either of these individuals at center unless we're going to trade Gagner away.

Pitlick is hopefully 2 years away from playing 3rd line center. He's got offensive upside, he's got size and he plays a mean game.

Edmonton and Toronto are horrible trading partners. This is a mystery to nobody except the casual Leafs fans who seem to come on these boards once a week or so to write a proposal involving the Oilers, which doesn't meet any of Edmonton's needs.

Edmonton is going to get a quality package for Penner. If they can't get that, they'll wait till next year to trade him. It's as simple as that. You don't trade away someone who's lead your team in goals several years in a row for chicken feed, no matter how horribly your team has preformed as a team over that period of time.

Please, quit dreaming.

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Old
02-13-2011, 10:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roof Daddy View Post
OK. We'll trade Penner for your first... phone Chiarelli and let him know.
WIN!

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02-13-2011, 10:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LEAFANFORLIFE23 View Post
To Leafs Dustin Penner

To oilers Versteeg + gunnarson or another young D man.

Why Edmonton does this they get a young winger and a proven playoff Performer to teach the guys like Hall Eberle and MPS whst it takes to win a stanley cup. Also he's only 24 his best years are ahead of him.

Why Toronto does this.

They complete what would be a VERY deep set of wingers it allows them to put Penner with Kessel Kuliemin back with Macarthur Armstrong with Lupul and Brown with Orr. Thats some serious depth right there.

I don't think it's that far off what do you think? if Gunnarson doesn'tdo it who would we have to add to Versteeg? be realistic that means DON'T say Schenn + versteeg

You are not going to get Versteeg + Gunnarson for Penner no matter how many times you want to believe it. Personally would not trade Versteeg for him straight up, plus would Burke really want to have him?

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02-13-2011, 10:09 AM
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LEAFANFORLIFE23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thadd View Post
Edmonton is not trading Penner for a winger. There's a possibility that they might trade Penner for a package that includes a tough as nails checking line center...but no way are we dealing for a guy we'd likely put on the wing.

Edmonton is interested in defensemen, high end defensive prospects and draft picks.

Yes, I can read Tambolini's mind.

With Horcoff playing decent hockey when healthy, he's without a doubt penciled in as a top 2 center with Edmonton.

As long as Gagner is with the Oilers, he's in the same boat.

We might end up drafting someone who could take away Gagner or Horcoff's minutes, but we're not going to trade for a guy who'd be as good as either of these individuals at center unless we're going to trade Gagner away.

Pitlick is hopefully 2 years away from playing 3rd line center. He's got offensive upside, he's got size and he plays a mean game.

Edmonton and Toronto are horrible trading partners. This is a mystery to nobody except the casual Leafs fans who seem to come on these boards once a week or so to write a proposal involving the Oilers, which doesn't meet any of Edmonton's needs.

Edmonton is going to get a quality package for Penner. If they can't get that, they'll wait till next year to trade him. It's as simple as that. You don't trade away someone who's lead your team in goals several years in a row for chicken feed, no matter how horribly your team has preformed as a team over that period of time.

Please, quit dreaming.

Versteeg and Gunnar are quaality players they are FAR from "chicken feed"

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02-13-2011, 10:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roof Daddy View Post
OK. We'll trade Penner for your first... phone Chiarelli and let him know.
So you're suggesting Penner for Toronto's 1st rounder? I highly doubt there's any way Oilers fans would laugh at that one.

That's 6th overall as things stand now.(Odds favor it heavily if they had the lottery today.) If Toronto ends up trading one or several of Giggy, Versteeg or Kaberle, the Leafs are just going to end up playing even worse.

If Burke found satisfactory packages for all 3 of these guys... and yeah... if Kaberle waives his NTC, you'd probably end up giving us 3rd or 4th overall.

With Ryder off the books next year, Penner's contract would be easy to take on. It's only 500K more than what Ryder makes.

I kinda think Boston would want something more. I doubt Edmonton throws in anyone in their system who's got any serious potential.

I'd be excited to see something like

Penner
2011 2nd
Bottom 8 prospect on our top 20 or 2011 3rd

For Toronto's 1st rounder.

With Penner gone, we'd certainly have 1st or 2nd overall locked into place. With Ottawa's situation at center now, they're going to draft a center with 1st or 2nd overall, leaving Edmonton to draft Larsson, if Edmonton ends up with 2nd overall.

If Toronto's 1st rounder ended up as low as 3rd or 4th, they might get the 2nd best center...if not Edmonton would likely end up drafting a damn good d-man. Would look like an incredible draft year for Edmonton's rebuild.

Ahh.... what it feels like to dream...

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Old
02-13-2011, 10:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LEAFANFORLIFE23 View Post
Versteeg and Gunnar are quaality(quality) players they are FAR from "chicken feed"
Yes, they are quality players. Edmonton is only going to trade Penner for someone they believe will be an impact player. You don't trade your perennial leading goal scorer for a few guys who're very good quality plugs.

Versteeg is a good supplementary scorer and Gunnar is possibly going to be a pretty good #4 d-man.

You can't possibly expect Oilers fans to believe that such a package amounts to the same value as their leading goal scorer.

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02-13-2011, 10:37 AM
  #11
LEAFANFORLIFE23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thadd View Post
Yes, they are quality players. Edmonton is only going to trade Penner for someone they believe will be an impact player. You don't trade your perennial leading goal scorer for a few guys who're very good quality plugs.

Versteeg is a good supplementary scorer and Gunnar is possibly going to be a pretty good #4 d-man.

You can't possibly expect Oilers fans to believe that such a package amounts to the same value as their leading goal scorer.
if you don't like the deal thats fine I was more disputing the chicken feed line it sounded like you were calling them garbage which they are not.

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02-13-2011, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thadd View Post
So you're suggesting Penner for Toronto's 1st rounder? I highly doubt there's any way Oilers fans would laugh at that one.

That's 6th overall as things stand now.(Odds favor it heavily if they had the lottery today.) If Toronto ends up trading one or several of Giggy, Versteeg or Kaberle, the Leafs are just going to end up playing even worse.

If Burke found satisfactory packages for all 3 of these guys... and yeah... if Kaberle waives his NTC, you'd probably end up giving us 3rd or 4th overall.

With Ryder off the books next year, Penner's contract would be easy to take on. It's only 500K more than what Ryder makes.

I kinda think Boston would want something more. I doubt Edmonton throws in anyone in their system who's got any serious potential.

I'd be excited to see something like

Penner
2011 2nd
Bottom 8 prospect on our top 20 or 2011 3rd

For Toronto's 1st rounder.

With Penner gone, we'd certainly have 1st or 2nd overall locked into place. With Ottawa's situation at center now, they're going to draft a center with 1st or 2nd overall, leaving Edmonton to draft Larsson, if Edmonton ends up with 2nd overall.

If Toronto's 1st rounder ended up as low as 3rd or 4th, they might get the 2nd best center...if not Edmonton would likely end up drafting a damn good d-man. Would look like an incredible draft year for Edmonton's rebuild.

Ahh.... what it feels like to dream...
not even close you wont get that first for a guy with a career 63 points

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Old
02-13-2011, 10:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LEAFANFORLIFE23 View Post
To Leafs Dustin Penner

To oilers Versteeg + gunnarson or another young D man.

Why Edmonton does this they get a young winger and a proven playoff Performer to teach the guys like Hall Eberle and MPS whst it takes to win a stanley cup. Also he's only 24 his best years are ahead of him.
Sounds like Dustin Penner

Pass on the deal, no interest in Versteeg from an Oilers point of view. Gunnarson seems like a good prospect, but I think we could get more from a different team.

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02-13-2011, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by TML g u n n e R s View Post
not even close you wont get that first for a guy with a career 63 points
Bruins got it for a guy with a career high 60.

Dont kill me it's a joke!

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02-13-2011, 10:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LEAFANFORLIFE23 View Post
if you don't like the deal thats fine I was more disputing the chicken feed line it sounded like you were calling them garbage which they are not.
I guess that's an accurate description.

Like what if I said Theo Peckham(Playing way beyond what was expected of him this year. I think some Oilers fans now and later put him ahead of Smid in the pecking order now.) + Linus Omark(Still needs work on defensive game, but is looking like a legit top-6 forward. Small but gritty, creative and shifty as hell) for Nazem Kadri?

I can imagine there's be half a dozen nasty things you'd stop yourself from writing at risk of getting infractions.

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02-13-2011, 10:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Akonite View Post
Bruins got it for a guy with a career high 60.

Dont kill me it's a joke!
Ha!.

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02-13-2011, 10:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TML g u n n e R s View Post
not even close you wont get that first for a guy with a career 63 points
Oh, come on now. This has nothing to do with Toronto. You gave up your first rounder fair and square a long time ago. This is between a Bruins fan and an Oilers fan.

We've been arguing with some of your crazy fans ever since Burke arrived in Toronto over Penner's value.

You say Penner for Bozak

Then I say Kadri for a 6th rounder

Then you say Gagner + Hall for Schenn

Then I say Kessel + Kaberle resigned + Toronto's 2012, 2013 and 2014 1st rounders for Taylor Chorney's mother's chocolate chip recipe.

We just go round and round in circles.

Penner is a winger.

Does Kessel need a winger? Maybe, but not a goal scorer. That's for sure. He needs a quality play maker. Most notably, a center like Richards, if he's UFA come that special time of the year.

Can anyone possibly disagree with that? Why on earth must we have these arguments about something that's completely impossible in the eyes of most Oilers fans again and again? (Penner or Toronto)

Edmonton would be happy to do a deal for Schenn, but he's off limits. Edmonton would probably be interested in Kadri, regardless of what they grab at this upcoming draft, but Kadri is off limits too.

Toronto would probably be happy with giving Gagner a chance, but he's off limits. Toronto would probably also be happy with taking a spin with Hemsky(playmaker), but it's just not going to happen due to what our teams have to offer one-another.

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02-13-2011, 10:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thadd View Post
Oh, come on now. This has nothing to do with Toronto. You gave up your first rounder fair and square a long time ago. This is between a Bruins fan and an Oilers fan.

We've been arguing with some of your crazy fans ever since Burke arrived in Toronto over Penner's value.

You say Penner for Bozak

Then I say Kadri for a 6th rounder

Then you say Gagner + Hall for Schenn

Then I say Kessel + Kaberle resigned + Toronto's 2012, 2013 and 2014 1st rounders for Taylor Chorney's mother's chocolate chip recipe.

We just go round and round in circles.

Penner is a winger.

Does Kessel need a winger? Maybe, but not a goal scorer. That's for sure. He needs a quality play maker. Most notably, a center like Richards, if he's UFA come that special time of the year.

Can anyone possibly disagree with that? Why on earth must we have these arguments about something that's completely impossible in the eyes of most Oilers fans again and again? (Penner or Toronto)

Edmonton would be happy to do a deal for Schenn, but he's off limits. Edmonton would probably be interested in Kadri, regardless of what they grab at this upcoming draft, but Kadri is off limits too.

Toronto would probably be happy with giving Gagner a chance, but he's off limits. Toronto would probably also be happy with taking a spin with Hemsky(playmaker), but it's just not going to happen due to what our teams have to offer one-another.
when did i say anything about toronto... all i said is i doubt boston does that..

that has nothing to do with Toronto

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Old
02-13-2011, 10:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Akonite View Post
Bruins got it for a guy with a career high 60.

Dont kill me it's a joke!
Love that comment, but liking that avatar even more.

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02-13-2011, 11:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TML g u n n e R s View Post
when did i say anything about toronto... all i said is i doubt boston does that..

that has nothing to do with Toronto
You obviously just skimmed what I wrote instead of actually reading it, but that's OK.

I'd be crazy if I were to say that I expect Edmonton to land another top 5 pick without giving up a young prospect, but I can always hope. Tambolini tried to do it last year at the draft, and he's going to try to do it again at this upcoming draft.

Look at what Florida got for Horton---Florida Panthers traded Nathan Horton and Gregory Campbell to the Boston Bruins for Dennis Wideman, a 1st round selection in 2010 and a 3rd round selection in 2011. -

Not a bad package. A 1st rounder and a decent option to have play as #2 dman. Good cap hit, on wideman, as well.

Horton is 3 years younger than Penner, has played 1 more year in the NHL.

Penner is coming off of a 63 point season and is probably going to end up with high 50's/low 60's in terms of point production on the worst team in the league.

Horton is horribly inconsistent, gets injured now and then and hasn't hit 60 points since 2007-08. (he's done it twice)

Horton was traded because his numbers had been sucking. He couldn't stay healthy enough to put up the points they needed out of him.

Penner is looking like his comfort range on the league worst team is 30G/30A when his team's best playmaker is missing a significant amount of time each year. He's consistent, lacks an injury history, is bigger and every year on average lands more hits while also taking fewer penalty minutes.

To suggest that Edmonton can expect a similar package if Penner is traded now is fair. That team is going to get a playoff run with him this year and a full season out of him before they decide whether or not to resign him.

In my mind he's the best power forward available in the trade market right now. So no, the value isn't that far off. Boston might be thinking "Man, we can't wait forever for Savard to go on a healthy streak. Let's make this deal to and go on an epic cup run." or they might be thinking "Toronto's 1st could draft us a puck moving d-man we'll be needing", but I think they'll use other playing chips to upgrade their defense.

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