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Schenn (LA) available for a top line forward?

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Old
02-13-2011, 03:04 PM
  #76
Oilfan2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chalfdiggity3 View Post
you obviously know nothing about hockey then. Hemsky while a good player isnt even near as talented as Gaborik is. ***** and whine all you want about gaboriks history of being injured 3 years ago. He has consistantly played 70 games or more every season since. He hasnt had an injury related to his past injures since the year he took off. The guy has played on a team with no other first line players the past two seasons for the rangers and if you look at the stats hes over a ppg player.

Please i dare you to post a poll up on here asking who the better player is and who they would rather have on their team, Hemsky or Gaborik even with the cap and i promise you you will be laughed at and get a resounding answer of Gaborik hands down over Hemsky.

Please gain some perspective and knowledge before posting something as ridiculous as this.
How about we poll NHL GM's instead??... folks who know more about the game than...aw, never mind...Not even worth my time, to be honest. Just looking at your location tells me all I need to know about where your perspective lies...

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Old
02-13-2011, 03:04 PM
  #77
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Shoot, you could almost afford two Hemsky's when you talk about that contract... Some people around here don't seem to understand salary cap implications.

to oilfan22- good point. Eastern fans forget theres more than 15 teams in the league that you can watch. Probably never even heard of gaborik when he was with the wild.

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Old
02-13-2011, 03:04 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by rajuabju View Post
We're just gonna offer sheet Parise
Yeah... cause losing 4 1st round pick (that's what it woud take for Lou not to match) is worst then losing Schenn?

I like your thinking

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Old
02-13-2011, 03:06 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Kingjordan View Post
He is available....
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For Ovi or Sid or Nash
no overrating here

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Old
02-13-2011, 03:08 PM
  #80
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to L.A. - versteeg , kadri

to tor - schenn
2nd round pick


Last edited by 93gilmour93: 02-13-2011 at 03:16 PM.
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Old
02-13-2011, 03:14 PM
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSimpson18 View Post
The difference between Gaborik and Hemsky is alot closer than you think. Hemsky is criminally underrated and the 7.5mil versus 4mil difference puts Hemsky over the top. That contract is just a killer, why else are Ranger fans even discussing moving him?

You're opinion is no more or less valid than anyone else, except you don't seem to appreciate how good Hemmer is. And arguing who his teammates are? Hemsky plays for Edmonton... His center is Shawn Horcoff... And he's still around ppg every year.
He got offered that much because hes worth that much. i understand the contract implications with what your saying but that doesnt make hemsky better at all. Gaborik is just better PERIOD, he is a top 10 talent in the nhl. Ranger fans and Sather arent discussing moving him, maybe if you reading comprehension was above the 5th grade you can see that other teams are inquiring about him, bc other teams WANT him, not the other way around. We have no interest in trading him, but if you get a deal that you cant refuse then you go with it. Sather wouldnt be a good gm if he didnt atleast listen to what other teams are offering.

I know how good hemmer is and i think hes a very talented player, but give me a break. Hes not anywhere near as good or talented as Gaborik, its not even a debate. HAHA i would much rather have Horcoff centering Gaborik instead of Erik Christenson.

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02-13-2011, 03:17 PM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oilfan22 View Post
How about we poll NHL GM's instead??... folks who know more about the game than...aw, never mind...Not even worth my time, to be honest. Just looking at your location tells me all I need to know about where your perspective lies...
Whatever you say there vanilla ice. You can poll whoever you want, GM's and anyone else in the league would rather have Gaborik over Hemsky. Hmm i wonder why so many teams wanted Gaborik when he was a FA? Your pathetic if you think location has anything to do with someones hockey knowledge.

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Old
02-13-2011, 03:22 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Chalfdiggity3 View Post
Whatever you say there vanilla ice. You can poll whoever you want, GM's and anyone else in the league would rather have Gaborik over Hemsky. Hmm i wonder why so many teams wanted Gaborik when he was a FA? Your pathetic if you think location has anything to do with someones hockey knowledge.
i agree. hemsky is a good player but gaborik is the better player hands down. the only thing thats the same between the two is the injury plagued seasons.

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02-13-2011, 03:23 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Chalfdiggity3 View Post
Whatever you say there vanilla ice. You can poll whoever you want, GM's and anyone else in the league would rather have Gaborik over Hemsky. Hmm i wonder why so many teams wanted Gaborik when he was a FA? Your pathetic if you think location has anything to do with someones hockey knowledge.
Keep in mind that it is more than just talent at stake here. A few years ago, the less informed also thought that Drury and Gomez were great FA signings at $7mm per. Not so much anymore, eh?

Gaborik brings risk to the table given his contract and injury history.

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02-13-2011, 03:23 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by CSimpson18 View Post
Shoot, you could almost afford two Hemsky's when you talk about that contract... Some people around here don't seem to understand salary cap implications.

to oilfan22- good point. Eastern fans forget theres more than 15 teams in the league that you can watch. Probably never even heard of gaborik when he was with the wild.
You can talk about the contract all you want, Gaborik is worth more in terms of a trade and to a team than hemsky. Just stop with the salary cap implications, the rangers have plenty of cap to sign all their RFAs and depending upon what we do with drury we can even sign Richards to a 6-7m/yr contract and have some capspace left. Please know what your talking about before saying something.

Just because im from the east doesnt mean i dont watch all 30 teams in the nhl, and know all the players to a good extent. I knew of gaborik when he first entered the league in 2000 and drafted 3rd overall.

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Old
02-13-2011, 03:23 PM
  #86
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Since the LA system is ridiculously deep in prospects, lets try a quantity for quality deal:

To LA: Spezza, Kovalev and Ruutu (only Spezza remains after this season)

To Ottawa: Voynov, Deslauriers, Jones, Toffoli, and Clifford

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Old
02-13-2011, 03:24 PM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chalfdiggity3 View Post
He got offered that much because hes worth that much. i understand the contract implications with what your saying but that doesnt make hemsky better at all. Gaborik is just better PERIOD, he is a top 10 talent in the nhl. Ranger fans and Sather arent discussing moving him, maybe if you reading comprehension was above the 5th grade you can see that other teams are inquiring about him, bc other teams WANT him, not the other way around. We have no interest in trading him, but if you get a deal that you cant refuse then you go with it. Sather wouldnt be a good gm if he didnt atleast listen to what other teams are offering.

I know how good hemmer is and i think hes a very talented player, but give me a break. Hes not anywhere near as good or talented as Gaborik, its not even a debate. HAHA i would much rather have Horcoff centering Gaborik instead of Erik Christenson.
Why the insults? They just make you look childish, doesn't help your argument at all. The discussion was about value to a team. I'll take 2 Hemsky's over 1 Gaborik ANY DAY OF THE WEEK.

Since lockout:
Gaborik 351points in 326GP
Hemsky 322points in 351GP
Edge Gaborik but it's close.

This year:
Hemsky .87ppg
Gaborik .84ppg
Edge Hemsky but it's close

Playoffs since lockout:
Hemsky 17points in 24GP
Gaborik 5points in 11GP
edge Hemsky. It's not close but small sample sizes.

In what world should Gaborik be worth close to twice as much? Give me Hemsky please.

As for NYR keeping Gaborik and having no cap problems, you and Slats are in complete agreement. Have fun paying Richards-Gaborik a combined 15million. Lombardi is smarter than that.

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Old
02-13-2011, 03:26 PM
  #88
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our biggest problem areas on the Kings currently are:

1. elite winger(gamebreaker) to play with Kopitar
2. offensive 2nd line center to takepressure of Kopitar

-Schenn is near ready and being billed as a top 2 center. Why trade a young kid with great upside that will fill a need if not next year, the year after. This makes him more valuable to the Kings franchise and we would want more then his proper NHL value.

A few things may change this.

-If L.A landed a guy like Spezza or Richards(re-signed), then that takes away the importance of having a guy like Schenn who is ready to step in and drops his value to L.A.
-If he is needed in a package for a proven, consistantly healthy, elite game breaker like Nash or Parise then yes, I trade him in a package for that elite player. Guys like Gaborik (health), Hemsky (health, not a gamebreaker) would be nice, but do to certain valid concerns, I don't include a prospect like Schenn.

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02-13-2011, 03:27 PM
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tomd View Post
Keep in mind that it is more than just talent at stake here. A few years ago, the less informed also thought that Drury and Gomez were great FA signings at $7mm per. Not so much anymore, eh?

Gaborik brings risk to the table given his contract and injury history.
Not really, its all about talent. Yea they werent great signings back then but if you look at what the rangers fanbase has said in the past when we first signed them, most ranger fans believed that both of them werent close to being a good signing at 7m per. Lets keep in mind that Gaborik IS worth the contract, plus i believe gomez is gone isnt he? While drury may be gone after this season and if not then his contract is done next season anyway.

Leave the Injury history out of it already, Hemsky and Gaborik havent had a major injury relating to their injury risk in years. The injuries that had occurred to both players since have been injuries that would hurt and take out any player for a period of time.

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02-13-2011, 03:35 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Chalfdiggity3 View Post
Not really, its all about talent. Yea they werent great signings back then but if you look at what the rangers fanbase has said in the past when we first signed them, most ranger fans believed that both of them werent close to being a good signing at 7m per. Lets keep in mind that Gaborik IS worth the contract, plus i believe gomez is gone isnt he? While drury may be gone after this season and if not then his contract is done next season anyway.

Leave the Injury history out of it already, Hemsky and Gaborik havent had a major injury relating to their injury risk in years. The injuries that had occurred to both players since have been injuries that would hurt and take out any player for a period of time.
So you take out the injuries then...What you have left are two talented offensive players so you now have to look at points and cost. As noted above, production is pretty close at half the cost. Does that not equate to value?

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02-13-2011, 03:42 PM
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSimpson18 View Post
Why the insults? They just make you look childish, doesn't help your argument at all. The discussion was about value to a team. I'll take 2 Hemsky's over 1 Gaborik ANY DAY OF THE WEEK.

Since lockout:
Gaborik 351points in 326GP
Hemsky 322points in 351GP
Edge Gaborik but it's close.

This year:
Hemsky .87ppg
Gaborik .84ppg
Edge Hemsky but it's close

Playoffs since lockout:
Hemsky 17points in 24GP
Gaborik 5points in 11GP
edge Hemsky. It's not close but small sample sizes.

In what world should Gaborik be worth close to twice as much? Give me Hemsky please.

As for NYR keeping Gaborik and having no cap problems, you and Slats are in complete agreement. Have fun paying Richards-Gaborik a combined 15million. Lombardi is smarter than that.
Your insults as to where i live and my hockey knowledge are just pathetic and like a little girl. Remove your tampon for a moment and do the math. Since the lockout, hmm

Gaborik - 1.08
Hemsky - .91

Ha ill gladly sign Richards to a 6m per year contract. He is a top center man in the game, and he as well averages basically a ppg and can play the point on the pp. Both positionally and play that is needed for the rangers. They have a ton of top end two way players, they are in need of top end scoring talent to play with gaborik.

The contract inflation is just what happens to players when they hit the FA market, since every team is bidding with each other.I dont mind overpaying a little for a player who is worth that type of money. If Hemsky was to hit the open market he would garner more than what he is earning. I never said Hemsky isnt a great player, just that Gaborik is a much better player.

This arguement isnt about would you rather 2 hemskys over 1 gaborik. Its about who is the better player. Gaborik over hemsky any day of the week

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02-13-2011, 03:43 PM
  #92
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The only person I would even think of trading Schenn for, who has been rumored to move, his Gaborik. It's a high risk high reward, but Kopitar's big body protecting the puck passing it to a streaking Gaborik with Brown handling the grit. Wow what a line.

Brown-Kopitar-Gaborik, that's an elite line. But with Schenn, he's almost NHL ready. So I don't know, who'd be #2 C for the future? You know Schenn won't get that #1 as long as Kopitar is there.

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02-13-2011, 03:58 PM
  #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chalfdiggity3 View Post
He got offered that much because hes worth that much. i understand the contract implications with what your saying but that doesnt make hemsky better at all. Gaborik is just better PERIOD, he is a top 10 talent in the nhl. Ranger fans and Sather arent discussing moving him, maybe if you reading comprehension was above the 5th grade you can see that other teams are inquiring about him, bc other teams WANT him, not the other way around. We have no interest in trading him, but if you get a deal that you cant refuse then you go with it. Sather wouldnt be a good gm if he didnt atleast listen to what other teams are offering.

I know how good hemmer is and i think hes a very talented player, but give me a break. Hes not anywhere near as good or talented as Gaborik, its not even a debate. HAHA i would much rather have Horcoff centering Gaborik instead of Erik Christenson.
That tells us all we need to know about your hockey knowledge. Top 10 in the NHL...

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Old
02-13-2011, 04:07 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by Chalfdiggity3 View Post
Your insults as to where i live and my hockey knowledge are just pathetic and like a little girl. Remove your tampon for a moment and do the math. Since the lockout, hmm
Okay it looks like I'm engaged in a battle of wits with an unarmed man so I'm not gonna keep it up for much longer but here we go.

You entered the conversation with this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chalfdiggity3 View Post
you obviously know nothing about hockey then.

Please gain some perspective and knowledge before posting something as ridiculous as this.
How dare anyone call your hockey knowledge into question! HOW DARE THEY!!!!!!1!!

Then there came this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chalfdiggity3 View Post
maybe if you reading comprehension was above the 5th grade you can see that other teams are inquiring about him, bc other teams WANT him, not the other way around. Sather wouldnt be a good gm if he didnt atleast listen to what other teams are offering.
Really? Sather a good gm? Is it 1985 again? To say nothing of the irony of insulting someone's reading while demonstrating such poor grammar and spelling.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chalfdiggity3 View Post
Leave the Injury history out of it already, Hemsky and Gaborik havent had a major injury relating to their injury risk in years.
Not sure what you're trying to say there. The fact is both players get injured alot. To expect that to change when there's so much history to say otherwise shows you're either being intellectually dishonest on purpose or you don't realize how often the two have been hurt.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chalfdiggity3 View Post
Remove your tampon for a moment and do the math. Since the lockout, hmm

Gaborik - 1.08
Hemsky - .91
I did do the math. It's close. Is 10 points a season worth 3.5million? I don't think so but I guess you do. Pretty sure people don't get jobs as GMs in the NHL with that type of thinking. Unless maybe you can ride Gretzky/Moose to the top...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chalfdiggity3 View Post
Ha ill gladly sign Richards to a 6m per year contract.
You think Slats will pull that off? What makes you think that? The Drury contract? 8mil for Gomez? Redden? Gaborik @7.5? Good luck with that...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chalfdiggity3 View Post
This arguement isnt about would you rather 2 hemskys over 1 gaborik. Its about who is the better player. Gaborik over hemsky any day of the week
The discussion is about who is more appealing for LA. Keep in mind Dean Lombardi doesn't overpay for anyone and has a boatload of young guys expecting raises in the next few years. Thanks for playing.

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02-13-2011, 04:12 PM
  #95
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LA will still be a strong team when Schenn comes around to the NHL. It's likely they will be even better as their other prospects should emerge on the scene.

They'll have their top line forward soon enough.

Don't get me wrong, if a guy like Parise or Bobby Ryan is offered who are both relatively young, Schenn+ is up for grabs.

For Iginla and to a lesser extent Gaborik, it's not such a good idea.

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02-13-2011, 04:16 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by Volchenkov 28 View Post
LA will still be a strong team when Schenn comes around to the NHL. It's likely they will be even better as their other prospects should emerge on the scene.

They'll have their top line forward soon enough.

Don't get me wrong, if a guy like Parise or Bobby Ryan is offered who are both relatively young, Schenn+ is up for grabs.

For Iginla and to a lesser extent Gaborik, it's not such a good idea.
Agreed.

And finally, if Gaborik and Hemsky are such wonderful talents (and they are) then the Rangers and Oilers should have no interest in trading them.

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02-13-2011, 04:22 PM
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Originally Posted by tomd View Post
Agreed.

And finally, if Gaborik and Hemsky are such wonderful talents (and they are) then the Rangers and Oilers should have no interest in trading them.
Oilers won't be able to resign one of Hemsky/Penner when the ELCs of Hall/Eberle/Pajaarvi end. Simply trying to get a good return on a player that will inevitably be gone. For Edmonton it's not about icing the best team next year but rather in 3 years when it's time to contend.

Rangers would move Gaborik if the return provided actual value for their dollars.

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02-13-2011, 04:28 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by CSimpson18 View Post
Okay it looks like I'm engaged in a battle of wits with an unarmed man so I'm not gonna keep it up for much longer but here we go.

You entered the conversation with this:



How dare anyone call your hockey knowledge into question! HOW DARE THEY!!!!!!1!!

Haha bc of the fact that you think hemsky is a better hockey player than gaborik, and what the Kings need and want is a gamebreaking player and hemsky is NOT that. Gaborik is.

Then there came this:



Really? Sather a good gm? Is it 1985 again? To say nothing of the irony of insulting someone's reading while demonstrating such poor grammar and spelling.

Yea actually sather has been a good gm lately, he is finally rebuilding in the right way, has lots of young talent that he has kept together. He is continually getting the team younger and better. I agree he hasnt been the best at signing players but he is a master at trades.


Not sure what you're trying to say there. The fact is both players get injured alot. To expect that to change when there's so much history to say otherwise shows you're either being intellectually dishonest on purpose or you don't realize how often the two have been hurt.

The fact is Gaborik hasnt had a major injury to his groin in years. The injuries that he has recieved were for a dislocated shoulder, which can easily happen to anyone. I do know how often Gaborik has been hurt, and his groin isnt the problem anymore. Hence, why he has played over 70games in both seasons with the rangers.


I did do the math. It's close. Is 10 points a season worth 3.5million? I don't think so but I guess you do. Pretty sure people don't get jobs as GMs in the NHL with that type of thinking. Unless maybe you can ride Gretzky/Moose to the top...

Gaborik is having a bad year this year and still outscoring hemsky, Gaborik had over 80pts last year as well. Since he has been with the rangers, yes he is worth the money.



You think Slats will pull that off? What makes you think that? The Drury contract? 8mil for Gomez? Redden? Gaborik @7.5? Good luck with that...

Maybe has to do with the fact that redden is in the minors and has been a great influence on the young kids on defense there. Gomez is gone and hasnt been our problem in years, plus we recieved a very good dman in Mcdonagh who will be a top 4 dman. Drury is pretty much done with the rangers at the end of this season and regardless will be gone next year. I admit those signings werent great except for Gaborik but to say Richards isnt worth the money is retarted. Hes a consistant 80pt player a year.

Besides that why wouldnt Richards want to sign here? He gets to play in NY, will play along side one of the best players in the nhl, there are ALOT of young talented players on the rangers roster who will continue to get better, and lets not forget a top 3 goalie in lundqvist. The rangers are a year or two away from being able to compete for the cup with their players maturing, getting better, and with more young talent being infused into the club every year.



The discussion is about who is more appealing for LA. Keep in mind Dean Lombardi doesn't overpay for anyone and has a boatload of young guys expecting raises in the next few years. Thanks for playing.
If you look at their salary cap and money wise, they can afford Gaborik and sign the young RFAs to reasonable contracts. I know what the discussion is about, which is why Kings fans would rather a top talent, game breaker, and sniper in Gaborik over Hemsky

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02-13-2011, 04:31 PM
  #99
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Originally Posted by Zetterberg4Captain View Post
Schenn isnt going anywhere.

If the Kings wants a top 6 forward, which they so desperately need, then trading for one of penner or hemsky makes the most sense.

The Oilers need defencemen so a deal around Hemsky and Tuebert makes alot of sense. But Hemsky is simpy worth more and thats 100% undisputable.

To LA
-Hemsky
-Smid

To Edmonton
-Tuebert
-Simmonds
How does LA come out with the two best players?

Hemsky is worth more than Simmonds and Tuebert combined. I could see it taken Schenn and a bit more to get Hemsky. I have no idea how an all-around good player who puts up about a point-per-game is worth a third-liner and an NHL hopeful.

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02-13-2011, 04:34 PM
  #100
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Agreed.

And finally, if Gaborik and Hemsky are such wonderful talents (and they are) then the Rangers and Oilers should have no interest in trading them.
The Rangers arent interested in trading Gaborik, idk where your getting this idea from. Sather has never said he was looking to trade Gaborik. The only thing that was mentioned was that other teams were inquiring about gaborik and that sather would listen to what was being offered. If a gm doesnt atleast listen before hanging up the phone you wouldnt be doing your job.

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