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Old
02-14-2011, 12:44 PM
  #26
VanIslander
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Originally Posted by BM67 View Post
I've never lost interest in the history, the players, or even assembling a great team, just in all the rest of the crap that goes with the draft.
I know how you feel. And you got the order exactly right: 1. the history, 2. the players, 3. "even" assembling a great team. The ATD has been 'earning' its adopted home of Fantasy Games board placement whereas it shouldn't fall far from the tree of the History board. A tradeless draft would have been a step in the right direction; a focus on bio building also helps. So would being more concerned about the last pick someone made than on one's own next pick.

We have lost most of the serious history buffs from the drafts and their replacements have been more gamer oriented overall. There still are some serious discussions about history. For that it remains worth it. One thing I like about the MLD/AAA/AA drafts is joy of focusing on the players and the history of the game, how trades are almost nonexistent and how nobody seems obsessed with playoff jostling, instead discussing the details of bios, really more of the original spirit of the draft, going back to the early days when we didn't have rankings of teams and playoffs (just ranking of players based on draft position - ideally). I'm not saying do away with these features. The problem is one of degree not kind, with priorities. Can the trades and even the time clock (or require shortlists to be submitted), focus on bio building, more lineup assassinations pre-regular season ranking and less playoff rounds. Or, hell, let it be what it has become and anyone who doesn't like can just step away anytime they want. Lump it or leave it. There are 40 teams and it is thriving. No need to pull weeds. Just let it grow in any direction. I've accepted that. I wish you guys well.

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02-14-2011, 12:46 PM
  #27
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i posted this in the history forum last year:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen: 2-17-1931
Boston was bad a few seasons back when Manager Art Ross had the habit of jumping out onto the ice to argue with the officials and Eddie Shore did his falling acts, feigning injury when checked by an opponent. Now Ross may do some talking, but it's all from the bench, and the customers have run out of sympathy for Shore when he flops, so the life of the referee is much easier than it was in Boston.
"boston was bad" refers to how difficult refereeing was.

it seems strange, b/c i have read many other things about shore being targeted with hits and sticks and playing through bad injuries.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id...ie+shore&hl=en




about clint benedict's alcoholism and his dispute with ottawa mangement:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morning Leader: 9-30-1924, page 10
OTTAWA HOCKEY CLUB FIGHTS BENEDICT ACTION FOR $800; AVER GOALIE BROKE TRAINING

Ottawa, Sept. 29 -- The defence of the Ottawa Hockey Association, Limited, against the action started by Clinton Benedict, former goal minder of the Ottawa professional team has been filed with the clerk of the County Court and contains charges against the former hockey player. Mr. Benedict, some months ago, sued the club for $800 salary and remuneration, which he claimed he was entitled to under two contracts and which he had never been paid.

Officers of the club state they are determined to fight the claim and will allow the case to go to trial. The whole case is ready for the session of the County Court, which commences on October 7, and will likely be heard during that week. In its defence, the club counterclaims for $300 against Mr. Benedict.

In their filed defence, the owners of the Ottawa hockey club relate differences over salary and contracts, subsequent to the signing of the original contract for the 1923 season. Excerpts from the defence claims follow:

Quote:
10. Because of the plaintiff's breaches of training rules, details of which are hereinafter contained, the defendant fined the plaintiff $300 and notified the plaintiff thereof.

12. The plaintiff was fined for persistent breaches in training rules, inasmuch as he persisted in indulging in intoxicants during the playing season and in direct contravention of rules established by the defendant, and after repeated warnings from the defendant's officers.

Alleged Breaches of Contract
13. The following are the particulars of such breaches:
(a) before the Toronto game on January 22, 1924, as the team was taking the train to play in Toronto, on January 23, 1924, plaintiff arrived in Toronto under the influence of beer of whiskey, according to his own statement at the time to one of his teammates, who assisted him to the berth, where however, one of the defendant's directors observed plaintiff and noticed that plaintiff appeared to be intoxicated.

(b) On the train to Toronto on February 13, 1924, Messrs. McDowell and Ahearn, directors of the defendant company, spoke seriously to plaintiff regarding his drinking habits and plaintiff broke down and promised faithfully to leave liquor alone.

(c) After the game of February 21, 1924, (on which day, Dr. Lorne Graham, the club's physician, described the plaintiff's nervous condition as being due to liquor) it was necessary to allow him to recuperate, and defendant company had to use an untrained substitute in a match at Hamilton, and consequently lost such game.

(d) On the afternoon of Saturday, February 23, 1924, the day of a Canadien-Ottawa game at Ottawa, Dr. Lorne Graham was called to attend plaintiff, who had suffered a nervous breakdown, which breakdown the said Dr. Graham ascribed to the excessive use of liquor.

(e) On March 21, 1924, the day of a very important game at Montreal, Quebec, he ordered beer up to his room at the Windsor Hotel and drank so much sometimes during the day that he was unable to play properly and the defendant's team were beaten 3-0, plaintiff actually scoring one of the goals on himself. On the said day, Thain McDowell, one of the director's of the defendant company, and X, the manager, spoke to Benedict and he admitted that he had been drinking and promised to refrain from the use of intoxicants.

On Night of Play-Off
(f) On night of Saturday, March 18 (probably a typo which should be should say 8), 1924, the night of the Ottawa-Canadien play-off game in Montreal, all the players, including the plaintiff, were told they must retire immediately after the match, as the team were playing the same team again on Monday, the second day thereafter in the last and deciding game. Plaintiff, however, alone disobeyed this order, and disappeared about 11pm the same evening. Several times between 11 o'clock and midnight, the plaintiff's wife, who was in room 1100 of the hotel the Windsor, telephoned defendant's manager and asked him to locate the plaintiff, who she said had refused to remain in his room. At about 2:30am on Sunday the plaintiff phoned to Messrs. X and Y of the team and asked them to go over to the room he was in. X and Y got up out of bed as the knew we were looking for the plaintiff and went down to the number of the room he had given them.
i think a couple of dates in that report are wrong. Ottawa lost 0-3 to Montreal on Feb 21, not March 21. season was finished before March 21. the final NHL game was March 11, not March 18. March 8 was a saturday, but march 18 was a tuesday, so it was probably a typo for march 8, which was the date of the 1st game of the NHL finals.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen: 9-26-1924, page 1
Former Ottawa Goaler Answers Questions Made by Hockey Club Management

Benedict Denies Any Misconduct Under Contract

Former Goaler of the Ottawas Files Statement in the County Court Refuting Allegations

No Right Impose Fine, He Declares

Asserts Club Never Suffered Loss Through Any Action of His

Clint Benedict, ex-goaler for the Ottawa hockey team, who is prosecuting in the county court a claim for $800 alleged to be unpaid salary, in a statement today filed with the clerk of the county court, denies any misconduct and states that at no time did he render himself in such physical condition as to be unable to carry out his contract with the club.
Mr. Benedict denies the right or jurisdiction of the club to impose any fine on him.
He states that the club never suffered any damages, as alleged, through action of his.
The statement in full follows.
Quote:
In reply to the defendant's statement of defence, the plaintiff says that the terms and circumstances of his contract with the defendant were not as stated in the said statement of defence, but that under his said contract, the plaintiff was entitled to a salary of $2300; that he duly carried out all the terms of his said contract and was at no time in any way liable to the defendant for breaches of the said contract and never misconducted himself under or in respect of same; and the defendant has no right or jurisdiction to impose any fine on the plaintiff under his contract with the defendant; and the plaintiff is consequently entitled to payment of the unpaid balance of his salary, $800, with interest and costs of action.

The plaintiff by way of defence to the defendant's counterclaim denies that he rendered himself at any time to such physical condition as to be unable to properly carry out his contract with the defendant and says that he duly carried out his contract with the defendant and denies that the defendant suffered damages alleged, or any damage through fault of the plaintiff, and denies any other allegations contained in paragraph one.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ottawa Citizen: 10-8-1924, page 1
CLINT BENEDICT ACCEPTED OFFER BY HOCKEY ASSN.
Action is Withdrawn From County Court List

The action brought by Clinton Benedict, former goaltender of the Ottawa Hockey Association, Ltd., and which had been set for trial--the sittings of the county court this week, has been settled out of court by Benedict, accepting $350 which had been paid into court by the club.
Settlement of the case was made when Mr. A.C. Craig, counsel for Mr. Benedict, went to Mr. Redmond Quain, representing the hockey club, and notified him that Benedict was prepared to accept the amount of money that had been deposited in court and which represented the amount of Benedict's last pay check of $300, which instead of cashing he had returned to the officers of the club, and $50 on which there was some uncertainty.

Coincident with the settlement, it was announced that Benedict would be offered a contract at a nominal figure to play this year with the club in order to bind him to the club, but that Joe Ironstone of the Sudbury Wolves would be the regular net custodian of the Ottawa hockey team.


Following the settlement, the following statement was issued by Mr. T.F. Ahearn, president of the Ottawa Hockey Association, Ltd.:

Quote:
At a late hour this evening Mr. Clinton Benedict withdrew his action against this club for $800, accepting the salary check refused by him last March 15(?) before this action started, which check was again formally paid into court some time ago, together with $50 which this club claims to have paid him in cash but for which the club has no receipt.

The fine of $300 imposed by the club still stands and the balance of the $800 claim is made up of a claim by Benedict which he now renounces.

This club was prepared to carry on with the case, disputing Benedict's claim to any amount except what the club has always been ready to pay and the additional $50. We had called as witnesses Eddie Gerard, Cy Denneny, X, Campbell, Dr. Lorne Graham and directors of the club.

Benedict has been tendered a contract to play this season at a nominal sum in order to bind him to the club, but our regular goaltender this season will not be Benedict but will be Joe Ironstone of the Sudbury Wolves.

It is only fair to this club to have it clear that this is not a compromise or friendly settlement of this case, but a withdrawal by Benedict just as we were prepared to go on with the case this afternoon.

This organization is glad that the details of this case did not have to be further gone into, but throughout we have courted the fullest publicity in connection with our relations with Benedict and all our other players. We have felt throughout that any reluctance on our part to fight our goalkeeper's claims might have been misconstrued.

- (signed) T.F. Ahearn, president of the Ottawa Hockey Association, Ltd.


Last edited by nik jr: 01-26-2012 at 12:08 PM.
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Old
02-14-2011, 12:46 PM
  #28
overpass
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Originally Posted by Sturminator View Post
Yeah, the context of the report is strange, because MacKay did have, to all appearances, a good offensive season the year before. I am more interested in the commentary on his career, because I had always wondered about his strange up and down scoring levels out west.
This article (a modern analysis, not a primary source) states that the rover position switched from being an offensive position to a defensive position in the 1918-19 season, and was a primarily defensive position at least through the 1921-22 season.

One of the moves that happened that year was that Mickey Mackay switched positions with Cyclone Taylor, with Mackay moving back to rover and Taylor moving to centre. So the combination of moving back to rover and the rover position becoming more defensive would have depressed his scoring numbers.

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02-14-2011, 01:13 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by overpass View Post
This article (a modern analysis, not a primary source) states that the rover position switched from being an offensive position to a defensive position in the 1918-19 season, and was a primarily defensive position at least through the 1921-22 season.

One of the moves that happened that year was that Mickey Mackay switched positions with Cyclone Taylor, with Mackay moving back to rover and Taylor moving to centre. So the combination of moving back to rover and the rover position becoming more defensive would have depressed his scoring numbers.
That ties in well with what I quoted in post #4 which is from the year after they dropped the rover.

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02-15-2011, 01:10 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by overpass View Post
This article (a modern analysis, not a primary source) states that the rover position switched from being an offensive position to a defensive position in the 1918-19 season, and was a primarily defensive position at least through the 1921-22 season.
I would very much like to know where they got their information about the position switching of the players mentioned. I have primary source material that places Taylor on the 2nd all-star team at center in the 19-20 season, but I don't know where he played before and when or if he ever switched.

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02-15-2011, 03:26 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Sturminator View Post
I would very much like to know where they got their information about the position switching of the players mentioned. I have primary source material that places Taylor on the 2nd all-star team at center in the 19-20 season, but I don't know where he played before and when or if he ever switched.
I'm sure if you emailed Iain Fyffe he'd be happy to discuss it, especially since his history articles are probably not the most popular ones he writes. I've corresponded with him before on other subjects.


On another topic, I was reading the book "Old Scores, New Goals. The Story of the Ottawa Senators" by Joan Finnigan. It includes extensive interviews with her father and other long time hockey observers from Ottawa. This exchange with Bob Wake and (undrafted former Senator) was interesting. Has anyone ever come across this story before?

Quote:
Bob: I was in Montreal when Howie Morenz ran into the boards at the back of the rink, broke his leg, went in to the hospital, and died. And there were two stories that I heard. One was that he died because of the effects of the broken leg, which sounds odd, and the other one was that his friends brought so much alcohol into the room to him that he died of that.

Frank: I think that is right. I can't be sure. I was at the funeral in Montreal Forum that is where he was waken center ice thirty thousand people filed past, and from what I can understand, maybe he had a few drinks and had a blood clot.


Last edited by overpass: 02-15-2011 at 03:34 PM.
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02-15-2011, 04:04 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Sturminator View Post
I would very much like to know where they got their information about the position switching of the players mentioned. I have primary source material that places Taylor on the 2nd all-star team at center in the 19-20 season, but I don't know where he played before and when or if he ever switched.
With both the 1st and 2nd team rovers being from Seattle, I'm not sure you should take the positions as gospel.

With MacKay out that year, Taylor certainly could have taken his spot at center, and that would make Adams the rover I guess. Taylor did miss 8 of the 22 game season to add to the line juggling.

Looking at The Trail, we get Harris and Skinner starting at center for the two game playoff, with Adams at rover and Taylor as a sub.

24-25 All-Star Team

Quote:
Mickey Mackay is shifted to centre, with George Hay left wing and Bill Cook right
Seems Mickey is willing to move players to make his all-star squads, even if this isn't his "official" all-star team.


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02-16-2011, 07:21 PM
  #33
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The Toronto World, 8 Jan 1914

Quote:
The hockey fans were treated to some real hockey last night at the Arena when the Ontarios and Torontos hooked up for the first time. The Blue Shirts were always best and smothered the Murphyites with their speed and back checking, having it 9 to 3 at the finish.

There was something doing every minute and the grand passing and fast skating by the Torontos was pretty to watch.

The Orange and Green outfit were never in the hunt after the first few minutes and seemed lost in the killing pace. Jack Walker stopped the Ontario frontline nine times out of ten with his peculiar check.
The Montreal Daily Mail, 18 Mar 1914

Quote:
It is surely an honor to Jack Walker to be chosen as the most popular of the champion hockey team and to get a free trip to Merlin Springs, Texas; where both the Giants and Toronto Internationals are in training. The choice was well made for Walker in not only one of the cleverest of the Blue Shirts, but also the most reliable.
Ottawa Citizen, May 3, 1927

Quote:
Jack Walker Honored.
Jack Walker, veteran center-ice player with Detroit Cougars during the past season, has been judged the most popular player on the Detroit team, which is not surprising.

Walker, like Frank Nighbor of the champion Senators, is a type of player that plays the puck and not the man. Like Nighbor, he is poke-check expert, and also like the famous Senator star, he is a clean-living athlete and a credit to the game in which he has been a prominent figure for fifteen years.

Hockey owes much to players like Jack Walker.
The Pittsburgh Press, 9 Dec 1927

Quote:
Jack Walker of the Detroit Cougars, a thoughtful, brainy type of player, is generally credited with being the inventor of the poke check. He developed this system of purloining the puck from opposing forwards 20 years ago, while a member of the Port Arthur, Ont., amateur club, and out on the coast he taught it to Frank Nighbor, brilliant veteran forward of the Ottawa club. Nighbor, a player of precisely the same mental and physical type as Walker, developed and improved on Walker's basic idea of sweeping his stick along the ice to foremost exponent of a style of play that is now used by scores of forwards, though Nighbor is still one of the most skillful poke-checkers in sport.

Walker, slightly bald, but still gifted with great speed, skill in puck-juggling and a wicked shot, is a fine hockey player today after 20 years at least in senior amateur and professional ranks.


Last edited by BM67: 02-17-2011 at 08:58 AM.
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Old
02-17-2011, 04:45 PM
  #34
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Another piece about defensive strategy in the seasons following the dropping of the rover position. Back-Checking Great Feature Of the Tigers

The Calgary Daily Herald, March 10, 1925

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02-18-2011, 09:10 AM
  #35
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Maybe not quite old school, but a top 10 of the Czech Golden Stick voting going back to 1969. No voting totals unfortunately.

http://www.zlatahokejka2009.cz/historie

Some more info can be dug up here. Much of this can be found elsewhere, but at least this is in english.

http://hokej.snt.cz/index.html

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02-18-2011, 09:52 AM
  #36
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BM, I am cheered by your participation in this thread. You are one of the GMs whose presence I most miss in the ATD. Maybe we could co-GM sometime in the future? Anyway, here is an interesting article about Bathgate, Denneny (strange bookends) and shooting the puck:

Quote:
Bathgate can stickhandle and pass, but his shot has been his greatest stock in trade. To us it has always appeared "different" and when Rangers were at Detroit Tuesday, we asked him whether we were right or was it just an optical illusion. At times, we had thought his shot actually "curved". Sounds unbelievable although hockey observers from another area had told us all was possible and that Cy Denneny was able to do that little thing while playing with Ottawa and Boston in the 1920's.

When queried re "curving" a puck, Andy said:

"It's no secret, at times there is a spin on my shots. I picked it up from curling. Talking to curlers in Winnipeg, I was told that a curling rock delivered straight doesn't go true because of the irregularities of the ice. So by twisting the rock, it goes true and is under control.

When I can, I cradle the puck on the heel of the stick, not in the middle as so many other players. I think the puck spins. Others have remarked about it but I do believe it gives me better control once I take aim."

Talking to an NHL goalkeeper regarding the "curve" on Bathgate's shot, we got another answer.

"I wouldn't know. It comes so fast I have trouble even seeing the puck, must the less (sic) trying to figure out whether it curves or not. It seems to come at me at 100 m.p.h."

And that goalkeeper could be right.


Last edited by Sturminator: 04-14-2011 at 02:37 PM.
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Old
02-19-2011, 11:21 AM
  #37
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Mickey MacKay only 14 years old in 1914?

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=rBtkAAAAIBAJ&sjid=JnsNAAAAIBAJ&pg=11 45,3276347&dq=mickey+mackay&hl=en

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02-19-2011, 09:43 PM
  #38
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Herb Gardiner, and Mickey MacKay, won the Gordon Efficiency Medal as MVP of the Big-4 League.

The Calgary Herald, March 13, 1946

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02-19-2011, 11:09 PM
  #39
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Figured I'd add this here:

"Lalonde is a poor defensive forward. He enjoys hovering around the goal mouth waiting for a stray pass, but he isn't so fond of chasing an opposing player back into Saskatoon territory."



http://news.google.com/newspapers?id...ke+keats&hl=en

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02-20-2011, 07:08 AM
  #40
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I have some partial results for the 1936 All-Star results. Is it common knowledge, and if not, is anyone interested in getting them?

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02-20-2011, 07:47 AM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boy Wonder View Post
Figured I'd add this here:

"Lalonde is a poor defensive forward. He enjoys hovering around the goal mouth waiting for a stray pass, but he isn't so fond of chasing an opposing player back into Saskatoon territory."



http://news.google.com/newspapers?id...ke+keats&hl=en
The other all-star selection articles in the series.

Left Defense

Right Defense

Goalie

Right Wing

Left Wing

Subs

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02-20-2011, 08:01 AM
  #42
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Very nice stuff, BM67. Very interesting that they also recognized subs.

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02-20-2011, 08:45 AM
  #43
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Follow up on the Leader's All-Star picks.

Frank Patrick's All-Star Picks

Fan Vote

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02-20-2011, 11:35 AM
  #44
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Eddie Oatman for the US Hockey HOF?

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=pMYWAAAAIBAJ&sjid=rSAEAAAAIBAJ&dq=oa tman%20quebec&pg=3707%2C1721765

Quote:
Eddie Oatman, Canadian Hockey Star

Milwaukee Boy Star Of Fast Professional Team In Quebec

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02-24-2011, 01:29 PM
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I note the 3 games Sprague Cleghorn played with Ottawa in the 1902-21 season are missing from his statistical record at Hockey Reference, The Hockey Hall of Fame website and in Total Hockey and Total NHL.

The games are included in both the Stan Fischler and Zander Hollander encyclopedias and he shows up in these game summaries:

http://www.flyershistory.com/cgi-bin....cgi?H19200002

http://www.flyershistory.com/cgi-bin....cgi?H19200004

http://www.flyershistory.com/cgi-bin....cgi?H19200006

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02-26-2011, 01:25 AM
  #46
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Hey guys I found some intresting quotes about Frank Fredrickson while I was reading "Cyclone Taylor A hockey Legend"

Quote:
-Typical of the new breed was the rookie over there in Victoria, with Lester Patrick's Aristcrats. He was Frank Fredrickson, the twenty-five year old from Winnipeg, the superlative center of that city's Falcons, who was hailed on the prairies as the game's brightest star. That assessment was certaintly not far off, if off at all.

Quote:
-The Vancouver-Victoria game was scheduled for New Year's Day in 1921. It was billed as the battle of the World's Greatest Professionel (Cyclone Taylor) versus the World's Greatest Amateur (Frank Fredrickson). Victoria won the game 3-1 as Frank Fredrickson scored 2 goals.
Quote:
-"Frank Fredrickson was about as fine a playeras I've ever seen. He was fast, shifty, smart, and had a wonderful shot

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02-26-2011, 11:08 PM
  #47
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Got something nice on Dunderdale:

Lester Patrick has one of the fastest teams in the league as Kerr shows even greater speed than Tommie Dunderdale, the best scorer in the circuit last winter. - Ottawa Citizen, Nov. 27, 1913

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02-28-2011, 12:38 PM
  #48
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I knew that George Hay and apparently Worters were members of the unofficial All-Star teams selected by GMs, so I searched for them in the archives, and got the full unofficial All-Star team for 1927-28.

Anyone know what other years Worters was supposedly on one of these teams? Or any other player who was on one of these teams? I think it would be easier to find the teams by searching for names of players.

Anyway, the Unofficial All-Star Team of 1927-28, as voted on "by managers of the ten clubs:"

"To Morenz goes the honor of being the only unanimous choice. He was placed at his regular center positions by seven managers and at left wing by three. Just behind him in the balloting is Eddie Shore, rugged Boston defense star with nine first team and one second team vote. Roy Worters, wee goalie of the Pittsburgh Pirates polled seven votes for first team, one for second. Bill Cook, captain of the New York Rangers, is awarded one of the wing positions on the basis of seven first team and three second team ballots."

Article goes on to say that Ching Johnson got 4 votes for 1st team, 4 votes for 2nd. George Hay got 4 votes for 1st Team, 2 votes for 2nd.

First Team:
Goal: Worters (Pittsburgh)
Right Defense: Shore (Boston)
Left Defense: Johnson (NY Rangers)
Center: Morenz (Montreal Canadiens)
Right Wing: Bill Cook (NY Rangers)
Left Wing: Hay (Detroit)

Second Team
Goal: Hainsworth (Canadiens)
Right Defense: Clancy (Ottawa)
Left Defense: Gardner* (Canadiens)
Center: Boucher (NY Rangers)
Right Wing: Oliver (Boston)
Left Wing: Joliat (Canadiens)

*I assume this is a typo and they mean Herb Gardiner. There was no "Gardner" on the Canadiens this season.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id...orge+hay&hl=en

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02-28-2011, 01:03 PM
  #49
seventieslord
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
I knew that George Hay and apparently Worters were members of the unofficial All-Star teams selected by GMs, so I searched for them in the archives, and got the full unofficial All-Star team for 1927-28.

Anyone know what other years Worters was supposedly on one of these teams? Or any other player who was on one of these teams? I think it would be easier to find the teams by searching for names of players.

Anyway, the Unofficial All-Star Team of 1927-28, as voted on "by managers of the ten clubs:"

"To Morenz goes the honor of being the only unanimous choice. He was placed at his regular center positions by seven managers and at left wing by three. Just behind him in the balloting is Eddie Shore, rugged Boston defense star with nine first team and one second team vote. Roy Worters, wee goalie of the Pittsburgh Pirates polled seven votes for first team, one for second. Bill Cook, captain of the New York Rangers, is awarded one of the wing positions on the basis of seven first team and three second team ballots."

Article goes on to say that Ching Johnson got 4 votes for 1st team, 4 votes for 2nd. George Hay got 4 votes for 1st Team, 2 votes for 2nd.

First Team:
Goal: Worters (Pittsburgh)
Right Defense: Shore (Boston)
Left Defense: Johnson (NY Rangers)
Center: Morenz (Montreal Canadiens)
Right Wing: Bill Cook (NY Rangers)
Left Wing: Hay (Detroit)

Second Team
Goal: Hainsworth (Canadiens)
Right Defense: Clancy (Ottawa)
Left Defense: Gardner* (Canadiens)
Center: Boucher (NY Rangers)
Right Wing: Oliver (Boston)
Left Wing: Joliat (Canadiens)

*I assume this is a typo and they mean Herb Gardiner. There was no "Gardner" on the Canadiens this season.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id...orge+hay&hl=en
Incredible find - the best one of the draft! A lost all-star team, never before seen by the eyes of the ATD.

What's interesting is that with the exception of Boucher over Nighbor for the 2nd team, this imitates the Hart voting very well: Morenz, Worters, Shore, Hay, Johnson, Nighbor.

I'd have loved for this to be from the 1927 or 1930 seasons, then Worters could add another great season to his resume, but I'll take it anyway. It helps him to transcend the bad-team-goalie-getting-hart-votes stigma.

Also interesting - Herb Gardiner's resume getting beefed up a bit.

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02-28-2011, 06:13 PM
  #50
TheDevilMadeMe
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One writer picks his all-star teams for the first half of the 1928-29 season:

"It would be perhaps be advisable in the first place to point out that such a choice is after all merely the opinion of one man."

This is who he picks:

Goal: Roy Worters, backed up by Charlie Gardiner


About Worters: "he makes the hardest chances look easy"
About Gardiner: "with the team he has in front of him, we have every reason to suspect that Gardiner has very little time to collect his wits."

Right Defense: Hap Day and Eddie Shore


About Day: "one of the fastest breaking puck carriers in the league... unusually strong defensive player and a truly good fellow to have around a team.

About Shore: "200 pounds of brawn with remarkable speed and skating ability and a hard shot. Shore's failing lies in his high hat tendencies between games making him unpopular with his teammates."

Left Defense: King Clancy and Lionel Conacher

About Clancy: "the greatest fighter in the National Hockey League" (note: really?) "While much of Ottawa's success lies at Frank Nighbor's door, the team would have passed out of the picture long ago but for the leadership of this self-same Clancy and he is a hockey player in every sense of the word as much as a fighter."

About Conacher: "Possibly the strongest man in the league... used his weight to his advantage...hands out a perfect pass and has a very hard left hand shot."

Center: Morenz and Hooley Smith

note: author specifically mentions "with the peerless Frank Nighbor out of the game"

About Morenz: "perhaps the fastest skater in the league and most dangerous in the goal mouth. Like Conacher, one of the few left hand shots who drives the puck with the velcoity of the great right-handers such as..."

About Smith: "rugged, fast, a great poke check and playmaker... in an oratorical contest would probably finish number one of all the forwards in the league."

Right Wing: Bill Cook and Ace Bailey

About Cook: "knows all that's needed about the game, can adapt himself to a clean or rough game as occasion may call for and is an exponent of combination play at all times."

About Bailey: "With his all-round effectiveness so well known in Toronto and his courage under fire the talk of the circuit..."

"Jimmy Ward... and Harry Oliver... are mighty fine right wings, but not quite as good as Bailey and Cook.

Left Wing: Nels Stewart, followed by Joliat closely over George Hay

About Stewart: "a big man, dangerously rough at times, a very hard man to check, and one of the most finished players around the goal. In one game at Montreal I saw Stewart back-check like a most enthusiastic rookie, but after his team had scored two goals, he assumed his careless manner, merely standing around until someone brought the puck up to him... must drive a manager frantic... but when bearing down, he is the best left wing in the game."

About Joliat and Hay: "Each is a brilliant puck carrier and good skaters. Both can lay over a perfect pass, as well as take one... Hay is much heavier and less temperatmental (sic) than the much abused Joliat, but I'd give the latter my vote as I admire his fighting spirit and perseverance in spite of his lack of stature."

He mentions Percy Galbraith, Bun Cook, Hib Milks, and Hec Kilrea as other great left wings, who aren't as good as the mentioned three.

Forgot the link: http://news.google.com/newspapers?id...gardiner&hl=en

This is obviously not as good as the unofficial awards voted on by NHL GMs, but it's interesting nonetheless.


Last edited by TheDevilMadeMe: 02-28-2011 at 06:21 PM.
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