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Boucher scouting: Updated Player Ratings + Ratios for entire 2011-2012 Season

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Old
02-18-2011, 01:19 AM
  #76
Kriss E
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I'm gonna have to disagree with the stats. Hammer had a solid game.

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02-18-2011, 01:21 AM
  #77
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There was an image last night when Hammer is skating fast toward the other zone and while he carries the puck the camera is on him, he's already blown, pumping air like he was a pipeline. It was so funny. That's Hammer to me. I don't know how he can keep up when his body cannot do it anymore. Especially not by playing this much.

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Old
02-18-2011, 03:28 AM
  #78
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didnt watch the game but saw the highlight when he got undressed.. well he looked bad there, but really you can't blame him, he's all alone lol. At this point in his career Harmlik should be a good top 4 D... not a no.1 d

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Old
02-18-2011, 05:18 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Charlie Milles View Post
Awesome info, again, man!

Really concerning about Hamrlik. The last two games he's been our worst defenseman when we really can't afford him to be. Hamrlik has played a 1288 games in his career, the rest of Montreal's defense combined has only played 632 games! Hamrlik has played over 650 more games than Weber, Wiseniewski, Nash, Subban and Picard combined! He has to be a lot better than he's been lately. Mara, whose played 714 games in his career, should be in the lineup on Sunday so that will help our back end but Hamrlik still has to show much more leadership with veterans like Spacek and Gill out.

Good to see that Eller played well tonight. I wonder if him sitting out against Buffalo woke him up; hope it did. And it's great to see Kostitsyn with a grade of 60. He still has a ways to go, however.
anyone putting blame on Hammer should have their head examined. or watch games instead of some stats website... The guy is all alone out there... as of right now HE IS (along with PK) our D corp...

the guy played over 27 min against the Oilers by the way... he wasnt bad, he was dead tired...

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Old
02-18-2011, 05:22 AM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimota View Post
There was an image last night when Hammer is skating fast toward the other zone and while he carries the puck the camera is on him, he's already blown, pumping air like he was a pipeline. It was so funny. That's Hammer to me. I don't know how he can keep up when his body cannot do it anymore. Especially not by playing this much.
just thinking he did it half the season last year and is doing it again this season but for the whole 82 games...

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Old
02-18-2011, 05:23 AM
  #81
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didnt watch the game but saw the highlight when he got undressed.. well he looked bad there, but really you can't blame him, he's all alone lol. At this point in his career Harmlik should be a good top 4 D... not a no.1 d
a #1 D... "helped" by 3 rooks and a 7th D at best...

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Old
02-18-2011, 05:59 AM
  #82
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just_thoughts

I love these stats, they have given me a brand new procrastination tool !

As someone who has to lay out complex stats in table/graph form a lot (grad research ) I very humbly offer a suggestion on your layout.
If you combine your battle wins/loses stats into a percentage (as suggested earlier in the thread) you would be able to halve the number of rows used for these stats. Less rows would make it easier on the reader trying to scan down a long list of numbers while maintaining perspective on what means means what. It might also make it possible to read the whole table without scrolling down, which is an issue on a smaller screen (like mine!).
To maintain perspective on overall number of battles (which is obviously important in judging these stats) the breakdown could be organize like this:

OFPB (offensive zone puckbattles): 56% (5/9)

This makes it so you don't have to use contrasting colours to indicate 'wins' or 'loses'.

Just my thoughts. Completely disregard them if you want, you could write these stats on your a** and then sit on your scanner to record them and I would still add your page to my favorites!

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Old
02-18-2011, 08:21 AM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Sumoki Dachiba View Post
just_thoughts


If you combine your battle wins/loses stats into a percentage (as suggested earlier in the thread) you would be able to halve the number of rows used for these stats. Less rows would make it easier on the reader trying to scan down a long list of numbers while maintaining perspective on what means means what. It might also make it possible to read the whole table without scrolling down, which is an issue on a smaller screen (like mine!).
To maintain perspective on overall number of battles (which is obviously important in judging these stats) the breakdown could be organize like this:

OFPB (offensive zone puckbattles): 56% (5/9)

This makes it so you don't have to use contrasting colours to indicate 'wins' or 'loses'.

Just my thoughts. Completely disregard them if you want, you could write these stats on your a** and then sit on your scanner to record them and I would still add your page to my favorites!
Thanks. Any and all feedback is welcome. I'm trying to make these stats as easy to digest as possible. But at the same time I know some readers want to see all the numbers included. I'm trying to create multiple tables with different results in each (including one with just the percentages like you mentioned), while also including the table with all the numbers for those who enjoy that.
On a selfish note; while in realize the alternating red and green isn't pretty, it makes it much easier for me when entering data.
As for the stats, my butt, and a copier.......it sounds like a bad date I had in my early 20's. Really though, thanks for caring enough to give me some helpful feedback. I really do appreciate it.

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Old
02-18-2011, 08:32 AM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
I'm gonna have to disagree with the stats. Hammer had a solid game.
he had a solid start to the 2nd period was atrocious for the rest

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Old
02-18-2011, 10:48 AM
  #85
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You should make two tables imo. One for people who are ADD and just want to see quick %'s, one for people who would like to see the total break down.

%'s just make it easier imo. Easier to digest and figure out whose doing what.

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Old
02-18-2011, 11:26 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by just_thoughts View Post
Pretty impressive compilation of numbers


on the game against Oilers, Weber had 27,.. min TOI. +/- of 0. and he was amongst the worse ?

i do not follow you !

Could you explaine me ... or is it just the expected performance that would be linked to the "small victories" knowing that at the end, the more you win small battles, the more likely you are to score and not take goals ??

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Old
02-18-2011, 06:17 PM
  #87
just_thoughts
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Originally Posted by torero View Post
Pretty impressive compilation of numbers


on the game against Oilers, Weber had 27,.. min TOI. +/- of 0. and he was amongst the worse ?

i do not follow you !

Could you explaine me ... or is it just the expected performance that would be linked to the "small victories" knowing that at the end, the more you win small battles, the more likely you are to score and not take goals ??
Thanks for your interest.
In this blog I'm in no way saying that Weber was the worst, or even among the worst player on the ice. I'm simply attempting to communicate individual-player performance based on the metrics I've created. A low grade can be the result of many things; a player being used in situations he's not comfortable, or perhaps a player playing 10 minutes more than his season average. Fatigue causes players to make mistakes they wouldn't normally make.

In this particular game Weber won only 25% of his defensive-zone puck-battles. His season average is 63%, so this is why his grade suffered. The rest of his results were in his normal range.

It is for this very reason that I include the results; in order to give the readers the information, and thereby allow them to establish their own opinions.

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Old
02-18-2011, 06:19 PM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neofury View Post
You should make two tables imo. One for people who are ADD and just want to see quick %'s, one for people who would like to see the total break down.

%'s just make it easier imo. Easier to digest and figure out whose doing what.
Thanks. I'm working on this. Future blogs will include multiple tables. Hopefully they will offer options for readers with different preferences.

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Old
02-20-2011, 11:23 PM
  #89
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Habs lose battle of elements and battles for pucks
Tough return for Cammalleri

In a game where the temperature was as much a factor as any player, the Montreal Canadiens lost the Heritage Classic to the Calgary Flames by a score of 4-0.

http://justorunjustthoughts.blogspot.com/

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Old
02-21-2011, 09:36 AM
  #90
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too bad this team sucked so bad.

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Old
02-21-2011, 02:49 PM
  #91
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I just want to thank everyone once more for all the support. The blog has received well over 5000 hits in slightly more than 1 month. I'm seriously overwhelmed.

Thanks again!

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Old
02-21-2011, 03:13 PM
  #92
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You work harder when the Habs play than most players on the roster.

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Old
02-21-2011, 07:26 PM
  #93
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You work harder when the Habs play than most players on the roster.
Thanks. I think I threw more hits, at least.


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Old
02-22-2011, 12:14 AM
  #94
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Originally Posted by just_thoughts View Post
I just want to thank everyone once more for all the support. The blog has received well over 5000 hits in slightly more than 1 month. I'm seriously overwhelmed.

Thanks again!
All of them well deserved JT.

Congrats, and hopefully we can help push those numbers even higher.

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Old
02-22-2011, 01:11 AM
  #95
THE HOFF
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just_thoughts ...

when you say that having more metric data will flush the problems away ... I have to disagree. Sometimes, to highlight one variable without taking another into consideration is worst than ignoring them both. To explain emotions and human reactions, I'd stay away from scientific behaviorism ...

Normal stats aren't perfect. But when have you seen a player being (-3) having a great game ? Sometimes , it happens, in the complexity of the game...the stats aren't always providing justice...but they do most of the time. once you start making some other variables count, the ones you neglect will hit your analysis twice as hard.

I fully expect some players to lose the puck ... ie: Gomez or PK ... as they are a good example of players I expect to try and beat an oponent 1v1, or carry the puck. The roles of players become very important when you decide to analyse things so deeply. A defensive mistake made by hall gill or jeff halpern should count more than a defensive mistake make by A.kos. . And with each game that goes by in which a top 6 player doesn't record a shot, his score should be affected... but then, what happens if he doesn't get fed properly...or if he did such a bad job at getting open ? you see where I'm getting... once you go down that road... the ''answer'' may become harder to find than by leaving some variables cancel each other out...

its only a comment... I respect the time and the energy you put into this... and I hope that your determination and scientific approach will prevail on my freudian comments.

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Old
02-22-2011, 01:18 AM
  #96
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Originally Posted by JGRB View Post
For anyone who isn't following, this is his website: http://justorunjustthoughts.blogspot.com/

And it's pretty darn interesting and great way to evaluate a player without looking at the stats column. Let's face it, sometimes players can have great games without putting up points, or have terrible games and still manage to put up numbers. I think his work puts things into perspective nicely..

Thanks for continuing to do this, again Subban scored a fantastic grade. Pretty indicative of how he's played lately. Wisniewski had a terrible game, and your score sums it up well.
Geez, first I heard of it but sounds great. Hockey's equalivent to baseball sabemetrics? Very good, I noticed last year after his Ottawa injury we played better without Cammalleri in the lineup. This year I wonder what our record was when he was out? I'd like to take both year's record and compare to when he was in the lineup

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Old
02-22-2011, 08:51 AM
  #97
just_thoughts
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Originally Posted by THE HOFF View Post
just_thoughts ...

when you say that having more metric data will flush the problems away ...
I don't believe this, so I don't think I wrote that. Then again, I've been really tired lately

Quote:
Originally Posted by THE HOFF View Post
I have to disagree. Sometimes, to highlight one variable without taking another into consideration is worst than ignoring them both. To explain emotions and human reactions, I'd stay away from scientific behaviorism ...
I agree 100% with your disagreement


Quote:
Originally Posted by THE HOFF View Post
Normal stats aren't perfect. But when have you seen a player being (-3) having a great game ? Sometimes , it happens, in the complexity of the game...the stats aren't always providing justice...but they do most of the time. once you start making some other variables count, the ones you neglect will hit your analysis twice as hard.
Absolutely, you're bang on! My system is simply meant as a way to dig deaper into the game. The metrics are only meant as an addition to other information. ie; regular NHL stats, and our own personal perception of how a player played. I don't diminish this last factor at all. After all, we all bring our own percpective to the game, and mine is no more valuable than anyone's.


Quote:
Originally Posted by THE HOFF View Post
I fully expect some players to lose the puck ... ie: Gomez or PK ... as they are a good example of players I expect to try and beat an oponent 1v1, or carry the puck. The roles of players become very important when you decide to analyse things so deeply. A defensive mistake made by hall gill or jeff halpern should count more than a defensive mistake make by A.kos. . And with each game that goes by in which a top 6 player doesn't record a shot, his score should be affected... but then, what happens if he doesn't get fed properly...or if he did such a bad job at getting open ? you see where I'm getting... once you go down that road... the ''answer'' may become harder to find than by leaving some variables cancel each other out...
Again, you're bang on. I'm in no way putting this system ahead of the game. My goal remains the same. I want to see if our perception of how a player plays matches their performance during specific game situations. One is no more valuable than the other.

THE GAME IS BIGGER THAN ANY STATS. That's why I love it so much!

Quote:
Originally Posted by THE HOFF View Post
its only a comment... I respect the time and the energy you put into this... and I hope that your determination and scientific approach will prevail on my freudian comments.
No worries. I do not over-value my work in any way. I'm just one guy trying to add another perspective on the game. This system is simply meant as an addition to the big picture, not a replacement. I really appreciate your interest. This remains fun for me.

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Old
02-22-2011, 03:24 PM
  #98
just_thoughts
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New blog post:

Shhhh! Listen to the numbers

Habs "fans":
Relax, put away the pitchforks, and listen to the numbers.

http://justorunjustthoughts.blogspot.com/


Last edited by just_thoughts: 02-22-2011 at 06:50 PM.
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Old
02-22-2011, 03:52 PM
  #99
Jafar
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''Recent returnee Mike Cammalleri set a personal season-low mark with a final grade of 38. Number 13's biggest struggles came in the defensive and neutral-zones. He did not complete one successful dump-in, while losing 5 of 7 defensive/neutral-zone puck battles''

Interesting

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Old
02-22-2011, 07:26 PM
  #100
overlords
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Originally Posted by ReenMachine View Post
''Recent returnee Mike Cammalleri set a personal season-low mark with a final grade of 38. Number 13's biggest struggles came in the defensive and neutral-zones. He did not complete one successful dump-in, while losing 5 of 7 defensive/neutral-zone puck battles''

Interesting
Not out of the ordinary for cammy. He's as soft as they come.

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