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02-19-2011, 01:25 PM
  #1
I Am Chariot
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Potential Elite Players in the System

Every contender in this league has TWO Elite forwards.

This is what we need to contend for the cup. Do we have an Elite potential in the system? I'll go ahead and say Gabby is Elite, despite his off year. So where is his help?

If we don't have this potential, assets should be traded to acquire an Elite forward as opportunity presents itself?

I'm not as up on the farm system as others on here so maybe you can shed some light

TWO ELITE FORWARDS TO COMPETE

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02-19-2011, 03:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Chariot View Post
Every contender in this league has TWO Elite forwards.

This is what we need to contend for the cup. Do we have an Elite potential in the system? I'll go ahead and say Gabby is Elite, despite his off year. So where is his help?

If we don't have this potential, assets should be traded to acquire an Elite forward as opportunity presents itself?

I'm not as up on the farm system as others on here so maybe you can shed some light

TWO ELITE FORWARDS TO COMPETE
Gaborik is definately elite. He is just having an off year.

I really think Dubinsky if he stays healthy can get 65-70 points per season. That would probably get him in the top 25 in points in the NHL which could perhaps be close to elite?

Sign Richards! problem solved.. lol

I think Kreider has the potential to be a first line player, but is still a prospect.
Stepan not sure

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02-19-2011, 03:11 PM
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I think Kreider has potential to be elite, Stepan has potential to be a very good 1st line center, elite? maybe.

Thomas too possibly? We'll see.

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02-19-2011, 03:23 PM
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Cherepanov..may he RIP

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02-19-2011, 03:24 PM
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Cherepanov..may he RIP
Yes, but sadly you can't count him as "in the system."

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02-19-2011, 03:51 PM
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Kreider is the only one unless someone completely surprises us.

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02-19-2011, 04:05 PM
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a lot of maybes....

Krieder and Stepan are not actually projected as ELITE type players are they? More of the top 6 really good player...




Hey, Henke is Elite and he came out of nowhere. It can happen but look at the contenders. No argument about their top players being Elite

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02-19-2011, 04:07 PM
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Noone to the point where we can count on a young player stepping in and making this team a true contender.

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02-19-2011, 04:11 PM
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Kreider and stepan will be good to great players elite possibly but to early to tell
But I agree you win the cup with two elite, top of the line, threats not depth players like we have
Toews+Kane
Crosby+malkin
Datsyuk+zetterberg

Us =gaborik+dubi

I love dubi but he's not the guy that could e part of a championship winning duo to be counted on as the top producers like the above players were. The best answer right now is gaborik+Richards

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02-19-2011, 04:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chariot View Post
a lot of maybes....

Krieder and Stepan are not actually projected as ELITE type players are they? More of the top 6 really good player...




Hey, Henke is Elite and he came out of nowhere. It can happen but look at the contenders. No argument about their top players being Elite
Right now, the only ones in our system who could possibly follow a Henke-like path from anonymity (i.e. later round pick or undrafted) to stardom, could be:

Yogan: he was thought to be a first round pick heading into his draft year, had a down year and has been injured ever since - up until this past week.
Fasth: unknown Swedish player who was one of the better performers on their WJC team and was playing on HV71's first line in the Swedish Elite League when he was injured
And... that's all I can think of. Maybe Shinnimin if we sign him?

Thomas might have first line upside if his size isn't an issue, but I would call it a "coming out of nowhere" if he became elite since he was drafted in the 2nd round.

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02-19-2011, 04:17 PM
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I don't think any of our prospects are elite. A few of them are very good and will be very good in the NHL.

They either need to sign Richards to compliment Gaborik and get him motivated.

Or they need to trade Gaborik for a package that includes an elite level prospect, like Brayden Schenn.

Either way is fine. But they need to do one or the other.

And of course, cut some salary, because we need to retain our RFA's.

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02-19-2011, 04:19 PM
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Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
I don't think any of our prospects are elite. A few of them are very good and will be very good in the NHL.

They either need to sign Richards to compliment Gaborik and get him motivated.

Or they need to trade Gaborik for a package that includes an elite level prospect, like Brayden Schenn.

Either way is fine. But they need to do one or the other.

And of course, cut some salary, because we need to retain our RFA's.
Bang on.

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Old
02-19-2011, 05:16 PM
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The Rangers have had 20 potential elite goalies since I've been watching the Rangers. Corey Hirsch, Steve Weeks, Dan Cloutier, Dan Blackburn, Max Montoya, Jason LaBarbera just to name a few.

Never heard a word about some guy named Lunqvist.

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02-19-2011, 05:24 PM
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We have no elite prospects and the most elite forward on the roster isnt playing that way = trouble.

Tragically, the most elite potential we've had in a while passed away.

Step and Kreider are going to be good, but not elite. Lets not kid ourselves and be honest here. If they had that type of potential they would have went to another team.

And lets re-examine what the word "Elite" means - Stamkos is elite.

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02-19-2011, 05:26 PM
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There are not a lot of "elite" players in the NHL period.

We're looking at maybe 20 PPG players in the whole league this year. Less than one per team on average. And you get 100 20 goal scorers in a year if you're lucky.

Point being, if your draft picks are turning into 20-25 goal players, you should be pretty happy, especially since we never, and likely never will pick in the top 5.

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02-19-2011, 05:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Atoz View Post
The Rangers have had 20 potential elite goalies since I've been watching the Rangers. Corey Hirsch, Steve Weeks, Dan Cloutier, Dan Blackburn, Max Montoya, Jason LaBarbera just to name a few.

Never heard a word about some guy named Lunqvist.
LOL so true.. All these goalies were hyped somewhat and then some dude from Sweden come along and becomes the King of NY!!!

Amazing... So, who really knows with prospects? Kreider could bust and a player like Hagelin comes in just plays lights out and becomes a star.

Gordie Clark just has to keep on drafting players. Odds are someone will eventually become a first line player.

Meanwhile, Slats is a genious with trades and etc.. You just never know what rabbit he can pull out of his hat.

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02-19-2011, 05:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fitzy Duke of NY View Post
There are not a lot of "elite" players in the NHL period.

We're looking at maybe 20 PPG players in the whole league this year. Less than one per team on average. And you get 100 20 goal scorers in a year if you're lucky.

Point being, if your draft picks are turning into 20-25 goal players, you should be pretty happy, especially since we never, and likely never will pick in the top 5.
I hear you but that doesnt get us past

AO/Backstrom

Crosby/Malkin

Towes/Kane/Hossa

Stamkos/St Louis

Briere/Richards/Giroux/Carter ( stacked + Pronger yikes)

Kovy/Parise (vomits)


Other than Caps and Pens these teams are a combo of draft and UFA/Trade upgrades.

San Jose is another Marleau/Jumbo/Heatley

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02-19-2011, 05:42 PM
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Of the teams you've listed, only two have won the cup recently.

Our elite talent? Gaborik, Lundqvist, and eventually Staal. We have an outside chance of picking up one more in Richards this offseason.

But to win, we're going to need a hard working team, everyone has a role, good coaching, and more than a little luck.

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02-19-2011, 05:43 PM
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LOL so true.. All these goalies were hyped somewhat and then some dude from Sweden come along and becomes the King of NY!!!

Amazing... So, who really knows with prospects? Kreider could bust and a player like Hagelin comes in just plays lights out and becomes a star.

Gordie Clark just has to keep on drafting players. Odds are someone will eventually become a first line player.

Meanwhile, Slats is a genius with trades and etc.. You just never know what rabbit he can pull out of his hat.
Unusual unless you are Detroit

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02-19-2011, 05:43 PM
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We have 2 elite players--Lundqvist and Gaborik. It's nice having an elite goaltender because when he's on his game our not so elite forwards can go cold and our non-elite defensemen can make mistakes and he'll cover for them with his great play and, but that doesn't change the fact that the team could use another elite forward. And what I really mean is center. And if you look at the elite centers throughout the NHL, they're almost all drafted by their teams. Two exceptions that come to mind are Brad Richards and Joe Thornton, but that's not common, and even then it was a trade and not a signing. When are the Rangers ever going to finish low enough to have an elite center prospect be available to them when they pick, or have enough assets where they can swing a trade for a big-time center and not critically hurt the team's depth? They might have to send a spy to Detroit and learn their secret of drafting such incredible players in late rounds. If Brad Richards makes it to unrestricted free agency it will be a big opportunity to fill a desperate need.

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02-19-2011, 05:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fitzy Duke of NY View Post
Of the teams you've listed, only two have won the cup recently.

Our elite talent? Gaborik, Lundqvist, and eventually Staal. We have an outside chance of picking up one more in Richards this offseason.

But to win, we're going to need a hard working team, everyone has a role, good coaching, and more than a little luck.
The winner always does so with LOADS of HARD WORK, and so very often the heros are the grinders and soldiers. But its that Elite talent that ultimately puts them over the top on the way to the finals.... along with a hot goaltender.

Those elite players get so much ice time in the big games, its so hard to counter in a seven game series. If they dont beat you they wear your best guys down and some 3rd liner buries the gwg in triple OT


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Old
02-19-2011, 05:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR94 View Post
We have 2 elite players--Lundqvist and Gaborik. It's nice having an elite goaltender because when he's on his game our not so elite forwards can go cold and our non-elite defensemen can make mistakes and he'll cover for them with his great play and, but that doesn't change the fact that the team could use another elite forward. And what I really mean is center. And if you look at the elite centers throughout the NHL, they're almost all drafted by their teams. Two exceptions that come to mind are Brad Richards and Joe Thornton, but that's not common, and even then it was a trade and not a signing. When are the Rangers ever going to finish low enough to have an elite center prospect be available to them when they pick, or have enough assets where they can swing a trade for a big-time center and not critically hurt the team's depth? They might have to send a spy to Detroit and learn their secret of drafting such incredible players in late rounds. If Brad Richards makes it to unrestricted free agency it will be a big opportunity to fill a desperate need.

Maybe its Brad maybe not..... but I really think Sather has a tough choice because it's not going to be completely popular. Look at the Knicks.... you build up assets so you can trade them for a tremendous upgrade.

Sathers done well holding onto the youth but at some point those guys are worth enough that they can be moved for an upgrade.


Those of us who were around back in 92-94 remember some bittersweet trades that really stung, but did build the right team to compete for the cup.

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Old
02-19-2011, 05:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Mr Atoz View Post
The Rangers have had 20 potential elite goalies since I've been watching the Rangers. Corey Hirsch, Steve Weeks, Dan Cloutier, Dan Blackburn, Max Montoya, Jason LaBarbera just to name a few.

Never heard a word about some guy named Lunqvist.
Maybe you never heard a word about Lundqvist, but people who were familar with Swedish prospects and with his career in Sweden (which really took off after he was
drafted by the Rangers), were very aware of his potential from the beginning. The biggest question was whether his skills could transfer to the smaller size rinks.

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Old
02-19-2011, 06:03 PM
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Kreider? I'm not as optimistic about him as some of the other posters are. I think if we are lucky he is a 1st liner. Elite 1st liner is a whole different level to me. I know everyone has different standards but to me, 1st liner = 70+ points, while elite = mid 80s+ points.

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02-19-2011, 06:03 PM
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Maybe you never heard a word about Lundqvist, but people who were familar with Swedish prospects and with his career in Sweden (which really took off after he was
drafted by the Rangers), were very aware of his potential from the beginning. The biggest question was whether his skills could transfer to the smaller size rinks.
But then why did he slip to the SEVENTH?

same goes for guys like Miller.

You can say scouting is better now, and it is, but you can't discount the fact that very good/elite (depending on how you determine what elite is) can be found in other than the first.

Also, Stamkos is obviously elite, but I consider guys like him and Crosby and Ovy on a level higher. I consider consistent PPG and beyond players elite, because like Fitzy said they're the upper echelon of NHL talent, and don't have to be as good as Sidney Crosby to be considered elite.

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