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02-21-2011, 11:05 PM
  #1
Telos
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Past Kings Draft, Trade, Free Agent Signing Discussion

Full article here: http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-...7155922.column

Quote:
Originally Posted by Helene Elliott View Post
A general manager identifies a need for a productive left winger. He decides to trade a valuable asset to fill that need but gives his team a better chance to go deep in the playoffs this season and in the future.

Congratulations, Ray Shero of the Pittsburgh Penguins.

What, you thought it might be Kings GM Dean Lombardi shaking off his paralysis by analysis?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Helene Elliott View Post
It would be surprising if Lombardi does anything bigger than his usual and tedious mid-range deals.
She doesn't hold her punches. Not like she takes much of a leap, but predicts that Lombardi does nothing.

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Last edited by Telos: 02-21-2011 at 11:15 PM.
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02-21-2011, 11:16 PM
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But she's a hall of famer!

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02-21-2011, 11:19 PM
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etherialone
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In my opinion Shero is a Hall of Fame caliber person for his entire career including the work he has done in Pitts. In my opinion DL is going to need time to even get close to being considered to be on the same level as Shero but again, that is just an opinion.

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02-21-2011, 11:22 PM
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Helene once told me that the Kings would re-sign Gauthier. This wasn't based on any info, but just her "fear".

For a "Hall of Fame" writer she has very little hockey acumen.

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02-21-2011, 11:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HeadInjury View Post
Helene once told me that the Kings would re-sign Gauthier. This wasn't based on any info, but just her "fear".

For a "Hall of Fame" writer she has very little hockey acumen.
You disagree with her?

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02-21-2011, 11:28 PM
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Huh with articles like this I wonder why she isn't more popular around here.

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02-21-2011, 11:38 PM
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And how long did it actually take Shero to get that scoring winger for Crosby? Oh yeah, a couple of seasons.

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02-21-2011, 11:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scottkmlps View Post
And how long did it actually take Shero to get that scoring winger for Crosby? Oh yeah, a couple of seasons.
You mean it didn't happen overnight and that he tried other less critical options like Poniboy in the meantime?

In my opinion it can take a long time for all of the pieces to come together but it is clearly worth the wait.

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02-21-2011, 11:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kingscourt26 View Post
You disagree with her?
She, just like so many fans, think it's so easy and always say, "Where was Lombardi on that trade? Why didn't he offer <insert player(s) name here> for <insert other player(s) name here>?" or the ever popular, "Dean could've offered a better deal than that.".

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02-21-2011, 11:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonellisghost View Post
You mean it didn't happen overnight and that he tried other less critical options like Poniboy in the meantime?

In my opinion it can take a long time for all of the pieces to come together but it is clearly worth the wait.
Funny how that happens, isn't it?

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02-21-2011, 11:43 PM
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Now lets share the good news with our fellow King fans!

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02-21-2011, 11:45 PM
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Josh Deitell
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Helene is no less an armchair GM than the rest of us, she just happens to have a publicly-read outlet. To me, this is an abuse of journalistic freedom. It's an excuse for her to take a shot at the guy who runs the team that she covers that pays her bills, without any real reason.

Should we have traded Jack Johnson for Chris Stewart or James Neal? Not a chance. Unless there's a deal of two prospects and a pick for a high caliber forward that goes down with Lombardi watching from the sidelines, I don't see what there is to be upset about.

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02-21-2011, 11:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goallum View Post
But she's a hall of famer!
What's the name of that non-caucasion kid on South Park?

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02-21-2011, 11:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonellisghost View Post
You mean it didn't happen overnight and that he tried other less critical options like Poniboy in the meantime?

In my opinion it can take a long time for all of the pieces to come together but it is clearly worth the wait.
They did have Malkin, a trip to the Cup and then attaining said shiny Cup to tide them over while they kept winning, looking, winning some more and looking again until they nailed one in Neal...not really a fair comparison.

Lombardi's ability to reasonably argue that the market doesn't support X or there is nothing out there is gone after these trades we have seen.

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02-21-2011, 11:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zad View Post
They did have Malkin, a trip to the Cup and then attaining said shiny Cup to tide them over while they kept winning, looking, winning some more and looking again until they nailed one in Neal...not really a fair comparison.

Lombardi's ability to reasonably argue that the market doesn't support X or there is nothing out there is gone after these trades we have seen.
But at the price that these players are going for? When you hear a team like Edmonton asking for Schenn and a 1st round pick for an oft injured, never a point per game player, only hit 20 goals once in his 7 year career, I don't blame Lombardi not pulling the trigger. It's a bad year to be a buyer, and a very good year to be a seller.
I'm sure he would've liked to grab Neal, but I'm betting that the asking price from the Stars was probably more due to the fact the Kings are in the same division. Would you have been happy with Lombardi giving up Johnson for Neal? He would be filling one hole, and opening up another, a top 4 spot on the back end.

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02-21-2011, 11:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scottkmlps View Post
But at the price that these players are going for? When you hear a team like Edmonton asking for Schenn and a 1st round pick for an oft injured, never a point per game player, only hit 20 goals once in his 7 year career, I don't blame Lombardi not pulling the trigger. It's a bad year to be a buyer, and a very good year to be a seller.
Is Hemsky the only available top 6 forward? I had no idea. With all these trades for forwards happening, Ales must be exhausted. He must have changed teams, what, 10 times in the past 2 weeks? At least that Hemsky to Penguins trade is looking better now that Neal is not part of it.

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02-21-2011, 11:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scottkmlps View Post
She, just like so many fans, think it's so easy and always say, "Where was Lombardi on that trade? Why didn't he offer <insert player(s) name here> for <insert other player(s) name here>?" or the ever popular, "Dean could've offered a better deal than that.".
But you could also say why some GMs are more successful than others. The point is by the end of the day - sooner or later you have to pull big off a major deal to get your final piece(s). There's no guarantee. But you won't know would you until you do it. You have to swing at a pitch sooner or later. If you don't because you are waiting for the perfect pitch - perfect fit -then guess what - "STRIKE 3" You're out!
THERE'S NO SUCH A THING.

So far Dean has been! That's the reality you and I have to deal with whether you agree with me or not. You can say due to "whatever." He still struck out. All he has done and Helen is right are all "marginal deals." That's the truth...

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02-22-2011, 12:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zad View Post
They did have Malkin, a trip to the Cup and then attaining said shiny Cup to tide them over while they kept winning, looking, winning some more and looking again until they nailed one in Neal...not really a fair comparison.

Lombardi's ability to reasonably argue that the market doesn't support X or there is nothing out there is gone after these trades we have seen.
I agree with your second point.

To your first point I am not so certain it matters as much as you imply but instead of defending my position I give you something to think about "Aint nothin gonna break my stride, nobody gonna hold me down, oh no, I got to keep on movin".

I am going to take my opinion and get some sleep before hitting the road in the AM.

Aint no wrong now aint no right

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02-22-2011, 12:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scottkmlps View Post
But at the price that these players are going for? When you hear a team like Edmonton asking for Schenn and a 1st round pick for an oft injured, never a point per game player, only hit 20 goals once in his 7 year career, I don't blame Lombardi not pulling the trigger. It's a bad year to be a buyer, and a very good year to be a seller.
I'm sure he would've liked to grab Neal, but I'm betting that the asking price from the Stars was probably more due to the fact the Kings are in the same division. Would you have been happy with Lombardi giving up Johnson for Neal? He would be filling one hole, and opening up another, a top 4 spot on the back end.
Why would Neal cost Johnson? Has anyone officially stated that was what it would cost, or are you making that up?

Johnson >>>>>> Goligoski


I get that Dallas and the Kings are in the same division, and L.A. probably would have had to overpay for Neal (unless Dallas just wanted to get rid of him which appear to be the case), but I have yet to see that Dallas was asking for Johnson in return.

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02-22-2011, 12:05 AM
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I will never forget when Brian Burke asked for Pronger and found out it will cost him BIG TIME. And Kevin Lowe asked Brian, "do you want to go to the dance?"

And they did go win the Stanley Cup!

If you don't try - you won't know.

But success doesn't come CHEAP. In business, in our careers you CANNOT expect marginal investments and efforts and expect a humongous return.

It just doesn't happen that way....

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02-22-2011, 12:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Judge View Post
But you could also say why some GMs are more successful than others. The point is by the end of the day - sooner or later you have to pull big off a major deal to get your final piece(s). There's no guarantee. But you won't know would you until you do it. You have to swing at a pitch sooner or later. If you don't because you are waiting for the perfect pitch - perfect fit -then guess what - "STRIKE 3" You're out!
THERE'S NO SUCH A THING.

So far Dean has been! That's the reality you and I have to deal with whether you agree with me or not. You can say due to "whatever." He still struck out. All he has done and Helen is right are all "marginal deals." That's the truth...
[/thread]

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02-22-2011, 12:08 AM
  #22
Scottkmlps
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zad View Post
Is Hemsky the only available top 6 forward? I had no idea. With all these trades for forwards happening, Ales must be exhausted. He must have changed teams, what, 10 times in the past 2 weeks? At least that Hemsky to Penguins trade is looking better now that Neal is not part of it.
Way to take that post way out of context and spin it the way you wanted to see it. I was using the asking price of Hemsky as an example. Are you willing to give up Schenn and a 1st for a right winger, something the Kings don't even need? Would you be willing to give up Johnson for Neal? How about, lets say, Johnson, Loktionov, and a conditional 1st for Stewart, Shattenkirk, and a conditional 2nd?

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02-22-2011, 12:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adevandry View Post
Why would Neal cost Johnson? Has anyone officially stated that was what it would cost, or are you making that up?

Johnson >>>>>> Goligoski


I get that Dallas and the Kings are in the same division, and L.A. probably would have had to overpay for Neal (unless Dallas just wanted to get rid of him which appear to be the case), but I have yet to see that Dallas was asking for Johnson in return.
No it hasn't been stated, I'm using that as an example as the Kings would have to over pay to get Neal.

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02-22-2011, 12:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scottkmlps View Post
But at the price that these players are going for? When you hear a team like Edmonton asking for Schenn and a 1st round pick for an oft injured, never a point per game player, only hit 20 goals once in his 7 year career, I don't blame Lombardi not pulling the trigger. It's a bad year to be a buyer, and a very good year to be a seller.
Honestly, when was the last time that there was a fire sale on good players?

Quality is always going to cost quality...

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02-22-2011, 12:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adevandry View Post
Why would Neal cost Johnson? Has anyone officially stated that was what it would cost, or are you making that up?

Johnson >>>>>> Goligoski


I get that Dallas and the Kings are in the same division, and L.A. probably would have had to overpay for Neal (unless Dallas just wanted to get rid of him which appear to be the case), but I have yet to see that Dallas was asking for Johnson in return.
Thats kinda the point, if JJ is to much for Neal (or that much better than Goligoski) then who would the Kings trade??? We know Dallas has needed defense all year, and that was probably all they were willing to accept for Neal. There is a giant gap in the Kings depth chart as far as value goes from JJ to Amart or any other prospect. So in theory the Kings/Stars would not have made great trading partners (without adding in other factors).

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