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Old
02-28-2011, 06:14 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by Hot Conroy View Post
Well obviously the Flames needs are still a number 1 centre and a better pool of picks or prospects, all while not dealing existing picks or prospects which he has failed to do somehow, WTF!
If only we could find that elusive GM that will make a playmaking number one center fall in our lap.

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02-28-2011, 06:15 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Kotalik Fanboy View Post
That's fine dude but you did the math yourself... there's 100% chance that we gained a useful player now and a 91% chance we didn't give up anything substantial to get him. So what's the problem?
Actually, I think we got a 0% useful player when we could have a 9% chance of getting one down the road. You're under the assumption Modin is a useful player.

Also given that we lack a few picks this draft, I think it would've been better spent to keep it.

I mean Marco Sturm was on WAIVERS for free and you pass on him and pick up Modin instead for a pick???

Makes absolutely no sense. Plus you can't tell me Sturm doesn't bring grit with him.

On the note of a #1 center, Boyes at one point was considered a #1 center, and he was traded for a 2nd...

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02-28-2011, 06:16 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by DieselCGY View Post
Modin is still better then some players on your list
He actually is, some of those players didn't even have an NHL job at the start of the season

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02-28-2011, 06:21 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by FLAMES666 View Post
He actually is, some of those players didn't even have an NHL job at the start of the season
Just because they aren't in the NHL doesn't necessarily make them worse players. I mean you are telling me that Alexei Morozov isn't better than half the players in the NHL? That he isn't better than Kotalik whom had an NHL job starting this season and Morozov didn't?

There is no player on that list I would pick Modin over.

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02-28-2011, 06:24 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by tfong View Post
Actually, I think we got a 0% useful player when we could have a 9% chance of getting one down the road. You're under the assumption Modin is a useful player.

Also given that we lack a few picks this draft, I think it would've been better spent to keep it.

I mean Marco Sturm was on WAIVERS for free and you pass on him and pick up Modin instead for a pick???

Makes absolutely no sense. Plus you can't tell me Sturm doesn't bring grit with him.

On the note of a #1 center, Boyes at one point was considered a #1 center, and he was traded for a 2nd...
Is Modin 0% useless when there is an injury, and you actually think Sturm is a better suited player for a 4th line role? Boyes went for a 2nd we should have offered one......wait we don't have one. Feaster should have given our 2nd from next year so everyone could jump down his throat for that. But you do have a point we could have added Boyes, another under performing centerman. That would give us Boyes, Langkow, Jokinen, Stajan and Backlund for centers next year at the low price of 16.1 million dollars.

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02-28-2011, 06:25 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tfong View Post
Actually, I think we got a 0% useful player when we could have a 9% chance of getting one down the road. You're under the assumption Modin is a useful player.

Also given that we lack a few picks this draft, I think it would've been better spent to keep it.

I mean Marco Sturm was on WAIVERS for free and you pass on him and pick up Modin instead for a pick???

Makes absolutely no sense. Plus you can't tell me Sturm doesn't bring grit with him.

On the note of a #1 center, Boyes at one point was considered a #1 center, and he was traded for a 2nd...
Sturm also had a cap hit that we couldn't afford.

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02-28-2011, 06:27 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by tfong View Post
Just because they aren't in the NHL doesn't necessarily make them worse players. I mean you are telling me that Alexei Morozov isn't better than half the players in the NHL? That he isn't better than Kotalik whom had an NHL job starting this season and Morozov didn't?

There is no player on that list I would pick Modin over.
Your completely right I would want the effortless Kostitsyn over Modin come playoff time, or the great defensive wall in strahlman.

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02-28-2011, 06:31 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLAMES666 View Post
Is Modin 0% useless when there is an injury, and you actually think Sturm is a better suited player for a 4th line role? Boyes went for a 2nd we should have offered one......wait we don't have one. Feaster should have given our 2nd from next year so everyone could jump down his throat for that. But you do have a point we could have added Boyes, another under performing centerman. That would give us Boyes, Langkow, Jokinen, Stajan and Backlund for centers next year at the low price of 16.1 million dollars.
Actually I do think Sturm can play a 4th line role better than Modin. When was the last time you saw Modin play? The guy has no speed anymore. At least Sturm has some wheels still and he isn't afriad to play big (not that he is very small really). They both get injured easily so that cancels out.

My reference to Boyes is that his value was that of a 2nd rounder. I think we have that equivalent in roster player (Stajan comes to mind) and I think Boyes is an upgrade over Stajan. Langkow as from many sources and critics say is not likely to be back this year, if ever.

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02-28-2011, 06:32 PM
  #34
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First of all...I would like to say thanks for making my thread of 3 on the subject of attaining Modin as a Flame the busiest! Thank you!

Second of all..my goodness gracious! Some people just have to stop over analyzing every little detail of the trade! So what if it was a 7th rounder we gave up! This team is going to make the playoffs and I have no problem with Feaster trading for a guy who is depth/playoff performer/stanley cup winner to our team for basically nothing! Also Carson too at that!

There are always going to be critics who do not like it or Modin and I fully respect that..BUT...this team has limited options and I believe Feaster did exactly what he should have and I think we should just actually wait and see what this player can do!

NOBODY is expecting the poor guy to be a top line winger..he is DEPTH and we are just getting primed for the playoffs..let him walk at the end of the year! Atleast then we will have more cap space to please the pessimists by signing a bigger name player. And even when THAT happens...i guarantee there will still be people bashing it.

Like i always said before..."live and let live and just enjoy the ride!"

GO FLAMES GO!

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02-28-2011, 06:36 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by FLAMES666 View Post
Your completely right I would want the effortless Kostitsyn over Modin come playoff time, or the great defensive wall in strahlman.
What are you smoking?

Those players were from the 7th round that were being pointed out as "useless" picks.

I'm showing you 7th round picks that turn into NHLers.

Btw I would take SKostitsyn over Modin or Strahlman. I think Anton would've been a good fit for us needing a puck mover. Go watch a few Nashville games, SK has been working hard since being traded away from Montreal and he is doing much better now.

You're not even trying to refute my argument that Modin is a useless player or that a 7th rounder is worth something. You're just attempting to disqualify my argument because I've proven you wrong on previous counts now.

My point is that a 7th rounder is worth something, especially to a team with less picks (like the Flames). There were free options available as well like Sturm whom carried a 3.5m cap hit but prorated at deadline I believe it would've worked given we did have some space from Kotalik being sent down as well (assuming we kept him down there). What has Modin done lately?

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02-28-2011, 06:39 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by tfong View Post
Actually I do think Sturm can play a 4th line role better than Modin. When was the last time you saw Modin play? The guy has no speed anymore. At least Sturm has some wheels still and he isn't afriad to play big (not that he is very small really). They both get injured easily so that cancels out.

My reference to Boyes is that his value was that of a 2nd rounder. I think we have that equivalent in roster player (Stajan comes to mind) and I think Boyes is an upgrade over Stajan. Langkow as from many sources and critics fan opinions say is not likely to be back this year, if ever.
Sturm has a cap hit of 3.5m to Modin's 1.2. I'd rather pay a 13th forward position 2.3 mil less for unreliable production, but HEY. What do I know about money and expectations?

Boyes is an upgrade over Stajan, but what are you going to do to get Boyes? He has a cap hit of 4m, so we still need to unload someone, PREFERABLY Stajan and that's not happening at this trade deadline, if ever. As for Langkow, only fans speculate on his injury return, because it's very unbecoming of organizations or anyone in official standing to comment on such a topic so candidly that he would not return, so I fixed that part of your post for ya.

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02-28-2011, 06:41 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by tfong View Post
What are you smoking?

Those players were from the 7th round that were being pointed out as "useless" picks.

I'm showing you 7th round picks that turn into NHLers.

Btw I would take SKostitsyn over Modin or Strahlman. I think Anton would've been a good fit for us needing a puck mover. Go watch a few Nashville games, SK has been working hard since being traded away from Montreal and he is doing much better now.

You're not even trying to refute my argument that Modin is a useless player or that a 7th rounder is worth something. You're just attempting to disqualify my argument because I've proven you wrong on previous counts now.

My point is that a 7th rounder is worth something, especially to a team with less picks (like the Flames). There were free options available as well like Sturm whom carried a 3.5m cap hit but prorated at deadline I believe it would've worked given we did have some space from Kotalik being sent down as well. What has Modin done lately?
You haven't proven me wrong at all, you said you would take those players listed in your previous post before Modin, I wouldn't. Thats your opinion, not proving me wrong. You think a 7th rounder is more valuable then a depth player for making a playoff push. Your opinion once again, could care less if you devised a list of 8 players drafted in the 7th round in the past 10 years who are average at best.

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02-28-2011, 06:45 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Hot Conroy View Post
Sturm has a cap hit of 3.5m to Modin's 1.2. I'd rather pay a 13th forward position 2.3 mil less for unreliable production, but HEY. What do I know about money and expectations?

Boyes is an upgrade over Stajan, but what are you going to do to get Boyes? He has a cap hit of 4m, so we still need to unload someone, PREFERABLY Stajan and that's not happening at this trade deadline, if ever. As for Langkow, only fans speculate on his injury return, because it's very unbecoming of organizations or anyone in official standing to comment on such a topic so candidly that he would not return, so I fixed that part of your post for ya.
The Boyes thing was just food for thought really. So everything including Langkow etc... is all assumptions I know.

The thing about Sturm is you know he can play top six if someone goes down and he was FREE. My point is that you used a 7th pick whereas an arguably better player could've been obtained for free just days ago.

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02-28-2011, 06:49 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by FLAMES666 View Post
You haven't proven me wrong at all, you said you would take those players listed in your previous post before Modin, I wouldn't. Thats your opinion, not proving me wrong. You think a 7th rounder is more valuable then a depth player for making a playoff push. Your opinion once again, could care less if you devised a list of 8 players drafted in the 7th round in the past 10 years who are average at best.
Really speaking everything on hfboards and what I think or you think is an opinion.

My question is why you would rather bring onboard a player who is -19 in his last two seasons in 80 games played and 21 points in exchange for a 10% change at having a NHL level player

Whereas you could've had a player who is +20 in his last 93 games with 46 points for free.

This is ignoring of course play styles, Modin being the big body and Sturm being the determined speedy guy who is 4' shorter.

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02-28-2011, 06:59 PM
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Originally Posted by tfong View Post
The Boyes thing was just food for thought really. So everything including Langkow etc... is all assumptions I know.

The thing about Sturm is you know he can play top six if someone goes down and he was FREE. My point is that you used a 7th pick whereas an arguably better player could've been obtained for free just days ago.



He's not free. I said it before, and I'm saying it again, because you keep on saying he is "free."
Sturm would put the Flames about 600k over the cap, meaning more roster moves.
Roster moves.
For a 13th forward.
Who is paid 3.5m.

7th round pick > roster move to clear up space for a minor depth move.

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02-28-2011, 06:59 PM
  #41
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First off, I would of liked to get Boyes as well but it is unlikely that would of happened. Boyes is actually not playing centre any more either, he has been playing wing for the last few seasons. Second, he was basically traded for cap space. He makes 4 million a season and St. Louis basically wanted to unload his contract off of their books. So they had no interest in getting a roster player back in return. I am sure there were other teams who probably would of offered more for him but probably needed to send salary back to St. Louis, Buffalo had the cap space so that is why he went there. But I do think that Boyes would of been a good fit here.

Regarding the Modin trade I think it would of been better to trade a medium level prospect for him over the 7th round draft pick (lord knows we have enough of them in our system). A medium level prospect should be the equivalent to a 7th round pick anyways only they are further along in their devolpment. The only reason I say this is because we are already short 2 draft picks in upcoming draft leaving us a total 4 picks now. We were also short 2 draft picks in last years draft which isn't a great thing either. However, really at the end of the day it is most likely going to be a non factor so I not going to lose any sleep over it. Feaster made a deal that improved the Flames for playoffs and gave up for little in the process. I am sure another move or two will be made in the offseason to aquire a couple of more draft picks. All in all, considering what tradeable assets we have it was a positive day for the Flames.

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02-28-2011, 07:03 PM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hot Conroy View Post
[IMG][/IMG]


He's not free. I said it before, and I'm saying it again, because you keep on saying he is "free."
Sturm would put the Flames about 600k over the cap, meaning more roster moves.
Roster moves.
For a 13th forward.
Who is paid 3.5m.

7th round pick > roster move to clear up space for a minor depth move.
According to early report, Pardy is out for the season so you put him on IR and you now have that extra space for Sturm.

Also according to capgeek, we could actually take a player with a 2.4m caphit right now still so if you discount Modin, then you could've added Sturm even before putting Pardy on waivers.

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02-28-2011, 07:04 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tfong View Post
Really speaking everything on hfboards and what I think or you think is an opinion.

My question is why you would rather bring onboard a player who is -19 in his last two seasons in 80 games played and 21 points in exchange for a 10% change at having a NHL level player

Whereas you could've had a player who is +20 in his last 93 games with 46 points for free.

This is ignoring of course play styles, Modin being the big body and Sturm being the determined speedy guy who is 4' shorter.
+/- is the last thing I would base my decision on when one guy played for two top teams and the other on a struggling Atlanta team. Also Modin was really good for LA and don't know why you would need anything more then his type of player for a 13th forward. Also where would Sturm fit, he is not a 4th line guy, he excels playing in the top 6. We already have a 3 million dollar player in Hagman pushed down to the 4th line, did we need another?

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02-28-2011, 07:04 PM
  #44
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Waste of a pick. And I say that fully acknowledging just how useless a Flames 7th round pick is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FLAMES666 View Post
Feaster should have given our 2nd from next year so everyone could jump down his throat for that. But you do have a point we could have added Boyes, another under performing centerman. That would give us Boyes, Langkow, Jokinen, Stajan and Backlund for centers next year at the low price of 16.1 million dollars.
Boyes is a right winger now.

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02-28-2011, 07:05 PM
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According to early report, Pardy is out for the season so you put him on IR and you now have that extra space for Sturm.
Except he wasn't assigned and it was too late to do so.

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02-28-2011, 07:05 PM
  #46
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He's not free. I said it before, and I'm saying it again, because you keep on saying he is "free."
Sturm would put the Flames about 600k over the cap, meaning more roster moves.
Roster moves.
For a 13th forward.
Who is paid 3.5m.

7th round pick > roster move to clear up space for a minor depth move.
The Flames did have the option of sending Hagman down to the farm if they needed the cap space. Regardless I would not touch Sturm, his knee is more brittle than glass.

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02-28-2011, 07:26 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by FLAMES666 View Post
+/- is the last thing I would base my decision on when one guy played for two top teams and the other on a struggling Atlanta team. Also Modin was really good for LA and don't know why you would need anything more then his type of player for a 13th forward. Also where would Sturm fit, he is not a 4th line guy, he excels playing in the top 6. We already have a 3 million dollar player in Hagman pushed down to the 4th line, did we need another?
Sturm is UFA anyways, its the same argument you can use with Modin that you just use them as depth. Like I said, if you picked Sturm off waivers, its not like we paid a big price to get him, so there is no "obligation" to play him big minutes. The thing I like about Sturm is that his speed and two way play allows him to play any role. Obviously at this stage of his career he can still play top 6 whereas Modin can't. But this doesn't change the fact that of the two players, you paid for one with a small chance of an NHLer. But on the other hand you could've filled the 13th spot with a faster player without having to give up that 10% chance.

Nothing changes the fact he is just the 13th or depth forward. What it does change is that we now have one less pick and 10% less chance of an NHLer in the future.

Its not like Modin is any less fragile than Sturm.

@conroy: You have to wait for waiver claims. So you can just assign Pardy to IR then put in your claim for Sturm. Waiver isn't instant, you still need to wait for him to go through the team lists first and 24(48?) hours.

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02-28-2011, 07:38 PM
  #48
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Ok can I attempt to put this to rest? Yes we gave up a 7th for Modin. Also true, Sturm was on waivers, but cost double based on cap hit. Modin has great skills on the ice, and also is a great dressing room character.

Anyways, what tfong is arguing is that we could have a had a kostystin-like player, or a strahlman like that.

Unfortunately, tfong apparently has no idea about the Calgary Flames Draft past. Yes, there are still very capable NHL players out there when you get to the 7th round, but really, with he flames scouting, are we going to grab a player like that? probably not. AND even if we did, how many players mentioned above that were taken in the 7th round made it to being NHL regulars with the clubs that drafted them? Most of the time, a 7th round pick gets selected, then isnt signed, so they get a little bit angry and more motivated, they become better, and then finally they get signed by another NHL club who is in need of a cheap player to fill a position.


So in the end, that 7th round pick might be able to materialize into a good quality NHLer someday maybe 5-6 years down the line, but In this heated playoff race, I'd rather have Freddy Modin on the ice contributing, and also keeping th mood upbeat in the room.

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02-28-2011, 07:38 PM
  #49
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Are you guys complaining about losing the 7th rounder?

When was the last time a Flames' 7th rounder turn out to be anything?

Modin and Carson are nothing but insurance in case of injuries. You can consider them nothing, same as a 7th rounder in Flames hands.

There was nothing that Feaster could have done. He has a hot team so he cant mess with. He has nothing in term of prospects or picks that can attract real talent.

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02-28-2011, 07:50 PM
  #50
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I just think there were better options out there without using a 7th round pick.

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