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Is Erik Karlsson the worst defensive player in the NHL?

View Poll Results: Is Erik Karlsson the worst defensive player in the NHL??
Yes, sadly he is 22 13.50%
No, Karlsson isn't that bad 121 74.23%
Kovalev, he didn't even try 20 12.27%
Voters: 163. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
03-02-2011, 03:44 PM
  #251
Alpostrophe
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Why won't this thread die?

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Old
03-02-2011, 04:06 PM
  #252
TeamRenzo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by longsuffering View Post
First of all, this is the internet, you should not care or trust anything you read.

Secondly, maybe you should start a thread entitled " Karlsson overall defensive play is not that bad, really" ( you are delusional)

Thirdly, you last point about good stats > watching , makes no sense ( he has bad defensive stats and glaring mistakes when you watch)

My rationale, hmmm, well, little slow at work today, I was bored and am so sick and tired of Superfans like yourself blindly defending EK defensive play, when it is a real problem, defensive play, not offensive which is very good, I praise his offensive skills and hope that he develops into a competent defensive player, which would make him a more complete, long term franchise dman, which the EK superfan club has already annointed him
You have a problem with people singing his praises yet you harp on him for his lack of defensive play, you do realize that it is one and teh same right just opposite end of the spectrum.

Look, EK is not great defensively yet, but he will get better. Compare him to the rest of the team, overall the Sens have been pretty crappy all year in their own end. To call out a 20 year old is ridiculous.

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Old
03-02-2011, 04:08 PM
  #253
Niv
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As far as trolling goes, Tuna99 deserves a medal. A trolling thread doesn't often get this much attention

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Old
03-02-2011, 04:54 PM
  #254
longsuffering
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TeamRenzo View Post
You have a problem with people singing his praises yet you harp on him for his lack of defensive play, you do realize that it is one and teh same right just opposite end of the spectrum.

Look, EK is not great defensively yet, but he will get better. Compare him to the rest of the team, overall the Sens have been pretty crappy all year in their own end. To call out a 20 year old is ridiculous.
geez, thanks Team Renzo for your incredible observations, shame on me. I am glad he will get better, thanks for reassuring me and putting me in my place.

This thread is OVERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR, thanks to big poppa renzo and the internet morality police

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Old
03-02-2011, 05:02 PM
  #255
Asquaredx2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by longsuffering View Post
Please choose from one these stock replies courtesy of the EK Super Fan Club.

- you don't know anything about hockey
- It was Kuba's fault
- He is 20, these negative comments could ruin his career
- +/- means nothing, stupid stat
- there are alot of goals scored when he is on the ice, because he is on the ice alot
- he plays against the opposing teams best players
- he is an elite player
- he was f#@% allstar
- his speed more than makes up for his defensive mistakes
- his offense is what makes him a good defensive man
- it was the goalie's fault
- it was his d partners fault
- the whole team is horrible
- blah blah, something about the Leafs
- I don't actually watch the games, but his poster sure looks good on my wall

p.s. nobody wants objective critiques of this player on this board, he is awesome, case closed

The objective critique is that he has a lot of room for improvement and is not perfect defensively. Contending that he's not the worst defensive player in the NHL =/= blindly ignoring all Karlsson's faults. Contending that multiple people are usually at fault in a defensive breakdown leading to a goal =/= blindly ignoring Karlsson's faults.

There are so many potentially dangerous plays that Karlsson turns into non-issues because he's able to get back quickly and beat forwards to the puck (I remember one example on the powerplay distinctly last game). Because it's not "flashy" defence people ignore it and they only notice him when he makes mistakes and falsely assume his only contribution to this team's defense is negative.

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Old
03-02-2011, 05:43 PM
  #256
Sensfanman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asquaredx2 View Post
The objective critique is that he has a lot of room for improvement and is not perfect defensively. Contending that he's not the worst defensive player in the NHL =/= blindly ignoring all Karlsson's faults. Contending that multiple people are usually at fault in a defensive breakdown leading to a goal =/= blindly ignoring Karlsson's faults.

There are so many potentially dangerous plays that Karlsson turns into non-issues because he's able to get back quickly and beat forwards to the puck (I remember one example on the powerplay distinctly last game). Because it's not "flashy" defence people ignore it and they only notice him when he makes mistakes and falsely assume his only contribution to this team's defense is negative.
This is it. The be all end all of the issue. Well said.

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Old
03-02-2011, 06:26 PM
  #257
Curtinho
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I don't think that his defensive contribution is ONLY negative, but I think that the mistakes he makes outweigh the good defensive plays he makes. A lot of the mistakes he makes, or his inabilities he has, end up with a goal against us. As I've said before, that guy that always gets dunked on and has that picture taken? That's Karlsson.

With that in mind he's great offensively, he's only 20, and he has a lot of room to learn. We're a rebuilding team so he will be getting a lot of chances to improve his game. Some strength training over the summer, and a bit more of a focus on the defensive aspects of his game will do him some good.

Do we really think that he'll ever be elite defensively? Probably not, but as long as he's solid I won't mind. I'm more than happy to have him on our team though.

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Old
03-03-2011, 01:07 AM
  #258
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zetterberg40 View Post
Brett Lebda, Jakub Kindl. There's two.
Marc...Andre....Bergeron.

In Edmonton - He was the one that destroyed Roloson's knee in the Cup finals.
In NYI - He was benched regularly...While watching an Islanders game there were two commentators giving play by play and one said something along the lines of and it's a two on one with Bergeron back to which the other commentator said that's the scariest phrase in hockey.
In Montreal - In his first game he scores a goal but with the other team pressing in the final minutes he drops his stick in the slot and bends over to pick it up screening the goalie and giving up the tying goal.

This guy is HORRIBLE.

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Old
03-03-2011, 06:58 AM
  #259
Tuna99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadyone33 View Post
Marc...Andre....Bergeron.

In Edmonton - He was the one that destroyed Roloson's knee in the Cup finals.
In NYI - He was benched regularly...While watching an Islanders game there were two commentators giving play by play and one said something along the lines of and it's a two on one with Bergeron back to which the other commentator said that's the scariest phrase in hockey.
In Montreal - In his first game he scores a goal but with the other team pressing in the final minutes he drops his stick in the slot and bends over to pick it up screening the goalie and giving up the tying goal.

This guy is HORRIBLE.
I agree. It's like every time there is a 2-1 or a decision to pinch at the line it is the first time MAB is doing it. He gives indisiveness a new meaning. He was born without a defensive part of his brain.

He has the shot which has kept him in the league for so long and it's funny that people don't admit you can be so good offensively you stay in the league without being able to play D. People accept it the other way, players who have absolutley Zero offence (Cody Bass comes to mind as an Ottawa example or Jody Hull) but play tough D. If you called Jody Hull the worst offensive player in the history of the Sens people wouldn't have a problem with it, but you can't play the game the game the other way around. Poeple get offended for some weird reason

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Old
03-03-2011, 07:34 AM
  #260
wjhl2009fan
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longsuffering
He is 20 years old of course he is going to make mistakes.

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Old
03-03-2011, 08:36 AM
  #261
Sensfanman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuna99 View Post
I agree. It's like every time there is a 2-1 or a decision to pinch at the line it is the first time MAB is doing it. He gives indisiveness a new meaning. He was born without a defensive part of his brain.

He has the shot which has kept him in the league for so long and it's funny that people don't admit you can be so good offensively you stay in the league without being able to play D. People accept it the other way, players who have absolutley Zero offence (Cody Bass comes to mind as an Ottawa example or Jody Hull) but play tough D. If you called Jody Hull the worst offensive player in the history of the Sens people wouldn't have a problem with it, but you can't play the game the game the other way around. Poeple get offended for some weird reason
There is scientific evidence that suggests people dislike a loss more than they like an equivalent gain.

Example:
If you pay 1 dollar to flip a coin, heads you win 2 dollars, tails you win nothing
vs
If I give you 1 dollar and you flip a coin, heads you give me 2 dollars, tails you lose nothing

Most people would be more pissed if they lost the second game than if they didn't win the first despite equivalent outcomes. It's analgous to defense vs offense. Most people are more pissed if Karlsson costs a goal than if Chris Kelly can't score. It's called loss aversion.

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