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Old
03-06-2011, 02:34 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by nki View Post
Interesting. Why wouldn't we like the chart??
because it was about ticket prices

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03-06-2011, 02:41 PM
  #27
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Actually, I think that there's plenty of skill, but creativity seems to be discouraged.
It's both. Murray has stifled creativity and "skill" (defined here as play making ability) through his 1976 offensive system that should be as dead and buried as the disco ball but high end skill at the forward position isn't there. Kopitar is increasingly showing us that he is not an elite level center. Ryan Smyth and skilled don't collide in the same sentence. Brown...come on...Justin Williams is the most skilled winger we have. Penner is a great pick up not just because of his size but his amazing hands though remember who his center and right wing were in Anaheim - you want to talk about "skill"? Jesus.

A better coach takes this team to another level but I am not sure to the Cup. We are missing a couple of pieces still for that.

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03-06-2011, 02:45 PM
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Actually, I think that there's plenty of skill, but creativity seems to be discouraged.
Yepp!

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03-06-2011, 02:47 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by TonySCV View Post
You just can't help yourself, can you.
Well who else is to blame that the team is "short on skill" in the fifth season with DL in charge?

Maybe we can keep blaming Dave Taylor, that seems to be the popular thing to do.

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03-06-2011, 02:52 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Zad View Post
It's both. Murray has stifled creativity and "skill" (defined here as play making ability) through his 1976 offensive system that should be as dead and buried as the disco ball but high end skill at the forward position isn't there. Kopitar is increasingly showing us that he is not an elite level center. Ryan Smyth and skilled don't collide in the same sentence. Brown...come on...Justin Williams is the most skilled winger we have. Penner is a great pick up not just because of his size but his amazing hands though remember who his center and right wing were in Anaheim - you want to talk about "skill"? Jesus.

A better coach takes this team to another level but I am not sure to the Cup. We are missing a couple of pieces still for that.
I agree with with everything you have said except the part about Kopitar. I think Anze is an elite player but there is only so much you can do when you are the center of every teams defensive game plan.

If Kopitar ever gets either an elite winger or a truly good second line center to take some pressure off him he will be better.

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03-06-2011, 03:37 PM
  #31
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Lombardi basically said that the team doesn't have the most talented guys and part of that is his fault that he hasn't gotten someone. That basically led in to the reason we have a poor power play is we don't have the most creative players.

I completely disagree with this, there's a difference between creativity and just trying anything different. It seems that if they stray from the system it's the worst thing ever.

Another Lombardi quote I thought was hilarious was, "Our power play is going from low to high, getting a shot and getting traffic in front" When is there ever any ****ing traffic in front? Usually there's one guy who maybe in front and someone picking their nose to the left of the goalie.

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03-06-2011, 05:40 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Herby View Post
I agree with with everything you have said except the part about Kopitar. I think Anze is an elite player but there is only so much you can do when you are the center of every teams defensive game plan.

If Kopitar ever gets either an elite winger or a truly good second line center to take some pressure off him he will be better.
Nonsense brother. Dustin Penner is a first line left wing on a good team and Williams is that on the right. Kopitar need only look at himself. It's not Murray telling him to go behind the net when he is streaking with the puck down the lane. It's not his left or right wing that is keeping him from looking for the shot when the puck is on his stick. You can put a lot on Murray and his system but Anze doesn't get a pass with what is his own lack of courage / balls (to the net) and confidence (shot)

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03-06-2011, 05:43 PM
  #33
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they just magically appear and are in abundance
Magically appear? Look at his join date.

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03-06-2011, 06:06 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Herby View Post
Well who else is to blame that the team is "short on skill" in the fifth season with DL in charge?

Maybe we can keep blaming Dave Taylor, that seems to be the popular thing to do.
It's comical that any fan can take issue with the power play, harp on and on about how it's a coaching, and the second Dean says that it's a personnel problem, out comes a giant helping of "no **** sherlock - whose fault is that?". That only comes out of the mouth of someone that's so blinded by their distaste for management that they temporarily forget what their own two eyes have been witnessing all season.

What would help more - a new power play system or the addition of personnel? If Kompon can't get Jack Johnson and Drew Doughty and Anze Kopitar producing on the PP, he shouldn't be coaching the power play. That is star-caliber talent that isn't getting it done.

Dean's protecting his coaching staff by saying it's a personnel problem.

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03-06-2011, 06:13 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Belanger25 View Post
Lombardi basically said that the team doesn't have the most talented guys and part of that is his fault that he hasn't gotten someone. That basically led in to the reason we have a poor power play is we don't have the most creative players.

I completely disagree with this, there's a difference between creativity and just trying anything different. It seems that if they stray from the system it's the worst thing ever.

Another Lombardi quote I thought was hilarious was, "Our power play is going from low to high, getting a shot and getting traffic in front" When is there ever any ****ing traffic in front? Usually there's one guy who maybe in front and someone picking their nose to the left of the goalie.
Yeah, I don't buy it either. Could we use more talent up front? Sure. But we have plenty of talent that should bring better results on the PP. Talent level doesn't explain why teams like Minnesota or Buffalo have better PPs than we do. It doesn't explain why teams like Washington or Philadelphia have worse PPs than we do.

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03-06-2011, 06:16 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by TonySCV View Post
It's comical that any fan can take issue with the power play, harp on and on about how it's a coaching, and the second Dean says that it's a personnel problem, out comes a giant helping of "no **** sherlock - whose fault is that?". That only comes out of the mouth of someone that's so blinded by their distaste for management that they temporarily forget what their own two eyes have been witnessing all season.

What would help more - a new power play system or the addition of personnel? If Kompon can't get Jack Johnson and Drew Doughty and Anze Kopitar producing on the PP, he shouldn't be coaching the power play. That is star-caliber talent that isn't getting it done.

Dean's protecting his coaching staff by saying it's a personnel problem.


I was just writing about this

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03-06-2011, 06:32 PM
  #37
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There are so many little thing that are subtle little plays that could change the look. The one that probably drives me insane the most, puck goes from the point down low to Kopitar in the corner, all he needs to do is take 2-3 steps towards the front. Take the two steps look at your options and pressure the defense. Gives options, throw the puck at the goalies feet and start a scramble. If you got Penner and Smyth in front try it and get Brown and Williams to join in. If you're lucky maybe you'll catch a goalie off guard and get a short side goal.

Since the system we use is so point based the PK team does not have to pressure low and can stay high. That's why Johnson and Doughty can never get a shot off(One reason I don't mind Stoll shooting high every now and then is his poor accuracy might scare a defensive forward from pressuring him as hard as they'd like). Little things they could change can open up the space for them to score.

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03-06-2011, 06:38 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Beauty, eh? View Post
Magically appear? Look at his join date.
not Herby....acquiring top end skill. it's called sarcasm

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03-06-2011, 06:39 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Belanger25 View Post
There are so many little thing that are subtle little plays that could change the look. The one that probably drives me insane the most, puck goes from the point down low to Kopitar in the corner, all he needs to do is take 2-3 steps towards the front. Take the two steps look at your options and pressure the defense. Gives options, throw the puck at the goalies feet and start a scramble. If you got Penner and Smyth in front try it and get Brown and Williams to join in. If you're lucky maybe you'll catch a goalie off guard and get a short side goal.

Since the system we use is so point based the PK team does not have to pressure low and can stay high. That's why Johnson and Doughty can never get a shot off(One reason I don't mind Stoll shooting high every now and then is his poor accuracy might scare a defensive forward from pressuring him as hard as they'd like). Little things they could change can open up the space for them to score.
I totally agree. I don't know how much blame goes where on that but Kopitar was driving me crazy last game on the PP. He's either stationary with his ass planted on the half boards playing catch with the d-men or he's in the corner, stationary, and when he gets the puck he doesn't move. It makes it so easy to defend. If Kopitar attacks the net in those situations, either the PK forward(s) have to collapse down low to help and it opens up the point shot, which is what the coaches are always saying they want. If those PK forward(s) don't collapse down, then we actually are overloading the PK in scoring areas instead of how we typically do so at the blue line.

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03-06-2011, 06:44 PM
  #40
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I totally agree. I don't know how much blame goes where on that but Kopitar was driving me crazy last game on the PP. He's either stationary with his ass planted on the half boards playing catch with the d-men or he's in the corner, stationary, and when he gets the puck he doesn't move. It makes it so easy to defend. If Kopitar attacks the net in those situations, either the PK forward(s) have to collapse down low to help and it opens up the point shot, which is what the coaches are always saying they want. If those PK forward(s) don't collapse down, then we actually are overloading the PK in scoring areas instead of how we typically do so at the blue line.
I swear it's like we have 5 guys who have never played on a power play before. I'd bet Kopitar's shot is good enough to catch most goalies off guard from that sharp angle.

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03-06-2011, 06:45 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Whiskeypete View Post
they just magically appear and are in abundance
Don't you get it yet? All Lombardi had to do was pay mighty midget and everything would be fine today and the Kings would be dominating the NHL.

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03-06-2011, 06:52 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by TonySCV View Post
It's comical that any fan can take issue with the power play, harp on and on about how it's a coaching, and the second Dean says that it's a personnel problem, out comes a giant helping of "no **** sherlock - whose fault is that?". That only comes out of the mouth of someone that's so blinded by their distaste for management that they temporarily forget what their own two eyes have been witnessing all season.

What would help more - a new power play system or the addition of personnel? If Kompon can't get Jack Johnson and Drew Doughty and Anze Kopitar producing on the PP, he shouldn't be coaching the power play. That is star-caliber talent that isn't getting it done.

Dean's protecting his coaching staff by saying it's a personnel problem.
I agree with this to some degree, but do any of us really believe that Kompon tells Kopitar to stay glued to the half-wall on the PP? Do we also believe that he tells Kopitar to hold onto the puck for 2 or 3 seconds everytime he receives a pass on the half-wall?

I encourage folks to go back and watch the 5-on-3 PP from yesterday's game and see how long Kopitar holds onto the puck during that minute. He needs to make much quicker decisions and move more.

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03-06-2011, 06:53 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
I agree with this to some degree, but do any of us really believe that Kompon tells Kopitar to stay glued to the half-wall on the PP? Do we also believe that he tells Kopitar to hold onto the puck for 2 or 3 seconds everytime he receives a pass on the half-wall?

I encourage folks to go back and watch the 5-on-3 PP from yesterday's game and see how long Kopitar holds onto the puck during that minute. He needs to make much quicker decisions and move more.
It's Kompon's system and the lack of any type of movement. Watch that 5 on 3 and you'll see 5 Kings players who aren't moving, you're not going to score if no one is moving.

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03-06-2011, 06:54 PM
  #44
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Zad,

We will just have to agree to disagree on Kopitar. I have a ton of faith in his abilties and feel he is an elite center in the NHL. Like I mentioned in an earlier Kopitar thread I got a chance to talk to someone who plays the Kings four times a year and was absolutely glowing about Kopitar and how his teams entire defensive focus is shutting him down and how he is one of the most underrated stars in the game.

I also liked the Penner deal and Williams has been great this season but neither one is Kopitar's "Robin". The Kings still need to add that piece to the puzzle. We need another 75 point player.

@Tony,

You can sit here and say I am blinded by my distaste of the Kings management and that's fine, you can think that. But I could just as much say that people like KINGS17 want to sit back and praise him for the good and turn your heads on the major flaws with this team. Lombardi gets up there and tells people we don't have enough skill, pretty funny since he is the guy who traded away and let walk away a large amount of the skill that he inherited and replaced them with, what you guys like to call them "Lombardi Players" and then wonder why a PP filled with Lombardi players like Stoll, Smyth and Handzus sucks.

And I am in agreement with you on Kompon and Murray, been saying it since last season. But they are exactly what Dean wants. That is my biggest gripe with people like Sydor25, I respect his opinion more than most on this board but to think firing Murray is going to magically make this team an offensive power is ridiculous. This team has been built to run the Terry Murray dead-puck system from the moment he was hired after the 07-08 season.

As long as Dean Lombardi and Terry Murray are leading this team we can continue to try and win every game 2-1. Sorry if I find that to be an awful way to play hockey.

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03-06-2011, 06:57 PM
  #45
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Don't you get it yet? All Lombardi had to do was pay mighty midget and everything would be fine today and the Kings would be dominating the NHL.
i know. people also assume that top tier talent grow on trees, which is what i'm getting at. top tier LW's are rare these days - league wide, which is why almost every team is looking for them. there are a lot of 1a/1b's, 2's skating on top lines; but really only a few true 1A's out there

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03-06-2011, 06:59 PM
  #46
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Nothing on Schenn? I follow Mayor as well, but didn't see anything about Schenn.

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03-06-2011, 07:01 PM
  #47
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It's Kompon's system and the lack of any type of movement. Watch that 5 on 3 and you'll see 5 Kings players who aren't moving, you're not going to score if no one is moving.
Agree that none of the five are moving at all. I see the same thing, but I am not convinced that Kompon is coaching it exactly that way. The PP in the Vancouver series last year had much more movement, especially at the top with Johnson and Doughty walking the line. You really think Kompon told them not to do that anymore?

Kopitar has to be the most frustrating player to watch on the PP at this point. He is so predictable and slow in everything he does on the PP.

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03-06-2011, 07:02 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
I agree with this to some degree, but do any of us really believe that Kompon tells Kopitar to stay glued to the half-wall on the PP? Do we also believe that he tells Kopitar to hold onto the puck for 2 or 3 seconds everytime he receives a pass on the half-wall?

I encourage folks to go back and watch the 5-on-3 PP from yesterday's game and see how long Kopitar holds onto the puck during that minute. He needs to make much quicker decisions and move more.
It's been happening all season. I would have thought by now that 60 games in they'd have drilled into the player's heads that they can't stand still.

The 5 on 3 is embarrassingly bad.

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03-06-2011, 07:06 PM
  #49
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Zad,

We will just have to agree to disagree on Kopitar. I have a ton of faith in his abilties and feel he is an elite center in the NHL. Like I mentioned in an earlier Kopitar thread I got a chance to talk to someone who plays the Kings four times a year and was absolutely glowing about Kopitar and how his teams entire defensive focus is shutting him down and how he is one of the most underrated stars in the game.

I also liked the Penner deal and Williams has been great this season but neither one is Kopitar's "Robin". The Kings still need to add that piece to the puzzle. We need another 75 point player.

@Tony,

You can sit here and say I am blinded by my distaste of the Kings management and that's fine, you can think that. But I could just as much say that people like KINGS17 want to sit back and praise him for the good and turn your heads on the major flaws with this team. Lombardi gets up there and tells people we don't have enough skill, pretty funny since he is the guy who traded away and let walk away a large amount of the skill that he inherited and replaced them with, what you guys like to call them "Lombardi Players" and then wonder why a PP filled with Lombardi players like Stoll, Smyth and Handzus sucks.

And I am in agreement with you on Kompon and Murray, been saying it since last season. But they are exactly what Dean wants. That is my biggest gripe with people like Sydor25, I respect his opinion more than most on this board but to think firing Murray is going to magically make this team an offensive power is ridiculous. This team has been built to run the Terry Murray dead-puck system from the moment he was hired after the 07-08 season.

As long as Dean Lombardi and Terry Murray are leading this team we can continue to try and win every game 2-1. Sorry if I find that to be an awful way to play hockey.
I have never once said this team doesn't have flaws. Unlike you I did not expect the major repairs that were needed to the goaltending, defense, and finally offensive-minded forwards to be completed in just five short years. Considering the average junior player that is drafted takes about that long to make an impact in the NHL.

Since that seems to be what you were expecting, you must be an advocate of the philosophy of trading home-grown talent for mercenaries. That approach has proven to be a failure time and time again.

As far as your evaluation of Smyth and Stoll, yeah it sucks. Your evaluation that is.

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It's been happening all season. I would have thought by now that 60 games in they'd have drilled into the player's heads that they can't stand still.

The 5 on 3 is embarrassingly bad.
No disputing that.


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03-06-2011, 07:06 PM
  #50
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Skill is not the same as "creativity."

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