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Old
03-05-2011, 03:52 PM
  #101
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Originally Posted by chosen View Post
How about the Rangers not throw another enormous contract at someone who has pre-existing health issues.

That would be a nice change of pace.
How about the Rangers draft and develop their own homegrown first-line all-star playmaking center/PP QB?

Wait, what's that you say? They didn't do that?

Well, then there's basically only one option on the table. Unless you want to spend another 2-3-4 years, maybe more, struggling to make the playoffs.

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03-05-2011, 03:53 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
How about the Rangers draft and develop their own homegrown first-line all-star playmaking center/PP QB?

Wait, what's that you say? They didn't do that?

Well, then there's basically only one option on the table. Unless you want to spend another 2-3-4 years, maybe more, struggling to make the playoffs.
I know you're not a huge fan of Derek Stepan, but even you have to admit that the kid is going to have a good long NHL career. And he could very possibly become a 1B type pivot. And people are going to have to try even harder to label him a "3rd liner" as an excuse when we lose a couple games than Callahan and Dubinsky.

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03-05-2011, 03:57 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by Fitzy Duke of NY View Post
I know you're not a huge fan of Derek Stepan, but even you have to admit that the kid is going to have a good long NHL career. And he could very possibly become a 1B type pivot. And people are going to have to try even harder to label him a "3rd liner" as an excuse when we lose a couple games than Callahan and Dubinsky.
Actually, I'm a HUGE Derek Stepan fan. He's one of my all-time favorite prospects. I fell in love with him when he was in college because his approach to the game was, IMO, the best approach to the game: he used his head and passed the puck, cycled the puck. A LOT.

What I'm not a fan of is how, for whatever the reason may be, has traded in the game that got him here for a much less effective and efficient one. I don't know who is responsible for that, but I don't think it's good for the team or the player in the long-run. 20 goals for a rookie is very impressive, but at what price?

I've always felt he was going to be a very good player in the league. 60-65 points, maybe even 70-75. Weiss is a decent comparison, IMO, although Stepan will probably surpass his production.

But as much as I like him, he's no Richards, and 1B centers are not good enough to win Stanley Cups with.

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03-05-2011, 04:23 PM
  #104
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Brad Richards (concussion-like symptoms) stayed in Los Angeles, will work out there and the team will join him after the game tonight. Practice is iffy for Sunday, so his next workout with the team might be Monday morning at Staples Center before the game against the Kings.
http://starsblog.dallasnews.com/arch...n-in-goal.html

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03-05-2011, 04:57 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
How about the Rangers draft and develop their own homegrown first-line all-star playmaking center/PP QB?
.
In the New NHL, that only happens from tanking. Unless we trade lundqvist, we arent going to be getting a player of that level from a draft pick (luck aside).

Tavares, Kane, Crosby, Malkin, Ovechkin, Backstrom, Towes, etc, all got to their teams after their teams only after their rosters were gutted for multiple seasons.

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03-05-2011, 06:09 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by skroob View Post
In the New NHL, that only happens from tanking. Unless we trade lundqvist, we arent going to be getting a player of that level from a draft pick (luck aside).

Tavares, Kane, Crosby, Malkin, Ovechkin, Backstrom, Towes, etc, all got to their teams after their teams only after their rosters were gutted for multiple seasons.
Yes, that was kind of the point. Except we could have kept Lundqvist and still managed to get a top 3 pick had things been done differently.

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03-05-2011, 06:16 PM
  #107
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so the moral of the story is, the NYR MUST acquire talent via trade/UFAs in addition to waiting for our crop of young players and prospects to come to fruition.

with Redden and Drury's salary going away soon we should put that money into 2-3 drop dead talented players. we simply have to have more top end talent on this team while youth develops or we're going nowhere fast.

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03-05-2011, 06:33 PM
  #108
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Brad Richards didn’t end up on Broadway at Tuesday’s NHL trade deadline.

However, that doesn’t mean he won’t relocate there eventually.

The Dallas Stars centre didn’t want to be dealt to any other team but the Rangers before the deadline, and although he was willing to waive his no-movement clause to go to Manhattan, the two sides couldn’t find a fit.

While Stars GM Joe Nieuwendyk tried to sign Richards to a contract extension before the trade deadline, the two sides couldn’t agree on the length of the deal and never really got around to discussing money.

League sources say the Stars offered Richards a “fair market” contract, but it’s believed he and agent Pat Morris wanted a deal closer in the seven- to 10-year range.
http://www.ottawasun.com/sports/hock.../17507741.html

I certainly hope he is not looking for a seven to ten year deal. That would be asinine.

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03-05-2011, 06:39 PM
  #109
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7-10 year deal?

Maybe when we could get around the cap and sign him for a 4 mil cap hit.

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03-05-2011, 07:34 PM
  #110
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7-10 year deal?

Maybe when we could get around the cap and sign him for a 4 mil cap hit.
I'd lol if we could get away with it, but that is certainly cap circumvention and we'd probably be fined heavily with a pick or two taken away.

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03-05-2011, 07:52 PM
  #111
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Well, if that's true, then you an probably forget about Richards. *Sigh*.

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Old
03-05-2011, 08:01 PM
  #112
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Well, if that's true, than you an probably forget about Richards. *Sigh*.
The only team I could see offering him that deal would be Toronto.

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03-05-2011, 08:02 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by Steven Mastrosimone View Post
Well, if that's true, than you an probably forget about Richards. *Sigh*.
If Richards wants a seven year deal then no NtC or nmc and 6.5 vs 7 million rangers can afford that and gives them flexibility if he wants a nmc 4-5 years max

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03-05-2011, 08:08 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by Ih8theislanders View Post
The only team I could see offering him that deal would be Toronto.
Burke has spoken out quite extensively about his disdain for long term deals. Hell, he even testified about their evils at the Kovalchuk arbitration hearing. I doubt he changes his tune for Richards.

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03-05-2011, 11:45 PM
  #115
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Originally Posted by BlueshirtBlitz View Post
7-10 year deal?

Maybe when we could get around the cap and sign him for a 4 mil cap hit.
I don't think Sather would sign such a deal. Gaborik only got a 5 year deal at the age of 28. At 30, I doubt Sather would commit to more than 5 without a salary drop at the end. He's front loaded a lot of contracts in the past. As far as a NMC, I'm more a fan of the limited NTC - like a list of 13 teams he can turn down at the beginning of each season. Hopefully he's finally learned his UFA lessons.

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03-06-2011, 04:04 AM
  #116
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Now we put him further down the list and start focusing on other players...

7-10 years is insane..

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03-06-2011, 06:24 AM
  #117
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Rangers aren't offering that type of deal

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It's no slam dunk, by the way, that Richards will become a Ranger when (and if) the center hits the open market on July 1, for the Blueshirts won't be the highest bidder.

The Rangers won't offer either the term or dollars Richards will be able to get from the Kings and Maple Leafs and perhaps the Stars, either if they have their ownership situation settled or the NHL pledges a budget deep enough to retain Richards.

Expect Richards to get offers for seven or eight years in the neighborhood of $7 million to $7.5 million per. Expect the Rangers to offer five or six years at between $6 million to $6.5 million per.

Sather would have been willing to overpay to some degree for Richards in order to allow him to experience playing on Broadway and living in New York in the hope that would have made accepting a discount on a long-term deal an easier sell.

Now, the Rangers are left to take Richards' musings to friends about wanting to play in New York as a basis for hope going into July 1. But then, Marty St. Louis, another of coach John Tortorella's Tampa Bay favorites, always said that too, but never once took the necessary step to turn musings into reality.

Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/islan...#ixzz1Foz56Piy

5 years/$32.5M/$6.5M would be my highest offer

Arthur Staple from last week

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Reports around the league have indicated that the bidding for Richards on July 1 could get crazy, seeing as how he's the top center available. But it doesn't appear as though the Rangers, who almost always get their man on day one of free agency, will go nuts for Richards should he reach the open market.
http://mobile.newsday.com/inf/infomo...ed:i=1.2717805

There you have it. The hockey scribes with the best Ranger connects are reporting the same thing.

Won't break the bank for Richards. The Rangers told them that.

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03-06-2011, 06:53 AM
  #118
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Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
How about the Rangers draft and develop their own homegrown first-line all-star playmaking center/PP QB?

Wait, what's that you say? They didn't do that?

Well, then there's basically only one option on the table. Unless you want to spend another 2-3-4 years, maybe more, struggling to make the playoffs.
If you think the Rangers should go after another top paid player long term, who is coming off a concussion, and if they get their man, the damage to long term playoff appearances could end up far greater than not getting their man. In my mind, it is potential suicide.

Hey, that fits perfectly into Sather's track record, so it's probably the likely road.

Look, I've maintained since Sather was signed, that it would be a gigantic mistake. Some of you here are still saying he's been good since the lockout. If you believe he has been good since then, you don't pay top dollar for a longterm contract to someone who is currently concussed.

If Richards' concussion reappears, you've got 15 million a year tied up in Gaborik and Richards. It will make Drury and Redden seem like the good old days.

If you're saying Sather has stunk up the joint forever, than you can feel that signing Richards would be a smart gamble, but you would be admitting that it's been over 10 years of second rate garbage management.

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03-06-2011, 08:55 AM
  #119
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Eh.

I believe sanity will win in the end for both sides.

Richards won't get 10 years from any team, including Dallas. Maybe he just doesn't really want to be there, and he's pricing himself out, rather then leaving on a sour note by saying he doesn't want to return.

They shipped out one of his young linemates, Neal, and they have no stable ownership, and probably won't by July.

If he was ONLY willing to waive his NTC for the Rangers, what does that say?

Reading between the lines he wants to play for the Rangers and Tortorella in New York.

5-6 years, 6.5 per

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03-06-2011, 09:04 AM
  #120
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Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
Actually, I'm a HUGE Derek Stepan fan. He's one of my all-time favorite prospects. I fell in love with him when he was in college because his approach to the game was, IMO, the best approach to the game: he used his head and passed the puck, cycled the puck. A LOT.

What I'm not a fan of is how, for whatever the reason may be, has traded in the game that got him here for a much less effective and efficient one. I don't know who is responsible for that, but I don't think it's good for the team or the player in the long-run. 20 goals for a rookie is very impressive, but at what price?

I've always felt he was going to be a very good player in the league. 60-65 points, maybe even 70-75. Weiss is a decent comparison, IMO, although Stepan will probably surpass his production.
Uh, maybe it's because the NHL is an entirely different game than college hockey and what he used to do doesn't work as well? Not to mention he's going from a league in which he was on of the top talents in the nation to a league where there are tons of players who are just as talented as he is, if not moreso, and are older, bigger, smarter about playing this kind of hockey, etc.

He's still a very smart player, he cycles the puck, uses his head, and is always looking ahead. To be honest, I'm pretty impressed that he has adapted to the NHL in the way that he has. A lot of players can't handle having to tweak their game to be effective at the NHL level, but Stepan did it quite well. He's still a fantastic passer but he doesn't overlook chances of his own when he gets them, which is a chronic problem for guys labeled "playmakers"

So, I guess I have to disagree a bit...what brought him success at the college level was his smarts, and it's his smarts that are making him a successful NHL player at this point

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03-06-2011, 09:31 AM
  #121
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I agree with Lev, here.

Stepan isn't exactly dominating with skill.

He's more of a be in the right place at the right time, make smart decisions with the puck, type of guy.

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03-06-2011, 10:34 AM
  #122
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Hey, that fits perfectly into Sather's track record, so it's probably the likely road.
No, it isn't. It's nothing like most of Sather's moves. Most of Sather's moves involved signing role players to huge contracts. Richards is not a role player. He's one of the top 10 offensive players in the league.

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Look, I've maintained since Sather was signed, that it would be a gigantic mistake. Some of you here are still saying he's been good since the lockout. If you believe he has been good since then, you don't pay top dollar for a longterm contract to someone who is currently concussed.
Actually, I think Sather has done a horrible since the lockout. I think he's one of the worst executives in the history of professional sports. Signing Richards would be one of the few smart things he's done. For once, he'd be going after a player that is worth a big contract.

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If Richards' concussion reappears, you've got 15 million a year tied up in Gaborik and Richards. It will make Drury and Redden seem like the good old days.
But that's not even the point. The point is you haven't offered an alternative solution to a problem that has gone on here for nearly 15 years, and there doesn't appear to be any other viable one on the horizon.

If Richards gets hurt, he gets hurt. Plenty of players have had one concussion and managed to continue playing at a high level. If you had the chance to offer a max long-term contract to Crosby right now, you wouldn't do that? I sure would. But unfortunately there is only one Crosby. And you aren't getting Datsyuk or Sedin. That means Richards is the best thing you're going to get, and even then, guys at his level are rarely available.

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Uh, maybe it's because the NHL is an entirely different game than college hockey and what he used to do doesn't work as well?
Having watched all but one or two games this season, including preseason, I fail to see how this would be known, considering I haven't seen him attempt to play "his" game very often, if ever. From the very first game of the season, it was puzzling how passing got pushed to the backburner when the puck was on his stick.

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Not to mention he's going from a league in which he was on of the top talents in the nation to a league where there are tons of players who are just as talented as he is, if not moreso, and are older, bigger, smarter about playing this kind of hockey, etc.
And yet plenty of players in the same situation have not gone so far away from what made them successful as he has. There is no doubt every player has to adjust, but to make such a dramatic change...you don't see that quite as often, especially with players who rely on their mental game.

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He's still a very smart player, he cycles the puck, uses his head, and is always looking ahead. To be honest, I'm pretty impressed that he has adapted to the NHL in the way that he has. A lot of players can't handle having to tweak their game to be effective at the NHL level, but Stepan did it quite well. He's still a fantastic passer but he doesn't overlook chances of his own when he gets them, which is a chronic problem for guys labeled "playmakers"
I disagree completely. The only thing this tweaking has done is make him less effective, and worse, less efficient. He regularly foregos passes that he would have always made in college to take a lot of weak shots that result in low quality scoring chances this season. His tendency to pass the puck or look for a cycle has almost vanished compared to the way he played in college. It's like watching a completely different player.

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So, I guess I have to disagree a bit...what brought him success at the college level was his smarts, and it's his smarts that are making him a successful NHL player at this point
I don't know how you can watch him at Wisconsin and watch him now, and think that he's playing "smart." I think his game has been dumbed down in every regard. It may not be of his own doing. I don't know who is responsible, whether it is him or Tortorella, or some combination of factors, but it's very disappointing.

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03-07-2011, 03:50 PM
  #123
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No Richards tonight, but all in Dallas are hopeful for Wednesday.
http://twitter.com/#!/DarrenDreger/s...01847902474241

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Dallas Stars center Brad Richards is out for tonight's game. He is back in Dallas and worked out in Frisco this morning. This will be the tenth game that Richards has missed with concussion-like symptoms.
http://espn.go.com/blog/DallasStars/...-injury-update

Quote:
Brad Richards did not skate with the Stars in Los Angeles this morning, and is, in fact, back in Texas.

He skated this morning there and is getting treatment and talking to doctors. He seems to be doing well, coach Marc Crawford said, but it is a day-to-day process.

``There's not a question on conditioning or will or want or desire, it's just feel and trust,'' Crawford said. ``He has to feel the right way, and we have to trust that he understands himself better than anyone else. A lot of it is patience, and we have absolute patience with him.''
http://starsblog.dallasnews.com/arch...man-tonig.html

He left team in California and returned to Dallas. That doesn't sound good.

3 weeks since he suffered the concussion.

If the Rangers had traded for him,he would have missed the Buffalo,Minnesota,Ottawa and Philly games.

When will Richards play again? Wednesday against the Flames in Dallas? The Stars thought he was going to play over the weekend.

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03-07-2011, 03:54 PM
  #124
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Originally Posted by chosen View Post
How about the Rangers not throw another enormous contract at someone who has pre-existing health issues.

That would be a nice change of pace.
Thank you, someone with rationality. Signing Richards would be a huge mistake, although Im sure Sting36e will go on another 12 post rant with his usual cockiness and self superiority.

We have the correct pieces they just need to grow, also The Flyers were the 7th seed and made it to the Finals, once you get in, anything can happen, including this year.

EDIT: seriously didn't even see the post two slots above me before I posted that lol

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03-07-2011, 03:58 PM
  #125
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Thank you, someone with rationality. Signing Richards would be a huge mistake,
There is no rationality in saying Richards would be a mistake, other than missing a few weeks with a minor concussion. He's a 90+ point center who can qaurterback a powerplay. Where else are we getting such a player? Fairy tale land?

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although Im sure Sting36e will go on another 12 post rant with his usual cockiness and self superiority.
*Correct 12 post rant.

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We have the correct pieces they just need to grow, also The Flyers were the 7th seed and made it to the Finals, once you get in, anything can happen, including this year.
They do not have the elite talent. Not nearly enough. This team isn't winning a cup with Brandon Dubinsky as a 1st line LW, and Dan Girardi as a 1st pairing defenseman.

And people need to give the "anything can happen" as rest. The Flyers, for whatever reason, had an underwhelming regular season. Locker room problems. The way they played in the playoffs is what was expected of them all along.

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