HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Notices

Bettman 5 step plan against concussions

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
03-14-2011, 01:48 PM
  #26
googlymoogly
Registered User
 
googlymoogly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 8,087
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Habs10Habs View Post
Well first you get the committee, then you get the actions. Seems easy enough to understand to me.

As for rule #3, sounds fishy to me too, so we'll see how that one goes.
Whenever a player is injured during an illegal on ice action that player shall be suspended minimum one game. You are allowed only three of those infractions during your career. On 4th infraction you are suspended for 40 games no matter the outcome. This will take out the cheapshot artists from the league.

googlymoogly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 01:51 PM
  #27
Karl Pilkington
Registered User
 
Karl Pilkington's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Ottawa
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,937
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Habs10Habs View Post
Well first you get the committee, then you get the actions. Seems easy enough to understand to me.

As for rule #3, sounds fishy to me too, so we'll see how that one goes.


Yeahh, I just don't have faith in these committees. Wasn't there one set up for goalie equipment?

This isn't an issue that requires any further debate in my opinion. No rule change or configuration to the ice surface or equipment will be as effective a response than the NHL holding players accountable for their actions through suspensions and infractions that make sense.

Karl Pilkington is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 01:57 PM
  #28
Gary320
Moderator
 
Gary320's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 11,182
vCash: 500
I don't get out how any equipment change will change players giving each other head shots. Okay, sure maybe the victim won't be concussed as badly, but that still doesn't change the fact that it's a violent, lack of respect and it's still going to occur.

It's like, here instead of running around with a real knife, pretend your killing someone with a plastic knife. You're still saying, head shots are okay. That's the problem with this league, everything is fine until someone really get's badly hurt and then they see the problem.

I'm all in favor of setting a number of games. HEAD SHOT OF ANY KIND = X AMOUNT OF GAMES. Set a basis and people will stop. That's what I think. I have no problem with severity either. If it's 10 games for any hit to the head, so be it.

Gary320 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 01:57 PM
  #29
googlymoogly
Registered User
 
googlymoogly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 8,087
vCash: 500
Any team that injures another teams player to the point that player must retire will forfeit their 1st round draft pick to the victim team. This pick will be at the discretion of the victim team to decide what year they want to exercise their 1st round pick but must be used withing 3 years.

Any player that is injured and misses over 40 games that team will receive a 3rd round pick under the same rules above.

googlymoogly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 01:58 PM
  #30
swimmer77
What's an ROW?
 
swimmer77's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: in water
Country: Czech_ Republic
Posts: 3,338
vCash: 500
Was it Pacioretty getting hurt or sponsors threatening as a result of the hit that got Bettman moving? So the sponsors are not lining up like he first thought? I'm getting older and more cynical - I can't help it.

I'll believe this plan is meaningful when there is action because when it's all said and done, more often than not more is said than actually done - or something like that.

swimmer77 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 01:58 PM
  #31
Kriss E
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 20,944
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by googlymoogly View Post
Whenever a player is injured during an illegal on ice action that player shall be suspended minimum one game. You are allowed only three of those infractions during your career. On 4th infraction you are suspended for 40 games no matter the outcome. This will take out the cheapshot artists from the league.
Why wait for the 4th time to give out significant suspensions??..Why give so much rope to the player? Why start with 1 game??
7games minimum after first time. Each time, the suspension doubles. First 7, second 14, third 28, fourth 56..

Kriss E is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 02:00 PM
  #32
Gary320
Moderator
 
Gary320's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 11,182
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by googlymoogly View Post
Any team that injures another teams player to the point that player must retire will forfeit their 1st round draft pick to the victim team. This pick will be at the discretion of the victim team to decide what year they want to exercise their 1st round pick but must be used withing 3 years.

Any player that is injured and misses over 40 games that team will receive a 3rd round pick under the same rules above.
There are way too many problems with this.
You can even open up a whole scandal where a team fakes the injury.

No picks. Again, you are also suspending the TEAM not the PLAYER.
Which is unfair.

Gary320 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 02:02 PM
  #33
googlymoogly
Registered User
 
googlymoogly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 8,087
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Why wait for the 4th time to give out significant suspensions??..Why give so much rope to the player? Why start with 1 game??
7games minimum after first time. Each time, the suspension doubles. First 7, second 14, third 28, fourth 56..
I never waited for the fourth I said that at minimum any injury will deserve at least 1 game. If you injure someone very badly you deserve more. On the 4th offense it doesn't matter if all the victim gets is a bloody nose, if it's a match penalty you get 40 games automatic.

googlymoogly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 02:02 PM
  #34
Nedved
Registered User
 
Nedved's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,366
vCash: 500
good stuff bettman. step in the right direction.

Nedved is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 02:03 PM
  #35
googlymoogly
Registered User
 
googlymoogly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 8,087
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary320 View Post
There are way too many problems with this.
You can even open up a whole scandal where a team fakes the injury.

No picks. Again, you are also suspending the TEAM not the PLAYER.
Which is unfair.
No you are telling teams don't employ Matt Cookes or it will cost you.

googlymoogly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 02:04 PM
  #36
MoonlightGraham
Registered User
 
MoonlightGraham's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,474
vCash: 500
It's not enough.

Obviously it's a good thing if they penalise teams that rack up suspensions, but they need to add a rule that holds players responsible for hits that are reckless or obviously dangerous, like Chara on Pacioretty, or Cooke on Savard. Neither Cooke nor Chara were suspended, so these new rules wouldn't have had any effect on them. The problem with the current rules is that you can have hits that are technically legal but still extremely dangerous and unnecessary. Once again the NHL shows it lacks leadership and vision. I doubt anything will change unless a player dies on the ice, unfortunately.

MoonlightGraham is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 02:05 PM
  #37
OneSharpMarble
Registered User
 
OneSharpMarble's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,057
vCash: 500
Says nothing about having clear cut rules for suspensions so I would predict more flip flopping on suspensions and people asking if so and so "intended" to do it which is beside the point.

OneSharpMarble is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 02:08 PM
  #38
Hemlor
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 653
vCash: 500
why not penalize all headshots? I still can't understand why they don't seriously consider this. nowhere in the 5 step plan do they even approach this. They are still being very reactive, and not proactive, to make real deterrents. This league is a joke.

Hemlor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 02:13 PM
  #39
neofury*
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Montreal, PQ
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,277
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Habs10Habs View Post
It's still better than nothing at all Neo. I'm willing to give the special committee of Shanahan, R Blake, Yzerman, Niuewendyk a shot before knocking this.

We wanted change after what happened to Patches, now let's see what happens.
Oh I don't disagree. I just think it's a slap in the face that he and the NHL make such a stupid decision, stand by it, then days later he posts this. So which is it Gary, do you agree with this type of stuff or don't you? Seems pretty reactionary to me and if it's the case it just shows he's getting a lot more pressure than fans of other teams like to lead on regarding this issue.

I don't think many habs fans would be happy with anything other than good news regarding Max at this point

But alas you are right, any step in the right direction is a step none the less, however if we're on the topic of conflicts of interest, probably shouldn't have current general managers as part of the committee.

neofury* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 02:13 PM
  #40
Habitant le colon
Registered User
 
Habitant le colon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 954
vCash: 500
Wasn't already suggest in the past ... as for medical they could go as the NFL ... so its is WAY TOO LATE. 2 CENTS. But still happy to see that Yazerman will have to planify the next step.

Habitant le colon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 02:15 PM
  #41
PricePkPatch
Registered User
 
PricePkPatch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,777
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemlor View Post
why not penalize all headshots? I still can't understand why they don't seriously consider this. nowhere in the 5 step plan do they even approach this. They are still being very reactive, and not proactive, to make real deterrents. This league is a joke.
Dude. Relax. Take a deep breath.

..

Ok, feeling better? These are PROPOSITION made to open the discussion, not what's been decided. Bettman is trying to take control of the agenda, let's see what's going to be ruled.

PricePkPatch is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 02:15 PM
  #42
neofury*
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Montreal, PQ
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,277
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RE-HABS View Post
Is there anything really new there other than the fines and arenas to be looked at?

I think they need a player panel, management panel and an independant panel of none hockey people (medical/public figures/other leagues) to do research and strategy. Then have all 3 committees work together on combining their ideas for a safer game.
Heck this idea would work even better for assessing punishments in cases like this.

Management panel, player panel and independent panel (picked like a jury member in the case of the independent)

Then all three panels come up with something.

Management: no suspension
Player panel: 3 game suspension
Independant: 6 hame suspension

Add all three and divide by 3, Chara gets 3 games. It's still better than nothing and at least then if Chara did get 0 games, it would at least prove that an overwhelming amount of management players and even non-hockey people believed it shouldn't be penalized.

neofury* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 02:18 PM
  #43
NHLcrazy
Registered User
 
NHLcrazy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,857
vCash: 500
A- Any hits that resulted in a severe head injury* that were penalized by a major penalty during a game should result to a automatic 10 game suspension. 20 games for 2nd time, 40 games for third, 1 year ban for 4th, NHL ban for 5th.

B- Any hits that resulted in a severe head injury* that were not penalized during a game (referees missed it) should be reviewed by an INDEPENDENT committee and same rules as A should apply if play was considered careless and/or dangerous. The intent or not to injure is IRRELEVANT.

Now that should be a start to stop goonery.

*severe head injury: a medical board should define what severe head injury means. but we all know what it is...

NHLcrazy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 02:21 PM
  #44
Kriss E
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 20,944
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by googlymoogly View Post
No you are telling teams don't employ Matt Cookes or it will cost you.
Not quite, you're saying it MIGHT cost you.
You will still be able to explain yourself and if you're in the committee's good grace, you might get slapped with a 5000$ fine which, to a millionaire, represents very little.
Just like right now, players such as Chara, can receive a call after a hit and say ''it wasn't me'' and the league says ''sounds good to me!''.

Kriss E is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 02:27 PM
  #45
googlymoogly
Registered User
 
googlymoogly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 8,087
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Not quite, you're saying it MIGHT cost you.
You will still be able to explain yourself and if you're in the committee's good grace, you might get slapped with a 5000$ fine which, to a millionaire, represents very little.
Just like right now, players such as Chara, can receive a call after a hit and say ''it wasn't me'' and the league says ''sounds good to me!''.
This was my original post>>>>Any team that injures another teams player to the point that player must retire will forfeit their 1st round draft pick to the victim team. This pick will be at the discretion of the victim team to decide what year they want to exercise their 1st round pick but must be used withing 3 years.

Any player that is injured and misses over 40 games that team will receive a 3rd round pick under the same rules above. <<<< There would be no explaining if you injure someone longer than 40 games or the player must retire then it costs you a pick.

googlymoogly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 02:36 PM
  #46
Darth Joker
Registered User
 
Darth Joker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,723
vCash: 500
This 5-point plan would be fine, and a good step in the right direction *if* the NHL had the balls to pass out significant suspensions for head hunting.

But they don't.

And the fact that they don't renders Number 3 of 5 pointless (when it comes to lessening head shots).

And Number 3 of the 5 is the most important of the lot.


The NHL will not solve the concussion problem until they start passing out serious suspensions for head shots, along the lines of NHLcrazy's suggestions.

Darth Joker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 02:36 PM
  #47
habsjunkie2*
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 4,865
vCash: 500
Players committing an illegal hit causing injury will be suspended until injured player is back playing. In other words, Chara is out for as long as Max Pac.

I still don't get how a play that was deemed illegal during the game, 5 minute major worthy, and caused serious, serious injury, doesn't result in any suspension. Chara might have a decent track record and be a decent person, but even decent people make poor decisions in frustrating and difficult times. He and the Bruins were getting their ***** handed to them and didn't like it.

Whether his reckless actions meant to break Patches neck or not are irrelevent, his illegal actions did break his neck and he should of been held accountable.

Nothing in the proposal actually addresses the issue at hand. I'm still for legal, clean hits. It's the dirty illegal acts that need to stop. Clean, legal hits, rarely result in concussions and almost never result in boken necks, if the end result is a broken neck than chances are the hit wasn't clean. Please clean this junk up NHL.

habsjunkie2* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 02:38 PM
  #48
7th Player
Registered User
 
7th Player's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,953
vCash: 500
Talk is cheap.
I want to see the implementation of these steps.

7th Player is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 03:01 PM
  #49
Patccmoi
Registered User
 
Patccmoi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 979
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Joker View Post
This 5-point plan would be fine, and a good step in the right direction *if* the NHL had the balls to pass out significant suspensions for head hunting.

But they don't.

And the fact that they don't renders Number 3 of 5 pointless (when it comes to lessening head shots).

And Number 3 of the 5 is the most important of the lot.


The NHL will not solve the concussion problem until they start passing out serious suspensions for head shots, along the lines of NHLcrazy's suggestions.
Exactly how I see it.

The 5-step plan is all fine and well if they give suspension. But realize that in the last 2 games against us the Bruins got 0 suspension. They would not have been affected by ANY of these rule changes.

Patccmoi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-14-2011, 03:08 PM
  #50
kyne
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 242
vCash: 500
Hot air and empty rhetoric Bettman style. Basically what this means is when you're hit on the head, it's now mandatory that you see a doctor before resuming play. How progressive!

It's like re-arranging chairs on the Titanic. There's is nothing that deals with prevention of injury in any way, shape or form beyond some nebulous threat to punish some teams in a fashion that has yet to be clearly determined or even agreed on. The approach is still arbitrary punishment after the act instead of prevention and we can see how well that works. That philosophy is unlikely to change soon when almost half the GMs want to maintain status quo, a nepotistic former goon is still firmly in charge of discipline and the commissioner feels "extraordinarily comfortable" despite the fact a player just had his neck broken and the league's top player is suffering from a head injury.

It'll take someone dying on national TV before any serious change is considered. Till then, it's merely lip service.

kyne is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:11 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.