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Rangers agree to terms with Dylan McIlrath

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Old
03-16-2011, 05:08 PM
  #26
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Old
03-16-2011, 05:30 PM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrjimmyg89 View Post
i prefer this one for what its worth:



cool nickname for this kid. im eager to see how he does at a higher level, but im not holding my breath either, i dont feel as high for him as i did for say..Staal, or even Sauer.

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Old
03-16-2011, 05:46 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by azrok22 View Post
The downside is that if McIlrath suffers a career ending injury (or even death ala Cherepanov), the Rangers would no longer be compensated with the #40 pick in a subsequent draft.

We have Ethan Werek as a prospect only because Cherepanov passed away and we were compensated with the #47 pick. Granted, we'd all rather have Cherepanov, and you don't want anyone to suffer a career ending injury, let alone pass away, but signing McIlrath now makes little sense to me, because you lose that "get out of jail free-er card."

The only way it does make sense is if you're signing him at a cheaper rate now and believe that his value will be going up and that it would be more expensive to sign him later.

EDIT: To clarify, the rule is that if you are unable to sign your first round draft pick (for whatever reason), you are compensated with a pick 30 spots later in a subsequent draft. See Cherepanov. If you are able to sign your first round draft pick but they are unable to ever play for your team, you are not compensated. See Luc Bourdon - who died in a motorcycle accident after signing with the Canucks.
Did you have a problem when the Rangers signed Del Zotto to his ELC in May 2009?

Bourdon played one year of pro hockey before he died.

The NHL GM's and the NHLPA agreed on a one time exception to allow the Rangers to receive the #47 pick in 2009.

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Old
03-16-2011, 06:13 PM
  #29
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NHL general managers have given their approval to the Rangers' request for a compensatory pick in June's Entry Draft in the wake of the death of 2007 first-round selection Alexei Cherepanov, sources have told The Post.

Though it is unclear whether Article 8.3 (b) of the CBA must be amended to accommodate this specific circumstance, the Blueshirts now stand to receive the 17th pick of this year's second round following Glen Sather's presentation yesterday at the NHL GMs meetings in Naples, Fla.
Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/range...#ixzz1Go5lxNVZ

CBA was not amended to include the death of a player as a reason to receive a compensatory pick. NHLPA agreed to a one time exception. No guarantee it will happen again.

Post #153

http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=569837&page=7

Sather lobbied the NHL GM's to give the Rangers the comp pick

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=413511

Montreal didn't sign their 2006 1st rounder David Fischer so they received pick #50 in 2011 which was traded to the Islanders. That is what the rule is designed for. Fischer didn't develop at Minnesota and they didn't sign him by 8/15/10.

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03-16-2011, 06:14 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
Did you have a problem when the Rangers signed Del Zotto to his ELC in May 2009?

Bourdon played one year of pro hockey before he died.

The NHL GM's and the NHLPA agreed on a one time exception to allow the Rangers to receive the #47 pick in 2009.
Yes. Del Zotto still could've been in camp and could've signed the contract when he made the team.

You need to re-check your recollection, because yt was absolutely not a one time exception in Cherepanov's case. It's clearly defined in the CBA and is available for all teams in all situations.

The issue with Cherepanov was that because he was Russian, the Rangers would never lose his draft rights (if he refused to come to North America), so there was a question of whether they were truly "unable" to sign him under the CBA. They were unable due to his death, but because of the way the league treated un-signed Russians, there was no deadline that they needed to have him signed by.

I can't copy and paste from my PDF of the CBA, but you can download a copy here: http://www.nhlpa.com/About-Us/CBA/

Essentially, Article 8.3 (b) that “stipulates that compensatory picks be awarded to teams unable to sign first-round draft picks.”

So if your first overall pick dies before you sign him, you get the 31st pick in the draft. If your 10th overall pick suffers a career ending injury before you sign him, you get the 40th pick in the draft.

EDIT: I see you posted in between the post I quoted and my post, so to respond to that:

Quote:
CBA was not amended to include the death of a player as a reason to receive a compensatory pick.
It didn't need to be amended, because it was just a matter of interpreting Article 8.3(b) and whether the Rangers were unable to sign Cherepanov even though they technically still held his rights.

Quote:
Sather lobbied the NHL GM's to give the Rangers the comp pick
He lobbied them due to the above issue.

Quote:
Montreal didn't sign their 2006 1st rounder David Fischer so they received pick #50 in 2011 which was traded to the Islanders. That is what the rule is designed for. Fischer didn't develop at Minnesota and they didn't sign him by 8/15/10.
That is one thing the rule was designed for sure, but as demonstrated by the Cherepanov situation, it was not narrowly drawn to cover only that situation (of a player failing to develop), but also injuries/death.

DOUBLE EDIT: And I should clarify that I really don't think him signing is a big deal, but for first rounders, unless they're going to make it to the NHL prior to 20 years old, Article 8.3(b) provides a reasonably significant degree of protection that shouldn't be thrown away needlessly.


Last edited by azrok22: 03-16-2011 at 06:19 PM.
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Old
03-16-2011, 06:19 PM
  #31
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Not liking this signing, and heres why...

We don't need him in the NHL next year. We likely don't expect him to be. Not only do we lose compensation, but

Zipay says we are at 49 contracts right now with the addition of McIlrath and Bourque. using http://outsidethegarden.com/salaries.asp as a resource, we can see that when our UFAs are gone, including

Frolov
Prospal
Fedotenko
Eminger
White
Williams

that takes us down to 43, assuming we don't re-sign any of them. Then assume we don't re-up rfas

Mitchell
Didiomete
Soryal
Bickel

and we are at 39. Buy out Drury or retirement gives us 38. Our prospects we would want to sign include

Kreider
Hagelin
Horak
Werek

and maybe

Stajcer?
Campbell?
Shinnimin?
Maggio?
Pashnin?

And include Richards or other UFA additions. We may have to be somewhat conservative with signing late round prospects this year.

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Old
03-16-2011, 06:24 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fitzy Duke of NY View Post
Not liking this signing, and heres why...

We don't need him in the NHL next year. We likely don't expect him to be. Not only do we lose compensation, but

Zipay says we are at 49 contracts right now with the addition of McIlrath and Bourque. using http://outsidethegarden.com/salaries.asp as a resource, we can see that when our UFAs are gone, including

Frolov
Prospal
Fedotenko
Eminger
White
Williams

that takes us down to 43, assuming we don't re-sign any of them. Then assume we don't re-up rfas

Mitchell
Didiomete
Soryal
Bickel

and we are at 39. Buy out Drury or retirement gives us 38. Our prospects we would want to sign include

Kreider
Hagelin
Horak
Werek

and maybe

Stajcer?
Campbell?
Shinnimin?
Maggio?
Pashnin?

And include Richards or other UFA additions. We may have to be somewhat conservative with signing late round prospects this year.
No worries. McIlrath doesn't count as one of the 50.

"Age 18 and age 19 Players who were returned to Juniors, and who have not played 11 NHL Games in one season, shall be exempt from inclusion in the 50 Player limit." From Article 1 of the CBA - definition of "Reserve List."

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Old
03-16-2011, 06:26 PM
  #33
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Suppose it doesn't push the limit then.

But it does lose us a compensation pick if something goes horribly wrong. I'm interested in why management was so interested in signing him this early.

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Old
03-16-2011, 06:30 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fitzy Duke of NY View Post
Suppose it doesn't push the limit then.

But it does lose us a compensation pick if something goes horribly wrong. I'm interested in why management was so interested in signing him this early.
Maybe he pulls a Myers.

Hey, I can dream, can't I?

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03-16-2011, 06:30 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fitzy Duke of NY View Post
Suppose it doesn't push the limit then.

But it does lose us a compensation pick if something goes horribly wrong. I'm interested in why management was so interested in signing him this early.
Especially considering the likelihood that the Whalepack won't be doing much in the playoffs. With Moose Jaw clinching already, it doesn't seem like there will be much chance that he'll get to play in the AHL playoffs.

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Old
03-16-2011, 06:31 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fitzy Duke of NY View Post
Suppose it doesn't push the limit then.

But it does lose us a compensation pick if something goes horribly wrong. I'm interested in why management was so interested in signing him this early.
Right, which is why I'm not enamored with the signing. It should be emphasized that the team is required to tender him a bona fide offer each summer, or they'd lose his rights pursuant to CBA Article 8.6.

The real question will be answered when we see the details of the contract, because a league minimum ($500k contract) with no bonuses qualifies as a bona fide offer. If that's the contract McIlrath signed, then it's clear that the Rangers were simply doing what they must to retain him. If the contract includes bonuses and is for more than league minimum, then it's clear they actually wanted to sign him now. Note: you don't have to make bona fide offers to college player to retain their rights. Article 8.6(c).

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Old
03-16-2011, 06:32 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by we want cup View Post
Especially considering the likelihood that the Whalepack won't be doing much in the playoffs. With Moose Jaw clinching already, it doesn't seem like there will be much chance that he'll get to play in the AHL playoffs.
He doesn't need to sign with the Rangers to play in the AHL playoffs. The Wolf Pack could've signed him to an ATO contract just for the playoffs without him signing with the Rangers.

EDIT: Just realized I referred to the Whale as the Wolf Pack, oh well.


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Old
03-16-2011, 06:32 PM
  #38
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Im pretty sure the Rangers know what they're doing..
Probably more than anyone on this board.

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03-16-2011, 06:34 PM
  #39
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Im pretty sure the Rangers know what they're doing..
Probably more than anyone on this board.
In comparison to popular opinion on this board prior and immediately after the signings of Redden and Boogaard, I'm not sure that's a safe assumption to make.

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Old
03-16-2011, 06:48 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fitzy Duke of NY View Post
Suppose it doesn't push the limit then.

But it does lose us a compensation pick if something goes horribly wrong. I'm interested in why management was so interested in signing him this early.
Wouldn't you think that the chance of him retesting the draft is slightly higher than him having a fatal heart problem?

McIlrath is a monster hitter and a top fighter. And we have neither. And now he's a Ranger. Is there nothing that you guys won't nitpick to death?

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03-16-2011, 07:13 PM
  #41
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Great news!

He'll get a good look in camp, with a spot open on the right side of the third pairing.

Probably go pro after next season, though, I wouldn't be surprised if he was given a legitimate shot to make the club out of camp the way Del Zotto did. If he can keep up with the speed, it really wouldn't surprise me. Shot from the point, grit.

The right side is a bit tricky. Eminger or Gilroy coming back? Probably not, and if they go after Richards, there won't be much room left under the cap for a veteran in that spot, after re-signing our RFA's.

Kundratek vs McIlrath.

I think McIlrath wins.

The left side is a different story with Del Zotto, EDIT :: VALENTENKO :: or possibly McCabe staying for an extra year.

I really would not be surprised if McIlrath gets the 9-10 game trial.


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03-16-2011, 07:17 PM
  #42
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I bet they think he can make the team out of camp.

Staal - Girardi
Sauer - McDonagh
MDZ - McIlrath

McIlrath is already bigger than any of our defenseman, so it isn't like he isn't physically ready, though bigger guys do tend to take longer to acclimate themselves. We ran 2 rookies this year, that obviously won't be the case the next season as only 1 spot will likely be available on defense. The Rangers could afford to keep McIlrath on the third pairing if MDZ can round out his game. Otherwise, probably back to Moose Jaw, but I wouldn't be surprised to see McIlrath get his 10 game trial. He is definitely going to open some eyes at camp though.

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03-16-2011, 07:19 PM
  #43
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Get him to thy Barb, and he may be able to make the team out of camp.

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03-16-2011, 07:21 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Mastrosimone View Post
Get him to thy Barb, and he may be able to make the team out of camp.
Holy Barb, mother of Boyle.

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03-16-2011, 07:26 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by t3hg00se View Post
I bet they think he can make the team out of camp.

Staal - Girardi
Sauer - McDonagh
MDZ - McIlrath

McIlrath is already bigger than any of our defenseman, so it isn't like he isn't physically ready, though bigger guys do tend to take longer to acclimate themselves. We ran 2 rookies this year, that obviously won't be the case the next season as only 1 spot will likely be available on defense. The Rangers could afford to keep McIlrath on the third pairing if MDZ can round out his game. Otherwise, probably back to Moose Jaw, but I wouldn't be surprised to see McIlrath get his 10 game trial. He is definitely going to open some eyes at camp though.
Wouldn't be a fan of this. I don't think Big Mac has shown anything to indicate he's ready to play against NHL talent, and pairing him with MDZ in the hopes that D-Mac will be able to stay at home and guard the Rangers zone largely by himself isn't a good idea.

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03-16-2011, 07:28 PM
  #46
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IF he makes the team, which I doubt:

Staal-Girardi
McDonagh-McIlrath
Del Zotto-Sauer

Seems like a no-brainer to me. McDonagh compliments McIlrath perfectly. His skating is good enough to the point of where he could cover up for McI if he decides to make a Volchenkov-esque play.

And Sauer/Del Zotto makes sense, too.

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03-16-2011, 07:38 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by BlueshirtBlitz View Post
Wouldn't be a fan of this. I don't think Big Mac has shown anything to indicate he's ready to play against NHL talent, and pairing him with MDZ in the hopes that D-Mac will be able to stay at home and guard the Rangers zone largely by himself isn't a good idea.
He certainly isn't ready to face an NHL first line, but from what I've seen, his game will translate incredibly well to the NHL and he shouldn't have a problem against most teams bottom lines. I do however completely agree with you that paring MDZ with McIlrath is probably a mistake unless MDZ undergoes some serious improvement in the offseason, which I believe he will. This off-season he focused too much on the physical aspects of the game working with Gary Roberts when he should have just been on the ice every day rounding out his game. I think he knows that and will come into camp much improved next season.

However, that just can't be assumed, and BB is definitely right about McDonagh being a better d-partner for McIlrath.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Mastrosimone View Post
IF he makes the team, which I doubt:

Staal-Girardi
McDonagh-McIlrath
Del Zotto-Sauer

Seems like a no-brainer to me. McDonagh compliments McIlrath perfectly. His skating is good enough to the point of where he could cover up for McI if he decides to make a Volchenkov-esque play.

And Sauer/Del Zotto makes sense, too.
I'd be dissapointed to break up McD and Sauer, but neither has shown me any indication that they can't replicate their success with other dmen. Del Zotto for one would really benefit from playing with Sauer.

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03-16-2011, 07:40 PM
  #48
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I'd like MDZ and whatever new D-man, be it Big mac or not, to play with McDonagh and/or Sauer but I also really would like that pair to stay together.

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03-16-2011, 07:47 PM
  #49
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Originally Posted by Mr Atoz View Post
Wouldn't you think that the chance of him retesting the draft is slightly higher than him having a fatal heart problem?

McIlrath is a monster hitter and a top fighter. And we have neither. And now he's a Ranger. Is there nothing that you guys won't nitpick to death?
What I think is unlikely is deferring one year of signing McIlrath would cause him to re-enter the draft.

As I have said before, and as Surf so kindly mentioned, I'm sure the Rangers know why they signed him, i'm just interested to find out why that is as it makes little sense to me.

Zipay said the kid wasn't likely to compete for a spot next year, and the Wolfpack are hardly Calder cup contenders. Hard to explain.

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03-16-2011, 07:54 PM
  #50
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The VN's would make this board explode if he makes the team..He fights,hits and sticks up for teammates..."They" need players who can score points for their fantasy teams....Oh and God forbid he takes a nasty penalty late in the game when we are up by 4..

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