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"Time for Flyers fans to appreciate Carter"

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03-20-2011, 08:07 PM
  #101
CantSeeColors
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Originally Posted by ShotScore View Post
Statistics don't tell the whole story and that's what you're not understanding.

Stats can't tell you when momentum shifts during the course of a game.

Stats can't tell you what a player feels as time is ticking away and the pressure is building.

Stats can't tell you what a player goes through during the game. Pain, fatigue, nervousness, exhilaration, desperation, exhaustion, fear, etc. etc.

Stats can't tell you what drives a player to act the way he does when he does it.

This is what makes certain players clutch. This is why, even though, on paper, you can't prove "clutch" exists, it exists nonetheless.
The fact that stats can't prove anything they're not intended to prove is what makes certain players clutch?

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03-20-2011, 08:11 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by ShotScore View Post
Statistics don't tell the whole story and that's what you're not understanding.

Stats can't tell you when momentum shifts during the course of a game.

Stats can't tell you what a player feels as time is ticking away and the pressure is building.

Stats can't tell you what a player goes through during the game. Pain, fatigue, nervousness, exhilaration, desperation, exhaustion, fear, etc. etc.

Stats can't tell you what drives a player to act the way he does when he does it.

This is what makes certain players clutch. This is why, even though, on paper, you can't prove "clutch" exists, it exists nonetheless.
Those are all storylines, manufactured by humans. You can't measure them, unless you're going by inches in print. I love good stories. They're awesome.

But your argument is in faith. That's like dropping a grenade in an air raid.

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03-20-2011, 08:12 PM
  #103
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'This article does not exist.'

(It drops the last ) )

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03-20-2011, 08:13 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by Rick Blaine View Post
Those are all storylines, manufactured by humans. You can't measure them, unless you're going by inches in print. I love good stories. They're awesome.

But your argument is in faith. That's like dropping a grenade in an air raid.
Hey, one guy dropping grenades in an air raid might get lucky and blow up the critical target at the critical time.

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03-20-2011, 08:13 PM
  #105
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Not sure. I have, I think, often inferred some relativity to it, like for instance if a .300 hitter bats .300 in the playoffs while all other .300 hitters succumb to the pressure and bat .275.

This is interesting: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clutch_(sports)


http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/clutch

Sports . an extremely important or crucial moment of a game: He was famous for his coolness in pitching in the clutch.

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03-20-2011, 08:14 PM
  #106
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The guy played on broken feet. I appreciate that.

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03-20-2011, 08:14 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by ShotScore View Post
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/clutch

Sports . an extremely important or crucial moment of a game: He was famous for his coolness in pitching in the clutch.
So now clutch is a trait of a game instead of one of a player. Carter sure isn't a hockey game, so I guess you guys win.

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03-20-2011, 08:15 PM
  #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShotScore View Post
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/clutch

Sports . an extremely important or crucial moment of a game: He was famous for his coolness in pitching in the clutch.
Please define "crucial" using statistics.

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03-20-2011, 08:15 PM
  #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShotScore View Post
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/clutch

Sports . an extremely important or crucial moment of a game: He was famous for his coolness in pitching in the clutch.
Clutch situations exist.

Clutch plays exist.

Clutch players are an illusion of the human mind.

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03-20-2011, 08:16 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by CantSeeColors View Post
So now clutch is a trait of a game instead of one of a player. Carter sure isn't a hockey game, so I guess you guys win.
He's not part of a transmission, he isn't a hockey game...what the **** is he?

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03-20-2011, 08:18 PM
  #111
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He's not part of a transmission, he isn't a hockey game...what the **** is he?
A bum who can't score. Haven't you been reading?!

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03-20-2011, 08:20 PM
  #112
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Originally Posted by CantSeeColors View Post
A bum who can't score. Haven't you been reading?!
I have, but I seem to have come up short. I suppose my eyes aren't very clutch.

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03-20-2011, 08:20 PM
  #113
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Adam Vinatieri Vs. Scott Norwood

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03-20-2011, 08:21 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by Rick Blaine View Post
I have, but I seem to have come up short. I suppose my eyes aren't very clutch.
We are at a pretty crucial moment in this thread. Some eyes just don't measure up to others when Pain, fatigue, nervousness, exhilaration, desperation, exhaustion, fear, etc. etc. set in.

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03-20-2011, 08:22 PM
  #115
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Ive always been a carter defender and I'm glad Carter is finally getting some recognition. He is, in my opinion, one of the most under rated players in the league. Hes easily the best skater on our team, he's got a ridiculous shot, he's great in every area of the ice, and he plays in all situations. Plus we can pretty much consider him a lock for 30-40 goals a season.

Carter has matured alot this season, and he seems to be breaking his habit of shooting from anywhere he gets the puck, which can get him into trouble. He's been getting to the greasy areas alot and using his size to plant himself in the slot, which is great to see from Jeff, given his size and strength. His work ethic has also improved IMO, and he seems to be stepping into more of a leader role!




Ps; 1000th post!

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03-20-2011, 08:23 PM
  #116
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Originally Posted by MountainHawk View Post
Clutch players are an illusion of the human mind.
The vast majority of coaches will tell you different.

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03-20-2011, 08:27 PM
  #117
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The vast majority of coaches will tell you different.
Again, when do coaches matter?

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03-20-2011, 08:29 PM
  #118
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Originally Posted by JABEE View Post
Adam Vinatieri Vs. Scott Norwood
'nuff said

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03-20-2011, 08:29 PM
  #119
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The vast majority of coaches will tell you different.
No they won't. If clutch players existed than in basketball a teams "clutch" player would get the shot to tie or win the game. But it is constantly the best player that has the ball in their hands. It is why the Heat give the ball to Lebron every time the game is on the line even though he isn't "clutch."

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03-20-2011, 08:31 PM
  #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JXC View Post
The vast majority of coaches will tell you different.
The divide between those involved in the playing of the game and those who analyze it is well established.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CantSeeColors View Post
Again, when do coaches matter?
At least he didn't use a stat to support it this time.

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Old
03-20-2011, 08:32 PM
  #121
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No they won't.
Yes, they will. I know a lot of coaches and they all say the same thing: there are players who fold under pressure and there are players who thrive.

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03-20-2011, 08:34 PM
  #122
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A little something for the Lavi Lavers:

Quote:
“He’s somebody we count on to play in every situation and he’s proving himself to be a clutch player,” Flyers coach Peter Laviolette said yesterday.

http://www.metro.us/philadelphia/spo...year-extension

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03-20-2011, 08:40 PM
  #123
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Yes, they will. I know a lot of coaches and they all say the same thing: there are players who fold under pressure and there are players who thrive.
Coaches have the same information processing deficiencies as all humans do.

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03-20-2011, 08:44 PM
  #124
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Quote:
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Yes, they will. I know a lot of coaches and they all say the same thing: there are players who fold under pressure and there are players who thrive.
How many of these coaches are working on the NHL level?

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03-20-2011, 08:44 PM
  #125
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Originally Posted by JXC View Post
Yes, they will. I know a lot of coaches and they all say the same thing: there are players who fold under pressure and there are players who thrive.
I have played for multiple coaches. They have all said being "clutch" is just doing what your supposed to do. If you make a jumper to win the game it isn't clutch it's you shoot 50% from the field so it was either going to go in or it wasn't.

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