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ATD 2011 Lineup Advice Thread II

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Old
03-27-2011, 01:01 AM
  #26
seventieslord
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whoa, hold on, did Nicholls and Gretzky play a lot together at ES (insert question mark here) - I was under the impression that they didn`t actually assist on a lot of eachothers`goals except on the PP.

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03-27-2011, 01:07 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
whoa, hold on, did Nicholls and Gretzky play a lot together at ES (insert question mark here) - I was under the impression that they didn`t actually assist on a lot of eachothers`goals except on the PP.
I don't know the breakdown, but I was under the impression they were regular linemates based on the constant referral of Gretzky and Nicholls as partners of sorts with Gretzky boosting Nicholls.

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03-27-2011, 01:13 AM
  #28
TheDevilMadeMe
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Originally Posted by Leafs Forever View Post
I'd proably be inclined to Option C, if Demitra (who does have an AST at LW it seems) does get considered legitimate as a LW (which I think I can buy).
When did demitra get an AST at LW? He was never a postseason all star.

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03-27-2011, 01:22 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
When did demitra get an AST at LW? He was never a postseason all star.
3rd in LW AST voting is what I mean, accordding to the HHH bio added to the Demitra pick.

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03-27-2011, 01:33 AM
  #30
hungryhungryhippy
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Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
Hhh, is there any proof other than hockey reference that demitra can play left wing?

In his prime, he was listed as C/RW on yahoo fantasy hockey (yes, it's been around that long), and that's how I remember him.

It's possible he did play LW after his prime - if he played it well, I'd buy him there.
He can definitely play left-wing dude. I didn't realize it was even an issue, because I've always known Demitra as a guy who regularly played all three forward positions.

I vividly remember Demitra as a guy who played all forward positions. When the Canucks first signed him, I was confused about what position he played, so I looked into it and I remember finding that he played multiple positions in Minnesota. Gaborik was a RW and Mikko Koivu was getting 1st line center duties, I'm pretty sure (it was something like that. He played left wing in Vancouver too, when Sundin joined the team and Kesler was moved to the right wing on a line with Demitra and Sundin. (Demitra-Sundin-Kesler)

In addition to hockey-reference, TSN has him listed as a W/C (http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/teams/players/bio/?id=453) and The Hockey News also has him listed a W/C (http://forecaster.thehockeynews.com/...player.cgi?453)

THN also says this about him in their bio:

Quote:
ASSETS: Has terrific quickness, excellent finishing qualities and the ability to set up teammates. Can play any forward position and is very sportsmanlike.
Also, I think he played left wing in 1999 too, because according to this thread on HFboards: http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=145895&page=5 he was 3rd in All-Star Voting at left wing
Quote:
1998-99
HART: ....
NORRIS: ....
VEZINA: ...
LADY BYNG: ...
SELKE: ....
ADAMS: ....
ALL-STAR TEAMS:
CENTER: ....
LEFT WING: Paul Kariya 260 (47-8-1); John LeClair 172 (9-40-7); Pavol Demitra 23 (0-4-11); ....
and that was one of his best years, he scored 89 points (10th in the league) and finished 6th in Selke voting


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Old
03-27-2011, 01:35 AM
  #31
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I don't think you want to use his time on Sundin's wing as evidence that he can play LW..

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Old
03-27-2011, 01:53 AM
  #32
TheDevilMadeMe
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Ovechkin regularly gets votes for AS RW. There is a minority of hockey writers who are total idiots

Regardless, i might be showing my age, as I think of demitra in his prime in st louisnasn center who sometimes played RW. Anyway, I'm sold on him as LW. Since playmaking LWs are so rare, you got a mini steal. I like the option that has brad Richards at center, where he belongs. But what to do with tumba, who you solde as better than any of the soviets of the 50s who always get drafted ahead of him?

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03-27-2011, 02:00 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
Ovechkin regularly gets votes for AS RW. There is a minority of hockey writers who are total idiots

Regardless, i might be showing my age, as I think of demitra in his prime in st louisnasn center who sometimes played RW. Anyway, I'm sold on him as LW. Since playmaking LWs are so rare, you got a mini steal. I like the option that has brad Richards at center, where he belongs. But what to do with tumba, who you solde as better than any of the soviets of the 50s who always get drafted ahead of him?
Since tumba is apparently pretty gritty, he sounds like he'd make a pretty good fourth liner.

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03-27-2011, 02:26 AM
  #34
TheDevilMadeMe
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Originally Posted by Leafs Forever View Post
Since tumba is apparently pretty gritty, he sounds like he'd make a pretty good fourth liner.
He'd be an amazing fourth liner. But he probably deserves more minutes than that ideally. He's below average on a second line but would be top notch on a third scoring line.

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Old
03-27-2011, 02:28 AM
  #35
jarek
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New defense pairs!

Lester Patrick - Earl Seibert
Frank Patrick - Vasili Pervukhin
Terry Harper - Yuri Liapkin

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Old
03-27-2011, 09:52 AM
  #36
TheDevilMadeMe
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Originally Posted by Boy Wonder View Post
New defense pairs!

Lester Patrick - Earl Seibert
Frank Patrick - Vasili Pervukhin
Terry Harper - Yuri Liapkin
I like it a lot.

Seibert is an average #1, who can play great physical D and transition the puck competently. Lester a very good # 2 who favors offense over defense but isnt bad defensively.

Frank is a relatively weak #3 - he's talented, but don't give him too many minutes! Good physically and good offense for his short career though. Harper and pervukin would each make a solid but unspectacular #4 I think, so you're doing very well there. I'd prefer it if pervukhin's partner was more stay at home, like zinetula B was, but pervukhin seemed to do everything at high level but play physical, so I don't think the second pair is a liability.

Harper is just a good, physical shut down guy.

I've had liapkin before and I know what he brings - excellent offense on both the powerplay and in the transition game with his outlet pass, skates like a slug, prone to brainfarts in his own zone. Unlike other offense-only defensemen, apparently he was a pretty good penalty killer, so of buy him as a 5th option on the pk.


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Old
03-27-2011, 11:15 AM
  #37
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Todd Bertuzzi or Boris Mayorov on the right side of herbie Lewis and starshinov? The third member of the line's job is to be a beast in corners and at cycling the puck, while feeding starsh in front in the net. Mayorov had this role in real life, but does anyone think Bert would be better at it here? Bert has very good playmaking numbers at even strength, while being more of a front of the net goal scorer on the powerplay.

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Old
03-27-2011, 11:27 AM
  #38
BillyShoe1721
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I'm bored, so here's my roster so far:

Philadelphia Firebirds



Coach: Viktor Tikhonov
Captain: Jean Beliveau
Assistant Captain: Rod Langway
Assistant Captain: Brian Sutter

Dick Duff-Jean Beliveau(C)-Jari Kurri
Fred "Smokey" Harris-Frank McGee-Ken Hodge
Brian Sutter(A)-Pit Lepine-Johnny Peirson
Don Maloney-_____-Goldie Prodgers

Rod Langway(A)-Eduard Ivanov
Harry Howell-Sergei Gonchar
Frantisek Tikal-George Owen

Jiri Holecek
_____

PP1

Duff-Beliveau-Kurri
Gonchar-Owen

PP2

Harris-McGee-Hodge
Gonchar-Ivanov

PK1

Lepine-Kurri
Langway-Howell

PK2

Duff-Maloney
Ivanov-Tikal

PK3

Sutter-Beliveau
Langway-Howell

Any comments, critiques, or suggestions appreciated.

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Old
03-27-2011, 11:29 AM
  #39
EagleBelfour
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
Todd Bertuzzi or Boris Mayorov on the right side of herbie Lewis and starshinov? The third member of the line's job is to be a beast in corners and at cycling the puck, while feeding starsh in front in the net. Mayorov had this role in real life, but does anyone think Bert would be better at it here? Bert has very good playmaking numbers at even strength, while being more of a front of the net goal scorer on the powerplay.
I wouldn't want Todd Bertuzzi to play 2nd line minutes at ES, even in the ATD. Perhaps his skillset is more appropriate, but his peak years are too shallow in the ATD context and he would be a inconsistent contributor to this line. The more I think about it, the more I would stick with the Starshinov - Mayorov duo.

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Old
03-27-2011, 12:14 PM
  #40
TheDevilMadeMe
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Originally Posted by EagleBelfour View Post
I wouldn't want Todd Bertuzzi to play 2nd line minutes at ES, even in the ATD. Perhaps his skillset is more appropriate, but his peak years are too shallow in the ATD context and he would be a inconsistent contributor to this line. The more I think about it, the more I would stick with the Starshinov - Mayorov duo.
Bertuzzi's peak is three times as long as Vic hadfield's, and hadfield is usually used as a second liner.

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03-27-2011, 12:24 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
Bertuzzi's peak is three times as long as Vic hadfield's, and hadfield is usually used as a second liner.
Though true, that's is RW (well, in this case you're going to put him at RW) vs LW.

I think I like Mayorov on the line more myself for chemistry reasons.

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Old
03-27-2011, 12:39 PM
  #42
DaveG
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Looking for some input as to our forwards as they stand right now:

Kevin Stevens - Doug Gilmour - Glenn Anderson
Ray Whitney - Joe Malone - Rick Tocchet
Hec Kilrea - Butch Goring - Kevin Dineen
Rabbit McVeigh - ******** - Tomas Sandstrom

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Old
03-27-2011, 12:51 PM
  #43
TheDevilMadeMe
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Why is Joe Malone on the second line? He's clearly your most dangerous offensive player. Is it because he needs whitney's playmaking from the wing, and Whitney would be an awful first liner?

Also, which line gets your toughest defensive assignments?

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03-27-2011, 01:01 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
I like it a lot.

Seibert is an average #1, who can play great physical D and transition the puck competently. Lester a very good # 2 who favors offense over defense but isnt bad defensively.

Frank is a relatively weak #3 - he's talented, but don't give him too many minutes! Good physically and good offense for his short career though. Harper and pervukin would each make a solid but unspectacular #4 I think, so you're doing very well there. I'd prefer it if pervukhin's partner was more stay at home, like zinetula B was, but pervukhin seemed to do everything at high level but play physical, so I don't think the second pair is a liability.

Harper is just a good, physical shut down guy.

I've had liapkin before and I know what he brings - excellent offense on both the powerplay and in the transition game with his outlet pass, skates like a slug, prone to brainfarts in his own zone. Unlike other offense-only defensemen, apparently he was a pretty good penalty killer, so of buy him as a 5th option on the pk.
Thanks. I think Lester is a little stronger defensively than you suggest, however.

As well, I find that both Frank Patrick and Terry Harper are elite #3s and 4s, respectively. However, you seem to be more down on those guys than most!

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Old
03-27-2011, 01:10 PM
  #45
TheDevilMadeMe
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I'm don't think I'm down on frank patrick more than most. I think you're higher on him than most. Agree that I don't like Harper as much as most GMs - I think role players on dynasty teams are overrated here as a group.

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03-27-2011, 02:08 PM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
Why is Joe Malone on the second line? He's clearly your most dangerous offensive player. Is it because he needs whitney's playmaking from the wing, and Whitney would be an awful first liner?

Also, which line gets your toughest defensive assignments?
Everything's still a work in progress at this point as to determining fit.

We've toyed with the idea of Stevens - Malone - Anderson and Kilrea - Gilmour - Tocchet with Whitney as a 4th liner/PP specialist.

As for the defensive assignments, the Goring line most likely, though that's not to say that Gilmour couldn't hold his own there. But Goring is just a better fit as a defensive center, freeing up Gilmour, and Dineen has a pretty good reputation as a two-way player as well, especially once he moved on from Hartford.

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Old
03-27-2011, 03:19 PM
  #47
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So what do you guys think of my defense as a whole? It's undergone a major change since last time I psoted it.

Bill Gadsby-Sylvio Mantha
Nikolai Sologubov-Ivan Tregubov
Robyn Regher-Glen Harmon

Of course these guys are all in front one of the three best goalies in this in Plante. But anyway, would appreciate some thoughts on this one.


Last edited by vecens24: 03-27-2011 at 03:39 PM.
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Old
03-27-2011, 03:19 PM
  #48
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My defense is now complete:

Alexander Ragulin - Sprague Cleghorn
Barclay Plager - Barry Beck
Ian Turnbull - Barry Ashbee

How is that defensive core? Very tough bunch. Ashbee was drafted for his toughness and perseverance, and to protect Turnbull on the bottom pairing. A tough defensive unit playing ahead of a proven goaltender in Tiny Thompson.

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Old
03-27-2011, 03:30 PM
  #49
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Quote:
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Everything's still a work in progress at this point as to determining fit.

We've toyed with the idea of Stevens - Malone - Anderson and Kilrea - Gilmour - Tocchet with Whitney as a 4th liner/PP specialist.

As for the defensive assignments, the Goring line most likely, though that's not to say that Gilmour couldn't hold his own there. But Goring is just a better fit as a defensive center, freeing up Gilmour, and Dineen has a pretty good reputation as a two-way player as well, especially once he moved on from Hartford.
Yeah you have a tough job trying to optimize Gilmour and Malone with the wingers you have.

Whitney is probably more suited to playing with Malone but he doesn't belong on the first line and Malone does.. and Gilmour is probably best with good finishers because while he was a good goal scorer he was a much better playmaker.

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Old
03-27-2011, 03:37 PM
  #50
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Originally Posted by vecens24 View Post
So what do you guys think of my defense as a whole? It's undergone a major change since last time I psoted it.

Bill Gadsby-Sylvio Mantha
Nikolai Sologubov-Ivan Tregubov
Glen Harmon-Robyn Regher

Of course these guys are all in front one of the three best goalies in this in Plante. But anyway, would appreciate some thoughts on this one.
Regehr would be useless playing his off side, for starters. Gadsby-Mantha is an absolute dominant pair.

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