HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Florida Panthers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Frustrated Vokoun Waived NMC at TDL

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
03-29-2011, 10:50 PM
  #26
StrangeVision
HFBoards Sponsor
 
StrangeVision's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Florida
Country: United States
Posts: 14,298
vCash: 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
I'll stick by my post, without hesitation, yours proves nothings. Guy was moving EVERYTHING for just about ANYTHING, that the deal for Vokoun was bad in his eyes, tells me it was...BAD! Deal with it.
Because Tallon's decisions are 100% correct 100% of the time.

StrangeVision is offline  
Old
03-29-2011, 11:31 PM
  #27
Markstrom Rules
Sup
 
Markstrom Rules's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Pennsylvania
Country: United States
Posts: 16,069
vCash: 500
They thought they had a decent chance of re-signing him, how can you argue with that, and they still do because Vokoun's options are limited. If they thought there was no chance of re-signing him, he would have been moved for a 7th round pick.

Markstrom Rules is offline  
Old
03-29-2011, 11:37 PM
  #28
Laus723
Future Now
 
Laus723's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Boca Raton, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 27,051
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by StrangeVision View Post
Because Tallon's decisions are 100% correct 100% of the time.
Witty, can u come up with something of actual significance? Not what I'm saying, and there's several things I don't agree with, but there's plenty that while I may not like (Grabner) I understand completely. Care to actually offer something that will actually lead to a discussion?

__________________
So you're saying there's a chance!
Laus723 is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 12:31 AM
  #29
Erick
Registered User
 
Erick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Broward, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 11,587
vCash: 500
Um, when they kept Vokoun at the deadline, it was under the assumption that they could bring him back. If it was a guarantee that he was going to leave, I'm sure they would have traded him.

For what it's worth, they still can bring him back.

If DeBoer is his problem, then DeBoer can go bye-bye. Players are more important than coaches, especially when the player is a top 5-10 goalie in the league, and the coach has basically achieved nothing.

You're all overspeculating, for no reason.

There are very few teams in need of a goalie, so there's still a good chance he comes back.

Even if he does leave, it's not as if it's the worst thing in the world. What's the most we could have gotten for him? A 4th or 5th round pick? Who cares?

Erick is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 01:52 AM
  #30
StrangeVision
HFBoards Sponsor
 
StrangeVision's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Florida
Country: United States
Posts: 14,298
vCash: 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
Witty, can u come up with something of actual significance? Not what I'm saying, and there's several things I don't agree with, but there's plenty that while I may not like (Grabner) I understand completely. Care to actually offer something that will actually lead to a discussion?
I don't agree with your rationalization of Tallon's decision not to move Vokoun. If Tallon wanted to, he could have gotten a replacement goalie, a replacement goalie that would have gone further in helping this team get a better draft pick, thereby likely improving the team. As it is, Tallon decided not to move Vokoun. A decision that was, in my opinion, quite stupid.


Last edited by StrangeVision: 03-30-2011 at 02:16 AM.
StrangeVision is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 04:28 AM
  #31
Laus723
Future Now
 
Laus723's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Boca Raton, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 27,051
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by StrangeVision View Post
I don't agree with your rationalization of Tallon's decision not to move Vokoun. If Tallon wanted to, he could have gotten a replacement goalie, a replacement goalie that would have gone further in helping this team get a better draft pick, thereby likely improving the team. As it is, Tallon decided not to move Vokoun. A decision that was, in my opinion, quite stupid.
You weren't, nor was I, in the offices over the trade deadline days. As I said, he gave away several guys for very little, that should be telling, not sure how it's not, about what was offered for Vokoun. To call it "quite stupid," is ridiculous, especially based on the above. Appreciate the less troll-like post, though.

Laus723 is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 08:08 AM
  #32
Coolburn
Registered User
 
Coolburn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: South Florida
Country: Hungary
Posts: 7,767
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Coolburn Send a message via MSN to Coolburn Send a message via Yahoo to Coolburn
Quote:
Originally Posted by pantherbot View Post
This is incorrect as I have already pointed out. You keep bringing this up but it is NOT CORRECT. There were multiple UFA-to-be goalies on waiver on deadline day. They all made less money than Vokoun does now and were free asset-wise.
I've already addressed and debunked that myth. The trade deadline actually expired at 3pm. The waiver deadline was noon. Since the offer for Vokoun didnt come in until late, those goalies on waivers had already cleared BEFORE Vokoun wouldve been traded. So no YOU are incorrect in what you're saying so please stop trying to perpetuate that myth.

Also I believe the rosters are frozen in that no players outside the organization can be claimed after the deadline (has nothing to do with playoffs or not). So if Tallon traded Vokoun at the deadline since he couldnt claim anyone before trading him, the only option wouldve been to call up a goalie.


Last edited by Coolburn: 03-30-2011 at 08:38 AM. Reason: added fact about not being able to claim anyone after the deadline
Coolburn is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 08:15 AM
  #33
adam graves
Panthers 17yr sth
 
adam graves's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: south florida
Country: United States
Posts: 8,029
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
You weren't, nor was I, in the offices over the trade deadline days. As I said, he gave away several guys for very little, that should be telling, not sure how it's not, about what was offered for Vokoun. To call it "quite stupid," is ridiculous, especially based on the above. Appreciate the less troll-like post, though.
Correct. Said otherwise, plenty of evidence Tallon dumped what he could, even for questionable value. But with the known fact that there is some likelihood that Vokun, a top 10 goalie will resign here what would be stupid would have been to let him go for a 4th or 5th rounder, someone who has like a 5% chance of making the NHL.

Im still of the opinion that Vokun could sign for 2yrs in the low 3mil per/, mentor a markstrom while giving us fans quality goaltending to enjoy at the arena. The only thing we have been spoiled with is good solid goaltending over this decade of disaster.

adam graves is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 09:10 AM
  #34
StrangeVision
HFBoards Sponsor
 
StrangeVision's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Florida
Country: United States
Posts: 14,298
vCash: 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
You weren't, nor was I, in the offices over the trade deadline days. As I said, he gave away several guys for very little, that should be telling, not sure how it's not, about what was offered for Vokoun. To call it "quite stupid," is ridiculous, especially based on the above. Appreciate the less troll-like post, though.
You see, you're still just rationalizing it and not really showing or proving why Tallon made the right decision. The fact that he made some questionable deals on trade deadline day lends to the belief that he made the wrong decision regarding Vokoun.

Also, you my get less "troll-like" posts if you were a tad less condescending. Just a thought.

StrangeVision is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 09:12 AM
  #35
Laus723
Future Now
 
Laus723's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Boca Raton, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 27,051
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by StrangeVision View Post
You see, you're still just rationalizing it and not really showing or proving why Tallon made the right decision. The fact that he made some questionable deals on trade deadline day lends to the belief that he made the wrong decision regarding Vokoun.

Also, you my get less "troll-like" posts if you were a tad less condescending. Just a thought.
You give those to everyone, just saying...

And you've proven nothing yourself, just your own opinion.

Laus723 is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 12:36 PM
  #36
pantherbot
Registered User
 
pantherbot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 964
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coolburn View Post
I've already addressed and debunked that myth. The trade deadline actually expired at 3pm. The waiver deadline was noon. Since the offer for Vokoun didnt come in until late, those goalies on waivers had already cleared BEFORE Vokoun wouldve been traded. So no YOU are incorrect in what you're saying so please stop trying to perpetuate that myth.

Also I believe the rosters are frozen in that no players outside the organization can be claimed after the deadline (has nothing to do with playoffs or not). So if Tallon traded Vokoun at the deadline since he couldnt claim anyone before trading him, the only option wouldve been to call up a goalie.
yes and you are correct to the 12-3 pm time frame. But there was a LOT of time BEFORE 12 pm to do what I believe he should have done with Vokoun.

Assuming that he had absolutely zero offers for Vokoun before that time is silly to me. I may be wrong on this, we will never know, maybe nobody wanted a goalie with career .920 save percentage with a low asking price, but I really don't believe there were zero offers for Vokoun before 12 pm on deadline day. It is illogical to say a deal wasn't made because we needed to replace him with another goalie.

The only realistic reasons are a) want to re-sign him, b) believe higher trade value before Jul 1, or c) didn't think the incremental assets were worth the trouble.

pantherbot is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 01:24 PM
  #37
Coolburn
Registered User
 
Coolburn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: South Florida
Country: Hungary
Posts: 7,767
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Coolburn Send a message via MSN to Coolburn Send a message via Yahoo to Coolburn
Quote:
Originally Posted by pantherbot View Post
yes and you are correct to the 12-3 pm time frame. But there was a LOT of time BEFORE 12 pm to do what I believe he should have done with Vokoun.

Assuming that he had absolutely zero offers for Vokoun before that time is silly to me. I may be wrong on this, we will never know, maybe nobody wanted a goalie with career .920 save percentage with a low asking price, but I really don't believe there were zero offers for Vokoun before 12 pm on deadline day. It is illogical to say a deal wasn't made because we needed to replace him with another goalie.

The only realistic reasons are a) want to re-sign him, b) believe higher trade value before Jul 1, or c) didn't think the incremental assets were worth the trouble.
It was most likely all of the above reasons as to why he wasnt traded in combination with the low value he had at the deadline.

I disagree with several of your premises because yes I dont believe he had any "REAL" offers before that time. Very few teams were looking for a goalie at the deadline and even fewer had cap space still available to acquire him. Thats not even to mention the actual assets coming back which as Tallon has commented wasnt really worth considering. And I dont agree that it was illogical to say a deal wasnt made because a replacement was needed. To replace Vokoun, he wouldve had to give up something to do so...that had to be a valid factor into why Tallon didnt make a move as well. The net gain then on assets might not have been good enough to make a move.

Coolburn is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 01:28 PM
  #38
HowdyHowden93*
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 633
vCash: 500
it was reported that the only deal on the table for Vokoun was a 5th round pick from the New York Rangers.

I'm glad they didn't move im because I would have gone nuts lol. That offer is a slap in the face. Lets see if they will resign him. If not, well we've been in this situation before. This organization has had A LOT of GREAT goalies, goal tending has never been this organizations weakness. From the Beezer to Luongo to Vokoun. Hopefully Markstrom is the next on that list. Not soon tho, he's not ready. RE SIGN VOKOUN PLEASE!!! for the sake of next year do it!!!

HowdyHowden93* is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 01:31 PM
  #39
StrangeVision
HFBoards Sponsor
 
StrangeVision's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Florida
Country: United States
Posts: 14,298
vCash: 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
You give those to everyone, just saying...

And you've proven nothing yourself, just your own opinion.
The difference is I don't try to tell others how to post when I'm condescending.

I'm not trying to prove anything, unlike you it seems. I'm simply stating the fact that some of Tallon's decisions thus far have not been overwhelming. Tallon has made mistakes. He is not infallible. I'm not stating my opinion as fact, merely stating my position which is that his decision not to move Vokoun was dumb. That opinion is based both on his work as a GM and my own personal view on the matter. Maybe he himself overvalued Vokoun. Maybe he thinks he can get more at the draft. Regardless of what he was thinking, moving Vokoun for anything would have helped this team and Vokoun.

StrangeVision is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 01:40 PM
  #40
HowdyHowden93*
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 633
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by StrangeVision View Post
The difference is I don't try to tell others how to post when I'm condescending.

I'm not trying to prove anything, unlike you it seems. I'm simply stating the fact that some of Tallon's decisions thus far have not been overwhelming. Tallon has made mistakes. He is not infallible. I'm not stating my opinion as fact, merely stating my position which is that his decision not to move Vokoun was dumb. That opinion is based both on his work as a GM and my own personal view on the matter. Maybe he himself overvalued Vokoun. Maybe he thinks he can get more at the draft. Regardless of what he was thinking, moving Vokoun for anything would have helped this team and Vokoun.
yea he's made mistakes:

Bernier/Higgins/Wideman/Skille/Grabner

Trading a two time 20 goal scorer for a guy who has never done a thing in the NHL (Skille), I think this move was worse than waiving Grabner because he actually gave up on a 21 year old guy this team drafted. Where is the logic in this trade?? Skille blows.

But also has made some decent moves:

Bergfors/Samsonov/Carter

But overall I agree with you. The moves have not been overwhelming. If Tallon fails to do anything significant this off season with close to 30 million to spend, then sht is going to hit the fan.

HowdyHowden93* is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 01:41 PM
  #41
HowdyHowden93*
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 633
vCash: 500
He also brought in Reasoner, so you can add that to the good list lol.

HowdyHowden93* is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 02:19 PM
  #42
Laus723
Future Now
 
Laus723's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Boca Raton, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 27,051
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by StrangeVision View Post
The difference is I don't try to tell others how to post when I'm condescending.

I'm not trying to prove anything, unlike you it seems. I'm simply stating the fact that some of Tallon's decisions thus far have not been overwhelming. Tallon has made mistakes. He is not infallible. I'm not stating my opinion as fact, merely stating my position which is that his decision not to move Vokoun was dumb. That opinion is based both on his work as a GM and my own personal view on the matter. Maybe he himself overvalued Vokoun. Maybe he thinks he can get more at the draft. Regardless of what he was thinking, moving Vokoun for anything would have helped this team and Vokoun.
OK. Sure.

I'm not trying to prove anything, either. This is a discussion board. So happens I believe I see things a little more clearly some of the others that post here, sometimes, not all of the time. He didn't move Vokoun, ok, fine, not a problem for me. You THINK it's stupid, so offer the "Tallon 100% right 100% of the time" garbage. I believe he shopped him, had his eyes on other goalies that would have cost more to bring in than he was comfortable moving Vokoun for the package being asked. If that's wrong, so be it. He gave Wideman away for almost nothing...should be telling, especially to you!

I've never said he's some incredible GM, I don't like Grabner not being a Panther, but I'll defend it because...I understand it! I also look around the NHL and don't see a single other team doing one thing differently. Everyone knows that all prospects can be Daigle's.

Laus723 is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 02:35 PM
  #43
StrangeVision
HFBoards Sponsor
 
StrangeVision's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Florida
Country: United States
Posts: 14,298
vCash: 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laus723 View Post
OK. Sure.

I'm not trying to prove anything, either. This is a discussion board. So happens I believe I see things a little more clearly some of the others that post here, sometimes, not all of the time. He didn't move Vokoun, ok, fine, not a problem for me. You THINK it's stupid, so offer the "Tallon 100% right 100% of the time" garbage. I believe he shopped him, had his eyes on other goalies that would have cost more to bring in than he was comfortable moving Vokoun for the package being asked. If that's wrong, so be it. He gave Wideman away for almost nothing...should be telling, especially to you!

I've never said he's some incredible GM, I don't like Grabner not being a Panther, but I'll defend it because...I understand it! I also look around the NHL and don't see a single other team doing one thing differently. Everyone knows that all prospects can be Daigle's.
You don't see things more clearly. You rationalize things the way you want them to be. You evidence for your opinion have no real substance. You just keep going around in circles. The fact that he gave away some players for virtually nothing just helps my position. Had he traded Vokoun, the team would likely be lower in the standings and would get a better draft pick--which helps the team. He could have found some goalie somewhere to backup up Clemmensen to finish the year. It's not rocket science. If Tallon couldn't use any creativity whatsoever in his managerial role, then I really question his ability to take this team out of the gutter.


Last edited by Marty Straka: 03-30-2011 at 02:45 PM.
StrangeVision is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 02:43 PM
  #44
Laus723
Future Now
 
Laus723's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Boca Raton, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 27,051
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by StrangeVision View Post
You don't see things more clearly. You rationalize things the way you want them to be. You evidence for your opinion have no real substance. You just keep going around in circles. The fact that he gave away some players for virtually nothing just helps my position. Had he traded Vokoun, the team would likely be lower in the standings and would get a better draft pick--which helps the team. He could have found some goalie somewhere to backup up Clemmensen to finish the year. It's not rocket science. If Tallon couldn't use any creativity whatsoever in his managerial role, then I really question his ability to take this team out of the gutter.

Colorful PM, by the way. And I'm sorry, I haven't moved to France, yet. Although I'm pretty sure that despite that country not being the grand old USofA, they do still have the internet and I would be able to post from all the way over there.
And I'll counter with the same "strategy." You're going in circles and making it the way YOU want it to be. The deal was bad, Vokoun's still here, and no team admittedly tanks that bad. Guess Ottawa should've moved Spezza for peanuts based on the above? Plus, as has been said, he likely wants to re-sign Vokoun. It's dumb in your opinion, I disagree.

Laus723 is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 02:49 PM
  #45
BabyJagrov
Registered User
 
BabyJagrov's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Under the Sunshine
Country: St Pierre and Miquelon
Posts: 3,247
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by StrangeVision View Post
You don't see things more clearly. You rationalize things the way you want them to be. You evidence for your opinion have no real substance. You just keep going around in circles. The fact that he gave away some players for virtually nothing just helps my position. Had he traded Vokoun, the team would likely be lower in the standings and would get a better draft pick--which helps the team. He could have found some goalie somewhere to backup up Clemmensen to finish the year. It's not rocket science. If Tallon couldn't use any creativity whatsoever in his managerial role, then I really question his ability to take this team out of the gutter.
Getting Bergfors for Dvorak isn't creative enough for you ?

BabyJagrov is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 03:12 PM
  #46
Coolburn
Registered User
 
Coolburn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: South Florida
Country: Hungary
Posts: 7,767
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Coolburn Send a message via MSN to Coolburn Send a message via Yahoo to Coolburn
Hey fellas, you wanna debate how good/bad Tallon is as a GM or what moves he's made is good/bad, fine...go open a new thread for all that. But lets try to keep this on topic as this thread is about Vokoun not being traded and his dissatisfaction with FL.

Coolburn is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 03:18 PM
  #47
ursavolta
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: miami, Fl
Country: United States
Posts: 642
vCash: 500
i hope vokie gets signed. i think we need him for next year. Clemmer isnt too bad.. he holds the fort long enough for us to escape games.. but.. i rather have vokie here to mentor marky till he can start..

i think vokie gets traded tho tallon is probably going to package something for him...

i wish we could give plante some time on the ice as well..would like to see how he stands up against nhl caliber players. . .

ursavolta is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 03:39 PM
  #48
pb1300
BLEED RED
 
pb1300's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Aiyio, Greece
Country: Greece
Posts: 10,665
vCash: 500
Send a message via Yahoo to pb1300
Quote:
Originally Posted by ursavolta View Post
i hope vokie gets signed. i think we need him for next year. Clemmer isnt too bad.. he holds the fort long enough for us to escape games.. but.. i rather have vokie here to mentor marky till he can start..

i think vokie gets traded tho tallon is probably going to package something for him...

i wish we could give plante some time on the ice as well..would like to see how he stands up against nhl caliber players. . .
Vokoun is a UFA after this season, so Tallon wont package him for anything. If he couldnt get anything significant at the deadline, he wont get anything for his rights before the draft. I dont see Vokoun returning, going by the things he has said lately.

pb1300 is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 03:42 PM
  #49
ursavolta
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: miami, Fl
Country: United States
Posts: 642
vCash: 500
why must you pee in my cheerios


ehh i can dream... maybe he resigns? who knows.. after the playoffs, teams are going to get a better picture of what they need to address.. . . . . we can trade his rights.. right?

ursavolta is offline  
Old
03-30-2011, 04:55 PM
  #50
BabyJagrov
Registered User
 
BabyJagrov's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Under the Sunshine
Country: St Pierre and Miquelon
Posts: 3,247
vCash: 500
I think we will still be the team paying him the most and offering him the best contract and nicest situation !

Tampa Bay won't be able to offer 4 millions or 4.5 to Tomas Vokoun. We'll nearly have to to be over the cap. And Vokoun has also said he likes it here and wanted to stay on different occasions... A bad end to the season to go along with a bad back don't help his mood right now !

Vokoun has always been a moody guy... He'll be given a nice extension before the draft, and I think there is a good chance he signs it.

He may find a number one job in free-agency, but likely won't get the big money... Vokoun has a lot of years left in his tank IMO and he may look to go to a contender in his last few years like a Hasek. But he has always been a team player and will want the big dollars too, so I think Tallon will offer him the nice contract with a good talk and some nice work in the off-season to give him a competitive team !

BabyJagrov is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:33 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.