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Kick'em When They're Down Edition: Detroit @ Nashville 4/2/2011

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Old
04-02-2011, 05:43 PM
  #101
CloakroomCrusader
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If we don't find a way to close out games we're ****ed, plain and simple. It's ****ing ridiculous to let that happen.

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04-02-2011, 05:44 PM
  #102
Roman Yoshi
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All I can say is, the first guy I see on the ice tonight better keep his head up. Aggression will be taken out on some poor SOB

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04-02-2011, 05:46 PM
  #103
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Smithson is -5 in the last two games. -3 today. That's a weird stat.

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04-02-2011, 05:46 PM
  #104
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I know the whole team deserves a chunk of the blame for this one, but I would like to give a special chunk to Shane OB. If he skates away after Bertuzzi drops the gloves, Bertuzzi goes to the box, we get a PP, and we keep the momentum. Instead, Bertuzzi wins the fight and the wings score to make it 3-1 shortly after. Everyone choked, but that was the turning point.

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04-02-2011, 05:49 PM
  #105
Roman Yoshi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gopreds9 View Post
I know the whole team deserves a chunk of the blame for this one, but I would like to give a special chunk to Shane OB. If he skates away after Bertuzzi drops the gloves, Bertuzzi goes to the box, we get a PP, and we keep the momentum. Instead, Bertuzzi wins the fight and the wings score to make it 3-1 shortly after. Everyone choked, but that was the turning point.
Absolutely true

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04-02-2011, 05:51 PM
  #106
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When is this team going to learn? I am so sick of leads being blown. Someone needs to get in their ear and tell them the game ain't over until the clock hits 0's

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04-02-2011, 05:52 PM
  #107
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So we blew it. Good.

Now very heavy brain wash for the last three of four when we blew three goal lead and tomorrow morning a good bag skate just for fun of it and may be they will finally get that game goes 60 min.

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04-02-2011, 06:00 PM
  #108
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Check out our TOI for each player tonight. No wonder we collapse in the 3rd. Weber and Suter both played over 29:30. Legwand played over 22 minutes. Kostitsyn played 20. Meanwhile, Dumont, Geoffrion, and Wilson, a line i think has some scoring potential, all get get ~6 minutes each. That means Geoffrion, Dumont, and Wilson combined had less ice time than Joel Ward. I'll let that sink in for a second. Geoffrion, who recently had a hatty to save us in Buffalo, Dumont, our veteran scoring leader, and Wilson, our top forward prospect, had less time than Joel Freaking Ward.

I have no issues with the lines, I have issues with how much playing time they get. It is unbelievable to me that Trotz gives that much ice time to Wardo, who should have had 2-3 goals tonight, yet leaves these other guys riding the pine.

Rant mode off


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04-02-2011, 06:44 PM
  #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gopreds9 View Post
I know the whole team deserves a chunk of the blame for this one, but I would like to give a special chunk to Shane OB. If he skates away after Bertuzzi drops the gloves, Bertuzzi goes to the box, we get a PP, and we keep the momentum. Instead, Bertuzzi wins the fight and the wings score to make it 3-1 shortly after. Everyone choked, but that was the turning point.
Seriously. The turning point in the game was absolutely palpable. OB drops the gloves like an idiot, gets his butt kicked and takes some air out of our building and gives the Wings some momentum. It was all downhill from there. That guy is a bonehead playoff penalty waiting to happen.

Our inability to close out games is a serious problem. When was the last time we got a 2 or 3 goal lead and actually won by 2 or 3 goals? Does anyone know? It feels like it's been forever.

I really hope that Trotz's aw-shucks attitude in the press conference was just for the media; I was expecting him to be really fired up about us letting a team off the hook yet again. Hopefully he is behind closed doors, but he sounded pretty nonchalant about it today. Annoying. We won't get far in the playoffs unless we get this figured out.

+1 to gopreds9 on the comment about the lines too...Detroit was rolling 4 lines and they looked energized for most of the game even with their extended PK time. We pretty much benched our 4th line and started double-shifting Erat, and we were absolutely dragging as the game went on. Seems like we're always better when we can roll 4 lines.

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04-02-2011, 06:57 PM
  #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gopreds9 View Post
...
I have no issues with the lines, I have issues with how much playing time they get. It is unbelievable to me that Trotz gives that much ice time to Wardo, who should have had 2-3 goals tonight, yet leaves these other guys riding the pine.
I was going to make the same rant. But I figured why bother, Trotz works in mysterious ways...

I've decided to not ever rant about Ward's time. Trotz loves him, and his line has scored steadily recently, but the total minutes maddens me still, I can't help it. Also, Halischuk is worth over 11 minutes after being a scratch for a long time, while Wilson and Geoffrion, who score goals in their limited minutes, and have seemed to bring plenty of energy recently when they do play, get 6 or 7 minutes. I'd say it was the amount of special teams play (although Wilson should be on a powerplay unit since he can actually shoot, unlike some others) except they don't play much even in games with few penalties.

If you're an 'energy' player or a guy who won't score much, mistakes will be overlooked, but woe to thee who tries to score and makes a mistake. And it's not like our defense-only guys such as Smithson were minus three today, oh wait...

They're playing well though and getting big points with the short bench. I just am surprised Trotz hasn't spread it out more, the last few games. You can't flog the horses forever.


Last edited by OpenWheel: 04-02-2011 at 07:08 PM.
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Old
04-02-2011, 07:18 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by gopreds9 View Post
Check out our TOI for each player tonight. No wonder we collapse in the 3rd. Weber and Suter both played over 29:30. Legwand played over 22 minutes. Kostitsyn played 20. Meanwhile, Dumont, Geoffrion, and Wilson, a line i think has some scoring potential, all get get ~6 minutes each. That means Geoffrion, Dumont, and Wilson combined had less ice time than Joel Ward. I'll let that sink in for a second. Geoffrion, who recently had a hatty to save us in Buffalo, Dumont, our veteran scoring leader, and Wilson, our top forward prospect, had less time than Joel Freaking Ward. I have no issues with the lines, I have issues with how much playing time they get. It is unbelievable to me that Trotz gives that much ice time to Wardo, who should have had 2-3 goals tonight, yet leaves these other guys riding the pine.

Rant mode off
This is the norm on this team! I get that Trotz wants Ward out there for defense, but PLEASE explain this to me. Wilson still, 16 goals, with the ice time he has this season and plus 10. Geoffrion has shown he has scoring, not too confident in him defensively, but at least give them a chance!
As I have stated in earlier posts this year...... Make these offensive prospects all into the "Nashville mold".......BORING

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04-02-2011, 07:18 PM
  #112
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Not sure what to say but I think it goes back to something Grinder asked a few days ago, did we peak too soon? Are we starting to come down off our good play? We go on hot stretches for 10-12 games. Always have. I can't recall where we tear it up for 20-30 at a time in our history.

If we can't learn from Chicago last year in the playoffs and we can't learn from the last 2 weeks of how to hold on to a lead, when are we going to learn? Is it something the players need to be cognizant of? Is it the coaches that aren't keeping the pressure on the players? Not sure what the issue is but it needs to get fixed at some point.

The other thing is, we were given another "gift" if you want to call it that on the Holmstrom goal, went up 3-0, given chances on the PP once they cut the lead and tied it and still didn't get it done. This one's on us. Can't say the refs didn't help us out. Can't say the PP's weren't there. Can say the focus and ability to close out the game is a huge issue. The game is 60 minutes, especially come playoff time. This is playoff time. We need to step it up and if we don't, we're gonna get bounced again.

And for all those that say we'll be the underdogs again with a lower seed, that's BS. The 3-8 seeds are separated by less than 10 points so the teams are about the same so it's anybodies game. If we get one of the top two seeds then I can see us getting bounced but if we are anywhere between 3 and 6, we should be able to get into the second round.

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Old
04-02-2011, 07:30 PM
  #113
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glenn, considering 2 an d 3 are seperated by on point, it doesn't matter who anyone faces. heck, anaheim and us have played vancouver very well and chicago owns them. fact is, no one wants to play anyone because every series should be a good one. there are no bad teams 1-8. yes, i am now excluding dallas.

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04-02-2011, 07:31 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by gopreds9 View Post
Totally disagree. That goal for Detroit falls largely on O'Brien. If he just skates away, Bertuzzi goes to the box for an instigator and we are on a power play instead of giving them some of the momentum back. Just a stupid hockey play by a hot-head who wasn't thinking right. Selfish play instead of helping your team.
exactly

And we can't win with rolling just 3 lines, and continue to wear out the top lines...........i don't understand trotz thinking on this...and frankly I disagree with playing like this, and I do blame trotz....

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04-02-2011, 08:07 PM
  #115
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Here is another point I have after watching your game. JP lost his man on one of the goals, and that is it for him for the rest of the game!
All 3 other lines lose their man but "luck of the draw" the other team does not score, yet when it is Dumont there is a very short leash!
Trotz gets in his head who he trusts and who he does not.... almost like he just waits for certain players to make a mistake so he can sit them
I watch a lot of hockey. Watching the Chicago, Avs game last night.... SOOOO exciting in that both teams play more of a "free wheel" style.
I know Nashville does not have near the same talent, but MAN, is it entertaining hockey!

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04-02-2011, 08:39 PM
  #116
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My concern today was Peks. He looked average at best. Couple of those goals should not have been in. I'm afraid this game may have ended any real Vezina consideration he may have had.
Far as O'Brien goes, what would all of you be saying if he did not drop the gloves. He was challenged, he even started it. They were talking before the faceoff, he had no choice but to drop the gloves.
I liked what I saw except for about 5 minutes of the second period. Those 2 goals should not have happened. Even at the start of the 3rd, they had the boys on their heels, but they fought back and got back in the game. Leggy's line had a couple of good shifts.

Anyway, the point was big and Dallas losing has just about signed the deal for us. Take care of Atlanta on Tue and get ready for playoff hockey.

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04-02-2011, 08:47 PM
  #117
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In hindsight, I'm glad I felt too ill to go. Would have just pissed me off and given me a gigantic headache.

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04-02-2011, 09:20 PM
  #118
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My concern today was Peks. He looked average at best. Couple of those goals should not have been in. I'm afraid this game may have ended any real Vezina consideration he may have had.
Far as O'Brien goes, what would all of you be saying if he did not drop the gloves. He was challenged, he even started it. They were talking before the faceoff, he had no choice but to drop the gloves.
I liked what I saw except for about 5 minutes of the second period. Those 2 goals should not have happened. Even at the start of the 3rd, they had the boys on their heels, but they fought back and got back in the game. Leggy's line had a couple of good shifts.

Anyway, the point was big and Dallas losing has just about signed the deal for us. Take care of Atlanta on Tue and get ready for playoff hockey.
I agree with you on this. SOB did not cost us the game. If losing one fight is going to cost you a 3-0 lead then something is terribly amiss. I think people get it in their head that a guy makes bonehead plays and that's all he does all the time. Klein gets the same sort of deal. Suter got that deal when he was first brought up and it took him almost 2 years on any of the boards to rid him self of that label.

SOB brings one thing to the table for us on the blue line that we lack and that's a guy who protects Pekka night in and night out. He was the only guy out there tonight who was ready to drop the gloves. With Tootoo out, who amongst the forwards is going to drop them? No one. Klein, Weber and SOB will drop them if need be but we can't afford to lose Klein and Weber to 5 minutes in the box. They used their size on a few of those goals and drove to the net. As much as SOB can frustrate me at times, he does have size and the willingness to use it.

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04-02-2011, 09:38 PM
  #119
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Originally Posted by glenngineer View Post
I agree with you on this. SOB did not cost us the game. If losing one fight is going to cost you a 3-0 lead then something is terribly amiss. I think people get it in their head that a guy makes bonehead plays and that's all he does all the time. Klein gets the same sort of deal. Suter got that deal when he was first brought up and it took him almost 2 years on any of the boards to rid him self of that label.

SOB brings one thing to the table for us on the blue line that we lack and that's a guy who protects Pekka night in and night out. He was the only guy out there tonight who was ready to drop the gloves. With Tootoo out, who amongst the forwards is going to drop them? No one. Klein, Weber and SOB will drop them if need be but we can't afford to lose Klein and Weber to 5 minutes in the box. They used their size on a few of those goals and drove to the net. As much as SOB can frustrate me at times, he does have size and the willingness to use it.
I probably over-reacted a little, but I am particularly pissed off by selfish plays by hot heads. The captain of my high school team this year was thrown out or got a 10:00 in 5 games in a 20 game season because he made selfish plays instead of thinking about the team (i.e. cussing out refs, cheapshots). I agree it was a team effort, but there is no denying that fight was the turning point in the game.

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04-02-2011, 09:58 PM
  #120
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Originally Posted by glenngineer View Post
I agree with you on this. SOB did not cost us the game. If losing one fight is going to cost you a 3-0 lead then something is terribly amiss. I think people get it in their head that a guy makes bonehead plays and that's all he does all the time. Klein gets the same sort of deal. Suter got that deal when he was first brought up and it took him almost 2 years on any of the boards to rid him self of that label.

SOB brings one thing to the table for us on the blue line that we lack and that's a guy who protects Pekka night in and night out. He was the only guy out there tonight who was ready to drop the gloves. With Tootoo out, who amongst the forwards is going to drop them? No one. Klein, Weber and SOB will drop them if need be but we can't afford to lose Klein and Weber to 5 minutes in the box. They used their size on a few of those goals and drove to the net. As much as SOB can frustrate me at times, he does have size and the willingness to use it.
I am upset about the 2nd fight, not the first. The first, I see.

the 2nd, detroit had just called a time out, and then bertuzzi picked a 2nd fight!!! we were outplayed and outcoached...... they wanted sob out, imo, to muck up 2 d lines. smart on detroits part..........stupid on sob's part.


A guy with only 61 pim this year----takes 10 tonight...... he was told to pick that 2nd fight.

SOB had a choice, he could have walked away on the 2nd fight.... and bertuzzi might have gotten an instigator.


Last edited by predfan98: 04-02-2011 at 10:01 PM. Reason: adding.
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04-02-2011, 09:59 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by gopreds9 View Post
I probably over-reacted a little, but I am particularly pissed off by selfish plays by hot heads. The captain of my high school team this year was thrown out or got a 10:00 in 5 games in a 20 game season because he made selfish plays instead of thinking about the team (i.e. cussing out refs, cheapshots). I agree it was a team effort, but there is no denying that fight was the turning point in the game.
Turning point was two lucky goals by Detroit. Has nothing to do with OB.

Forth line was benched cause they didnt manager the puck good, got that first goal on them on bad own zone play and was most of the time locked up in the own zone...

I would bench Smithson too cause he is been playing poor lately... Our best faceoff man lost two faceoffs successfully blew his coverage afterwards and they scored 3 and 4.

We could have this game if Ward scored on 3 perfect chances in third or we connect on late PPs.

Our PP still sucks. No real movement, two guys behind the goal line, D go down very rare. It is so frustrated most of the time, SK or Erat get the puck and the rest of the unit watch them skate around looking for the play...

I think we have more PP goals this season of the rush then of the setup.


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Old
04-02-2011, 11:04 PM
  #122
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Smithson is -5 in the last two games. -3 today. That's a weird stat.
Ya but he is your defensive specialist, so he should play more (sarcasm). 1 assist in last 24 games and minus to boot.

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04-02-2011, 11:12 PM
  #123
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um...some of you bagging on sob for accepting the second fight should read some of his quotes after the game. he challenged bertuzzi....

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04-02-2011, 11:17 PM
  #124
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And the SOB and Bertuzzi thing goes back to the last game at home. They were chirping at each other all night long. Surprised they didn't go two weeks ago. They went twice today instead.

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04-02-2011, 11:33 PM
  #125
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So much for the "magic 3 goal = win" theory. I could tell when most of the play was in our own zone for much of the 2nd period, and all we were doing was dumping the puck out that the more experienced at winning big games team had the upper hand. Lost in the disappointment of a dream ending was the play of Howard in goal; for once, Peks was outplayed when the money was on the line. Division title...what was I thinking??????

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