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ATD 2011 Line-up Assassination Thread

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Old
04-06-2011, 11:58 PM
  #51
TheDevilMadeMe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EagleBelfour View Post
Detroit Falcons

(1930-1932)

Coach: Art Ross
Assistant Coach: Lloyd Percival


Anatoli Firsov (A) - Elmer Lach (A) - Cecil Dillon
Vladimir Krutov - Tod Sloan - Vladimir Vikulov
Don Marcotte - Kenneth Mosdell - Floyd Curry
Eddie Shack - Aleksandr Almetov - Konstantin Loktev
Sergei Kapustin, LW
Johnny Gagnon, RW

Doug Harvey (C) - Fern Flaman
Zdeno Chara - Bert Corbeau (A)
Jerry Korab - Bobby Rowe
Gilles Marotte

Al Rollins
Henrik Lundqvist


Powerplay:
Anatoli Firsov - Vladimir Krutov - Elmer Lach
Doug Harvey - Zdeno Chara

Cecil Dillon - Tod Sloan - Vladimir Vikulov
Jerry Korab - Fern Flaman

Penalty Kill:
Don Marcotte - Kenneth Mosdell
Doug Harvey - Zdeno Chara

Floyd Curry - Aleksandr Almetov
Bert Corbeau - Fern Flaman

Vladimir Krutov - Elmer Lach
Doug Harvey - Zdeno Chara

You're in my division, so you get it first.

Coaching:

I really wish you did a profile of Art Ross, because I'm still not sure how good he was or what his style was. I know that he's not nearly as highly thought of as Lester Patrick or Dick Irvin, but that's a wide range. I do know his teams often lost in the playoffs to lower seeds and he only has the one Cup, despite coaching Eddie Shore. On the other hand, he was an innovator.

Percival was a pioneer in the science of training, which should help Krutov at least. Of course, it would be better if the head coach was a Tikhonov/Keenan type dictator who could ban Krutov from every stepping foot inside a mcdonalds or 7/11.

Forwards:

Lach is a solid playmaking center for a first line. Solid backchecker. Too bad he was so injury-prone. Firsov is a fiery LW who is a very good first line talent, fast, with well rounded offense. Dillon has decent intangibles, but is more of a second line talent. The line is perfectly capable of puck winning by committee, but might sometimes have problems with more physical defenses.

Ah, krutov. For years, he was a fast skating tank who could score goals in tight. He really was a superstar in his own right. In just a few short months, he became fat and useless. Percival should help him, but like I said, the head coach really needs to strictly enforce rules. The other issue has been talked to death. Vikulov is a great playmaker from the wing, seems like a much lesser version of makarov, and that isn't really a bad thing. Sloan is a bit weak as a scoring line center - one great season, 2-3 more good ones, surrounded by mediocrity.

Great checking line, and mosdell gives it some offensive punch in the counter attack.

Shack is a prototypical 4th liner, not sure how the Russians will do on a 4th line.

Overall, I don't see all that much physicality from your forwards, certainly no line that will physically wear down the defense. That may or may not matter. Other than that, they are A well balanced group of players, though dillon and perhaps sloan are weak links.

Defense:

Harvey is clearcut #2 defenseman of all time in my opinion. He's lidstrom with a nasty physical edge and can be outright dirty without being caught. I think flaman is a bit overrated in the ATD - much of his value comes from intimidation, and atd forwards are not going to be as easily intimidated as NHLers Still, he's a better than average #2 and gives you an amazing top.pair next to Harvey.

Chara is an elite #3 - I actually think he's a bit better than Flaman. Corbeau is an elite bodychecker who isn't inept with the pick. This pair is physically intimidating to say the least, but won't provide all that much supporting offense. If you D has any weakness, I can see it being your second pairings' ability to handle fast forwards. Chara's one weakness has always been getting beaten to the outside by small, fast forwards on occasion, and I can see corbeau too far out of position going for the big hit to get back in time (how was corbeau's skating?). Still a very good pairing overall, even if I'm not all that impressed with corbeau as a number #4 (he's capable, perhaps average)

Good bottom pair - Korab brings some offense and yet more physical play. Rowe brings some good defense.

Definity one of the most physical defenses in the draft, and I wouldn't be surprised if it was the most.

Goaltending:

Before the draft, I didn't think Rollins was a top 40 goalie. Now inthink he probably is, but if he is, he's definitely bottom tier. Lundqvist is a very good regular season backup.

Special teams:

Harvey is an elite PP QB who should be able to set up Chara's big shot. Chara has little skill here other than a big shot, but he's not out of place next to Harvey. If you get good krutov, the forwards on the first unit should be effective.

2nd PP is okay, not great, but nobody really out of place.

First PK is absolutely elite. Chara is one of the most effective penalty killers ever and he's next to Harvey! When mosdell is the worst part of a PK unit, you know it's great.

2nd unit is pretty good. Flaman is an elite crease clearer and can easily go on a first unit. Corbeau is ok I guess - his bodychecking will keep the crease clear at least, just hope he doesn't run around too much. Almetov is good, not sure about curry, but if guess he's good.

I wouldn't want an injury prone player like lach to play PK minutes if he doesn't have to. Even if he's perfectly capable otherwise (and he is).


Last edited by TheDevilMadeMe: 04-07-2011 at 07:00 PM.
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Old
04-07-2011, 12:25 AM
  #52
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Forgot to review EB's spares - kapustin is a very good spare who is lightning fast, good offensively and not adverse to physical play at all. Gagnon is fine as an offensive minded winger. Two questions - what is the plan if a checker gets injured? What is the plan if Lach is out?

Marotte is a decent spare who seems fairly well rounded.

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04-07-2011, 12:53 AM
  #53
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Head Coach: Joel Quenneville
Assistant Coach: Marc Crawford

Roy Conacher-Syl Apps Sr.-Gordie Drillon
Keith Tkachuk-Dale Hawerchuk-Billy Boucher
Frank "Pud" Glass-Ernie Russell-Bruce Stuart
Wayne Merrick-Ryan Kesler-Ron Stewart

Spares: RW Billy Gilmour, W Bruce Ridpath

Denis Potvin-Ken Morrow
Hobey Baker-Dunc Munro
Sandis Ozolinsh-Al Arbour
D/F Walter Smaill

Dominik Hasek
Ryan Miller


PP1: Tkachuk-Hawerchuk-Boucher-Potvin-Ozolinsh
PP2: Conacher-Apps-Drillon-Baker-Munro

PK1: Kesler-Stewart-Arbour-Morrow
PK2: Merrick-Glass-Munro-Potvin
Not a full review, but why is your top line on the second PP? Munro is awful on the PP - maybe move Hawerchuk to the point?

Potvin is a horse and can handle many more minutes than Morrow - play him on the top pk instead of arbour.

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Old
04-07-2011, 04:23 AM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
You're in my division, so you get it first.

Coaching:

I really wish you did a profile of Art Ross, because I'm still not sure how good he was or what his style was. I know that he's not nearly as highly thought of as Lester Patrick or Dick Irvin, but that's a wide range. I do know his teams often lost in the playoffs to lower seeds and he only has the one Cup, despite coaching Eddie Shore. On the other hand, he was an innovator.
In my research in the era, I stumbled upon an article which credits Art Ross as the progenitor of the "kitty bar the door" style of hockey which Ottawa perfected....for what that's worth. I don't have the link any more. There is also a bit of information in one of the posts on Frank Fredrickson from the Dirt thread which describes Ross as a strict coach who should be able to get the best out of Fredrickson (which he obviously did, considering the results).

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04-07-2011, 05:06 AM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Mr Bugg View Post



Head Coach: Joel Quenneville
Assistant Coach: Marc Crawford

Roy Conacher-Syl Apps Sr.-Gordie Drillon
Keith Tkachuk-Dale Hawerchuk-Billy Boucher
Frank "Pud" Glass-Ernie Russell-Bruce Stuart
Wayne Merrick-Ryan Kesler-Ron Stewart

Spares: RW Billy Gilmour, W Bruce Ridpath

Denis Potvin-Ken Morrow
Hobey Baker-Dunc Munro
Sandis Ozolinsh-Al Arbour
D/F Walter Smaill

Dominik Hasek
Ryan Miller


PP1: Tkachuk-Hawerchuk-Boucher-Potvin-Ozolinsh
PP2: Conacher-Apps-Drillon-Baker-Munro

PK1: Kesler-Stewart-Arbour-Morrow
PK2: Merrick-Glass-Munro-Potvin
First Line:
Apps is definitely a solid and well-rounded top line center. He provides good scoring and passing skills. Both Conacher and Drillon are very good goal scorers, but they are both pretty one dimensional. While I do like all the individuals on the line, it does lack intangibles. Apps provides a little bit of them, but if he’s providing them all, it’s not enough. This line will definitely be able to score goal though!

Second Line:
Hawerchuk is a good second line playmaker, and despite some negative press, he’s got an excellent scoring winger in Tkachuk. Boucher brings a little grit. It’s tough to measure so many lines against each other, but this one should stand up pretty well.

Third Line:
Russell and Stuart are both good enough offensive players to play on 2nd lines. Stuart, I think, is a very under-rated guy around here. He was noted as one of the fastest skaters of his day, and considering his era, he has Zdeno Chara-like size. Glass is a good mucker and decent passer. Like the first line, this is a little lacking in playmaking.

Fourth Line:
This line, I assume will be used when you want to match against a 1st line. If that’s the case, I think they will really get overwhelmed. They do give you some solid PKers though.

First Pair:
Potvin is an absolute beast in every aspect of the game. He’s one of the very best #1s in the draft. Morrow is definitely a weak top pairing guy, but he’s solid enough to stay out of trouble. He’ll be a good anchor for Potvin.

Second Pair:
Sorry, but I really don’t buy either Baker or Munro as 2nd pairing guys. Munro would be an ok #6 with an offensive partner, and Baker would be a decent spare.

Third Pair:
I like this pair a lot. Ozolinch brings the flash and Arbour cleans up the mess. To me, this should be your 2nd pair. It’s still a relatively weak 2nd pair, but it’s definitely better than Baker/Munro.

Goalies:
Hasek is the best goalie of all time, so, in my mind anyway, you’ll have the edge in any match-up.

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04-07-2011, 06:34 AM
  #56
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Coach: Tommy Ivan
Assistant (PP, forwards): Todd McLellan
Captain: Fetisov
Alternate Captains: Stapleton, Larmer

F. Mahovlich - Barry - Larmer
Gagne - Goyette - Nedomanský
J. Wilson - Hlinka - Bauer
Pandolfo - Conroy - Lever
Zábrodský, Preston

Fetisov - Murphy
Stapleton - G. McNamara
T. Jonsson - Rochefort
K. Jönsson

Rayner
Moog

Powerplay:
PP1: Barry - Nedomanský - Mahovlich
Fetisov - Murphy
PP2: Goyette - Hlinka - Larmer
Stapleton - Jonsson

Penalty Kill:
PK1: Pandolfo - Conroy
Fetisov - Rochefort
PK2: Lever - Larmer
Stapleton - McNamara
PK3: Mahovlich - Goyette
Fetisov - Murphy

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Old
04-07-2011, 07:21 AM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dreakmur View Post



Arkady Chernyshev
Rudy Pilous

Alf Smith “A” - Norm Ullman - Andy Bathgate
Fred Stanfeild - Tom Dunderdale - Jack Marshall
Pete Mahovlich - Edgar Laprade - Andy Hebenton
Red Hamill - Paul Haynes - Peter McNab

Ray Bourque “C” - Ted Green “A”
Hod Stuart - Pat Egan
Hy Buller - Ken Randall

Vladislav Tretiak
Mike Richter



Eddie Wiseman, Victor Shuvalov, Kent Douglas


Power Play #1
Alf Smith - Norm Ullman - Andy Bathgate
Ray Bourque - Pat Egan

Power Play #2
Fred Stanfield - Tommy Dunderdale - Peter McNab
Hod Stuart - Jack Marshall

Penalty Kill #1
Pete Mahovlich - Andy Hebenton
Ray Bourque - Ted Green

Penalty Kill #2
Edgar Laprade - Fred Stanfield
Hod Stuart - Ken Randall

Panalty Kill Extras
Norm Ullman - Jack Marshall - Paul Haynes - Alf Smith
I think your first line is one of the best in this draft, the Ullman - Bathgate combination is really deadly - both can score or pass, Ullman brings solid defence, really great mix. Smith isn't out of place on that line, actually he'll contribute a lot by making Ullman's and Bathgate's job easier. Really well-constructed line.

I don't like your second line that much. Just an idea: maybe you should put Dunderdale on the wing and stanfield at C. Transition from C to W isn't unusual and Dunderdale as goalscorer may be more suited for the wing, while you can use Stanfield's defence and playmaking ability in the middle.

Very solid defencive line, that can score. And a jack-of-all-trades-master-of-none forth line which won't hurt your team.

Having Bourque on the ice with Bathgate and Ullman isn't really fair, not a fan of Green on the top pairing. And not a fan of Egan. it would be interesting to see TOI distribution for your D, i assume Stuart will see more ES TOI than Green?

I think made a right call when didn't put Bathgate on the point. Strong first unit, ok second, i'm not sold on Marshall playing the point. Solid pk-units.

I rank Tretiak as top-12 goaltender, so it's a nice advantage in a 40 teams competition.

Strong coaching tandem, i think Reay was good enough to be a head coach in a 40 team draft.

Long story short - you have a strong group with an outstanding first line, your defence isn't that strong, but Bourque can mask a lot of weaknesses by logging insane amounts of time, as can Tretiak.

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Old
04-07-2011, 07:30 AM
  #58
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Guelph Platers

GM: BraveCanadian
Coach: Al Arbour
Captain: Dave Poulin
Alternates: Clark Gillies, Bryan Trottier
Player Development Consultant: Gary Roberts

Clark Gillies - Bryan Trottier - Rick Middleton
John Ogrodnick - Rick MacLeish - Rene Robert
Mike McPhee - Dave Poulin - Yuri Lebedev
Martin Gelinas - Jason Arnott - Rick Vaive

Mike Ramsey - Guy Lapointe
Steve Smith - Eric Desjardins
Jamie Macoun - Reijo Ruotsalainen

Walter "Turk" Broda
Felix "the Cat" Potvin

Reserves
Craig Simpson - Sylvain Lefebvre - Dmitri Khristich

Powerplay:
PP1: Clark Gillies - Bryan Trottier - Rick Vaive - Guy Lapointe - Eric Desjardins
PP2: John Ogrodnick - Rick MacLeish - Rick Middleton - Steve Smith - Reijo Ruotsalainen

Penalty Kill:
PK1: Dave Poulin - Rick Middleton - Mike Ramsey - Guy Lapointe
PK2: Bryan Trottier - Rick MacLeish - Steve Smith - Eric Desjardins[/CENTER]
Ok, I'll start with Guelph because it's the first unreviewed team I found.

1st line: Trottier and Middleton are an outstanding two-way tandem who are great in all zones of the ice. Clark Gillies...I loved Jethro, but he's quite on the low-end offensively for a first liner. He had a couple of good offensive seasons playing with two superstars, but was never, I'd say, a top-30 player in the league offensively. He just didn't have the hands for it. Of course, his all-around game is somewhat underrated (as is Bossy's - Trottier wasn't the only guy on that line who could backcheck) and he's one of the most intimidating fighters of all-time, being heavyweight champ for I'd say a good 5-6 seasons, at least. Clark was also not stupid about fighting and would often pick fights when his team needed a pickup and avoid them otherwise. I specifically remember him laughing at Curt Fraser's challenge in the 1982 Cup Finals and just skating off. The Isles were killing the Nucks so badly on the scoreboard that Gillies had nothing to gain by fighting Fraser, and knew it.

So Clark certainly has his uses. If I were ever Gilles' owner (which I'll probably never be), I'd instruct him to go out there and rough the hell out of every soft ATD scoring star he can find. There are enough relatively unprotected stars in this draft that I think that aspect of Gilles' game could really make an impact. But anyway he wasn't much of a scorer and I think he brings down what is otherwise a very strong two-way 1st line. The line is, at any rate, still quite strong defensively with Gillies on the wing.

2nd line: It's been criticized some, but I think the balance of this line is ok between Ogrodnick the goalscorer and Robert the puckwinner/playmaker with MacLeish more or less a self-contained offensive player. None of them are high-end in their roles (though MacLeish always seemed to pick it up in the playoffs), but I think they fit well together as a unit and are somewhat more than the sum of their parts. MacLeish was a pretty good defensive player and Robert was, as well. The line is probably a bit above average defensively for an ATD 2nd line, but I wouldn't go further than that.

3rd line: The third line confuses me a bit. Lebedev was a gritty scorer and I think a pretty good offensive player for a 3rd line wing, but McPhee and Poulin are really just checkers at this level, and I feel like the Russian's offensive talents are somewhat wasted here. The line is very gritty and checks well, but it doesn't seem to have a clear role. It would make more sense to me if another checker were in Lebedev's place or another scorer in place of one of the other two.

4th line: Arnott and Vaive form the core of a tough scoring 4th line and are quite strong offensively for their roles, though I don't really know about Gelinas. This is clearly a secondary scoring unit, and a pretty good one, but I'd like to see someone better than Martin Gelinas on the left wing. I would personally bench Gelinas in favor of Simpson, which would give the line a stronger dose of grit and scoring, where it is already strong. I think Simpson - Arnott - Vaive would be a quite effective scoring 4th line who can also mix it up.

1st pairing: I'm a big fan of Lapointe, and Ramsey is a solid if low-end defensive "gatekeeper" for you on a top pairing. Guy was a great special teams player, but was somewhat less spectacular at even strength (some of that was just because of role - he was a 2nd pairing ES player most of the time in Montreal), and that will hurt you a bit here. It's a below-average even strength top pairing in this (I think - haven't really gone through all 40 teams with great detail), but one without discernable weaknesses. They can certainly get the job done for you.

2nd pairing: I like Desjardins as a two-way #3 in this, and I think he is generally underrated both by reputation and by Norris record. He's a good all-around 2nd tier #3, I think - not among the best, but a strong player in his role. Steve Smith was a tough customer and a really solid defensive defenseman in his prime, though I think he's somewhat below average in that role on an ATD second pairing. It's all-in-all a fairly average second pairing that, like the top pairing, won't dominate but also won't really be exploitable, either.

3rd pairing: Probably your best pairing relative to their role. I think Macoun is good enough to play on a 2nd pairing in this (he's as good as Smith, IMO), and Reijo is a nice puckmover for a bottom pairing. A good mix of talents and I think a very strong 3rd pairing.

Goaltending: Not much to say. Broda is a known commodity and a stud. He regularly played the entire regular season schedule and is in the upper eschelon of best playoff goalies all-time. With Broda you really don't need much of a backup which is good because Potvin isn't much of a backup. Felix the Cat will probably see 10-15 regular season games, at most, I'm guessing, and he's good enough for that. At 40 teams, Broda will give you an advantage in most matchups, sometimes a big one.

Coaching/leadership: Quite possibly the best in the draft. You have reassembled the leadership from the Islanders dynasty, which I consider to be one of the best led teams of all-time. The degree of difficulty in winning four Cups in a row post-expansion is mind-bogglingly high, but the Isles did it. This is a team that you can count on to always play up to its full potential and neither give up nor let up in a tight series.

Powerplay: Please, please swap Gilles and Middleton. Nifty was a terrific powerplay player and Gilles really doesn't belong on an ATD 1st unit. Middleton on one half-boards, Trottier on the other and Vaive in front with Lapointe and Desjardins at the point, however, would be a quite strong first unit, and I think you should go with that setup.

For the second unit, I'd stick with Ogrodnick and MacLeish, but consider Lebedev or Arnott for the third forward role. Clark Gilles was not a really special powerplay producer on the Island. He had a couple of good seasons, but I think Arnott was better overall, and though I don't know much about Lebedev, it wouldn't surprise me if he was, as well. It's not going to be a very strong unit either way because of suspect play from the points (after Reijo you really don't have any more viable pointmen), but removing Gilles from the PP, entirely, will help. With Middleton up there the first unit is really good, though, so the weakness of the second unit isn't of great concern.

Penalty kill: Extremely good all-around. The top-4 forward group are maybe the best in the draft, and while none of the defensemen are ATD elite PKers, all are strong in their roles. Just an excellent PK.

Overall comments: A quite defensively-oriented team that will be difficult to score on from top to bottom. The offense is pretty thin, to be honest, but the scoringline centers both raised their play in the postseason and the top powerplay (with Middleton, hopefully) is very strong, so there is no doubt they will score. Will win a lot of close, physical games in the postseason. Other than lacking a bit of coherence on the 3rd line, I think it is a well-built whole with clearly defined roles and players well-suited for their duties. It will be very strong against undisciplined teams and teams with grit/puckwinning issues, but outside of the top unit may really struggle against teams that can dominate puck possession and withstand physical pressure. Overall, a strong (first, I believe it is?) entry.

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Old
04-07-2011, 09:46 AM
  #59
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Ladies and Gentleman:


CINCINNATI FIREWORKS


Manager: Markrander87



Head Coach: Jacques Demers
Assistant Coach: Pete Muldoon
Captain: Ed Litzenberger
Assistant Captains: Darryl Sittler, Larry Robinson, Viktor Kuzkin


Bert Olmstead - Darryl Sittler (A) - Bernie Geoffrion
Dean Prentice - Paul Ronty - Ed Litzenberger (C)
Red Berenson - Art Chapman - Jerry Toppazzini
Shayne Corson - Rick Meagher - Danny Grant

Extra: Dolly Swift F/D, Marc Savard

Larry Robinson (A) - Allan Stanley
Vitaly Davydov - Viktor Kuzkin (A)
Paul Shmyr - Mathieu Schneider

Extra: Bob Turner


Bernie Parent
Gerry Mcneil


PP1: Olmstead - Sittler - Litzenberger
Geoffrion - Robinson

PP2: Berenson - Ronty - Grant
Schneider - Kuzkin

PK1: Prentice -Toppazzini
Robinson - Stanley

PK2: Berenson - Meagher
Kuzkin - Davydov

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Old
04-07-2011, 11:51 AM
  #60
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MONTREAL CANADIENS



Manager: ReenMachine

Head Coach: Harry Sinden
Defense Coach: Jacque Laperričre
Captain: Wayne Gretzky
Assistant: Nicklas Lidstrom
Assistant: Lanny McDonald

ROSTER

#16 Patrik Elias - #99 Wayne Gretzky - #9 Lanny McDonald
#17 Wendel Clark - #18 Denis Savard - #19 Jean Pronovost
#2 Louis Berlinquette - #11 Steve Kasper - #17 Mike Foligno
#14 Geoff Courtnall - #15 Billy Reay - #27 Alex Kovalev
Spares: #10 Barry Pederson , #30 Chris Nilan

#5 Nicklas Lidstrom - #16 Vladimir Konstantinov
#20 Gary Suter - #20 Dallas Smith
#26 Dave Langevin - #34 Al Iafrate
Spares: #26 Mike Milbury

#1 Alec Connell
#35 Jean-Sébastien Gigučre


PP1: Wayne Gretzky , Lanny McDonald , Alex Kovalev , Nicklas Lidstrom , Gary Suter

PP2: Denis Savard , Jean Pronovost , Patrick Elias , Al Iafrate , Vlad Konstantinov

PK1: Steve Kasper , Louis Berlinquette , Nicklas Lidstrom , Dallas Smith

PK2: Billy Reay , Mike Foligno , Vladimir Konstantinov , Dave Langevin

PK3: Wayne Gretzky , Patrick Elias

6 men: Gretzky , McDonald , Elias , Savard , Lidstrom , Suter
First off, this was a great effort by a first-time GM, and I applaud you for thinking outside the box. A lot of us veteran GMs I think had a problem mentally adjusting to the altered value of players in a 40-team ATD versus 30 teams, but without such a reference frame, you just added the best player on the board and came up with a wonderful team despite trading away so many early picks. You personally bettered me in terms of value received.

1st line- I echo whoever it was that said this was the best line a team could have hoped to build around Gretz in a 40-team ATD. While 99 doesn't have a highly physical winger on either side, Elias is an elite two-way forward and McDonald can flat-out score.

2nd line- Savard was a great pick, and I'd accept him as a first-line center in a 40-team ATD. However, his wingers are a bit weak at first blush. Clark has a single top-ten goals to his name; Pronovost is more established, but his playoff record is a bit weak and he's one-dimensional. Can this team score against 2nd pairings?

3rd line- A solid checking line. Berlinguette is an underrated player and a premier 3rd liner, and I've always liked Kasper. However, I don't know that this line is skilled enough offensively to do anything but tread water. When a line is playing substantial minutes against top units, they need to do a bit more.

4th line- Not my favorite fourth line. Courtnall and Kovalev are streaky, streaky players, and neither contributes much defensively. If they're not scoring they're useless, and can they score enough to overcome their deficiencies? My only major quibble with the forwards.

1st D- I for one love re-uniting real-life units, as my team last year attests to. I don't know why no one can buy Konstantinov as a weak #2, especially with his actual partner.

2nd D- I like this pairing. Very well-balanced, and using Smith as your #4 was a good choice.

3rd D- Again, good balance, and an above-average third unit.

Goalies- Obviously, to get the team you did, you had to sacrifice somewhere, and goal is the right place to do it. Still, Connell is a decent starter that can be relied on to be average. Giguere is a decent regular-season backup, I think.

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Old
04-07-2011, 12:18 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by BraveCanadian View Post
This is my current lineup. I will be out of town for a few days so I'll have to catch up on this stuff when I get back:




Guelph Platers

GM: BraveCanadian
Coach: Al Arbour
Captain: Dave Poulin
Alternates: Clark Gillies, Bryan Trottier
Player Development Consultant: Gary Roberts

Clark Gillies - Bryan Trottier - Rick Middleton
John Ogrodnick - Rick MacLeish - Rene Robert
Mike McPhee - Dave Poulin - Yuri Lebedev
Martin Gelinas - Jason Arnott - Rick Vaive

Mike Ramsey - Guy Lapointe
Steve Smith - Eric Desjardins
Jamie Macoun - Reijo Ruotsalainen

Walter "Turk" Broda
Felix "the Cat" Potvin

Reserves
Craig Simpson - Sylvain Lefebvre - Dmitri Khristich

Powerplay:
PP1: Clark Gillies - Bryan Trottier - Rick Vaive - Guy Lapointe - Eric Desjardins
PP2: John Ogrodnick - Rick MacLeish - Rick Middleton - Steve Smith - Reijo Ruotsalainen

Penalty Kill:
PK1: Dave Poulin - Rick Middleton - Mike Ramsey - Guy Lapointe
PK2: Bryan Trottier - Rick MacLeish - Steve Smith - Eric Desjardins
Definitely one of the top teams by the end of this thing. There isn't a player out of place here, and you managed to hold several ATD stalwarts to their usual spots, a definite accomplishment in a 40-team ATD.

1st line- An extremely balanced unit. Middleton takes Bossy's spot on the Trio Grande, and while you obviously weren't going to replace him, I think this line would have been better-served by a player with higher scoring finishes and pure offensive ability than a two-way guy like Middleton.

2nd line- Although it has the right pivot- a defensively responsible center that can nevertheless make plays- and is bookended by a scorer (Robert), I don't know that Ogrodnick fits into a second line even in an ATD. Still, when two-thirds of the line would fit onto a 30-team ATD's second unit, it's hard to complain.

3rd line- Again, you've got a solid 3rd liner in Poulin, a decent but one-dimensional checker in McPhee and a good scoring forward suited for a 3rd line.

4th line- Love the intangibles on this line. Arnott and Gelinas are the perfect option for a 4th line in the playoffs, and Vaive has a bit more raw scoring ability.

1st D- Lapointe is of course a premier two-way defender, and Ramsey is the right choice to balance him.

2nd D- While I like both players as individuals, I don't know that they're correctly matched here. Both are offensive dynamos- but there's only one puck. Desjardins is trust-worthy defensively, but enough to not a) sacrifice his efficiency b) shelter Smith?

3rd D- Another balanced unit. I think they're a reasonable third pairing, but due to the deficiencies of the second unit, they might be asked to play more than necessary.

Goalie- No worries here. Broda is an upper-tier goaltender and The Cat won't have to play much at all.

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04-07-2011, 12:30 PM
  #62
TheDevilMadeMe
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First Line:
Apps is definitely a solid and well-rounded top line center. He provides good scoring and passing skills. Both Conacher and Drillon are very good goal scorers, but they are both pretty one dimensional. While I do like all the individuals on the line, it does lack intangibles. Apps provides a little bit of them, but if he’s providing them all, it’s not enough. This line will definitely be able to score goal though!
No mention of drillin's abysmal defensive play? He's an amazing goal scorer (best bugg has) but you know it's bad when the normally glowing historical profile talks about his cherrypicking style. And unlike bure, I'm not sure he's fast enough ringer back when he actually feels like it.

That said, drillon should be an elite PP scorer and should really be on the first PP in my opinion.


I'm not nearly as down on the second D pair as you, but I do think they are a weakness.


Last edited by TheDevilMadeMe: 04-07-2011 at 12:41 PM.
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04-07-2011, 12:45 PM
  #63
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Am I missing something? As far as I'm aware, lidstrom and konstantinov were never regular partners and only played together on the PK. The regular pairings were lidstrom-Murphy, and fetisov-konstantinov as far ad I know.

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04-07-2011, 12:47 PM
  #64
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I'll put together Dailey and Ricci bios today, and hopefully a Hitch one soon.

Halifax Mooseheads


GM: Stoneberg
Coach: Ken Hitchcock
Captian: Toe Blake
Alternate Captains: Eddie Oatman, Kevin Lowe


Roster
Toe Blake (C)-Syd Howe-Ace Bailey
Gaye Stewart-Doug Weight-Eddie Oatman (A)
Jack Walker-Mike Ricci-Bobby Rousseau
Ed Sandford-Vincent Lecavalier-Pit Martin

Brad Park-Bill White
Kevin Lowe (A)-James Patrick
Gord Fraser-Bob Dailey

Martin Brodeur
Don Edwards

Spares:
Syl Apps Jr., C
Marian Gaborik, W
Lee Fogolin Jr., D
Jimmy Roberts, RW/D

1st PP Unit
Blake-Howe-Bailey
Rousseau-Park

2nd PP Unit
Stewart-Lecavalier-Oatman
Weight-Patrick

-Doug on the draws
-Dailey will get some time to unload his cannon from the point alongside Weight or Patrick.

PK Forwards
Martin-Walker
Ricci-Rousseau
Howe-Bailey

-Sandford to sub in as needed

PK Defensemen
Lowe-White
Park-Dailey/Fraser

Forward Minutes
nameESPPSHtotal
Blake154019+
Howe154221
Bailey1341.518.5
Stewart113014
Weight113014
Oatman123015
Walker130417
Ricci1001.511.5
Rousseau1242.518.5
Sandford8019
Lecavalier103013
Martin801.59.5
total1382814180

Defensemen minutes
nameESPPSHtotal
Park2041.525.5
White1904+23
Lowe1704+21
Patrick162.518.5
Fraser90211
Dailey111214
total92714113


Last edited by Stoneberg: 04-10-2011 at 12:56 PM.
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04-07-2011, 12:58 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
No mention of drillin's abysmal defensive play? He's an amazing goal scorer (best bugg has) but you know it's bad when the normally glowing historical profile talks about his cherrypicking style. And unlike bure, I'm not sure he's fast enough ringer back when he actually feels like it.
I said the wingers were one-dimensional.

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04-07-2011, 01:03 PM
  #66
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I said the wingers were one-dimensional.
That's a wide range though. Conacher might be offense only, but he's not a Liability in any way.

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04-07-2011, 01:11 PM
  #67
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Garnish Phantoms

GMs: tony d and DaveG

Head Coach: Pat Quinn

Kevin Stevens - Joe Malone - Glenn Anderson (A)
Ray Whitney - Doug Gilmour (C) - Rick Tocchet
Rabbit McVeigh - Butch Goring - Kevin Dineen (A)
Hec Kilrea - Cliff Ronning - Tomas Sandstrom
Rick Kehoe, Keith Acton

Rob Blake (A) - Harvey Pulford
Lennart Svedberg - Dollard St Laurent
Kevin Hatcher - Chris Phillips
Dave Manson, Dick Redmond

Terry Sawchuk
Miikka Kiprusoff

PP1: Joe Malone - Doug Gilmour - Glenn Anderson - Rob Blake - Cliff Ronning
PP2: Kevin Stevens - Butch Goring - Ray Whitney - Kevin Hatcher - Lennart Svedberg

PK1: Butch Goring - Rabbit McVeigh - Rob Blake - Harvey Pulford
PK2: Doug Gilmour - Hec Kilrea - Dollard St. Laurent - Chris Phillips


Last edited by DaveG: 04-15-2011 at 10:35 AM.
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04-07-2011, 01:14 PM
  #68
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I asked a couple of wings fans a while ago and they did play together at ES , even if it wasn't all the time.

( lid-kons )

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04-07-2011, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by DoMakc View Post
I don't like your second line that much. Just an idea: maybe you should put Dunderdale on the wing and stanfield at C. Transition from C to W isn't unusual and Dunderdale as goalscorer may be more suited for the wing, while you can use Stanfield's defence and playmaking ability in the middle.
Don't feel bad. I don't like it that much either

I toyed with moving Dunderdale to the wing, but that was when guys like Bernie Federko were still around.

With so many multi-position players, I've got a lot of flexibiltiy. If that's something that would be accepted, I'd do it.... but I'm not sure most people like the idea of Dunderdale on the wing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoMakc View Post
Having Bourque on the ice with Bathgate and Ullman isn't really fair, not a fan of Green on the top pairing. And not a fan of Egan. it would be interesting to see TOI distribution for your D, i assume Stuart will see more ES TOI than Green?
As I said before, Hod Stuart is my #2 defenseman, and will be getting the 2nd most minutes.

Here are the minutes (ES, PP, PK):
Ray Bourque 20+4+4 = 28
Hod Stuart 20+3+3 = 26
Ted Green 18+0+4 = 22
Pat Egan 18+4+0 = 22
Ken Randall 8+0+3 = 11
Hy Buller 8+0+0 = 8

(As of right now, the last 3 minutes go to Jack Marshall on the PP)


Quote:
Originally Posted by DoMakc View Post
Long story short - you have a strong group with an outstanding first line, your defence isn't that strong, but Bourque can mask a lot of weaknesses by logging insane amounts of time, as can Tretiak.
Looks like I'm higher on Green and Egan than a lot of people. I'll have to get selling them.

Just curious, what don't you like about Egan? He's an explosive scorer and big time physical presence.

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04-07-2011, 01:25 PM
  #70
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2nd D- While I like both players as individuals, I don't know that they're correctly matched here. Both are offensive dynamos- but there's only one puck. Desjardins is trust-worthy defensively, but enough to not a) sacrifice his efficiency b) shelter Smith?
Eh? Steve Smith an "offensive dynamo"?! I don't know what to make of that statement.

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04-07-2011, 01:25 PM
  #71
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Minnesota Fighting Saints


GM: Nalyd Psycho
Head Coach: Lester Patrick
Captain: Yvan Cournoyer
Assistant Captains: Lloyd Cook & Russell Bowie

#12 Dickie Moore-#26 Peter Stastny-#21 Yvan Cournoyer
#11 Gordie Roberts-#13 Russell Bowie-#24 Sergei Makarov
#9 Murray Murdoch-#16 Bobby Holik-#3 Alf Skinner
#14 Ab McDonald-#5 Jaroslav Holik-#19 Lorne Carr

#77 Ernie Johnson-#56 Sergei Zubov
#8 Lloyd Cook-#7 Art Duncan
#6 Don Awrey-#23 Jeff Beukeboom

#1 Georges Vezina
#2 Jirí Králík

Spares: #22 Bohuslav Stastny, #62 Sami Pahlsson, #65 Sami Salo, #4 Yuri Fedorov

First Power Play Unit:
Moore-Stastny-Cournoyer
Johnson-Zubov

Second Power Play Unit:
Roberts-Bowie-Makarov
Cook-Duncan

First Penalty Kill Unit:
Murdoch-Cournoyer
Johnson-Awrey

Second Penalty Kill Unit:
Bowie-McDonald
Cook-Beukeboom
I'm skipping around, but I've really been looking forward to reviewing this team. So much to like and a few things that just make me scratch my head.

Coaching:

Lester Patrick is a top 10 coach all time and is one of the few well suited to coach a run and gun team. Perfect coach for you.

Forwards: Moore would be an elite glue guy even without the offense. But he does have the offense - one of the best playmakers from wing ever and he can score some goals too. Stastny is a middle of the road top center and isn't soft. Cournoyer is actually a pretty weak first liner in the regular season - his scoring finishes and all star nods are not impressive. He raises his game tremendously in the playoffs though.

Second line has talent - it's in the running for most talented second line in the draft. But i really think that it is less than the sum of it's parts. Makarov is an elite 2nd line talent who can score, pass, and stickhandle at an extremely high level. He'd be an excellent first liner. But as the only playmaker of the line, his ability to score goals suffers quite a bit. Bowie is a pure sniper and a very good one. Small though. Gord Roberts is another goal scorer and is believable as a "power forward lite.". I just think you could use the real deal next to a shrimp like Bowie and a nonphysical guy like makarov. This line will still produce quite a bit, just not as much as the overall talent is capable of.

Third line should be very effective at even strength at winning face-offs and checking

Ab and jaroslav are great 4th line types who bring more scoring than most grinders. Carre provides more offense, not sure about his grit level though.

Defense:

Johnson is a premiere defensive defenseman with reach, speed, and decent physicality. The only thing lacking is puck handling. Zubov can handle the puck. He's not terrible defensively, but is over his head on a top pairing and will be a liability at times. Johnson can cover a lot of ice, but he can't cover the whole thing!

The run and gun theme goes to your second pairing. These guys will be great at pushing the puck up ice, but might be in a little trouble in their own zone when they can't dictate the play. But they are quite good at dictating the play.

Bottom pair is great in their own zone and very physical. They might get stuck in their own zone from time to time though with the lack of puck skills. Still a solid shutdown pair.

Goaltending:

Vezina isn't as good as Charlie gardiner, but he's awfully close. He probably won't steal you a series, but he won't lose you one either. Kralik is a bit untested, but had the talent to be a solid backup.

Special Teams:

Makarov is slumming it on a second unit, but I guess he has to since cournoyer is a bit of a PP specialist. PP is strong with one big exception - moose Johnson is a terrible puck handler and should be nowhere near a first unit. It's easy to fix though - Bowie the rover can okay point an one of the Holiks can center.

The penalty kill, however is a major liability. Johnson and Murdoch are great of course. There are only a few dozen forwards to play a significant number of games since expansion to never kill a penalty. Most of them are goons one of them is Cournoyer. Bowie doesn't seem particularly capable on the PK either. McDonald and Cook are questionable too I think but at least believable.

Suggestion: dress Palsson and replace cournoyer and Bowie on the PK. I realize pahlsson was only a noteworthy player for a few seasons, but your PK as currently constructed really hurts an otherwise strong team.

Spares:
Already talked about pahlsson. Rest of the guys are a fairly versatile bunch, which is what you want.

Overall: a breathtaking amount of top end talent, playing a run and gun game it seems. The 2nd line is a bit awkward, but no denying the skill up there. This team will score a lot, but might have trouble holding a lead at times.


Last edited by TheDevilMadeMe: 04-07-2011 at 07:01 PM.
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Old
04-07-2011, 01:30 PM
  #72
Dreakmur
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Only the second quote specifically mentions his defensive play. Reread your profile and I will say that it's pretty good evidence that Egan is better defensively than Hollett. I'm not sure how good that makes him though.
Actually, the 2nd and 3rd both specifically talk about his defensive play.

"Blocking" doesn't mean shot-blocking in that article. It means his ability to stop players from getting to his net, which is probably the most important aspect of defensive play.


The first one said he was an all-around presence, which doesn't specifically say he was good, but does imply it.

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04-07-2011, 01:31 PM
  #73
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That's a wide range though. Conacher might be offense only, but he's not a Liability in any way.
The biggest issue I see with Kimberley's top line is that it doesn't have a puckwinner or really any aggression, whatsoever. I don't know if I've ever before seen a line composed of three Byng finalists (and two winners), but Bugg has pulled it off here.

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04-07-2011, 01:31 PM
  #74
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There is no way Hod Stuart can handle 26 minutes at this level. Only about 10 defensemen in the NHL did that last year. That's what I'm playing quackenbush, my #1 and a man legendary for his endurance.

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04-07-2011, 01:38 PM
  #75
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There is no way Hod Stuart can handle 26 minutes at this level. Only about 10 defensemen in the NHL did that last year. That's what I'm playing quackenbush, my #1 and a man legendary for his endurance.
26 minutes isn't that hard for a defenseman, especially one who is an effortless skater.

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