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Rangers Devils Pre Game Talk: It All Comes Down To This

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04-08-2011, 03:23 PM
  #101
MartyForVezina
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Originally Posted by Jersey Girl View Post
...with good reason. The average fan has enough difficulty understanding the standings as it is. Let's not make it MORE complicated for goodness sakes.

For some reason every other sports league is fine with a simple Wins/Losses/Pct formula, but the NHL has to make it complicated.
From a pure logic standpoint, that points system is perfect for how NHL games are structured. Really not that complicated, but I do agree it wont be adopted because of your reasoning mainly.

Also realize "every other sport" has endless overtime to decide the winner.

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04-08-2011, 03:26 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by MartyForVezina View Post
From a pure logic standpoint, that points system is perfect for how NHL games are structured. Really not that complicated, but I do agree it wont be adopted because of your reasoning mainly.

Also realize "every other sport" has endless overtime to decide the winner.
Except football, but it rarely gets that far. Although it's been close to happening a lot more in recent years. I still say 10 minute OT will find a winner more often then going to the shootout.

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04-08-2011, 03:26 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by Jersey Girl View Post
For some reason every other sports league is fine with a simple Wins/Losses/Pct formula, but the NHL has to make it complicated.

That's because the NHL doesn't want games going for 5 hours because no one can win the game. We see that in the playoffs, it would never fly in the regular season. In football, basketball, baseball, they can have unlimited OT. In basketball the odds of two teams having the same score after one OT isn't that high, and even less so after two. In baseball, well the physical toll in baseball isn't that high, that playing a 5 hour game hardly makes a difference. In football, the odds of a team not scoring after one quarter is extremely slim.

The NHL doesn't want ties, so that's what it is. I'd personally prefer a 20 minute 4 on 4. Winner takes 2 points, loser takes nothing, otherwise there's a tie. The amount of ties would be extremely low.

3 point games are ridiculous when normal games are worth 2. It artificially inflates the standings. Also, shootout wins counting as much as a regulation/ot win is ridiculous.

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04-08-2011, 03:27 PM
  #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MartyForVezina View Post
From a pure logic standpoint, that points system is perfect for how NHL games are structured. Really not that complicated, but I do agree it wont be adopted because of your reasoning mainly.

Also realize "every other sport" has endless overtime to decide the winner.
Football does not. Though I'd be fine with it if it did.

I'd be behind indefinite overtime periods. But it mucks with typical programming schedules, and player's energy levels.

I bet goaltender's GAA would improve significantly, though.

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04-08-2011, 03:30 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by Fitzy Duke of NY View Post
Football does not. Though I'd be fine with it if it did.

I'd be behind indefinite overtime periods. But it mucks with typical programming schedules, and player's energy levels.

I bet goaltender's GAA would improve significantly, though.
Obviosuly football doesnt, but I didnt see the need to specify since a tie has happened twice in the past decade I think.

Edit: And to further specify I did not inlcude soccer either before that gets mentioned lol.

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04-08-2011, 03:31 PM
  #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fitzy Duke of NY View Post
Football does not. Though I'd be fine with it if it did.

I'd be behind indefinite overtime periods. But it mucks with typical programming schedules, and player's energy levels.

I bet goaltender's GAA would improve significantly, though.
Football's system is fine. One full quarter of OT, sudden death. I don't see why the NHL can't do that. At worst as I said, make it 4 on 4. I'd be shocked if the amount of ties declined by less than 50%.

The NHL is the only sport that doesn't have a full period of OT in the regular season (except Soccer obviously).

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04-08-2011, 03:34 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by DubiSnacks17 View Post
I've always been a fan of
3 points regulation/ot win
2 points shootout win
1 point shootout loss
0 points regulation/ot loss

It'll never be adopted though.

This would be how the standings would look:
Team GP W SOW SOL L PTS Points Ahead of 9th
y - Washington 81 43 5 6 27 145 28
x - Philadelphia 80 43 3 7 27 142 25
y - Boston 80 43 2 6 29 139 22
x - Pittsburgh 80 38 9 3 30 135 18
x - Tampa Bay 80 38 6 6 30 132 15
x - Montreal 81 40 3 3 35 129 12
NY Rangers 81 34 9 3 35 123 6
Buffalo 80 36 5 1 38 119 2

Team GP W SOW SOL L PTS Points Behind of 8th
Carolina 80 34 5 5 36 117 -2
e - Toronto 81 32 5 6 38 112 -7
e - New Jersey 80 34 3 2 41 110 -9
e - Atlanta 80 29 5 7 39 104 -15
e - Ottawa 81 30 2 5 44 99 -20
e - NY Islanders 80 26 4 5 45 91 -28
e - Florida 80 25 4 7 44 90 -29
That is awesome!! I have wanted to see this for a long time!

IMHO that is exactly how it should work. 3 points for EVERY game.

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04-08-2011, 03:46 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by Zuccarello Awesome View Post
Ok so... I just got off the phone with Time Warner Cable (I just moved from NY to Chapel Hill, NC) and they told me that I can't order NHL Centre Ice anymore. I can only order the "Stanley Cup package" which only starts once the playoffs start. This seems absolutely absurd to me. Why would they not want to make a ton of money off of me watching ONE regular season game?? I was willing to pay 80 dollars to watch the game tomorrow (I justified it by saying I'd spend that much or more on a ticket to GO to the game) but they told me that is no longer possible. I'm thinking about calling back and speaking to someone else because that just seems inaccurate to me.

But, can someone please suggest another option for me to watch the game tomorrow? Is there something through nhl.com that would allow me to purchase tomorrow's game to watch on my computer? Or are there normally high-quality streams of the game anywhere? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks guys.
Sent you a PM

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Old
04-08-2011, 04:04 PM
  #109
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We can debate the silly scoring system all we want. If the Rangers don't get in it's because they lost a game they could have won. I always look back to that ho-hum loss on a Tuesday night back in December. Those games count too.

They missed the playoffs last season by losing in the shootout, last game of the season. It sucked.

The kicker is "if" they get in they will be the 8 seed and than all the teams will be AHEAD of them in the standings, then they will crush all in their path....

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04-08-2011, 04:07 PM
  #110
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04-08-2011, 04:11 PM
  #111
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Just...



Do it.

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Old
04-08-2011, 04:58 PM
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
Nash has all of the playoff history going for him. You're right. He's the missing piece
Are you kidding me? He's made the playoffs what once? Are we going down another "he isn't a winner" road? Yeah guys like Kovalchuk, Nash, Thornton, man I'll pass on them. Gimme some Ben Eager, Craid Adams, and Adam Hall any day because they're winners

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04-08-2011, 05:10 PM
  #113
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Somehow I have a feeling if we're getting in at all it's because we win tomorrow and Buffalo loses their next 2.

Ha if only they got one of those 20 something 1-goal games to overtime earlier in the year

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Old
04-08-2011, 05:11 PM
  #114
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Simple solution to the point nonsense.

1. Get rid of the shootout.
2. Get rid of the loser point.
3. Extend 4 on 4 OT to ten minutes.

Every game is worth two points and ties aren't as prevalent as they were before the lock out. With ten minute OT, chances are someone would score more often than not.

I hate the ****ing shootout even though it's benefited this team. Not a way to finish a game. Ties weren't the worst thing in the world.

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04-08-2011, 05:30 PM
  #115
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Originally Posted by NYRFAN218 View Post
Simple solution to the point nonsense.

1. Get rid of the shootout.
2. Get rid of the loser point.
3. Extend 4 on 4 OT to ten minutes.

Every game is worth two points and ties aren't as prevalent as they were before the lock out. With ten minute OT, chances are someone would score more often than not.

I hate the ****ing shootout even though it's benefited this team. Not a way to finish a game. Ties weren't the worst thing in the world.
i dont see how anyone can be a fan of the tie. hockey would be the only sport that has ties (im not counting football, a tie happens once every five years). ive been to about 10 games that ended in a tie. each time i wish i just stayed home and picked a different game to go to. shootouts are a weak way to end a game, but a tie is even weaker.

go 4 on 4 for ten, then shootout. and get rid of the loser point

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04-08-2011, 05:32 PM
  #116
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One team gets a win, one team gets a loss...no matter how they get the loss. Simple.

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Old
04-08-2011, 05:35 PM
  #117
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current standings...

----------------gp-w-l-ot-pts-r/ot/w
NY RANGERS ATL 81 43 33 5 91 34
---CAROLINA SE 80 39 30 11 89 34

OK lets say New York wins in regulation, and Carolina wins one in regulation and one in shootout.

standings would become......

-----------------gp-w-l-ot-pts-r/ot/w
NY RANGERS ATL 82 44 33 5 93 35
---CAROLINA SE 82 41 30 11 93 35

.... would the Rangers still have 8th?

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04-08-2011, 05:45 PM
  #118
Greg in MA
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Originally Posted by Blue'sClues View Post
.... would the Rangers still have 8th?
No, Carolina owns the second tiebreaker as they have more points in head to head games thanks to OTL's.

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04-08-2011, 05:54 PM
  #119
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Originally Posted by Blue'sClues View Post
current standings...

----------------gp-w-l-ot-pts-r/ot/w
NY RANGERS ATL 81 43 33 5 91 34
---CAROLINA SE 80 39 30 11 89 34

OK lets say New York wins in regulation, and Carolina wins one in regulation and one in shootout.

standings would become......

-----------------gp-w-l-ot-pts-r/ot/w
NY RANGERS ATL 82 44 33 5 93 35
---CAROLINA SE 82 41 30 11 93 35

.... would the Rangers still have 8th?
imagine the rangers lose tomorrow but carolina losses both games in ot. they would get in because of the loser points. terrible

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04-08-2011, 05:54 PM
  #120
Stanley Foobrick
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Originally Posted by Greg in MA View Post
No, Carolina owns the second tiebreaker as they have more points in head to head games thanks to OTL's.
Then why does NHL.com list the tie breakers like this.....?

TIE-BREAKING PROCEDURE
* - Division leaders are seeded 1, 2, and 3 in Conference standings. If two or more clubs are tied in points during the regular season, the standing of the clubs is determined in the following order:
1.The fewer number of games played (i.e., superior points percentage).

2.The greater number of games won, excluding games won in the Shootout (NEW for 2010-11). This figure is reflected in the ROW column.

3.The greater number of points earned in games between the tied clubs. If two clubs are tied, and have not played an equal number of home games against each other, points earned in the first game played in the city that had the extra game shall not be included. If more than two clubs are tied, the higher percentage of available points earned in games among those clubs, and not including any "odd" games, shall be used to determine the standing.

4.The greater differential between goals for and against for the entire regular season.

..... seems to me they are saying higher number of regulation-OT wins comes before head to head.


Edit..... nevermind 35-35 goes direct to head to head..... makes sense.


Last edited by Stanley Foobrick: 04-08-2011 at 06:04 PM.
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04-08-2011, 05:58 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by Blue'sClues View Post
Then why does NHL.com list the tie breakers like this.....?

TIE-BREAKING PROCEDURE
* - Division leaders are seeded 1, 2, and 3 in Conference standings. If two or more clubs are tied in points during the regular season, the standing of the clubs is determined in the following order:
1.The fewer number of games played (i.e., superior points percentage).

2.The greater number of games won, excluding games won in the Shootout (NEW for 2010-11). This figure is reflected in the ROW column.

3.The greater number of points earned in games between the tied clubs. If two clubs are tied, and have not played an equal number of home games against each other, points earned in the first game played in the city that had the extra game shall not be included. If more than two clubs are tied, the higher percentage of available points earned in games among those clubs, and not including any "odd" games, shall be used to determine the standing.

4.The greater differential between goals for and against for the entire regular season.

..... seems to me they are saying higher number of regulation-OT wins comes before head to head.
regardless, you have to get the points to be tied with somebody. in carolinas case they have many loser points, could potentially get 2 more and make the playoffs.

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04-08-2011, 05:59 PM
  #122
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I like the idea of a 2nd OT 3 on 3 deciding the winner. If it's still tied, they should decide the winner with three rounds of fist fights. Followed by sudden death (literally) rounds.

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04-08-2011, 06:00 PM
  #123
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Originally Posted by HockeyBurd View Post
I like the idea of a 2nd OT 3 on 3 deciding the winner. If it's still tied, they should decide the winner with three rounds of fist fights. Followed by sudden death (literally) rounds.
this should be considered

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04-08-2011, 06:07 PM
  #124
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Originally Posted by NYRFAN218 View Post
Simple solution to the point nonsense.

1. Get rid of the shootout.
2. Get rid of the loser point.
3. Extend 4 on 4 OT to ten minutes.

Every game is worth two points and ties aren't as prevalent as they were before the lock out. With ten minute OT, chances are someone would score more often than not.

I hate the ****ing shootout even though it's benefited this team. Not a way to finish a game. Ties weren't the worst thing in the world.
Two 5 minute OT periods of 4 on 4 followed by 3 on 3. That should resolve most ties.

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Old
04-08-2011, 06:09 PM
  #125
Ryan McDonut
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i may watch a stream of the carolina game tonight.

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