HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Talent evaluation of our young players is terrible.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
04-10-2011, 03:21 AM
  #26
Redux91
I do Three bullets.
 
Redux91's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Montreal West Island
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,874
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Redux91 Send a message via MSN to Redux91
Quote:
Originally Posted by habakkuk View Post
What if I said we could have 3 top six forwards, with a combined total of 73 goals and 154 points and we wouldn't have to give anybody off our big team roster to get them.
What if I said we would trade three of our top 4 goal scorers for a couple of minor league crapshoots.
That's what we've done in trading our problem children: Sergei 23g 50pts,
Milkhail 29g 58 pts and Matt 21g 46 pts. Obviously there's something rotten in Denmark because we havn't heard a peep from either of these players since they we liberated from Montreal. There is a serious problem somewhere, whether it's in the evaluation of our young players or in the way we handle them in Montreal.
Notice I didn't mention Roy, Leclair or Latendresse.
Is this a team where history, tradition or conformitity are more important than talent? I'm delighted we have Price, Subban and Pacioretty to lead us forward but was worried about Subban for a while. He seemed to being led down the same old road where the media prepares the way by telling us how immature how disruptive or how useless these guys are just prior to the organization trading them.
By the time these guys are finally traded we've destroyed any trade value they might have had.
I would tell you who gives a ****.
Your what people call "living in the past"
Get over it. they're gone.
Just because they did it somewhere else doesnt mean they would of done it here.

Redux91 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 06:15 AM
  #27
LBC Vapo*
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 613
vCash: 500


genius team management

LBC Vapo* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 07:08 AM
  #28
ECWHSWI
5M? insulting!!!
 
ECWHSWI's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 15,888
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LBC Vapo View Post


genius team management
one of them will start his golfing season sooner than the other three...

ECWHSWI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 09:17 AM
  #29
Fozz
Registered User
 
Fozz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 6,438
vCash: 500
Having D'Agostini or Grabovski in a top-6 role = non-playoff team.

Fozz is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 09:25 AM
  #30
jlgib21*
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 620
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fozz View Post
Having D'Agostini or Grabovski in a top-6 role = non-playoff team.
Why didn't you add SK 74 name there? Keep in mind it's not just the production,it's the enormous cap hits they take,which hurts our ability to improve.Sounds like your saying D'ags,and Grabovski wouldn't be an improvement over: BP,DD,TP,JH,TM,RW or SG. We are very offensively challenged right now,

jlgib21* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 09:30 AM
  #31
Miller Time
Registered User
 
Miller Time's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 8,293
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryI View Post
Congrats. Every team makes mistakes.
are you captain obvious?

you missed a few:

some teams make fewer mistakes...

teams who make fewer mistakes have more success, win more games/championships...

point of playing is to win games/championships...

and we could go on and on, being obvious is fun, but a little pointless in a discussion board, don't you think?

Miller Time is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 09:34 AM
  #32
jlgib21*
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 620
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post
are you captain obvious?

you missed a few:

some teams make fewer mistakes...

teams who make fewer mistakes have more success, win more games/championships...

point of playing is to win games/championships...

and we could go on and on, being obvious is fun, but a little pointless in a discussion board, don't you think?
I thought it was to make the playoffs and sell out.

jlgib21* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 09:36 AM
  #33
The Kremelin Wall*
the krEMELIN wall
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,769
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post
are you captain obvious?

you missed a few:

some teams make fewer mistakes...

teams who make fewer mistakes have more success, win more games/championships...

point of playing is to win games/championships...

and we could go on and on, being obvious is fun, but a little pointless in a discussion board, don't you think?
Who's won more championships than us?

The Kremelin Wall* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 10:10 AM
  #34
Miller Time
Registered User
 
Miller Time's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 8,293
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattKOTW View Post
Who's won more championships than us?
i'm all for being proud of our legacy, but coming off of our first decade without a cup (and without a playoff run deeper than the 2nd round, I'd say resting on our laurels is not a great idea moving forward.

Miller Time is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 10:39 AM
  #35
Picaroon
Registered User
 
Picaroon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: New Brunswick
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,788
vCash: 500
Why do people care about losing Grabo? He scores goals and THAT IS IT. He plays for himself and not the team and I'm glad he is gone.
I liked Dago when he was here, but you can't win em all.
Lats is a lazy bum and is no more valuable than Pouliot.

Picaroon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 10:49 AM
  #36
25th
Registered User
 
25th's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Aylmer beach, Qc
Posts: 802
vCash: 500
The problem IMO is that young guys aren't treated equaly as the vets.

Spacek could make all the mistake in the world, his playing time wasn't affected. P.K. on the other hand...

Eller could take a dumb penalty early in a game and not see any ice time the rest of the game. Plekanec could take two in a row and...

Gomez was terrible for most of the season but never got the treatment Eller, Pouliot, Ak46 and Desharnais got at times...

In such conditions, I can understand why Grabo and Sergei became irate and troublesome...

25th is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 11:00 AM
  #37
Moester
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Montreal
Posts: 947
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Moester Send a message via MSN to Moester
Quote:
Originally Posted by coolasprICE View Post
Ya, the only thing you're leaving out is that these players didn't depart from the same team in a matter of a year or two.
I was talking about the most notable examples. But the fact of the matter is that several teams have face the same situation. Islanders, Rangers, Wild, Oilers, Flyers, Blackhawks have all faced similar situations. But the fact of the matter is that losing 2nd line players or 2nd pairing d-men happens. You simply only keep track of what happens on the Habs so don't notice the reality of player movement in the NHL.

Moester is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 11:06 AM
  #38
Newhabfan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Montreal
Posts: 2,050
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 25th View Post
The problem IMO is that young guys aren't treated equaly as the vets.
There's no problem there. Young guys should not be treated equally as the vets. Not in hockey and not in real life. If you are an 18 yr old and just started working for any company, don't expect to be treated the same way the 30+ year old with 10 years of experience. Life is like that and it should be like that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 25th View Post
Spacek could make all the mistake in the world, his playing time wasn't affected. P.K. on the other hand...

Eller could take a dumb penalty early in a game and not see any ice time the rest of the game. Plekanec could take two in a row and...

Gomez was terrible for most of the season but never got the treatment Eller, Pouliot, Ak46 and Desharnais got at times...
That's because:
- Spacek's errors are caused by him not being physically capable of more. Subban's errors are caused by him not being responsable.
- You know Spacek knows he messed up and he will do his best to correct it. Subban needs to learn that first ... guess what - Subban learned it this season by being benched.

Being benched is mostly an educational tool. No point in "educating" Spacek, Plek or Gomez - they are perfectly aware when they suck and what's needed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 25th View Post
In such conditions, I can understand why Grabo and Sergei became irate and troublesome...
Like we were going to change the whole team structure and philosophy to please Sergei ? For Crosby or Ovechkin maybe - but not for SK.

btw - "Grabo" missed the playoffs last three years in a row if you did not know while the low stats guys made them.

Newhabfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 11:10 AM
  #39
habfaninvictoria
Registered User
 
habfaninvictoria's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Victoria BC
Posts: 1,708
vCash: 500
instead of *****ing and moaning who is't here, how about cheering those who are and are about to start the playoffs.

If we were more patient with our young players they might become better players here, but..... one of the biggest problems is the bipolar fan base that sees a superstar in the making at 19 yrs old who we picked up in the 5th round....

get over it


GO HABS GO

habfaninvictoria is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 11:31 AM
  #40
11Goat11
Inside her
 
11Goat11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,788
vCash: 500
The only one I was sad to see go was D'ags, I thought he would turn into a goal scorer much like Pacioretty he just needed more time.

I have no use for players like SKost, Lats, and Grabs, thought they were bigger than the team and unwilling to pay their dues. Look at Grabs last night, last game of the season against a hated rival and is a complete no show, I mean show some pride.

The Habs knew these guys had talent but decided they weren't going to fit with the make up of the team. Not looking at contracts but going into the playoffs against the Bruins I would rather have Gomez in the lineup than Grabovski.

I am done with high maintenance attitude skill players like SK and the team has agreed, you either buy into what the team and coach is preaching or you don't.

11Goat11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 11:46 AM
  #41
TheCanasianfrasian
Registered User
 
TheCanasianfrasian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 952
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to TheCanasianfrasian
S. Kostitsyn, M. D'agostini, M. Grabovski. R. Obyrne

S. Kostitsyn 77gp 23g 27a 50pts 20pim +/-10

M. D'agostini 82gp 21g 25a 46pts 40pim +/-8

M. Grabovski 81gp 29g 29a 58pts 60pim +/-14

R. Obyrne stats aren't stellar but he's playing 20+ minutes and is one of colorado's best defenceman.

Kost, grabo and D'ago's stats would have put them all in the top 4 pointers on the habs roster this year.

My question is simple, what do you think is the reason for underestimating these players, and why does the habs organisation constantly underestimate their young players.

As far as i know we are one of the only teams that trade away young guys every year for late round picks and ahl players, just to see those players turn into 40-60 pts per season players. If you have other examples of teams that do this as much as the habs please post them!

TheCanasianfrasian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 11:49 AM
  #42
overlords
Hfboards
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Trolling Brian Wilde
Posts: 26,411
vCash: 500
Seriously, dude. The thread was like 4 down from this new one.

overlords is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 11:49 AM
  #43
Kboum
Registered User
 
Kboum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Sherbrooke
Country: Canada
Posts: 541
vCash: 500
We are in playoffs

D'agostini isnt
O'Byrne isnt
Grabovski isnt

Why the hell everyone talking about these players now
D'agostini couldnt crack our top 6 we got a prospects who's player great
Before the injuries, O'Byrne wasnt top 6 D, I love the kid but hey we got a good prospect future 3rd liner. O'B is playing 20 mins on the worst D squad of the league imo with all their injuries Avs were looking really bad I saw a lot of games of them cause my buddy follow them a lot

Grabovski and S.Kost, I wont tell you why they were traded, you probably know it

Stop complaining and enjoy our playoffs. I like our team why so many people are negative on these board

Kboum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 11:50 AM
  #44
Next Best Thing*
 
Next Best Thing*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Montreal, Quebec
Posts: 6,007
vCash: 500
Those players would have never put up those numbers on the Habs, they were all headcases save for D'agostini who completely forot what it meant to be a forward. The end.

Next Best Thing* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 11:52 AM
  #45
overlords
Hfboards
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Trolling Brian Wilde
Posts: 26,411
vCash: 500
People forgot that we were up against a wall with d'agostini. We had players returning from injury and he was playing like garbage and obviously needed more time in the AHL. He would have had to go through waivers and some **** team like the islanders might have picked him up. We got a good prospect in return.

overlords is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 11:55 AM
  #46
TheCanasianfrasian
Registered User
 
TheCanasianfrasian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 952
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to TheCanasianfrasian
Quote:
Originally Posted by Next Best Thing View Post
Those players would have never put up those numbers on the Habs, they were all headcases save for D'agostini who completely forot what it meant to be a forward. The end.
Ok, so another question then, why does this alway happen to habs prospects (suck in montreal, can't crack the top 6, headcase, locker parasite, ergo all excuses we have heard on these boards over the years).

If you want to trade them away because they aren't jiving with the team thats fine, its the evaluation of their worth thats mind boggling.

no matter who the players are, who the gm is, who the coach is, etcetc this has been a recurring problem for a good 15 years now.

TheCanasianfrasian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 11:56 AM
  #47
Kboum
Registered User
 
Kboum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Sherbrooke
Country: Canada
Posts: 541
vCash: 500
Can someone tell me how many points these guy will get in playoffs :

Latendresse
D'Agostini
O'Byrne
Grabovski


I'd really like to know. Do you think they will win the Cup ? If you know that interest me please

I heard they got the new taylormade stuff is it working good ? You should ask them

Kboum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 11:57 AM
  #48
TheCanasianfrasian
Registered User
 
TheCanasianfrasian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 952
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to TheCanasianfrasian
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kboum View Post
Can someone tell me how many points these guy will get in playoffs :

Latendresse
D'Agostini
O'Byrne
Grabovski


I'd really like to know. Do you think they will win the Cup ? If you know that interest me please

I heard they got the new taylormade stuff is it working good ? You should ask them
So your argument is simply that they suck because they couldnt make a difference in their new teams and make the playoffs? What if they make they playoffs next year? And the year after that?

TheCanasianfrasian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 12:01 PM
  #49
Kboum
Registered User
 
Kboum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Sherbrooke
Country: Canada
Posts: 541
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCanasianfrasian View Post
So your argument is simply that they suck because they couldnt make a difference in their new teams and make the playoffs?
My argument is : we don't need them. They couldnt play on our top 6. IF they play top 6 on a bad team I don,t care good for them.

S.Kost - Grabovski : behavior problems
D'agostini : we were gonna lose him on waivers better have a prospect in return he was playing like an ass
O'Byrne : I prefer Markov, Subban, Gorges, Hammer, Gill, Wiz

PA PArenta has like 53 pts with the Isles, I'm happy or him but I don't want him on my top 6 either... Maybe got 53 pts but have you seen his team ? Do you think he would have got 53 pts with the Canucks ? The Red Wings ? The Caps ?...

you see the logic ?

Kboum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-10-2011, 12:08 PM
  #50
Taupy
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,857
vCash: 500
Oh look it's this thread again, has it been a month already?

Taupy is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:03 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.