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Old
04-11-2011, 03:53 PM
  #76
Kritter471
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Cam Fowler would not have played in Dallas this year (and for good reason - he's a train wreck behind his own blue line and would have only made this defense's problems worse). Drafting a player simply to keep him away from another team is also a dumb idea.

You can make a lot of reasonable arguments about the merits of drafting him over Campbell, but the two you're trying to make are really, really short-sighted.

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04-11-2011, 04:12 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Kritter471 View Post
Cam Fowler would not have played in Dallas this year (and for good reason - he's a train wreck behind his own blue line and would have only made this defense's problems worse). Drafting a player simply to keep him away from another team is also a dumb idea.

You can make a lot of reasonable arguments about the merits of drafting him over Campbell, but the two you're trying to make are really, really short-sighted.
Cam Fowlers defending is way less of an issue than you make it out to be.

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04-11-2011, 04:27 PM
  #78
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Deride Cam Folwer all you like Kritter, he's a part of the reason Anaheim finished ahead of Dallas and I'll go ahead and say he alone was worth 4-6 points. It's not the nail in Niewendyk's coffin but it does show yet another poor decision by the front office.

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Old
04-11-2011, 04:37 PM
  #79
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I agree that at least a year or more in the AHL would be beneficial for Glennie. I guess I just get the sick feeling that the lenders have a little more control over the team in financial situations than they should.

A team in this situation, with a forced Cap Floor, entry level contracts with bonuses are king. Dallas doesn't have any significant example other than Glennie and Campbell. I honestly I'm surprised they didn't go hard, or maybe they did and should have gone harder, after a Euro or NCAA free agent. Those guys tend to sign these types of contracts. People get shocked over Brunnstrom and Bozak's contract numbers, but they are perfect (not for fans ... for the money people) for teams like Dallas. Those players are never going to earn the B bonuses. Honestly, I doubt there is on example of a free agent signing a bonus laden ELC earning B bonuses. The only players that earn those are guys like Crosby, Ovechkin, and Toews. You're talking top of the line, players at very young ages. So that $2 million counts against the cap, gets teams to the floor, and severely lowers their actual obligation to real money.

In a perfect world, I agree that Glennie has to earn his way on to the roster. I'd love to see that happen. I can't say I'm in favor of giving up a 2nd to do it, but a one season, incentive heavy contract to Jamie Langenbrunner could be perfect for the Stars. You'd obviously include some reasonable, reachable goals, but throw in something crazy like 40 goals for $1 million to blow up the cap hit. I don't think they'll let you go crazy like $2 million for 82 goals, so they'd have to find a balance of realistic on paper but unlikely to reach.

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04-11-2011, 04:41 PM
  #80
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Oh yeah ... so the strange non-return of Brandon Segal to the AHL .... I guess that means he's out?

If they don't even want him finishing the year in Texas, why would he return next year?

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Old
04-11-2011, 04:47 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by piqued View Post
I was nodding along with you until this point. The fact that Glennie's caphit outstrips his salary and will help the lenders get to the floor just isn't a good enough reason to throw him to the wolves. He's the classic slow developer, a bit like Bobby Ryan. You want to err on the side of too much AHL time with him. No one doubts his skill level. But he's got to learn to play disciplined, structured hockey. I mean, why do you think they had him follow around Lehtinen during that training camp? This has always been the issue. I'd hate to see one of our few chances at another impact player squandered because the current team is bad and we had no one else to play in a scoring role. And frankly there's also the concern of just keeping him away from the losing culture this team has developed until the point when his play demands a spot in the NHL.
Agree completely with you here. The ONLY way Scott Glennie should see NHL ice-time in anything other than a preseason game is if he has blown the doors of the AHL and has his baby Stars coaching staff seeing flashes of Benn's Calder playoff dominance. This is true for all of the reasons you point out but I'll add another - attitude. Glennie's attitude, work ethic, and overall drive have been questioned by everyone around him at various times. The last thing he needs, or the Stars need, is an entitled high 1st rounder who thinks this is the way sports go. If you don't create an environment of competition amongst your own prospects you will wind up with a mediocre (at best) NHL club looking for all the world like 18 year olds in a bar with fake I.D.'s.

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Old
04-11-2011, 10:17 PM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kritter471 View Post
Cam Fowler would not have played in Dallas this year (and for good reason - he's a train wreck behind his own blue line and would have only made this defense's problems worse). Drafting a player simply to keep him away from another team is also a dumb idea.

You can make a lot of reasonable arguments about the merits of drafting him over Campbell, but the two you're trying to make are really, really short-sighted.
Fowler definitely would have made Dallas this year. Offensively hes ahead of Larsen and physically too, even if he was behind him defensively, he absoulutely would have been here.

If Dallas makes that same mistake again this year I might be done with this team for a few years. I'd actually want them to move up to try to get Murphy (Whose Fowler++ except for size) but thats a pipedream

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04-11-2011, 11:23 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Prophet of Glennie View Post
Fowler definitely would have made Dallas this year. Offensively hes ahead of Larsen and physically too, even if he was behind him defensively, he absoulutely would have been here.

If Dallas makes that same mistake again this year I might be done with this team for a few years. I'd actually want them to move up to try to get Murphy (Whose Fowler++ except for size) but thats a pipedream
What do you think of oleksiak?

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Old
04-11-2011, 11:25 PM
  #84
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do you guys think we need a new backup?

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04-11-2011, 11:45 PM
  #85
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do you guys think we need a new backup?
No, I think Crawford needs to not be retarded and never play our BU again after one bad game.

Raycroft was great the majority of his starts before that Calgary game.

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Old
04-12-2011, 09:31 AM
  #86
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Raycroft is the backup next year. That's just the way it's going to be.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigG44 View Post
I can't say I'm in favor of giving up a 2nd to do it, but a one season, incentive heavy contract to Jamie Langenbrunner could be perfect for the Stars. You'd obviously include some reasonable, reachable goals, but throw in something crazy like 40 goals for $1 million to blow up the cap hit. I don't think they'll let you go crazy like $2 million for 82 goals, so they'd have to find a balance of realistic on paper but unlikely to reach.
Going back to our earlier conversation, it seems to make more sense to throw money at a player like Laich, who is actually good and in his prime, rather than engage in these tricks with numbers or sign spares to deals they're not remotely worth.

The European free agent season hasn't started in earnest yet. There's still time to be active there and bump up the team cap hit. Though I admit I'm surprised also they couldn't land a single NCAA FA considering that was Joe's area of focus before becoming a GM.

One other concern that struck me was: what if the Rangers waive Avery and then bring him back on re-entry? He's close to wearing out his welcome there also now. We could be in the strange position of hoping that he doesn't get claimed by another team, thereby voiding his remaining cap hit on Dallas' books.

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Old
04-12-2011, 10:59 AM
  #87
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Originally Posted by piqued View Post
Raycroft is the backup next year. That's just the way it's going to be.Going back to our earlier conversation, it seems to make more sense to throw money at a player like Laich, who is actually good and in his prime, rather than engage in these tricks with numbers or sign spares to deals they're not remotely worth.

The European free agent season hasn't started in earnest yet. There's still time to be active there and bump up the team cap hit. Though I admit I'm surprised also they couldn't land a single NCAA FA considering that was Joe's area of focus before becoming a GM.

One other concern that struck me was: what if the Rangers waive Avery and then bring him back on re-entry? He's close to wearing out his welcome there also now. We could be in the strange position of hoping that he doesn't get claimed by another team, thereby voiding his remaining cap hit on Dallas' books.
I think we're just looking at this in different ways.

I agree with you that going after a key UFA would be ideal. Laich would be at the top of my list, but as I pointed out a week or so ago, I highly doubt you're going to attract a guy like that.

There's an obvious problem with this off-season. Lack of certainty. Is Tony Tavares full of it or will Dallas have an owner by June 30th? Will that new owner be willing to increase payroll, even by another $5 million or so? Will Richards sign with Dallas?

Some people are pointing out that a point here or there, and this season is completely different. It's a positive instead of a negative. Yeah, that's correct, but this uncertainty remains regardless. The playoffs would have been great. They would have have put off the thoughts of an ugly off-season a week .. maybe more. Regardless, this off-season was always going to be difficult.

Everything I've said from the past day in a half is the belief that the sale will not get done in time for free agency. Nothing we've heard about the sale of the team has happened yet. The only thing that did happen is we found out the lenders thought they could milk the team for more money, and that's exactly what they're doing. The next belief I'm working from is that Brad Richards will not be a Dallas Star next season.

Based on those two assumptions, I don't think you can expect a potential, high profile free agent with several offers to join a team with so much uncertainty. Therefore, the stupid gimmicks that I don't want to see, like inflated ELC's and veteran one-year deals, are just something I see as inevitable.

Regarding Avery, my bigger fear would be a demotion to the minors. NY isn't a team that wastes cap space on buyouts or re-entry waivers (they do that with terrible UFA signings … ) They bury players in the minors. If that happened, $2 million opens up on Dallas' cap, but they still have to pay Avery that money. It's a nightmare I hadn't thought of, but thanks for bringing it up ….

I'd love to be completely wrong, but I'm just tired of being optimistic. Not much has gone the Stars way the last 3 seasons, and there's no legitimate indication that a sale of the team is close. I don't think it's the end of the world, I just think that we'll have to wait another season for change.

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Old
04-12-2011, 11:07 AM
  #88
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This run n' gun system we try and run just isn't working. Look at a team like the Phoenix Coyotes. They don't have the offensive talent we do, but Tippet's system worked for us and it's working for them. We don't have the payroll or D core to pull that type of system off and it's been made abundantly clear these last 2 years. Getting rid of Tippet may go down as one of the biggest mistakes in franchise history. We need more structure to our game.
Is Tippett really the answer? If you factor in Avery, the Stars and Coyotes had virtually the same level of spending this year. The Coyotes won one more game and finished with four more points and I don't think they had nearly the man games lost to injury that Dallas did.

It's fine to say that Crawford's system isn't the answer, but I don't think Tippett was consistently better when he was in Dallas or would be with the personnel the Stars have now.

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Old
04-12-2011, 11:19 AM
  #89
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so is there any chance we can get somebody in here who could actually win a fight? other than the minn debacle, that game in boston when we got our ***** whipped was the most embarrassing game i can recall.

of course, a defense would go a long ways towards being respectable...

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04-12-2011, 11:28 AM
  #90
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so is there any chance we can get somebody in here who could actually win a fight? other than the minn debacle, that game in boston when we got our ***** whipped was the most embarrassing game i can recall.

of course, a defense would go a long ways towards being respectable...
We could offer sheet Crombeen. He fights often and wins often. Wouldn't that be something.

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Old
04-12-2011, 11:33 AM
  #91
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Originally Posted by eartotheground View Post
so is there any chance we can get somebody in here who could actually win a fight? other than the minn debacle, that game in boston when we got our ***** whipped was the most embarrassing game i can recall.

of course, a defense would go a long ways towards being respectable...
With Barch under contract, I doubt they'll sign a fighter.

Your only hope is they leave a couple spots open for Texas Stars players to make the team. I know Wathier, Sawada, and Gazdic are willing to fight. Gazdic is Dallas' best pure fighter prospect, but he also probably needs to work on his overall game. He's still young. Unless you want him to turn into a version of Barch (one that at least could win fights though), he probably needs more time to work on his skating and overall game. He's still a 4th liner at the AHL level. I'd like to see him gain some more responsibility down there. Maybe he can develop a solid defensive game.

On a side note, people seem to hate Wathier for some reason. I imagine he'd get a Barch-like reputation pretty quickly on these boards. Honestly, he and Sawada are both 26 and turn 27 years old next season. They probably are what they are. Petersen was able to develop an NHL niche at an older age so there's some hope I guess.

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Old
04-12-2011, 01:09 PM
  #92
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What do you think of oleksiak?
Love him, and that's an accomplishment since I usually hate NCAA players.

He's who i think we'll go after but he's not my first choice.

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Old
04-12-2011, 01:28 PM
  #93
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Step one: Give Jamie Benn lots of roids and HGH.

Step two: Teach Vincour how to shoot.

Step three: Re-sign Richards.

Step four: Hear the lamentations of their women.

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04-12-2011, 02:26 PM
  #94
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Razor says we've probably seen Richards last game as a Dallas Star.

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Old
04-12-2011, 02:44 PM
  #95
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Being pessimistic about it might work well. Will be insanely happy if hes retained, and not very disappointed if hes not.

I can't see it happening right now with how much of a failure this team is but I'm sure if he could stay he would.

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04-12-2011, 02:52 PM
  #96
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Richards concussion cost this team dearly long term. I suspect Newy felt given what was offered he would just keep Newy and take his chances. Instead this is the worst possible scenario. This team without Brad has one good line and some decent role players but not enough, a below average defense and an average to below average goalie with a below average farm. The Texas Rangers and Jon daniels especially knew that no money means you have to build through youth. instead we sit. Newy blew it and really has not made one correct assessment since he was here from Lags, to Campbell, to richards, to Crawford, to resigning Barch and Petersen (2 goals Really) to whether we are a playoff team. Even the gogo trade is a push at best as it the Lets signing which at 3 mill was more than Niemi and others got. I give him Adam Burnish (congrats). We will be lucky to save the franchise here if this continues.

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Old
04-12-2011, 02:54 PM
  #97
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I hope you aren't calling the Lehtonen signing bad, hes a huge reason why we were even in it this year.

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04-12-2011, 03:03 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by Prophet of Glennie View Post
I hope you aren't calling the Lehtonen signing bad, hes a huge reason why we were even in it this year.
I'll interpret Starsdude speak into regular people speak:

"Even the gogo trade is a push at best"
means
it was a good trade

"as it the Lets signing"
means
I like Lehts he is a good goaltender

"I give him Adam Burnish (congrats)."
means
I heart Adam Burrish

"We will be lucky to save the franchise here if this continues. "
means
there is some work to do

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Old
04-12-2011, 03:29 PM
  #99
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If he asks for a regular sandwich, should I order him a 6 foot party sub then?

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Old
04-12-2011, 04:10 PM
  #100
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Guy Carbo, Muller, or Gully please.

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