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John Tortorella Discussion (Update: Torts extended 3 years)

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04-17-2011, 03:19 PM
  #751
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Anybody see Tort's pregame today? He said he hopes something good happens to us offensively. How does this guy still have a job in NHL? It is coach's job to figure out how his team will create offense and score goals. Any idiot can hope, hopeing is not coaching.

Can his ass after the sweep.

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04-17-2011, 06:31 PM
  #752
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Originally Posted by Rangers44 View Post
Anybody see Tort's pregame today? He said he hopes something good happens to us offensively. How does this guy still have a job in NHL? It is coach's job to figure out how his team will create offense and score goals. Any idiot can hope, hopeing is not coaching.

Can his ass after the sweep.
Have an axe to grind much? Cut through the garbage and just tell us what you really have against Tortorella. You're summing up his coaching career in one sentence? The guy COACHED in the AHL and won a Calder Cup with Rochester. He didn't will the lightning through prayer and positive thinking to a Stanley Cup victory.
So what if he says, "I hope we can score some goals (which is basically what he's saying)." Coaches say that all the time. How petty do u want to get here? In the middle of a playoff series, this is what you're concerned with?

At first (which, was many, many posts, and moons ago on this thread), you guys wanted him fired if the team can't make it to the playoffs. Now they make it, and he gets no credit (or does he?) so it's time to look for any behavior seemingly negative on Tortorella's part and point it out as if it has any significance.

On top of that, they do make the playoffs, and instead of cutting him slack, you decide to change your demands so that the odds are stacked a little bit higher against Torts. Now he must avoid a sweep! What's next? Let me guess. He must win 2 games against Washington or else he should be fired?

This is why people who support Tortorella must keep reminding fans that he's coached and won championships before. For those who are nauseated at listening to posters "constantly" point out that Tortorella coached the Lightning to a Stanley Cup, there's a purpose and a reason. People who hate him continually nit pick at whatever appears negative enough to warrant a post regarding Tortorella's inability to coach. So again, we revert to his resume. He didn't forget over night.

Not to mention your post makes little sense. All he can do is try as hard as he can to help the team score goals through coaching. After that is the hope that his players will come through. He can't coach the puck into the net.


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04-17-2011, 08:08 PM
  #753
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Ummmm...okay. You started the whole thing, chief.
I'm not your chief, buddy, and I didn't start the carrying on and nit picking the definition!

Who cares! He looked like #1 Center today, and we are all thankful.

I also will not complain today because we won a game and most everyone seemed to give full effort.
Better lines than last game too(and the sky is blue lol)

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04-17-2011, 10:54 PM
  #754
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I'm not your chief, buddy, and I didn't start the carrying on and nit picking the definition!

Who cares! He looked like #1 Center today, and we are all thankful.

I also will not complain today because we won a game and most everyone seemed to give full effort.
Better lines than last game too(and the sky is blue lol)
In the future, then, if you don't want to have a conversation about a subject then don't start talking about it. And I'm not your "buddy" either.

The team has worked hard the entire series and, FYI, Dubinsky @25+ ATOI was the number one center tonight. Not Boyle. Still, Boyle and the entire team gave a monster effort tonight. I thought they would have serious trouble after the disallowed goal but give the team, and Tortorella, credit.

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04-17-2011, 10:57 PM
  #755
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Originally Posted by Rangers44 View Post
Anybody see Tort's pregame today? He said he hopes something good happens to us offensively. How does this guy still have a job in NHL? It is coach's job to figure out how his team will create offense and score goals. Any idiot can hope, hopeing is not coaching.

Can his ass after the sweep.
I agree with the poster who commented on this - if you can't give any credit to Tortorella after a game like this then you'll be clamoring for his head even if he wins a Cup here. No clue.

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04-17-2011, 11:28 PM
  #756
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Originally Posted by haohmaru View Post
I agree with the poster who commented on this - if you can't give any credit to Tortorella after a game like this then you'll be clamoring for his head even if he wins a Cup here. No clue.
Just ignore dumb posts like that. Not even worth trying to place a counterargument.

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04-18-2011, 01:46 AM
  #757
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Well if not for Dubinsky's lucky goal we would likely have lost this game, and Caps were nowhere near as good as in the 1st 2 games.

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04-18-2011, 02:31 AM
  #758
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Torts moves Dubi to center: 1G 1A in 26 min

Great move by torts. If dubi plays like he did yesterday, this series will shift in our favor shortly.

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04-18-2011, 02:40 AM
  #759
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Originally Posted by mrjimmyg89 View Post
Torts moves Dubi to center: 1G 1A in 26 min

Great move by torts. If dubi plays like he did yesterday, this series will shift in our favor shortly.
wow really? Who moved him to wing in the first place? Tort simply got lucky this game because the Caps did not play great.

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04-18-2011, 08:49 AM
  #760
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Well if not for Dubinsky's lucky goal we would likely have lost this game, and Caps were nowhere near as good as in the 1st 2 games.
It must be tough to get any enjoyment out of the sport when you're such a miserable person.

FYI, the Caps were nowhere near as good for a reason.

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04-18-2011, 09:02 AM
  #761
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Well if not for Dubinsky's lucky goal we would likely have lost this game, and Caps were nowhere near as good as in the 1st 2 games.
I don't think Caps were much worse. Neuverth was. Lundqvist played well all 3 games, but was able to outplay Neuverth only in game 3.

Back to topic. You cannot go after coach for his expression of hope regarding goalscoring. Coach cannot control scoring. No one can. Scoring is incidental. What is not incidental are scoring chances. Scoring chances (both quantity and quality of them) is the only way to pass the judgement on coach contribution to the offense. Those come from Xs and Os and lamp oil burning. Due to general ignorance of the fans and even the media they continue to look at it as if coach was/is responsible for goals scored. Hence Torts pray for luck there.

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04-18-2011, 09:02 AM
  #762
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Originally Posted by haohmaru View Post
In the future, then, if you don't want to have a conversation about a subject then don't start talking about it. And I'm not your "buddy" either.
Don't watch South Park? You're reading into my tone wrong, that's not what I meant LOL. My fault and my apologies

Quote:
Originally Posted by haohmaru View Post
The team has worked hard the entire series and, FYI, Dubinsky @25+ ATOI was the number one center tonight. Not Boyle. Still, Boyle and the entire team gave a monster effort tonight. I thought they would have serious trouble after the disallowed goal but give the team, and Tortorella, credit.
F(everyone's)I (OK~ maybe all the slight ugly tone isn't entirely my fault...), as it's up on NHL.com for everyone to read, not discover. (Still disgree with the lack of Avery, who looked great again, but again will not complain b/c of the W)
You can judge by what you read, I'll judge by what I see. Not saying Dubinsky wasn't at the top of my list yesterday, but Boyle wasn't proving me wrong, that's for sure!
Anyway, you're right about the effort the whole series (though I never said that the effort wasn't there).
Maybe it's that they not just worked hard but looked to have direction with that effort.
Credit to Torts and all yesterday fior sure! I think everyone was worried that disallowed goal would deflate them into classic NYR helter skelter. Thank god, let's see another like it please!

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04-18-2011, 09:48 AM
  #763
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Don't get me wrong, I'm not dissing Boyle. I wish the guy nothing but (further) success - even if it's just so we get SOMETHING out of that horrific (for us) 2003 draft.

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04-18-2011, 10:24 AM
  #764
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It makes me sick that one of the bright spots of the season, Zuccarello, is singled out and made sit during the playoffs. The young talented forward who outplayed at least half the forwards in the lineup is not receiving valuable playoff experience. Tort doesn't care much for the future, this is not how you develop players.

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04-18-2011, 10:29 AM
  #765
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It makes me sick that one of the bright spots of the season, Zuccarello, is singled out and made sit during the playoffs. The young talented forward who outplayed at least half the forwards in the lineup is not receiving valuable playoff experience. Tort doesn't care much for the future, this is not how you develop players.
Zuccarello is not very good. We need to call a spade a spade here, as Torts would say.

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04-18-2011, 10:35 AM
  #766
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Zuccarello is not very good. We need to call a spade a spade here, as Torts would say.
What a bunch of BS, you just subscribe to Tort's point of view, instead of actually watching games and thinking on your own.

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04-18-2011, 10:37 AM
  #767
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What a bunch of BS, you just subscribe to Tort's point of view, instead of actually watching games and thinking on your own.
Weren't you talking "sweep" yesterday? And, are you seriously going to sit there and say that Avery, who replaced MZA, wasn't effective yesterday?

Maybe you should stop "thinking on your own". It's not working.

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04-18-2011, 10:42 AM
  #768
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What a bunch of BS, you just subscribe to Tort's point of view, instead of actually watching games and thinking on your own.
Yea, OK, why dont you put a filter on that brain of yours and stop typing whatever misguided thought that creeps into it. It would benefit this board greatly.

Im one of Torts' biggest critics here, but Im not going to attack him for not playing Zuccarello, because

1. quite frankly, Zuccarello doesnt deserve to be playing with the way his last month or so went.

2. its RIDICULOUS to accuse Torts of not subscribing to a youth movement.

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04-18-2011, 10:51 AM
  #769
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Originally Posted by Rangers44 View Post
It makes me sick that one of the bright spots of the season, Zuccarello, is singled out and made sit during the playoffs. The young talented forward who outplayed at least half the forwards in the lineup is not receiving valuable playoff experience. Tort doesn't care much for the future, this is not how you develop players.
Wow. I'm a huge Torts detractor, but you're out to lunch on this one.

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04-18-2011, 10:55 AM
  #770
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Yea, OK, why dont you put a filter on that brain of yours and stop typing whatever misguided thought that creeps into it. It would benefit this board greatly.

Im one of Torts' biggest critics here, but Im not going to attack him for not playing Zuccarello, because

1. quite frankly, Zuccarello doesnt deserve to be playing with the way his last month or so went.

2. its RIDICULOUS to accuse Torts of not subscribing to a youth movement.
If there was no salary Cap, we would never have youth movement, you are wrong thinking that Tortorella likes developing young players, he would much rather have a team full of veterans, but thanks to the Cap he is stuck with young players.

BTW I love your argument against Zuccarello, no facts, no examples, no stats to back anything up.

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04-18-2011, 10:57 AM
  #771
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Wow. I'm a huge Torts detractor, but you're out to lunch on this one.
If Tort would care about the future, he would play Zuccarello over Christensen.

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04-18-2011, 11:06 AM
  #772
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Originally Posted by Rangers44 View Post
If there was no salary Cap, we would never have youth movement, you are wrong thinking that Tortorella likes developing young players, he would much rather have a team full of veterans, but thanks to the Cap he is stuck with young players.

BTW I love your argument against Zuccarello, no facts, no examples, no stats to back anything up.
Really? WTF? Like his Cup winning TBL team?

Fedotenko 25
Richards 23
Boyle 27
Lecavalier 23
St. Louis 28
Lukowich 27
Sarich 24
Cibak 23
Roy 28
Svitov 21
Kubina 26
Dingman 27
Afanasenkov 23
Modin 29
Clymer 25
Perrin 28

Their top 5 scorers in the playoffs were 23, 28, 29, 23, and 25 years old respectively. They had a few vets sprinkled in (Andreychuk @ 40, Stillman, 30, Sydor 31 and Tim Taylor) but that's about it. Your argument about Torts and veterans is, again, without merit.

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04-18-2011, 11:31 AM
  #773
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If there was no salary Cap, we would never have youth movement, you are wrong thinking that Tortorella likes developing young players, he would much rather have a team full of veterans, but thanks to the Cap he is stuck with young players.

BTW I love your argument against Zuccarello, no facts, no examples, no stats to back anything up.
What's wrong with that? You typically win championships (you know-the whole point of professional sports) with a seasoned line-up. Torts and every other coach knows this.

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04-18-2011, 11:45 AM
  #774
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If Tort would care about the future, he would play Zuccarello over Christensen.
Building towards the future is only part of Torts' job. The other part is winning games now. If Christensen does a better job helping us win these playoff games, then he should be playing. Christensen and Zuccarello have been about even in terms of production over the past month and a half, so Torts will just ride the hot hand. Zucca was awful in his first game, and Christensen has been better.

But that's beside the real point... Torts doesn't care about the future? Why, then, is he giving big minutes to Sauer and McDonagh? He could easily be giving those minutes to McCabe and Eminger, two veteran players. Why do Stepan and Anisimov average over 16 minutes? Why did he help turn Brian Boyle into a valuable player, rather than scratching him early on and letting him fade into oblivion? Why does he insist on playing the young Matt Gilroy?

There are a lot of things you can fault Torts for, I think, but not buying into youth development is just absurd. Torts won with youth in TB, and is trying to do the same here. Stop making me defend him...

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04-18-2011, 11:49 AM
  #775
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rangers44 View Post
If there was no salary Cap, we would never have youth movement, you are wrong thinking that Tortorella likes developing young players, he would much rather have a team full of veterans, but thanks to the Cap he is stuck with young players.

BTW I love your argument against Zuccarello, no facts, no examples, no stats to back anything up.
Why don't you provide us with some facts, examples and stats to support Zucca over Christensen? I mean, you're the one in conniptions over this, it's on you to make the argument.

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