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Carle is a huge plus for Flyers

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Old
04-20-2011, 05:51 PM
  #26
DrHamburg
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he gets killed on here way more than he should. With that being said he is very good offensively I feel but the problem is while everyone makes bad decisions on the ice, when he makes a bad one its REALLy bad. But he is a solid defenseman that i want on my team and shouldn't be traded away just to trade him away as people think.

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Old
04-20-2011, 05:52 PM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DenverBoone View Post
Whatever bias I may have isn't relevant to what we are talking about here- which is the conventional wisdom that coaches are predisposed to lying to media if it's expedient.
So, people don't lie to the media?

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04-20-2011, 06:04 PM
  #28
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I thought this said Carter for a second. I almost flipped.

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04-20-2011, 06:07 PM
  #29
Terence Peterman
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Originally Posted by DenverBoone View Post
Whatever bias I may have isn't relevant to what we are talking about here- which is the conventional wisdom that coaches are predisposed to lying to media if it's expedient.
I don't know if I'd call it conventional wisdom...and it's not particular to coaches. It's what people do. Haven't you ever watched House?

Edit: I don't see how you can think your bias doesn't matter here. You're going to bat for Carle, in a Carle thread, refuting a legitimate thought that maybe, just maybe, coaches aren't always the best guys to ask about how good a player on their team is.


Last edited by Terence Peterman: 04-20-2011 at 06:13 PM.
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Old
04-20-2011, 06:18 PM
  #30
Bort Sampson
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He's good for what he is, and I'm really critical of the guy. He's decent all-around, though he definitely lacks any physicality in his own zone. With that said, it's not his strong suit, and he plays to his strengths. He's a very good offensive option for the Flyers, which is undeniable considering the ways he's already delivered for the team. He still has brain farts, but most players do. His are a bit more apparent because he's one of the primary puck movers on the team.

Pronger coming back will take a lot of Carle's mistakes away, as well as the effectiveness of the opposition forecheck (Ruff currently has the Sabres running Carle and Syvret after dump-ins).

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04-20-2011, 10:14 PM
  #31
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I find it hysterical to read the people who have to hold their nose to give Carle any sort of the praise he is due critique someone else for bias. Hypocrisy, **** Yeah!

"How can you prove he is not lying!"

Really? How can you prove he is lying? It's a stalemate.

I think it is pretty clear how much the coaching staff believes in Matt Carle, given prior comments and how much icetime he gets. They're certainly not displeased with him, that's for sure.

Carle is a MUCH, MUCH, MUCH better defenseman than pretty much anyone around these parts gives him credit for.

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04-20-2011, 11:32 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mja View Post
I find it hysterical to read the people who have to hold their nose to give Carle any sort of the praise he is due critique someone else for bias. Hypocrisy, **** Yeah!

"How can you prove he is not lying!"

Really? How can you prove he is lying? It's a stalemate.

I think it is pretty clear how much the coaching staff believes in Matt Carle, given prior comments and how much icetime he gets. They're certainly not displeased with him, that's for sure.

Carle is a MUCH, MUCH, MUCH better defenseman than pretty much anyone around these parts gives him credit for.
Yeah I know, he is easily our third best D-man on this Flyer team behind Pronger and Kimmo. He just isn't as flashy as Mez and Coburn.

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Old
04-21-2011, 12:33 AM
  #33
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I think some people don't want to praise Carle because it would mean they couldn't complain anymore about the manner in which Holmgren acquired him. Pronger is just a cover excuse, for them.

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Old
04-21-2011, 01:12 AM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson 514 View Post
Similarly, do you still leave cookies out for Santa Claus?
YESSSSSSSSS!!!!!

His mistakes are glaring. His good plays often go unnoticed. That's why i feel like he has a negative rep. I admit that I captain the Matt Carle hate-wagon during the playoffs. I've already seen a handful of bonehead plays by Carle in the 4 playoff games. Sometimes he seems too calm and careful rather than focused and thorough (ie Pronger/Timonen)

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Old
04-21-2011, 08:03 AM
  #35
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Carle has played well.

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Old
04-21-2011, 09:23 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Spongolium View Post
To be fair to mr Carle, He had to DEAL with pronger on one leg, it was not Pronger carrying Carle. Carle started the season off great without Pronger. Pronger was absolutly terrible for about 3 weeks.
Pronger struggled with the knee when he first came back... and then turned on the beast mode. He finished at a 2.28 GAON/60, which is behind only OD and Meszaros, who both drew easy defensive shifts for this team. What is remarkable about that is that you are right, he struggled at first and that number was rather high for him. It plummeted after that.

Carle's GAON/60 was brutal until Pronger's game came around. Carle was actually much better during the current Pronger absence than he was early in the year...

Quote:
Originally Posted by DenverBoone View Post
Carle had a major brain fart with the cross ice pass last game, but otherwise did really well with syvret as his partner. Coburn has had the luxury of playing with Kimmo all year, yet Carle has been better than Coburn on many statistical levels with the revolving door of Mez, Walker, Pronger, Gus and Syvret as his partner.
Pronger played 50 games this year... it wasn't that much of a revolving door.

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Old
04-21-2011, 09:26 AM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sobrien View Post
YESSSSSSSSS!!!!!

His mistakes are glaring. His good plays often go unnoticed. That's why i feel like he has a negative rep. I admit that I captain the Matt Carle hate-wagon during the playoffs. I've already seen a handful of bonehead plays by Carle in the 4 playoff games. Sometimes he seems too calm and careful rather than focused and thorough (ie Pronger/Timonen)
He had 39 assists this year... the majority of 'em at even strength. It's also been noted all year that he created a great deal of offense. To suggest his good plays don't get noticed is a bit silly.

At the same time, he's a turnover machine ... as is Coburn, which is why the two of 'em take heat. OD is pretty bad too, but he's clearly a 3rd pairing guy and that goes with the territory.

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Old
04-21-2011, 09:47 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by JXC View Post
Carle has played well.
Really, I thought he has been average at best. Turnover after turnover, avoiding hits at all costs causing Buff offensive zone time, For 3 + mill a year and Pronger out, he needs to be ALOT better imo.

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Old
04-21-2011, 09:52 AM
  #39
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Carle remains what he's always been....good as an offensive defenseman, but a liability in his own zone.

He makes some great plays defensively on occasion, and usually follows it up with 5 really dumb moves or soft turnovers.

Right now, I'm glad we have him and I think he's done well, if you have a reasonable understanding of his abilities. He's still weak in his own zone and he may always be. I think he's a good piece to have in the fold on this team right now, but that doesn't mean he's integral. Right now if I have to name one defenseman to hang onto not named Timonen or Pronger from this squad, it's probably Meszaros.

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Old
04-21-2011, 10:19 AM
  #40
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I'm not a huge Carle fan but he's the kind of player that once gone you kind of realize he was more an asset than a liability although his lapses are frustrating especially in a close series where he's on the ice for both of the goals in the 1-0 losses.

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04-21-2011, 10:26 AM
  #41
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Originally Posted by DrDoom View Post
I'm not a huge Carle fan but he's the kind of player that once gone you kind of realize he was more an asset than a liability although his lapses are frustrating especially in a close series where he's on the ice for both of the goals in the 1-0 losses.
Wasn't Carle's fault last night, though you'd like him to have intercepted/blocked the crossing pass.

Z coasting in to get a better view of the goal as it was scored was cute. I don't know if Z would have gotten there, but that was a CLEAR example of the problem with him defensively. Put Hartnell out there and the net ends up off the moorings.

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Old
04-21-2011, 10:28 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Wasn't Carle's fault last night, though you'd like him to have intercepted/blocked the crossing pass.

Z coasting in to get a better view of the goal as it was scored was cute. I don't know if Z would have gotten there, but that was a CLEAR example of the problem with him defensively. Put Hartnell out there and the net ends up off the moorings.
While Carle had no support, you'd like to see him make a decision to either go after the shooter or the pass, he didn't really cover either that well.

I'm not blaming him; the problem on that goal occurred away from Carle, who was at least where he should have been on the ice. I just think his lack of a strong decision is kind of indicative of Carle's game in his own zone: often times he's just not sure what the correct move is.

Seeing Zherdev half-ass his way back really did burn, though. Perfectly demonstrates his compete defensively.

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Old
04-21-2011, 10:31 AM
  #43
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Originally Posted by infidelappel View Post
While Carle had no support, you'd like to see him make a decision to either go after the shooter or the pass, he didn't really cover either that well.

I'm not blaming him; the problem on that goal occurred away from Carle, who was at least where he should have been on the ice. I just think his lack of a strong decision is kind of indicative of Carle's game in his own zone: often times he's just not sure what the correct move is.

Seeing Zherdev half-ass his way back really did burn, though. Perfectly demonstrates his compete defensively.
The play jumped on Carle quickly, though. Tough spot for the defender. Giroux jumped out on the puck, but it got past him making it a 3 on 2 down low, Syvret then went to the puck (in retrospect we probably would have been better off if he'd stayed in the shell a bit more and just covered the front of the net) and the puck got past him creating a quick 2 on 1...

What I guarantee you the coaches are going to breakdown is that Z should have read the play defensively and been crashing down to neutralize the odd-man situation down low on the backside with the other two forwards high...

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Old
04-21-2011, 10:33 AM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Z coasting in to get a better view of the goal as it was scored was cute. I don't know if Z would have gotten there, but that was a CLEAR example of the problem with him defensively. Put Hartnell out there and the net ends up off the moorings.
OMG Z plays no D? What's new.....

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Old
04-21-2011, 11:58 AM
  #45
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
The play jumped on Carle quickly, though. Tough spot for the defender. Giroux jumped out on the puck, but it got past him making it a 3 on 2 down low, Syvret then went to the puck (in retrospect we probably would have been better off if he'd stayed in the shell a bit more and just covered the front of the net) and the puck got past him creating a quick 2 on 1...

What I guarantee you the coaches are going to breakdown is that Z should have read the play defensively and been crashing down to neutralize the odd-man situation down low on the backside with the other two forwards high...
Yeah, it's a tough spot to be in, but you still have to decide to go somewhere. Bear in mind, I'm not blaming Carle; a bunch of people botched their assignments way more than he did before it even got there. G doesn't need to finish the hit there, Syvret should have stayed to the slot, and Zherdev was obviously in no man's land. But Carle still isn't a saint.

That play was a collapse all over the ice.

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Old
04-22-2011, 11:18 PM
  #46
GKJ
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Big -2 for Carle in the biggest game of the year, which includes him being a big goat on the game-winning goal. The Carle rationalists around here were right when we said that he was probably going to be on the ice and make a big blunder to really kill this team, and tonight it happened.

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Old
04-22-2011, 11:40 PM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson 514 View Post
Big -2 for Carle in the biggest game of the year, which includes him being a big goat on the game-winning goal. The Carle rationalists around here were right when we said that he was probably going to be on the ice and make a big blunder to really kill this team, and tonight it happened.
I knew it was over as soon as he threw that puck away. Of course, Leighton helped make sure I was right too, but ugh.

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Old
04-23-2011, 12:07 AM
  #48
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I like Carle, but he has to go next year to free up cap to get a goalie. He's a puck mover who obviously isn't helping **** on the pp, and if the choice is between him and Coburn, I'd rather keep the guy who has consistently stepped up his game in the playoffs since 07/08

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Old
04-23-2011, 12:21 AM
  #49
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Carle would rather bang 800 diseased women before he took a shot on goal. **** you, Matt Carle.... **** you.

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Old
05-06-2011, 11:23 PM
  #50
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Looks more like a huge MINUS to me.....


-8 for the playoffs

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