HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Notices

Dan Girardi

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
04-21-2011, 10:52 PM
  #51
SupersonicMonkey*
DROP THE PUCK
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: USA
Country: United States
Posts: 15,193
vCash: 500
I didn't suggest a 5 forward Power Play unit. I suggested the QB be a forward.

Del Zotto will be back in the NHL. McDonagh will continue to improve.

Our defense is not the issue.

The main issue is the Power Play.

The outlet pass is not as prevelant an issue as you're making it out to be. These guys aren't completely incapable of passing the puck. And realistically you are not going to get an elite puck moving defenseman that's reliable defensively as well on every pair. They're at a premium and cost more then we can afford.

Again, our top four can go against any team in the league.

Our Power Play is what needs to be fixed first and foremost.

SupersonicMonkey* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-21-2011, 10:59 PM
  #52
JeffMangum
A Love Supreme
 
JeffMangum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Listening to music
Country: United States
Posts: 54,532
vCash: 300
Quote:
Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
I didn't suggest a 5 forward Power Play unit. I suggested the QB be a forward.

Del Zotto will be back in the NHL. McDonagh will continue to improve.
McDonagh and Del Zotto are the only two defenseman I see potentially becoming capable of manning a #1 powerplay unit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
Our defense is not the issue.

The main issue is the Power Play.
You are correct. Offense from the defense is an issue, though. The powerplay could be helped by adding a defenseman that can start the rush, and make crisp passes from the blueline, as well as walk the line, and take smart shots. We have no one doing this on our blueline.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
The outlet pass is not as prevelant an issue as you're making it out to be. These guys aren't completely incapable of passing the puck. And realistically you are not going to get an elite puck moving defenseman that's reliable defensively as well on every pair. They're at a premium and cost more then we can afford.
It actually is. This team will be nothing more than a pretender until they figure out two things:

1. The powerplay
2. The breakout

Adding a top notch offensive defender helps with that, which none of the current top 4 defenseman are. And, again, as I said 3 times, Ryan Suter or Brent Burns. Both are top-15 two-way defenseman that are UFAs at the end of 2011-2012. I see Burns being available, especially if the Wild suck it up again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
Again, our top four can go against any team in the league.

Our Power Play is what needs to be fixed first and foremost
If you're talking strictly defense, sure. Otherwise, they can't, because the offense just isn't there.

__________________

#TannerGlass2014
SEEN YOUR VIDEO!
#SheWentToHarvard
JeffMangum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 12:16 AM
  #53
satrabyk
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,865
vCash: 500
No hes not the best Defensive D man in the league. Yes he blocks shots and sacrafices his body but he does struggle in other areas. Shot blocking isnt everything, there is a lot that makes a Number 1 defensive D man. Hes not strong enough, gets pushed of the puck to often, and he struggles with bouncing pucks far to often at the other team blue line. I would still take Stall and Sauer at this point going forward but having Girardi is still great to depth but lets not go overboard. You must be listening to Mcguire to often lol.

satrabyk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 12:21 AM
  #54
satrabyk
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,865
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Mastrosimone View Post
McDonagh and Del Zotto are the only two defenseman I see potentially becoming capable of manning a #1 powerplay unit.



You are correct. Offense from the defense is an issue, though. The powerplay could be helped by adding a defenseman that can start the rush, and make crisp passes from the blueline, as well as walk the line, and take smart shots. We have no one doing this on our blueline.



It actually is. This team will be nothing more than a pretender until they figure out two things:

1. The powerplay
2. The breakout

Adding a top notch offensive defender helps with that, which none of the current top 4 defenseman are. And, again, as I said 3 times, Ryan Suter or Brent Burns. Both are top-15 two-way defenseman that are UFAs at the end of 2011-2012. I see Burns being available, especially if the Wild suck it up again.



If you're talking strictly defense, sure. Otherwise, they can't, because the offense just isn't there.
You have valid points but this team can have the best 6 D man in the league, with the forwards up front they are going nowhere. Lets fix the Offense as this is a must. Christ out, W2 out, Prospal out, Drury out, and Gaboirk possibly replaced via trade. The offense needs a total change for next season, the D with the exception of 1 guy either within or via free agent is pretty solid.

satrabyk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 12:28 AM
  #55
satrabyk
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,865
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBlueMercow View Post
My thoughts exactly. He blocks so many shots, but I feel like those shots can be prevented in the first place. Not sure if it's his fault or the Offense's but he really shouldn't have to block that many in a game.
Hes not exactly a very technically sound D man as is are most of our team but they find a way to get the job done. The main thing is also these days the difference between a top defendor and the bottom is minimal as it is in goaltending, so its not like the OP is way off in his statements. I mean Stall was in my book one of the best but since the injury he suffered before the playoffs, now has been nothing more than average.

satrabyk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 02:29 AM
  #56
Bluenote13
Believe In Henke
 
Bluenote13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: BKLYN, NYC
Posts: 23,632
vCash: 500
Staal has been average?

Girardi's shutdown defense is overrated cause all he does is block shots?

Man, what the hell are some of you watching this whole season?

Both have been Bulls this year, solid as any top pairing in the league most nights. Appreciated players but taken for granted at time by fans. A symptom of Sather's mediocre squads.

Bluenote13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 03:20 AM
  #57
eco's bones
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Elmira NY
Country: United States
Posts: 12,224
vCash: 500
I would expect Burns to stay in Minnesota. But who knows maybe Gaborik could bend his ear.

Despite whatever happens on Saturday I expect the Rangers to improve next year. We have 4 solid young defensemen. If MDZ can get some offensive confidence back we're in a position where we can play to his strengths and limit his even strength time. I think the Rangers might think about bringing in a solid physical vet and leave the last spot for Gilroy/Valentenko/Kundratek.

PWP should improve if 1) Richards signs 2) Gaborik starts scoring again 3) MDZ gets his act together. Staal and Girardi are good enough to add some secondary scoring from the D.

eco's bones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 03:21 AM
  #58
Screw You Rick Nash
🚨🚨🚨🚨🚨🚨🚨🚨
 
Screw You Rick Nash's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Brooklyn, New NY
Country: United States
Posts: 27,212
vCash: 3000
Why wasn't Girardi drafted?

__________________
++++++++++[>+++++++>++++++++++>+++>+<<<<
-]>++++++.>+.+++++++++++++++.>+++++++++.<-.
>-------.<<-----.>----.>.<<+++++++++++.>-------------
-.+++++++++++++.-------.--.+++++++++++++.+.>+.>.

New and improved Hockey Standings
"A jimmie for a jimmie makes the whole world rustled." -31-
Screw You Rick Nash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 05:43 AM
  #59
Levitate
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 20,422
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecemleafs View Post
blocking shots does not make u the best defensive dman in the league.
Well it got people to think that Volchenkov was the best defensive defenseman in the league.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bumrusherer View Post
True warrior...It will be interesting to see how he plays next season though. Can he be expected to achieve the same amount of success next season? Surely his body wont be able to take the same beating.
Why not? He only missed two games this year and there will be plenty of time to heal between now and next season. He's still young...he'll be back 100% and ready to block more shots next year.

As long as he's not breaking things blocking these shots then I don't think there's that much wear and tear from season to season...from season start to season end, yes, but not between seasons.

Quote:
Originally Posted by genericnyrusername View Post
When is the last time you've even seen Girardi without Staal? With all the hate that came his way before this year it seems like the first step those people are taking is, yeah he's alright I guess. Skip that step and assess how he's actually been. Kid's a stud defensive Dman.

Sorry if it came across like I'm killing your comment because most of it is very flattering towards Girardi, the first part just bothered me and led me into how some people can't just accept the guy yet.
Staal has been out a couple of times with injury and Girardi struggled without him. He looks like he tried to do too much and continually was getting caught pinching or being wayyyy too down low in the offensive zone, etc. It'd be kind of interesting to see how he'd even out his game if Staal was out for a long time, but from what we've seen, he has struggled the few times he hasn't been out there with Staal this season. I don't think he'd continually struggle though if it was long term, I think he'd settle down, but just wouldn't be quite as effective


and without jumping too far into this...the breakout isn't nearly as big a problem as getting through the neutral zone is, and unless you think that defensemen should be sending long stretch passes through the neutral zone with a high rate of success every single time, then a lo of that falls on the forwards to accomplish, not the defensemen.

The breakout is alright, at least definitely better than it was under Renney. Getting to the good side of the red line is more of a problem.

Levitate is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 08:33 AM
  #60
Jersey Girl
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 3,865
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Mastrosimone View Post
Wait...what? Montador? As in Steve Montador? Up there with Weber, Seabrook, Staal, Keith, Orpik, and Martin?
Yeah, this is what happens when someone asks for a list, and it's provided...somebody tries to zero in on one guy to make the whole list sound defective. Which is probably why a list was asked for in the first place. Ok, forget Montador, the point is not about debating Steve Montador.

The point I challenged is that someone said Girardi is the best defensive d-man in the league. In a league with Chara, Pronger, Weber, Seabrook and Lidstrom, that's a false statement.

And my overall point is that I like Girardi a LOT. Just because I don't think he's the absolute best doesn't mean I don't want him on my team.


Last edited by Jersey Girl: 04-22-2011 at 08:40 AM.
Jersey Girl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 08:51 AM
  #61
Levitate
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 20,422
vCash: 500
I'd put Girardi on par with most of those guys...where they have him beat is usually in other areas that aren't strictly defensive but add something else to their game. Chara and his size/hitting/slapshot, Orpik and his hitting, Martin and his skating, Keith and his offense, etc.

Strictly defensively, Girardi isn't so far off when he's on his game. It's just that other players bring a little extra beyond that strict defensive ability (and it's why I consider Staal a better defensive defenseman...Staal brings a better awareness in the defensive zone, better puck control, moves the puck better in the defensive zone, etc)

But straight up stopping guys and negating scoring chances? Girardi is good enough to rank up there in the league

Levitate is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 09:17 AM
  #62
RangerBoy
1994 FOREVER
 
RangerBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 31,472
vCash: 500
Minnesota will probably look into trading Burns this summer for a top line forward. His agent Ron Salcer is a pain in the ass and Burns is going to UFA next summer. Burns is so overrated and inconsistent. Burns wants $5M plus. Rangers should not look into adding major money on D. People here become obsessed with players they barely watch.

RangerBoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 09:19 AM
  #63
Darrelle Lundqvist
Swagelin
 
Darrelle Lundqvist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 1,781
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kaneone View Post
Why wasn't Girardi drafted?
Yeah, I can't believe that either, same with Dan Boyle.

Darrelle Lundqvist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 09:28 AM
  #64
NYR Sting
Heart and Soul
 
NYR Sting's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 9,506
vCash: 500
Girardi is a great second pairing defenseman. The thing is, this team already has two great second-pairing defensemen and they are just rookies. What they need is to improve their first pair, and in my book, that means upgrading on Dan Girardi.

I don't know if Brent Burns is the right target there, but something has to be done. You need to have a better puck distributor on the back end, not just up front.

NYR Sting is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 11:11 AM
  #65
Mio41
Ron Harris #3
 
Mio41's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Long Island
Country: United States
Posts: 2,425
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jersey Girl View Post
In a league with Chara, Pronger, Weber, Seabrook and Lidstrom, that's a false statement.
Defensively better than all except Chara...I said defensively...also people that think the only thing he does is block shots don't know anything about hockey, he does all the little things right...

Mio41 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 11:12 AM
  #66
Mio41
Ron Harris #3
 
Mio41's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Long Island
Country: United States
Posts: 2,425
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
Girardi is a great second pairing defenseman.
You watch Ranger games? He plays 30 minutes a night against the best forwards in the league and has kept Ovechkin in check this whole series...

Mio41 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 11:36 AM
  #67
OverTheCap
Registered User
 
OverTheCap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 9,597
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
Girardi is a great second pairing defenseman. The thing is, this team already has two great second-pairing defensemen and they are just rookies. What they need is to improve their first pair, and in my book, that means upgrading on Dan Girardi.

I don't know if Brent Burns is the right target there, but something has to be done. You need to have a better puck distributor on the back end, not just up front.
Totally agree.

I've said it before and I'll say it again: The Rangers won't come close to competing for a cup if they don't have a puck-moving defensemen in their top 4, let alone the top pairing. All the recent cup winners have had a PMD on their top pairing and it is an absolutely essential piece to winning a cup. I look at what Duncan Keith and Drew Doughty have done in this playoffs thus far, and that's exactly what this team is missing on the top pair.

This is not a knock on Girardi at all, he's been great this year. It's more of an issue of how our defense is structured. I think a lot of people are content with having Staal-Girardi and McDonagh-Sauer as the top 4 for the future, but if we can't get a PMD in there somewhere, we're screwed.

OverTheCap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 11:42 AM
  #68
Bluenote13
Believe In Henke
 
Bluenote13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: BKLYN, NYC
Posts: 23,632
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kaneone View Post
Why wasn't Girardi drafted?

Cause much like this thread, people are constantly looking at players to bring one glaring obvious trait that we can all hang our hat on. With Girardi its never been a wow factor, the guy just gets the job done. I hate our current ownership and Sather regime but with Girardi they struck gold ! A minute eater on defense that was acquired for nothing and brought along with patience. That's my kind of managing.

Is he hitting people through the boards? No. Is he making amazing offensive plays. Not quite. He's a guy that frustrates offensive players with sound defense, tough as nails resilience and confidence, which ultimately wins championships. Kevin Lowe says hi

Bluenote13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 11:49 AM
  #69
wolfgaze
Interesting Cat
 
wolfgaze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 12,047
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Mastrosimone View Post
McDonagh and Girardi looked pretty terrible together, so that's why I moved him down.
Very limited sample size. Takes time to develop chemistry.

wolfgaze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 11:51 AM
  #70
Darrelle Lundqvist
Swagelin
 
Darrelle Lundqvist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 1,781
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
Girardi is a great second pairing defenseman. The thing is, this team already has two great second-pairing defensemen and they are just rookies. What they need is to improve their first pair, and in my book, that means upgrading on Dan Girardi.

I don't know if Brent Burns is the right target there, but something has to be done. You need to have a better puck distributor on the back end, not just up front.
?????

Darrelle Lundqvist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 11:53 AM
  #71
Bluenote13
Believe In Henke
 
Bluenote13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: BKLYN, NYC
Posts: 23,632
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by OverTheCap View Post
I look at what Duncan Keith and Drew Doughty have done
Then we should just go to the Keith/Doughty tree and pick one up, that simple !

I agree the PP needs someone at the point, but the team needs puck carriers and distributors everywhere, but most importantly upfront. We have relatively no one keeping the puck on his stick for more than 4 seconds. The breakout passes have been fine, like Lev said, its the neutralzone they can't seem to handle. They treat the puck like a grenade, or maybe that's just Torts brilliant plan, either way its not very good.

Bluenote13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 12:02 PM
  #72
Ke11y96
Registered User
 
Ke11y96's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 468
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by OverTheCap View Post
Totally agree.

I've said it before and I'll say it again: The Rangers won't come close to competing for a cup if they don't have a puck-moving defensemen in their top 4, let alone the top pairing. All the recent cup winners have had a PMD on their top pairing and it is an absolutely essential piece to winning a cup. I look at what Duncan Keith and Drew Doughty have done in this playoffs thus far, and that's exactly what this team is missing on the top pair.

This is not a knock on Girardi at all, he's been great this year. It's more of an issue of how our defense is structured. I think a lot of people are content with having Staal-Girardi and McDonagh-Sauer as the top 4 for the future, but if we can't get a PMD in there somewhere, we're screwed.
See I think Staal can become one of these guys, his offense is coming along and frankly if you look at the growth of a guy like Keith for example his first 3 years in the league he was a 20-30 pt dman hardly a norris trophy winner..

You need a good offense and I think Staal and Girardi clear the puck and move it very efficiently..This was year 4 for Staal and only until Torts got here was the organization pushing him to become more offensive..With some more high end offensive talent upfront Staal given the minutes he plays could easily hit 10 goals and 35 assists...This year 45 points ties him with Keith and right there with Burns, Karlson ect..

Its a style of play but more than anything its a particular batch of forwards the do the job for you..Why wasn't Mike Green a ppg d man this year? they changed their style of play and he has tremendous scoring forwards! Keith dropped 20 points maybe it has something to do with no byfuglien, Ladd, Versteeg banging in his point shots...Great offensive defenseman generally have great depth and scoring forwards..Plus they're given the green light to go-go-go..Staal not only is the best shut down dman we have but is still learning the #1 Defenseman role and at 24 is doing just fine...

Ke11y96 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 12:16 PM
  #73
JeffMangum
A Love Supreme
 
JeffMangum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Listening to music
Country: United States
Posts: 54,532
vCash: 300
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
Minnesota will probably look into trading Burns this summer for a top line forward. His agent Ron Salcer is a pain in the ass and Burns is going to UFA next summer. Burns is so overrated and inconsistent. Burns wants $5M plus. Rangers should not look into adding major money on D. People here become obsessed with players they barely watch.
Nice assumption. No, he's not "overrated". Yeah, he is inconsistent, but he's still much better than Girardi offensively. Hell, he's better than anyone on the team offensively, 6'5, can quarterback a powerplay, put up 45+ points and 15+ goals, pretty much everything. He's much more than adequate defensively, as well. I know you're busy with you cap numbers, but come on. Every time someone mentions a player you don't like, all you do is talk about salary and give no reasons as to why they're "overrated".

JeffMangum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 12:19 PM
  #74
msv957
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,044
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
We do not need to upgrade Dan Girardi... who lead the league in blocked shots, logs nearly 30 minutes, and put up 30 points.

What upgrade is there realistically?
I think fans want an upgrade over Girardi because he is not a shiny first round pick!

He is an undrafted free agent who made the NHL through sheer determination. Nothing was given to him. What is not to like about a player like this.

As you mentioned, there is not much more of an upgrade to Girardi. He is a heck of a defensive defenseman who puts up 30 points.

msv957 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-22-2011, 12:23 PM
  #75
E Nixson
Powered by Intel
 
E Nixson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 878
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by msv957 View Post
I think fans want an upgrade over Girardi because he is not a shiny first round pick!

He is an undrafted free agent who made the NHL through sheer determination. Nothing was given to him. What is not to like about a player like this.

As you mentioned, there is not much more of an upgrade to Girardi. He is a heck of a defensive defenseman who puts up 30 points.
He's also said he wants to be a Ranger for his career.

E Nixson is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:43 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.