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Old
10-13-2003, 11:20 AM
  #26
Munchausen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jl.roberts
Aside from the Ribs line, Bulis, Ryder ( so far ), and Koivu are the only other players who can consistently contribute offensively.
I think we have to be careful about Ryder's production. Yes he brings his "A" game every night and will work relentlessly for 60 minutes but that does not mean he'll contribute "consistenly" on the score board in his 1st NHL season, even if it is spent (not likely) playing on the 1st line with Koivu all year long.

I like Ryder to death and am his biggest fan but I don't count on him to produce like a top-6 should, scoring around 20-25 goals, in his first season. If he does, it'll be a pleasant surprise that could be rewarded with the Calder but I'm not expecting anything close. If indeed he plays top-2 line, it'll be for his physical contribution first and foremost, in front of the net and in the corners. 15 goals is realistic for him this year IMO.

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10-13-2003, 11:38 AM
  #27
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Jan Bulis-Saku Koivu-Richard Zednik
Marcel Hossa-Mike Ribeiro-Jason Ward(GIVE this guy a chance PLEASE!!)
Niklas Sundstrom-Yanic Perreault-Michael Ryder
Andreas Dackell-Steve Begin-Daren Langdon



BTW: 300th POST

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Old
10-13-2003, 11:43 AM
  #28
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Koivu won't face Caps:

http://rds.ca/cgi-bin/nouvelles?site...t=LNHCAN#89708


this appears to be reporting that Julien will leave the line-up as it is (or is it suggesting that he should?)

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Old
10-13-2003, 12:20 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Plekanec

My lines would be:

Ryder - Koivu - Ward

Hossa - Ribeiro - Zednik

Bulis - Juneau - Sundstrom or Dackell

Dwyer - Begin - Langdon

Scratch, dealt or buy out: Sundstrom or Dackell, Perreault, Audette
I agree with these lines. Audette doesn't deserve or belong to the first line anymore, and I think it's a good idea to give Ward an opportunity to see what he can do...If Ward doesn't work out then I guess we have to default Bulis.

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Old
10-13-2003, 12:26 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dynasty
I agree with these lines. Audette doesn't deserve or belong to the first line anymore, and I think it's a good idea to give Ward an opportunity to see what he can do...If Ward doesn't work out then I guess we have to default Bulis.

Audette still needs some time on the 1st, IMO. He's working hard - really is - and I think it's a question of time until he starts producing. Then, we can dump him for a 4th.

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Old
10-13-2003, 02:28 PM
  #31
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I think that the Hossa-Ribeiro-Zednik is a lock for the second line (when Saku will be back)

Bulis-Koivu-Audette
Hossa-Ribeiro-Zednik
Sundstrom/Perreault(faceoffs)-Juneau-Ryder
Langdon/Dackell/Bégin/Dwyer-Ward

 
Old
10-13-2003, 03:56 PM
  #32
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healthy

That would be a dream comes true if all the line-up will be healthy.

if this happen, my lines are:

Bulis - Koivu - Ryder

Hossa - Ribeiro - Zednick (can't change this line)

Juneau - Perreault - Ward

Langdon - Bégin - Dackell / Sundstrom

Subs : Dackell / Sundstrom, Audette

Hamilton wyer, Higgins

Markov- Rivet

Hainsey - Quintal

Souray - Brisebois

Subs : Bouillon

Hamilton : Komisarek

I'd like to see a trade that open holes for ward and komi.

Audette, Juneau, perreault rivet Brisebois are assurely on the trade block

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Old
10-13-2003, 04:53 PM
  #33
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Ward is not a first line player. I liked him and Higgins out there on the 4th line.

I'd prefer to have Sundstrom in the lineup instead of Dackell and I would keep Bulis on that line too because he can play with two playmakers. He's too predictable and has no change of pace to play on a scoring line.

Audette needs Koivu.

Ryder should stay on a scoring line if he keeps scoring, which I don't think he will. But leave him there for 20 games if he shows promise, don't yo yo him.

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Old
10-13-2003, 06:05 PM
  #34
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If we were living in an ideal world and there were no salary constraints my line up would be the following :

Sundstrom - Koivu - Ryder (Sundstrom has played with guys like Naslund, Forsberg and Gretzky, maybe he can rejuvanate his career on a scoring line with Koivu by doing the defensive work and a little offensive contribution, Ryder would wield the gun with Koivu carrying the ammo behind him. A first line LW with a lot of speed, sniper skills and some defensive awareness would be welcome so Sundstrom could replace Dacks on the third line. But we gotta work with what we have...)

Hossa - Ribeiro - Zednik (Looks like a proven formula)

Bulis - Juneau - Dackell (It's now obvious Juneau and Dacks need Bulis speed and energy to be effective as a line. They can be a nice shutdown line because they show up every night skate hard and position themselves well. I also think that in a perfect world Bulis would be a 3rd line winger for us and I really hope he stays with the habs for a long time doing exactly that so why not start grooming him now as our 3rd line defensive LW)

Bégin - Kilger - Ward (Finaly a real 4th line with size and grit. Ward is not the fastest skater out there but he has a lot of heart and he works hard. We need guys like him on our 4th line. We should forget about his 1st or 2nd line potential of 4 years ago for the time being. He really needs a fast skater on his line and this guy is Kilger. While Bégin can bring energy or just sit in favor of Langdon when we need more robustesse)

I'd be saying good bye to Audette and Perreault. By either buying them out or trading them. Perreault should be pretty easy to trade for a 3rd or 4th rounder while Audette would have to be bought out. I can already hear some of you say : but what if Koivu gets injured again ? We can always call up Plekanec or Higgins. Both of them should improve all season long.

So now we can carry our 2 extra D (Bouillon and Komisarek) + our tough guy Langdon. With him and Bégin switching depending on the opposition. I really think we should keep Komo with the big team. What he has to work on is his speed of execution IMO and that is something that will be hard to work on in the AHL.

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Old
10-13-2003, 06:17 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Munchausen
I think we have to be careful about Ryder's production. Yes he brings his "A" game every night and will work relentlessly for 60 minutes but that does not mean he'll contribute "consistenly" on the score board in his 1st NHL season, even if it is spent (not likely) playing on the 1st line with Koivu all year long.

I like Ryder to death and am his biggest fan but I don't count on him to produce like a top-6 should, scoring around 20-25 goals, in his first season. If he does, it'll be a pleasant surprise that could be rewarded with the Calder but I'm not expecting anything close. If indeed he plays top-2 line, it'll be for his physical contribution first and foremost, in front of the net and in the corners. 15 goals is realistic for him this year IMO.
I believe that is exactly he reason he will be used on one of the top two lines. He gives us grit with decent hands a rare commodity in this team. I do not care if he only produces 30pts as a first liner. his role will be to Help saku and his partner to get more. Somehow though I think he will take the opportunity and run with it!

I would surely like to see the following lines Once Koivu is back:

Bulis, Koivu, Ryder
Hossa, Ribeiro, Zednik
Begin, Perreault, Audette
Langdon, Kilger, Ward

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Old
10-13-2003, 06:22 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habruti!
I believe that is exactly he reason he will be used on one of the top two lines. He gives us grit with decent hands a rare commodity in this team. I do not care if he only produces 30pts as a first liner. his role will be to Help saku and his partner to get more. Somehow though I think he will take the opportunity and run with it!

I would surely like to see the following lines Once Koivu is back:

Bulis, Koivu, Ryder
Hossa, Ribeiro, Zednik
Begin, Perreault, Audette
Langdon, Kilger, Ward
Oh well what about another suggestion as well which would IMO be the most obvious...Switch Perreault with Koivu, Juneau with Perreault and Dackell with Sundstrum to end up with the following lines:

Ryder, Koivu, Audette
Hossa, Ribs, Zednik
Bulis, Perreault, Sundstrum
Langdon, Kilger/Begin, Ward

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Old
10-14-2003, 10:50 PM
  #37
Marksman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KILLger
Audette still needs some time on the 1st, IMO. He's working hard - really is - and I think it's a question of time until he starts producing. Then, we can dump him for a 4th.
Funny how things work out - he needed 9 shots to get a goal but he did...hopefully that bursts the dam for him (and same for Perreault)

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Old
10-14-2003, 11:02 PM
  #38
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As I posted in the other thread :

Bulis - Koivu - Ward
Hossa - Ribeiro - Zednik
Ryder - Perreault - Audette
Sundstrom/Dwyer - Kilger/Bégin - Langdon/Sundstrom

This isn't by any means a conventional lineup, but it should be IMO what we put on in the ice. Maybe a fourth line of

Sundstrom - Juneau - Dackell

which could play take the defensive shifts could work to and we could insert one or two grit players when needed. Anyway I don't think we should touch Ribeiro's or Perreault's lines for now.

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Old
10-15-2003, 01:09 AM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PornoHolocaust
Anyway I don't think we should touch Ribeiro's or Perreault's lines for now.[/I]

Does anyone else think that Marcel Hossa plays like a big moo-moo? He hasn't done anything to impress me this year. Can anyone enlighten me as to his merits on the second line (those proven, not projected please)?

I wouldn't mind too much if he were one of the demotions when the injured players return, although his puck pushing skills along the boards are not lost on this fan. Ribeiro does need to play with a strong winger who can do that.

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Old
10-15-2003, 01:58 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shazbot
Does anyone else think that Marcel Hossa plays like a big moo-moo? He hasn't done anything to impress me this year. Can anyone enlighten me as to his merits on the second line (those proven, not projected please)?

I wouldn't mind too much if he were one of the demotions when the injured players return, although his puck pushing skills along the boards are not lost on this fan. Ribeiro does need to play with a strong winger who can do that.
I think Hossa's played solid along the boards and defensively, but he doesn't force plays and use his size the way he can consistently. At times he'll go to the net with authority, and dig for rebounds, but the consistency in his game isn't there.

Personally, I would like to see Julien tell Hossa to go straight at the net on each play while Ribeiro and Zednik create plays. There were a few occasions where Hossa and Zednik were skating down the wings, Ribeiro down the middle with puck control, Ribeiro passing the puck over to Zednik and Hossa simply sliding to the backboards waiting for a pass, or moving to the high slot. Meanwhile Zednik would take a simple shot on net that winds up being an easy save. If Hossa wreaked some havoc in front of the net, he'd eventually cause some goals, get a tip in or rebound. This would give him some confidence, and we'd go from there.

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Old
10-15-2003, 02:07 AM
  #41
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thanks for your comments, Mike8.

the way i see it, at this point (injured players included) there are 4 groups of players that the forward lines somehow need to be sorted out from.

top-two-line players:

Koivu
Perreault
Ribeiro
Audette
Ryder
Zednik

3rd-liners or fillers:

Bulis
Juneau
Dackell
Sundstrom

fillers:

Hossa
Ward
Kilger

full-time 4th-liners:

Langdon
Bégin
Dwyer

by filler, i mean a player that can fill in on any line, from 1 to 4.

that is quite a puzzle.

i've left Higgins out because i think it's obvious he'll be sent down as soon as the injured players come back.

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Old
10-15-2003, 02:15 AM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike8
Personally, I would like to see Julien tell Hossa to go straight at the net on each play while Ribeiro and Zednik create plays.
Maybe that is because Zednik isnt the greatest passer? To me most of his assist seem come from someone putting his rebounds in. Telling to him become playmaker would be forcing him into role hes not familiar. Hes a shooter first and foremost. Hossas junior numbers suggest he is a good playmaker given a chance - he should be the one cycle with Ribs and Zed moving into slot area. Hossa doesnt have points to show yet but the season is young... he certainly isnt hurting the line.

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Old
10-15-2003, 02:27 AM
  #43
Mike8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marksman2
Maybe that is because Zednik isnt the greatest passer? To me most of his assist seem come from someone putting his rebounds in. Telling to him become playmaker would be forcing him into role hes not familiar. Hes a shooter first and foremost. Hossas junior numbers suggest he is a good playmaker given a chance - he should be the one cycle with Ribs and Zed moving into slot area. Hossa doesnt have points to show yet but the season is young... he certainly isnt hurting the line.
Yes, I agree that Zednik is not a good passer. My point was that Ribeiro seems to move the puck to Zednik after crossing the blueline more often than moving it to Hossa. At that point, Zednik either takes a shot right at the goaltender for an easy save, or he'll circle behind the net and try for an easy wrap-around save.

I would like to see Hossa make the save a bit more difficult for the goaltender. If he goes to the net, it would be far more useful than waiting for a pass around the perimeter so he could set up a play or a shot, when Zednik will always try for the shot himself.

This would also get Hossa involved in the play -- something he struggles with at times. He needs to get hungrier, play with authority and pounce on opportunities. This is what Ryder and Ward have excelled at in their stints with the Habs, but what Hossa has had trouble with.

You are correct in pointing out that in junior Hossa was primarily a playmaker. But unless the Habs move him back to center, he won't be the go-to-guy on his line. He has a great shot with the quickest release on the team. I'd like to see him use it more. I think that he can become more of a sniper on the pro level, using his size to drive the net and play strong along the boards if he's given specific directions in what to do in the offensive zone.

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