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Keep your Guts & Heart, I'll take skill any day.

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Old
04-25-2011, 11:50 AM
  #76
SlingshotVv
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am i the only person that find it hilarious that someone out there (OP) watches NYR games and says: "we definitely need more Christensen" ???

I'm curious to know what "skilled players" the OP would like to see surround his Wolski-Christensen-Gaborik dream team?

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04-25-2011, 12:39 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by SlingshotVv View Post
am i the only person that find it hilarious that someone out there (OP) watches NYR games and says: "we definitely need more Christensen" ???

I'm curious to know what "skilled players" the OP would like to see surround his Wolski-Christensen-Gaborik dream team?


I GOTTA HAVE MORE CHRISTENSEN

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Old
04-25-2011, 01:45 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by qwertyaas View Post
Lack of skill, poor cap allocation and an untimely injury.

$11mil of dead cap space in Drury, White, Boogard, Frolov...

This team needs top-end offensive talent and bad. Problem is it's very tough to land those players outside of drafting nowadays. The one we had from the 2007 draft... Hopefully Kreider and Thomas pan out to their ceilings.
Had our GM not hamstrung us with cap issues by his atrocious UFA signings this team had some minor league chips to take advantage of the Hawks fire sale last summer...not saying that would have put us in SC contention this season but maybe we aren't playing the last 20 games of the regular season as if it was the playoffs

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04-25-2011, 01:49 PM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SlingshotVv View Post
am i the only person that find it hilarious that someone out there (OP) watches NYR games and says: "we definitely need more Christensen" ???

I'm curious to know what "skilled players" the OP would like to see surround his Wolski-Christensen-Gaborik dream team?
Zherdev - Connolly - Svatos

Laich - Demitra - Arnott

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04-25-2011, 02:41 PM
  #80
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You give Kane to Torts and he will zherdev him out. You give Z to laviolette and he would make a playoff performer out of him.

If Hossa wasn't wanted by PIT so bad, Christ would have had a Stanley Cup ring. It depends who is your coach very much.
The sooner they rid of Torts the sooner we will have skill players. With Torts Stepan and Kreider will become plumbers. That is all he can do. Great bottom 6 developer.

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04-25-2011, 02:47 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by 94now View Post
You give Kane to Torts and he will zherdev him out. You give Z to laviolette and he would make a playoff performer out of him.

If Hossa wasn't wanted by PIT so bad, Christ would have had a Stanley Cup ring. It depends who is your coach very much.
The sooner they rid of Torts the sooner we will have skill players. With Torts Stepan and Kreider will become plumbers. That is all he can do. Great bottom 6 developer.
well put.

i agree.

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04-25-2011, 02:51 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by 94now View Post
You give Kane to Torts and he will zherdev him out. You give Z to laviolette and he would make a playoff performer out of him.

If Hossa wasn't wanted by PIT so bad, Christ would have had a Stanley Cup ring. It depends who is your coach very much.
The sooner they rid of Torts the sooner we will have skill players. With Torts Stepan and Kreider will become plumbers. That is all he can do. Great bottom 6 developer.
Complete nightmare scenario. I am hoping Torts' system this year was more a bi-product of the roster, and not what he will continue to do in the future.

Your top-6 and bottom-6 cannot be synonymous and practically interchangeable.

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04-25-2011, 03:13 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Ailurophile View Post
Complete nightmare scenario. I am hoping Torts' system this year was more a bi-product of the roster, and not what he will continue to do in the future.

Your top-6 and bottom-6 cannot be synonymous and practically interchangeable.
Keep hoping.

Just FYI, any skill player can do plumber job. They just refuse to do it, because once you get there, once you start to hit, to block, to grind you will end up doing it forever. Everyone who ever played hockey knows the rule

Hands>>Shoulders>>Fists

You have to move up, not down. Prust work his way from the fighter up to a grinder ( i.e. from fists to shoulders), good for him. But to make one with good stick skills, with great scoring touch a bottom 6 player is a crime. Torts has done that. He calls it all around development.

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04-25-2011, 04:56 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by savebyrichter35 View Post
I think we can pretty much just lock up the thread after this post. I'm not sure what the OP is really getting at honestly. Is there anyone that doesn't believe we need more talented players to win? Nobody thinks we're gonna win a Stanley Cup with a team full of Prusts and Callahans, but we're also not gonna win a Stanley Cup without them.
I was referring to the knee jerk reaction of most fans to want to turn skill guys into plumbers because they value "heart, Guts and Intangibles" more than goals. I love Cally, but on what planet is he worth more than a Gabby?

I guarantee you that when the Baffoon from Banf-f-f goes out and overpays for Richards if he has an off season they'll want to run him out of town on a rail.

btw - Cally and Prust are two of my favs on the team. This is not about individual players, it's about valuing plumbers over surgeons. There's a time and a place for each.

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04-25-2011, 05:00 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by 94now View Post
Keep hoping.

Just FYI, any skill player can do plumber job. They just refuse to do it, because once you get there, once you start to hit, to block, to grind you will end up doing it forever. Everyone who ever played hockey knows the rule

Hands>>Shoulders>>Fists

You have to move up, not down. Prust work his way from the fighter up to a grinder ( i.e. from fists to shoulders), good for him. But to make one with good stick skills, with great scoring touch a bottom 6 player is a crime. Torts has done that. He calls it all around development.
Thank you. You get "it."

He's also a bully that loves to brow beat his team and throw them under the bus. Most on here act like they've never heard the term "...kind of player" before. It's his way or the highway.

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04-25-2011, 05:05 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SlingshotVv View Post
am i the only person that find it hilarious that someone out there (OP) watches NYR games and says: "we definitely need more Christensen" ???

I'm curious to know what "skilled players" the OP would like to see surround his Wolski-Christensen-Gaborik dream team?
Are you intentionally obtuse? I hope not, for your sake.

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04-25-2011, 05:06 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Dagh View Post
Indeed. Flyers were almost knocked out yesterday, against a team with much less skill. Skill alone is useless, much like grit alone.
With sieve for goaltenders. It's still a team game.

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04-25-2011, 05:12 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Section 409 View Post
Yesterday I saw Brandon Prust skate as hard as he could from behind our net on a backcheck to disrupt an offensive oppurtunity for the Caps, something that some players on this team would never do.

How about, some of our offensive players actually skate back hard to, players like Gaborik, who could have actually disrupted a 2OT goal instead of causing it? There has to be a balance, a team of Wolski's and Christensen's will not go far.
I used Wo and Christensen because they're on the team. Needing a goal to tie or go ahead late in the game I do want Christensen over Prust, every time. Shoot outs too. I have no problem if you would throw Prust out there. I just wouldn't. There's a time and place to deploy a wrecking ball like Prust (who I really did).

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04-25-2011, 05:20 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by NYRKindms View Post
seems to me this whole thread is dancing around the real problem and it is a problem we have discussed over and over on these boards.


Sather. The team construct and lack of success is on him and him alone. The horrible contracts that he has given out have handcuffed the team. Instead of making tweaking moves during the season to put us over the hump we have been stuck with 'guys who need a change of scenery' swapping our headcases for other teams headcases.

He has killed this team. If Drury doesn't retire, we still have a bunch of guys that need to be resigned and we still have all the huge offensive holes we have now.
Get this, now we want to dump Captain Valium so we can take a shot at Richards. We Ranger fans make his ineptitude possible by always coveting names. Think about it - we're not even out from under Dreary and Redden and we are pining for Richards.

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04-25-2011, 05:23 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by NYRKindms View Post
seems to me this whole thread is dancing around the real problem and it is a problem we have discussed over and over on these boards.


Sather. The team construct and lack of success is on him and him alone. The horrible contracts that he has given out have handcuffed the team. Instead of making tweaking moves during the season to put us over the hump we have been stuck with 'guys who need a change of scenery' swapping our headcases for other teams headcases.

He has killed this team. If Drury doesn't retire, we still have a bunch of guys that need to be resigned and we still have all the huge offensive holes we have now.
Get this, now we want to dump Captain Valium so we can take a shot at Richards. We Ranger fans make his ineptitude possible by always coveting names. Think about it - we're not even out from under Dreary and Redden and we are already pining for Richards.

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04-25-2011, 06:00 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by HoosierDaddy View Post
Get this, now we want to dump Captain Valium so we can take a shot at Richards. We Ranger fans make his ineptitude possible by always coveting names. Think about it - we're not even out from under Dreary and Redden and we are already pining for Richards.
Richards has the ability to live up to a big contract, Drury did not.

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04-25-2011, 06:15 PM
  #92
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Richards has the ability to live up to a big contract, Drury did not.
So how many years are you willing to commit to? Then we can discuss if a 31 year old can live up to a big contract...not defending Drury here but his agent didn't hold a gun to Slats head.

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04-25-2011, 06:24 PM
  #93
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The more and more I read this board, the more and more I feel like most people here were not fans between 97 and 2004.

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04-26-2011, 08:57 AM
  #94
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Boooo I guess you just started watching this team then HoosierDaddy. Cause thats been the rangers post cup till now, and its hasn't worked to say the least.

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04-26-2011, 09:27 AM
  #95
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To the OP

It depends on who you're talking about.

I'd much rather have a work horses like Callahan & Dubinsky over skilled guys like Zherdev & Wolski.

But if you're asking me to choose over skill like Gaborik, which is a whole other level and a supposed worker like Drury and the answer is simple.

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04-26-2011, 09:34 AM
  #96
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Originally Posted by NHRangerfan View Post
So how many years are you willing to commit to? Then we can discuss if a 31 year old can live up to a big contract...not defending Drury here but his agent didn't hold a gun to Slats head.
I say 5-6 at around 6.5-7. You guys understand that the cap will continue to go up, correct? You need to get skill while skill is available.

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04-26-2011, 09:36 AM
  #97
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Originally Posted by vipernsx View Post
It depends on who you're talking about.

I'd much rather have a work horses like Callahan & Dubinsky over skilled guys like Zherdev & Wolski.

But if you're asking me to choose over skill like Gaborik, which is a whole other level and a supposed worker like Drury and the answer is simple.
This is true because Z and wolski are inconsistent. If they were more consistent, I would take ten over a grinder any day of re week. Dubi and cally are work horses, but they possess skill, that is why I love them. They can literally do it all

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04-26-2011, 09:38 AM
  #98
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Originally Posted by NHRangerfan View Post
Had our GM not hamstrung us with cap issues by his atrocious UFA signings this team had some minor league chips to take advantage of the Hawks fire sale last summer...not saying that would have put us in SC contention this season but maybe we aren't playing the last 20 games of the regular season as if it was the playoffs
I agree we would have been much better with big buff on the pp

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04-26-2011, 10:33 AM
  #99
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The problem is people apply the lack of "guts and heart" as they please as an explanation for anyone who isn't putting up points and doesn't play exactly like ryan callahan. This leads to any skill player being turned on the second he begins to slump.

It's frustrating b/c I know most people here have played competitive sports, i'm sure many at a high level, and they should know it's not that cut and dry. Some days you have it, some you don't. Hell, some seasons you have it, some you don't. Being outplayed can easily look like you're being "outworked". In fact there's almost no way to get blown out say 4-0 and look good, somehow people think that the only reason anybody loses or fails is b/c they don't care enough or don't work hard enough. It ignores the fact that we're playing another team that is also working and trying to. Somehow we think our fate is only in our team's hands, and the other team is simply a prop to get in our way.

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04-26-2011, 11:10 AM
  #100
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Originally Posted by allstar3970 View Post
The problem is people apply the lack of "guts and heart" as they please as an explanation for anyone who isn't putting up points and doesn't play exactly like ryan callahan. This leads to any skill player being turned on the second he begins to slump.

It's frustrating b/c I know most people here have played competitive sports, i'm sure many at a high level, and they should know it's not that cut and dry. Some days you have it, some you don't. Hell, some seasons you have it, some you don't. Being outplayed can easily look like you're being "outworked". In fact there's almost no way to get blown out say 4-0 and look good, somehow people think that the only reason anybody loses or fails is b/c they don't care enough or don't work hard enough. It ignores the fact that we're playing another team that is also working and trying to. Somehow we think our fate is only in our team's hands, and the other team is simply a prop to get in our way.
Nice. Too large to put out as signature, I guess. Yet it should be shown more often as an educational piece.

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