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Who starts Game 6?

View Poll Results: SHOULD start, not would.
Niemi 28 22.40%
Nitty 97 77.60%
Voters: 125. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
04-25-2011, 09:59 AM
  #151
stalockrox
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Originally Posted by SJeasy View Post
Look at the other side on the Flyers' series. After the outset, the only goals that Miller is letting through are the ones that are not savable by any goalie. And he is stopping shots that he has no business stopping. Philly is one of the most potent offenses in the league for a reason and he shut them down twice. And Buffalo has no business in the playoffs with their injuries and thin talent. Big thing for Miller is he got one of those enforced respites just at the end of the season. The balance is again falling to the goalies that are more rested. It keeps happening year after year; it isn't just the Sharks.
OK- Miller's played well, I don't think I said anything about Buffalo?
Or are you comparing Buffalo to the Kings?

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04-25-2011, 10:48 AM
  #152
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OK- Miller's played well, I don't think I said anything about Buffalo?
Or are you comparing Buffalo to the Kings?
No you didn't say anything about Buffalo, I was pointing you in their direction on goaltending. They are a prime example of a team being helped by having a rested goalie which Niemi is not. I was using Buffalo as a counterpoint to the Sharks. A similar team to the Sharks is Nashville where Rinne has looked less than stellar. At the end of the season, Rinne was ridden hard and put away wet just like Niemi. There was no intent for Buffalo to rest Miller in preparation for the playoffs, it was happenstance due to Miller's injury. Quick is sort of in between. The Kings didn't start riding him until mid-March.

Edit:
I will make my point about rest again or retract it at the end of the playoffs. I have my list of goalies who were rested and those who were not for all 16 teams. Over the last half decade, the rested ones have been winning.


Last edited by SJeasy: 04-25-2011 at 10:56 AM.
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04-25-2011, 11:19 AM
  #153
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Originally Posted by SJeasy View Post
No you didn't say anything about Buffalo, I was pointing you in their direction on goaltending. They are a prime example of a team being helped by having a rested goalie which Niemi is not. I was using Buffalo as a counterpoint to the Sharks. A similar team to the Sharks is Nashville where Rinne has looked less than stellar. At the end of the season, Rinne was ridden hard and put away wet just like Niemi. There was no intent for Buffalo to rest Miller in preparation for the playoffs, it was happenstance due to Miller's injury. Quick is sort of in between. The Kings didn't start riding him until mid-March.

Edit:
I will make my point about rest again or retract it at the end of the playoffs. I have my list of goalies who were rested and those who were not for all 16 teams. Over the last half decade, the rested ones have been winning.
Well Antti sure has been getting his fair share of rest the past three games!

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04-25-2011, 11:20 AM
  #154
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Hm ... Todd must like the challenge of coming from behind.
I think the whole team likes the challenge of coming from behind. They always play best when they are down a couple (or more) goals.

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04-25-2011, 11:22 AM
  #155
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Originally Posted by polmaniac932 View Post
Well Antti sure has been getting his fair share of rest the past three games!
That wasn't the kind of rest I meant. Some of those worn out goalies got the same kind of rest Aunty got.

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04-25-2011, 12:44 PM
  #156
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I'm not claiming to be a goalie expert here, but I think that the fact Quick sees the puck a lot is an advantage. The Sharks take a ton of shots from the outside, into the giant crown on his chest, clear lanes from the blue line... You'll notice the games where Niemi has been good he's seen 30+ shots. I think he, like just about every other goalie, needs to make a couple of saves early to feel the puck, get his bearing and get comfortable. When the very first shot you see is a double deflection and the 2nd is a 2 on 1, doesn't give him much time to find his groove.

He needs to be better, no doubt about it and I'm not making excuses for him but there are goaltenders who need to see a lot of shots and he seems to be better when that happens. I also know the Sharks don't often give up a lot of shots, I'm just making an observation.

Also, comparing the Sharks goalie situation to the Flyers is just silly...you want to talk about a team winning despite their goaltending. Although, I really do miss Boosh and his Nabby impressions.
You are correct, sir.

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04-25-2011, 12:57 PM
  #157
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Originally Posted by SharksFan1 View Post
I think the whole team likes the challenge of coming from behind. They always play best when they are down a couple (or more) goals.
I have a theory about that.

I get the impression this team is at its best when its skating fast, free-wheeling, crashing the net hard, moving up and down the ice.

They have one of the bigger, stronger, deepeer and more talented groups of wingers in the league (and have for several seasons). So when they are coming from behind and just focused on just getting the next goal, they create way more offense than when they are trying to play a tight-checking defensive game where nobody goes to the net for fear of giving up a breakaway. I get the impression that this team would generally do better in a track meet style game than a grinding game.

It's like having Joe Montana, Jerry Rice, John Taylor, and Roger Craig on your offense, and then just calling a bunch of conservative runs into the line and punting deep. If you've got stars, utilize their potential.

That's only a mild theory I have though, and I say that knowing full well there is a fair amount of evidence to suggest they'd do worse in such a game (though matchups are a key component in that, too).

Also have to acknowledge the reality that the Kings are also going to collapse more defensively when up by 3 goals because they don't have to push for any offense. There's also the matter that while the Kings are rolling all of their lines, the Sharks are constantly running out only their top lines. So you'll see more shifts for guys like Pavelski, Clowe, Marleau, and Couture in 3-goal games than you will in 1-goal games where 5-10 minutes of ice time will go to Mayers & Eager, etc. So naturally, more Marleau and less Mayers means more offense firepower.

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04-25-2011, 12:59 PM
  #158
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Originally Posted by polmaniac932 View Post
Well Antti sure has been getting his fair share of rest the past three games!

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04-25-2011, 01:52 PM
  #159
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04-25-2011, 01:56 PM
  #160
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http://www.behindthenethockey.com/20...85/antti-niemi

I though this was a good article examining Niemi's career numbers on the road.

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04-25-2011, 02:11 PM
  #161
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Originally Posted by Jesus Toews View Post
http://www.behindthenethockey.com/20...85/antti-niemi

I though this was a good article examining Niemi's career numbers on the road.
So really, we just have to stick with him til the pattern lines up with the playoffs being his high point instead of his low. That'll probably happen in the next 4 years...

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04-25-2011, 02:34 PM
  #162
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Not thus far in this postseason he isn't.



He's been at fault enough.....more than most playoff teams can afford, and without the tremendous other saves to back him up.

I mean look at Quick's performances. Most of the goals he's had absolutely no chance at. Maybe could've had one in Game 1 (Couture's goal) and maybe one or two in Game 4. BUT, Quick is also getting absolutely peppered with shots by wave after wave of talented forwards. He's already had a shutout. He posted a 51-save performance. He was otherwise fantastic in the Game 1 loss. Niemi had a few big saves in Game 4, and otherwise he's just looked mediocre to bad.

The Kings are losing DESPITE Quick. Even if Quick does give up a bad goal in a game, you go back to him because his track record in each game and the entire series affords him a mistake or two. The same cannot be said of Niemi thus far.



Niemi is only the "starter" because Niittymaki went down to injury earlier in the year.

In either case, you start the guy who gives you the best chance to win. I still thought Niemi might give the Sharks the best chance to win after Game 3. Now after seeing two solid performances by Niitty, I believe he is the one who gives the Sharks the best chance to win right now. At least in this series.

Maybe Niemi is fighting the puck more than usual right now. Maybe Niemi *could* be better than Niitty, he's not playing like it right now. Whatever the reason (fatigue, defense, whatever), I don't believe Niemi gives the Sharks the better chance of winning tonight. That being said, that doesn't mean the Sharks won't win with him tonight.

And if we're going to compare to other teams, then you should also look last year at Montreal and Philadelphia. Philly in particular got to Game 6 of the SCF going with whichever goaltender gave their best chance of winning....or at least, whoever had the best chance of finishing the game in one piece.
Exactly.

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04-25-2011, 03:11 PM
  #163
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No one should base their decision to bring Niitty in on his performance as a mid-game fill-in.

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04-25-2011, 03:24 PM
  #164
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Originally Posted by polmaniac932 View Post
No one should base their decision to bring Niitty in on his performance as a mid-game fill-in.
The decision can be partly based on it to the extent that it proves that he isn't suffering the lingering effects of injury. I also would not base a decision on his first start after months on IR either. I would expect him to play as well as he did during the first month of the season which is good but not great.

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04-25-2011, 04:42 PM
  #165
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Originally Posted by polmaniac932 View Post
No one should base their decision to bring Niitty in on his performance as a mid-game fill-in.
Can we base it on how Niemi played in the games in which Nitty had those performances?

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04-25-2011, 05:24 PM
  #166
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04-25-2011, 06:49 PM
  #167
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No one should base their decision to bring Niitty in on his performance as a mid-game fill-in.
I don't see why not. He has been good in his fill-in role. And it's not as if game 5 should even really be considered as a fill-in game. He played 50 minutes. For all intents and purposes, he played the whole game. At least enough of the game to say that he's capable of starting and performing well if given the opportunity.

Personally, game six was the best thing to give Niittymaki that opportunity anyway. If Niemi has another bad performance, you're then stuck between a rock and a hard place. Either stick with Niemi after consecutive bad performances and even before then the series was not going good for him or you give Niittymaki's first playoff start in his career in a game 7. Not good choices either way.

However, if you stick Niittymaki in game six and he falters, you give Niemi the game 7 on more of a rest which would be akin to his rest prior to game 1. And if Niittymaki performs well in game six but it's a loss, you can go back to him knowing he won't have the same butterflies as if it were his first ever playoff start and you can trust him to perform well as he has done in what would theoretically be the third game of this series.

Vancouver went that route and it actually brought the team back to a point where they could compete with the Hawks and they had their chances to win game six with Schneider in net. Certainly a tough choice for McLellan and I hope Niemi works out for him tonight. I just don't like the thought of continuously going to Niemi when he's struggling when you paid Niittymaki 2 million bucks to play when your other 2 million dollar goalie is not going well. That was the whole point of having two goalies of the level these guys are at. You go with who is performing better.

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04-26-2011, 12:03 AM
  #168
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**** Niemi. The game shouldn't have even been in the OT.

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04-26-2011, 12:11 AM
  #169
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**** Niemi. The game shouldn't have even been in the OT.

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04-26-2011, 12:13 AM
  #170
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Nitty >>>>>> Niemi.

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04-26-2011, 12:25 AM
  #171
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Niemi was awful.

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04-26-2011, 12:41 AM
  #172
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Niemi was awful until the last 5 minutes.


Fixed.

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04-26-2011, 12:46 AM
  #173
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Fixed.
I can agree with that but if he's giving up those rebounds against teams that actually have guys that can finish, the Sharks are toast in round two.

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04-26-2011, 01:00 AM
  #174
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I can agree with that but if he's giving up those rebounds against teams that actually have guys that can finish, the Sharks are toast in round two.

I agree, I'm just trying to take away SOMETHING positive from his play tonight. Hopefully that end of the game momentum along with a little rest will have him ready for round 2.

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04-26-2011, 01:01 AM
  #175
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I can agree with that but if he's giving up those rebounds against teams that actually have guys that can finish, the Sharks are toast in round two.
He was pretty bad, but he stepped up when it mattered most. He did justenough to get the Sharks a win.

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