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Old
04-29-2011, 05:15 PM
  #101
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Originally Posted by RangerFan10 View Post
if we get Richards the left wing has to come from inhouse. I don't understand where we get the cap room for Richards AND any of those guys.

IMO Dubinsky is a fine option.
I totally agree and think him leading the team in points this year, he's earned it.

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04-29-2011, 05:43 PM
  #102
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Kreider, Chris

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04-29-2011, 05:54 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by Purple McIlwraath View Post
Kreider, Chris
You want to slot a rookie with no Nhl experience experience on the first line?

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04-29-2011, 06:32 PM
  #104
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You want to slot a rookie with no Nhl experience experience on the first line?
Its happened before.

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04-29-2011, 07:41 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
Its happened before.
Putting a Stamkos, Ovi, etc. as a rookie on the first line is ok.

Kreider on the first line is a recipe for disaster for the kid. He needs time to learn the game. Doesn't have the IQ to be a top liner yet.

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04-29-2011, 07:59 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by NY Lito View Post
Putting a Stamkos, Ovi, etc. as a rookie on the first line is ok.

Kreider on the first line is a recipe for disaster for the kid. He needs time to learn the game. Doesn't have the IQ to be a top liner yet.
Just because he plays there doesnt mean he will play 20+ minutes a game. Let him get the majority of his even strength time with them and rest him during the PP's and PK's until he proves he is ready. That would put him at about 15 or so minutes a game. Not impossible.

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04-29-2011, 08:13 PM
  #107
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Just because he plays there doesnt mean he will play 20+ minutes a game. Let him get the majority of his even strength time with them and rest him during the PP's and PK's until he proves he is ready. That would put him at about 15 or so minutes a game. Not impossible.
Understood.

But Kreider playing 15 mins there (and learning the NHL game the hard way) is not the best option. Most of the UFA's (if they come at a reasonable price obviously) are a much better option.

IMO Kreider should play for the Whale first. If he makes the NHL, bottom six. From what I've seen of him the past two years, I don't see him playing at the NHL yet. He has all the tools, but needs more time than people think. Nowhere near where Stepan or McD were. I don't want him at BC, but the AHL would help him a lot.

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04-29-2011, 08:15 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by NY Lito View Post
Understood.

But Kreider playing 15 mins there (and learning the NHL game the hard way) is not the best option. Most of the UFA's (if they come at a reasonable price obviously) are a much better option.

IMO Kreider should play for the Whale first. If he makes the NHL, bottom six. From what I've seen of him the past two years, I don't see him playing at the NHL yet. He has all the tools, but needs more time than people think. Nowhere near where Stepan or McD were. I don't want him at BC, but the AHL would help him a lot.
To me, Kreider is just as physically ready as McDonagh was at the end of last season. I think that if he signs, he will be with the Rangers. Torts will want to teach him and he will not be out of place playing in the NHL.

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04-29-2011, 08:23 PM
  #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NY Lito View Post
Putting a Stamkos, Ovi, etc. as a rookie on the first line is ok.

Kreider on the first line is a recipe for disaster for the kid. He needs time to learn the game. Doesn't have the IQ to be a top liner yet.
Well, first off. Its not a recipe for disaster. We had a rookie as recently as this season getting time on the "top line". It didn't work out in disaster. He played all 82 games in the regular season and every game in the playoffs. And he's not on the same level as Ovechkin, Crosby, etc.

Its a false sense that a player needs to be elite of the elite to get minutes in a bigger role in the NHL.

If Kreider goes pro, he will probably make the NHL roster. We need skill. They'll like his skill. And he undoubtedly will get time with Gaborik and who ever centers that line (hopefully Richards).

Tortorella isn't going to keep a set of lines together for prolonged periods or time. He often times mixes things up on the fly during games.

I think its somewhat foolish to assume he wouldn't get tme there if he's on the roster.

As would Dubinsky, and who ever else is on the LW next season.

Its not a recipe for disaster. Its about finding chemistry. The game doesn't change from one line to another. You can't baby players that much. Tortorella doesn't baby players.

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04-29-2011, 08:33 PM
  #110
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Just get Kreider up here. I'm tired of signing a million guys. We're just like the Yankees except we have a cap and we're not winning championships. That's really bad

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04-29-2011, 08:44 PM
  #111
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Its up to Kreider. They tried signing him last summer and are persuing him now. Hopefully after the WC and prospect camp they'll get him signed. He will have spent a good chunk of the summer with players both on the NHL roster (Stepan & McDonagh) and other prospects. As well as the coaching staff and management. Hopefully its enough to convince him to leave school.

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04-29-2011, 08:45 PM
  #112
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If Kreider refuses, I say we send McIlrath to kick his ass.

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04-29-2011, 08:46 PM
  #113
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Tortorella has mentioned wanting to "sink his teeth" into Kreider.

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04-29-2011, 08:47 PM
  #114
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If Kreider refuses, I say we send McIlrath to kick his ass.
Lol. He's an intimidating guy for sure.

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04-29-2011, 08:49 PM
  #115
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Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
Tortorella has mentioned wanting to "sink his teeth" into Kreider.
That's creepy. No wonder he wants to stay at BC

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04-29-2011, 08:51 PM
  #116
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Jesus.

Kreider is nowhere near NHL ready. Nowhere even close to it. He needs proper development. Sticking him with 1st line responsibilities, right out of college, is not proper. Really, he should be in the QMJHL right now, but he decided to go to college, which is a fine decision, but it's really hurt the development of his offensive game. I say sign him, get him to Connecticut. Give him all the chances in the world to get his offensive game up to where is should be for a guy as physically gifted as him. He also needs to work on his hockey sense, and aggressiveness. Blame York, but he's not nearly ready.

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04-29-2011, 08:54 PM
  #117
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Originally Posted by Steven Mastrosimone View Post
Jesus.

Kreider is nowhere near NHL ready. Nowhere even close to it. He needs proper development. Sticking him with 1st line responsibilities, right out of college, is not proper. Really, he should be in the QMJHL right now, but he decided to go to college, which is a fine decision, but it's really hurt the development of his offensive game. I say sign him, get him to Connecticut. Give him all the chances in the world to get his offensive game up to where is should be for a guy as physically gifted as him. He also needs to work on his hockey sense, and aggressiveness. Blame York, but he's not nearly ready.
This is why I don't like drafting out of college; junior kids FTW. But that's just me.

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04-29-2011, 08:57 PM
  #118
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This is why I don't like drafting out of college; junior kids FTW. But that's just me.
I'm fine with drafting out of the collegiate ranks, as long as they're going to develop the player correctly. Parise, Toews, Pavelski, and Vanek were all college stars, as was Kessel. I would be fine with Kreider staying until his senior year if the Rangers feel that's best. But you can't rush a guy of Kreider's ilk. He's extremely raw - his game needs a LOT of work, but if he figures it out, it is going to be worth it in the end.

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04-29-2011, 08:58 PM
  #119
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Your entitled to your opinion. But there are a lot of folks in the business that feel he is ready.

USA hockey feels he's able to compete against NHL caliber players.

The Rangers want him signed.

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04-29-2011, 08:59 PM
  #120
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Kreider wasn't drafted out of college. He was drafted out of Prep High School.

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04-29-2011, 09:00 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
Your entitled to your opinion. But there are a lot of folks in the business that feel he is ready.

USA hockey feels he's able to compete against NHL caliber players.

The Rangers want him signed.
USA hockey took Kreider last year. It's nice, but it doesn't mean he's NHL ready. He's not. The Rangers want him signed, probably because they want to be able to develop him, while York is more worried about winning games. They won't put him with 1st line responsibilities, though. They're not idiots, they're not fanboys, they're professionals. Unless Kreider comes in and dominates, he will be in the AHL, or in the NCAA.

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04-29-2011, 09:00 PM
  #122
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There is no better place to develop your game than in the NHL. The minors are just for guys are aren't going to see ice time up here and are better served getting extra ice time to develop on the farm team. If Kreider is going to get ice time here, then there's no need for him to be in the minors. There seems to be this idea that skills must develop in the minors or in juniors. That's not the case at all.

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04-29-2011, 09:01 PM
  #123
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Originally Posted by Steven Mastrosimone View Post
USA hockey took Kreider last year. It's nice, but it doesn't mean he's NHL ready. He's not. The Rangers want him signed, probably because they want to be able to develop him, while York is more worried about winning games. They won't put him with 1st line responsibilities, though. They're not idiots, they're not fanboys, they're professionals. Unless Kreider comes in and dominates, he will be in the AHL, or in the NCAA.
Ok, that's where I'm not so sure...

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04-29-2011, 09:04 PM
  #124
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Originally Posted by Machinehead View Post
There is no better place to develop your game than in the NHL. The minors are just for guys are aren't going to see ice time up here and are better served getting extra ice time to develop on the farm team. If Kreider is going to get ice time here, then there's no need for him to be in the minors. There seems to be this idea that skills must develop in the minors or in juniors. That's not the case at all.
In certain cases, that is the case. Kreider needs to develop his offensive skills getting #1 ice time, 1st PP unit time, as he needs to get his confidence up big time. He doesn't use his frame to his advantage in terms of forechecking. He needs to assert himself much more, and it's holding him back offensively.

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Ok, that's where I'm not so sure...
Gordie Clark sure isn't an idiot. Sather, yes, for the most part, but Clark is probably the most intelligent man in the org.

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04-29-2011, 09:09 PM
  #125
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Even if Kreider makes the team out of camp, and gets put on the first line, he won't be there all season unless he just plays out of his mind Calder worthy hockey. Even then you can't be sure Torts won't pull his play under 10 minutes on the 4th line routine he likes to do with rookies from time to time.

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