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Just say no to the buyouts this year

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Old
05-04-2011, 11:28 AM
  #126
beastly115
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Originally Posted by RangerEsq View Post
This is the most realistic estimate I've seen around here. People saying he'll take $6 per are going to be totally shocked by what he gets.

You've got to figure someone will offer him more than lesser players (who were getting $6 to $7.5 per) who hit free agency.
Not really. There's an article somewhere where Richards said he regrets taking a contract with such a high cap hit. So let's put 2+2 together, shall we? Richards currently makes 7.8M. He won't get that much on the market. He stated he wants to take a lower cap hit so he can be on a better team. My gut feeling is 6 yrs, 6.5M per. Realistically I can see 7 years, 7.25M per. Long duration but 7.25M puts him right in line with other players of similar caliber.

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05-04-2011, 11:30 AM
  #127
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GAGline, but I thought everyone here says that Brad Richards is a once in a generation chance to get a star without surrendering assets. Why would GMs all around the league pass on his services unless he was getting paid so much all of them thought it's too much, regardless that he is the only star for years who can be acquired for free?

There are only two ways to look at him: he's a once in a generation UFA or he's not.

1. If he is a once in a lifetime (or at least many years) UFA, then there will be a ridiculous bidding war for him, with other teams in better position to acquire his services because they are closer to winning the Cup.

2. If he's not a very rare UFA, then let's wait until we know our needs after the kids mature.
With regards to #1, there is a limiting step here and that is Richards himself. Where does he want to go? He's stated he wants to go to a competitive team. He obviously has connections to several teams (TB, NYR, etc.). Just because a team bids for him doesn't mean he'll entertain the thought of going there.

Hell, didn't the NYI offer Kovalchuk a max contract or something and he blew them off?

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05-04-2011, 11:39 AM
  #128
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If he will choose a team based on something other than money, you've gotta figure it will be their odds of winning the Cup, not his old coach from 7 years ago.

I think our only chance of getting him is to outbid everyone. Maybe a horrible team like the Islanders won't even be entertained as an option, but 25+ teams in the league will be places that Brad would consider if they gave him a good offer. You have to figure that out of those 25 teams he would be ok with, at least a half dozen will also have very serious interest in him.

Again, if he's a once in a generation UFA, then why would anyone pass on him unless they thought he's so badly overpaid, he's not worth even for free anymore?

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05-04-2011, 12:17 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by RangerEsq View Post
GAGline, but I thought everyone here says that Brad Richards is a once in a generation chance to get a star without surrendering assets. Why would GMs all around the league pass on his services unless he was getting paid so much all of them thought it's too much, regardless that he is the only star for years who can be acquired for free?

There are only two ways to look at him: he's a once in a generation UFA or he's not.

1. If he is a once in a lifetime (or at least many years) UFA, then there will be a ridiculous bidding war for him, with other teams in better position to acquire his services because they are closer to winning the Cup.

2. If he's not a very rare UFA, then let's wait until we know our needs after the kids mature.
Who says he's a once in a generation UFA? Kovalchuk was UFA just last year, so that puts the lie to that particular statement.

But the reality is that Brad Richards is better than any other offensive player on our team and signing him would go a long way toward making us a real contender. Waiting for the kids to mature isn't the best option because they may never develop into top line players. We know what our needs are. We need a #1 center and a PPQB. Richards can be both. If Artie and/or Stepan develop into #1 centers, is that a bad problem to have? No.

Look, I'm usually the first person to argue against signing players when I think the cap implications will hurt us. I argued against Kovy last year because of all the RFAs we had to sign, both last year and this year. Last year, buying out Drury wasn't a good option. This year it is. We traded Rozy for Wolski, not just to bolster our offense, but to give us a better option on a buyout.

The cap space is there and our only significant RFAs next year are MDZ and MZA, neither of whom has earned a raise at this point. By then, both Drury and Wolski will be completely off the books. Saving that cap space for 2012 isn't going to help us in the long run because there are no centers available in 2012 who are as good as Richards.

Could Richards flop on Broadway? Of course. But that doesn't mean you sit on your hands and hope for the best.

The world is going to end in 2012 anyway, so we'd best make our move now.


Last edited by GAGLine: 05-04-2011 at 12:34 PM.
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05-04-2011, 12:33 PM
  #130
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If he will choose a team based on something other than money, you've gotta figure it will be their odds of winning the Cup, not his old coach from 7 years ago.

I think our only chance of getting him is to outbid everyone. Maybe a horrible team like the Islanders won't even be entertained as an option, but 25+ teams in the league will be places that Brad would consider if they gave him a good offer. You have to figure that out of those 25 teams he would be ok with, at least a half dozen will also have very serious interest in him.

Again, if he's a once in a generation UFA, then why would anyone pass on him unless they thought he's so badly overpaid, he's not worth even for free anymore?
There won't be 25+ teams bidding on him. Not even close. You really need to do your homework here. Go through all the teams in the league and tell me who is going to bid on Richards. Many teams have internal budgets and many others are already set at center. And Richards has said he wants to play for a contender, so that will rule out even more teams.

You think a team like pittsburgh or vancouver is going to bid on him? Or how about florida or phoenix? Highly doubtful.

Last year there were 2 teams seriously bidding for Kovalchuk. 2 teams. I can't think of more than 5 teams who will give serious bids for Richards this offseason, and it will likely come down to a 3 team race, with dallas and the Rangers being 2 of them.

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05-04-2011, 12:51 PM
  #131
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Originally Posted by GAGLine View Post

The world is going to end in 2012 anyway, so we'd best make our move now.


That's right, I want the Rangers to be the last team to ever win a cup. They need to go for the glory!

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05-04-2011, 12:53 PM
  #132
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There won't be 25+ teams bidding on him. Not even close. You really need to do your homework here. Go through all the teams in the league and tell me who is going to bid on Richards. Many teams have internal budgets and many others are already set at center. And Richards has said he wants to play for a contender, so that will rule out even more teams.

You think a team like pittsburgh or vancouver is going to bid on him? Or how about florida or phoenix? Highly doubtful.

Last year there were 2 teams seriously bidding for Kovalchuk. 2 teams. I can't think of more than 5 teams who will give serious bids for Richards this offseason, and it will likely come down to a 3 team race, with dallas and the Rangers being 2 of them.
Agreed. Richards is going to have a very short list of teams he's willing to sign with....

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05-04-2011, 12:58 PM
  #133
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Hmm, what if the Islanders offered him a contract in the ballpark of $150 million for 10 years?

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05-04-2011, 01:10 PM
  #134
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Hmm, what if the Islanders offered him a contract in the ballpark of $150 million for 10 years?
Assuming this is a serious question, there's absolutely no chance, because it's been reported numerous times that he wants to join a competitive team with stable ownership.

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05-04-2011, 01:11 PM
  #135
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If he will choose a team based on something other than money, you've gotta figure it will be their odds of winning the Cup, not his old coach from 7 years ago.

I think our only chance of getting him is to outbid everyone. Maybe a horrible team like the Islanders won't even be entertained as an option, but 25+ teams in the league will be places that Brad would consider if they gave him a good offer. You have to figure that out of those 25 teams he would be ok with, at least a half dozen will also have very serious interest in him.

Again, if he's a once in a generation UFA, then why would anyone pass on him unless they thought he's so badly overpaid, he's not worth even for free anymore?
Are you trolling us? Be honest.

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05-04-2011, 01:14 PM
  #136
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Assuming this is a serious question, there's absolutely no chance, because it's been reported numerous times that he wants to join a competitive team with stable ownership.
Define "stable ownership," because...

Oh, who the **** am I kidding? Although, them throwing out a number that could create headlines wouldn't be out of the question.

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05-04-2011, 01:16 PM
  #137
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Hmm, what if the Islanders offered him a contract in the ballpark of $150 million for 10 years?
10 years from now Richards is 41--NHL last year came down hard against teams trying to front load contracts. In order for that contract to fly they'd have to balance such a contract at both ends. That scenario is not going to happen.

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05-04-2011, 01:18 PM
  #138
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10 years from now Richards is 41--NHL last year came down hard against teams trying to front load contracts. In order for that contract to fly they'd have to balance such a contract at both ends. That scenario is not going to happen.
With Kovalchuck, they were offering him $100 million for 10 years, and I think it would have been evened out just like they did with Double Penetration.

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05-04-2011, 01:22 PM
  #139
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Define "stable ownership," because...
Richards wants another shot at a Stanley Cup before his career ends, which isn't surprising. He also wants to join a team that has an ownership committed to that cause and willing to spend the necessary money to fill out their roster and field the most competitive team possible. He's not going to join any team with a self-imposed cap or any team whose ownership is in limbo or in question.

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05-04-2011, 01:28 PM
  #140
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Richards wants another shot at a Stanley Cup before his career ends, which isn't surprising. He also wants to join a team that has an ownership committed to that cause and willing to spend the necessary money to fill out their roster and field the most competitive team possible. He's not going to join any team with a self-imposed cap or any team whose ownership is in limbo or in question.
I know, I was just sassin' ya! The only two front-runners I see in the bid for Richards are the Rangers and Maple Leafs, with an advantage in favor of the Rangers: The young players, the coach, and a team that can't say they haven't been to the playoffs for 6 straight seasons.

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05-04-2011, 01:32 PM
  #141
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I know, I was just sassin' ya! The only two front-runners I see in the bid for Richards are the Rangers and Maple Leafs, with an advantage in favor of the Rangers: The young players, the coach, and a team that can't say they haven't been to the playoffs for 6 straight seasons.
I agree.... Toronto is more or less just a pay-day.

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05-04-2011, 01:36 PM
  #142
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With Kovalchuck, they were offering him $100 million for 10 years, and I think it would have been evened out just like they did with Double Penetration.
Devils tried to frontload that. NHL told them no. Devils made cosmetic changes. NHL still said no and finally the league stepped in and evened the contract out and penalized New Jersey. Don't see it happening.

The way it seems to me is Richards is going to want to go to a contender--preferrably a team in the east. The Flyers are already at the ceiling for next year right now. They won't have the cap space. The Penguins are right behind them--close to $56 mil on the books for 11-12--they won't have the cap space. Other teams in the $50's going into next year include Boston, New Jersey, San Jose, Chicago and Washington. It will be tough for any of those teams to find enough cap space to add a really big contract.

To me the contenders include the Rangers who have 14 players signed for $42 mil including Drury's $7 mil that they can at least get back half--if they buy him out. They have a number of RFA's to sign as well. There is a connection between Richards and Tortorella. The Rangers definitely seem to fit the profile of a team that Richards would want to play for.

I think the Sabres might be a team willing to go after Richards. New owner who wants to raise the profile of his team and apparently willing to spend money to do it. Personally I wouldn't want to live in Buffalo but the team is pretty good and Vanek might be an ideal fit for a passer like Richards.

Toronto is a higher profile team that teased to get into the playoffs with a late season run. Richards-Kessel?

Nashville--not out east but they have cap space and a young very up and coming team.

Dallas.

Tampa Bay--Richards old team. They have cap space but only 11 signed for next year--so they have a lot of contracts they'll have to do including Stamkos. That could be one high octane offense with the likes of Richards, St. Louis, Le Cavalier, Stamkos, Malone etc. Great coach and a definite contending team.

Montreal--plenty of cap space. Another high profile eastern team.

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05-04-2011, 01:55 PM
  #143
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There won't be 25+ teams bidding on him. Not even close.
Please re-read what I wrote. I said that there are 25 teams that he would probably have at least some interest in.

In return, probably half a dozen or so of those 25 teams would submit bids of various competitiveness.

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05-04-2011, 01:57 PM
  #144
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If you offer someone something crazy enough, they will take the money. I just can't imagine a team, even the Islanders, being crazy enough to offer him $150.


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05-04-2011, 02:05 PM
  #145
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Devils tried to frontload that. NHL told them no. Devils made cosmetic changes. NHL still said no and finally the league stepped in and evened the contract out and penalized New Jersey. Don't see it happening.
kovalchuk's deal is still frontloaded to lower the cap hit, just not as extreme as the originally tried. the deal is $100 mil over 15 years, but he'll make $90 mil during the first 10 seasons, the extra 5 years lowers the cap hit from $9 mil/year to $6.75 mil/year

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05-04-2011, 02:07 PM
  #146
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Please re-read what I wrote. I said that there are 25 teams that he would probably have at least some interest in.

In return, probably half a dozen or so of those 25 teams would submit bids of various competitiveness.
25 teams he would be interested in, really? How do you even figure this?

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05-04-2011, 02:45 PM
  #147
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25 teams he would be interested in, really? How do you even figure this?
Why would he exclude most of the league if they give him good terms (most money, NMC, etc)? It doesn't mean that he will sit there saying that he really likes 25 teams. It means that he won't absolutely rule out more than 5 teams.

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05-04-2011, 03:51 PM
  #148
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Why would he exclude most of the league if they give him good terms (most money, NMC, etc)? It doesn't mean that he will sit there saying that he really likes 25 teams. It means that he won't absolutely rule out more than 5 teams.
Sigh, are you even thinking about the details of what you're suggesting?

-How many teams have the cap space to pursue Richards?
-How many teams are in a financial position (regardless of cap space) to pursue Richards?
-How many of those teams are competitive enough that Richards would even consider signing with them for what will likely be his last contract?

25 teams is nearly 85% of the league. When was the last time a free agent even had 50% of the teams pursuing that player?

You're not taking very many of the facts into consideration and just making blanket generalizations. Kovalchuk was the biggest free agent to hit the market post-lockout and it only came down to 2 teams competing to sign him. Teams can offer whatever they want, but if the player has no interest in joining said team it doesn't matter whatsoever. You saw that with ATL trying to sign Kovalchuk. He didn't want to play there, hence, they weren't even part of the equation. If you're read any of the Brad Richards related media over this past season or any of the articles that RangerBoy has posted on the forum, you'd realize that there is a short list of teams that Richards will consider playing for. He has specific intentions and preferred destinations. We will not be competing against 20, 15, or even 10 teams to sign him.

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05-04-2011, 04:01 PM
  #149
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Sigh, are you even thinking about the details of what you're suggesting?

-How many teams have the cap space to pursue Richards?
-How many teams are in a financial position (regardless of cap space) to pursue Richards?
-How many of those teams are competitive enough that Richards would even consider signing with them for what will likely be his last contract?

25 teams is nearly 85% of the league. When was the last time a free agent even had 50% of the teams pursuing that player?

You're not taking very many of the facts into consideration and just making blanket generalizations. Kovalchuk was the biggest free agent to hit the market post-lockout and it only came down to 2 teams competing to sign him. Teams can offer whatever they want, but if the player has no interest in joining said team it doesn't matter whatsoever. You saw that with ATL trying to sign Kovalchuk. He didn't want to play there, hence, they weren't even part of the equation. If you're read any of the Brad Richards related media over this past season or any of the articles that RangerBoy has posted on the forum, you'd realize that there is a short list of teams that Richards will consider playing for. He has specific intentions and preferred destinations. We will not be competing against 20, 15, or even 10 teams to sign him.

Gawd, do you even read what I write? Seriously? Maybe English isn't a language you use outside of this forum, I don't know.

I didn't say 25 teams would be interested in him. I said that there are only about 5 teams that he would exclude under all circumstances.

The other 25 teams are not excluded... by BRAD. Now, they may exclude themselves because the TEAM is not interested or because the TEAM does not have the cap space or for some other TEAM reason, but from Brad's point of view, I can't imagine that his list of teams that he would not go to under any circumstances is 28 teams.

Honestly, are you telling me that he has only 2 teams that he would even listen to their offers?

It's really not that hard to understand what I wrote. Is English a language you use on a regular basis?

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05-04-2011, 04:10 PM
  #150
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I didn't say 25 teams would be interested in him. I said that there are only about 5 teams that he would exclude under all circumstances.
Wow, talk about baseless speculation that's contrary to everything that's been reported. Got any more wild guesstimates you'd like to throw out there while you're at it?

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