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Old
05-06-2011, 04:16 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by Cartsiephan View Post
The recurring, "Richards must be injured, probably shoulder" is starting to irk me. I know these guys have down time and need some time to recharge their batteries. I am all for that. But guys who want to win still take time to focus on working on their weaknesses, or in Richards case strengthen the shoulder and body so come May/June they are not worn down, fatigued.
Yeah, I bet they sleep too. What a waste of 8 hours! Trade those bums for 7th round picks, and then trade those picks for ECHL players.

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05-06-2011, 04:23 PM
  #27
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Trade everyone! **** it. Kick the team out of from Philly! Maybe go to Kansas City or something. Or the Flyers could fold all together. All these are good choices.

Remember Joffrey Lupul? Yes, we need more of these guys, bring back Uppy too. Reunite the Old City Party Crew.



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05-06-2011, 04:24 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Yeah, I bet they sleep too. What a waste of 8 hours! Trade those bums for 7th round picks, and then trade those picks for ECHL players.
Tell that to Sidney Crosby. Or JvR on his summer workouts, I wonder if that helped him?

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05-06-2011, 04:26 PM
  #29
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Tell that to Sidney Crosby. Or JvR on his summer workouts, I wonder if that helped him?
You're right! Richards and Carter haven't improved one bit since coming into the league!

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05-06-2011, 04:28 PM
  #30
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Yea im sure that florida, nyi,ottowa, colorado, minnesota and teams like that wouldn't want to swap rosters with us if they could. Because players like richards and carter can be found in every draft. There are so many teams in this league that would like to have core like ours

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05-06-2011, 04:28 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Cartsiephan View Post
Both have won and put up solid numbers in NA hockey. Schneider has made a better progression to the NHL level at this time, but Bernier is going to be a good NHL goalie sooner than Bobrovsky IMO.
Putting up good numbers in the AHL doesnt mean anything.... Bob put up good numbers in the KHL. I guess we can talk about AHL vs KHL but that argument wont go anywhere.

Schneider is 2-3 years older than Bob, and still doesnt have a starting spot. I know he is behind Luongo, but he is still 25 years old. I know that isnt old, but when Bob is 22 and played more NHL games, thats a positive for Bob.

Bernier is the only one that I think could have a chance but is still a unknown quality. He is about the same age as Bob but with less NHL games. Right now he is riding draft position and AHL stats.

I'll put it like this. A guy on the main board had it as

Schnieder >>>> Bob . I asked him why, he had nothing to back it up, but "IMO". Right now, alot of people are ridding the fluff train. Until one of the three SHOWS that they are better, I'll hold of before anointing one of them the next top goalie in the league.

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05-06-2011, 04:29 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
You're right! Richards and Carter haven't improved one bit since coming into the league!
Have they won the Cup? Crosby has. You're right, just accept it for what it is at this point. People should just be happy that they made the playoffs.

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05-06-2011, 04:30 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Cartsiephan View Post
Have they won the Cup? Crosby has. You're right, just accept it for what it is at this point. People should just be happy that they made the playoffs.
Oh, so, that's it? Every player who hasn't won a cup doesn't do anything over the summer and is lazy?

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05-06-2011, 04:31 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
Putting up good numbers in the AHL doesnt mean anything.... Bob put up good numbers in the KHL. I guess we can talk about AHL vs KHL but that argument wont go anywhere.

Schneider is 2-3 years older than Bob, and still doesnt have a starting spot. I know he is behind Luongo, but he is still 25 years old. I know that isnt old, but when Bob is 22 and played more NHL games, thats a positive for Bob.

Bernier is the only one that I think could have a chance but is still a unknown quality. He is about the same age as Bob but with less NHL games. Right now he is riding draft position and AHL stats.

I'll put it like this. A guy on the main board had it as

Schnieder >>>> Bob . I asked him why, he had nothing to back it up, but "IMO". Right now, alot of people are ridding the fluff train. Until one of the three SHOWS that they are better, I'll hold of before anointing one of them the next top goalie in the league.


Bobrovsky is mentally a couple years behind both, he has the tools, just has to work on the mental makeup. I would still take Schneider, he is the type of goalie who can be successful in the NHL.

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05-06-2011, 04:32 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Oh, so, that's it? Every player who hasn't won a cup doesn't do anything over the summer and is lazy?
Worked for Crosby. Sometimes it takes a little elbow grease to improve on all the god given talent, ya know what I mean? Think Bobby Abreu.

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05-06-2011, 04:34 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Cartsiephan View Post
Bobrovsky is mentally a couple years behind both, he has the tools, just has to work on the mental makeup. I would still take Schneider, he is the type of goalie who can be successful in the NHL.
Based on what? I personally think Bernier is easily the better goalie. I was never really on the Schneider fan bus. All people had to back him up for the past 2-3 years is his AHL stats. Until this season where he played backup role on one of, if not the best team in the league, he has been pretty average in the NHL.

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05-06-2011, 04:34 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Cartsiephan View Post
Worked for Crosby. Sometimes it takes a little elbow grease to improve on all the god given talent, ya know what I mean? Think Bobby Abreu.
So Crosby's natural talent, his teammates, and his coach had nothing to do with it?

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05-06-2011, 04:37 PM
  #38
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So Crosby's natural talent, his teammates, and his coach had nothing to do with it?
All elbow grease. That Malkin guy is a fraud.

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05-06-2011, 04:39 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Cartsiephan View Post
Bobrovsky is mentally a couple years behind both, he has the tools, just has to work on the mental makeup. I would still take Schneider, he is the type of goalie who can be successful in the NHL.
Actually, Bobrovsky's real issues right now are with his fundamentals, not his "mental makeup," which has only been raised as an issue recently due to some scuttlebutt that can easily be misconstrued.

There's no reason to think Bob can't be as good as the other two; he has so far put a bigger and better mark on this league than either of the others, even if that's only circumstantial at the moment.

There is zero reason to pull the trigger on Schneider/Bernier. Neither has proven capable of starting, let alone making deep playoff runs.

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05-06-2011, 05:21 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
Other than being drafted, what have these two proven more than Bob has?

I said it before, Bernier and Schneider are riding on fluff atm. They havent proven more than Bob has.
Bob is younger (22) and has played mostly on losing teams. Schneider has never had a losing season at any level and at 25 yrs old, has already had the benefit of ample seasoning in the AHL. I believe this makes Cory more proven and NHL ready than Bob and thus he represents less of a risk as a go-to young stud to take the reigns of a team. Further, Schneider's numbers in starting more than 20+ games this season have been significantly better than Bobs. Schneider posted a 2.23 GAA and .929 SV% vs Bob's 2.59 GAA .915 SV%. Both are strong lateral movers but Schneider is more aggressive and challenges shooters more effectively. I also believe his positioning is better, his glove is stronger. Both of them need work on their stick handling, which should come in time.

Bob is a good, young raw talent, but Schneider is more of a sure thing at this point in time. The Flyers window of opportunity being what it is with an aging Pronger and Timonen, I'd feel more comfortable and excited with Schneider for the reasons I've stated.

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05-06-2011, 06:57 PM
  #41
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Not to mention, going this route (Schneider) to fortify the goalie position avoids a big cap hit vs Bryz/Vokoun etc. and, depending on who is traded, may clear cap to sign Leino etc.

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05-06-2011, 07:01 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by fauxflex View Post
Bob is younger (22) and has played mostly on losing teams. Schneider has never had a losing season at any level and at 25 yrs old, has already had the benefit of ample seasoning in the AHL. I believe this makes Cory more proven and NHL ready than Bob and thus he represents less of a risk as a go-to young stud to take the reigns of a team. Further, Schneider's numbers in starting more than 20+ games this season have been significantly better than Bobs. Schneider posted a 2.23 GAA and .929 SV% vs Bob's 2.59 GAA .915 SV%. Both are strong lateral movers but Schneider is more aggressive and challenges shooters more effectively. I also believe his positioning is better, his glove is stronger. Both of them need work on their stick handling, which should come in time.

Bob is a good, young raw talent, but Schneider is more of a sure thing at this point in time. The Flyers window of opportunity being what it is with an aging Pronger and Timonen, I'd feel more comfortable and excited with Schneider for the reasons I've stated.
Schneider isn't a sure thing. That's the point.

If you're giving up on Bob, you want to be getting a goalie who you KNOW can be a consistently solid force. Vokoun can, Bryzgalov can; Schneider hasn't proven that he can playing 60+ in the NHL.

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05-06-2011, 07:25 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by fauxflex View Post
Bob is younger (22) and has played mostly on losing teams. Schneider has never had a losing season at any level and at 25 yrs old, has already had the benefit of ample seasoning in the AHL. I believe this makes Cory more proven and NHL ready than Bob and thus he represents less of a risk as a go-to young stud to take the reigns of a team. Further, Schneider's numbers in starting more than 20+ games this season have been significantly better than Bobs. Schneider posted a 2.23 GAA and .929 SV% vs Bob's 2.59 GAA .915 SV%. Both are strong lateral movers but Schneider is more aggressive and challenges shooters more effectively. I also believe his positioning is better, his glove is stronger. Both of them need work on their stick handling, which should come in time.

Bob is a good, young raw talent, but Schneider is more of a sure thing at this point in time. The Flyers window of opportunity being what it is with an aging Pronger and Timonen, I'd feel more comfortable and excited with Schneider for the reasons I've stated.
Kinda like infidelappel said... how does geting a goalie who play LESS games then Bob, make him NHL ready? Just cause he played in the AHL doesnt make him NHL ready... Look at the total stats between the two. Their almost EXACTLY the same...except Schneider is 3 years older and Bob come over from Russia...as a rookie and started.

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05-06-2011, 07:26 PM
  #44
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If it were 3 or 4 years ago, I'd be all for getting Schneider. But when a goalie is the last piece needed for a cup, give me the best established goalie on the market, not someone who may or may not work out. Too me, Bob is still the goalie of the future for this team. They just need someone to fill in while he prefects his game.

There is nothing wrong with the core of this team. The fact that some people are ready to through Richards under the bus after all he's done before this kind of has me disappointed in a few Flyers fans.

BTW, I suppose this is as a good a place to ask this question. What is the rule with Buyout's counting against the cap? Both Pronger and Briere have massively front loaded contracts with Pronger earning 525000 the last two years and Briere earning 3,000,000 and 2,000,000 in his last two years. If they Flyers were to buy them out, would it be a fraction of the their cap hits that would count against us? Or is it a fraction of what they are earning those last two years? If its the latter, then really, neither of those contracts are bad at all.

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05-06-2011, 07:39 PM
  #45
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No Schneider. Getting him makes no sense with Bob already on the team.

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05-06-2011, 07:42 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Coppy View Post
If it were 3 or 4 years ago, I'd be all for getting Schneider. But when a goalie is the last piece needed for a cup, give me the best established goalie on the market, not someone who may or may not work out. Too me, Bob is still the goalie of the future for this team. They just need someone to fill in while he prefects his game.

There is nothing wrong with the core of this team. The fact that some people are ready to through Richards under the bus after all he's done before this kind of has me disappointed in a few Flyers fans.

BTW, I suppose this is as a good a place to ask this question. What is the rule with Buyout's counting against the cap? Both Pronger and Briere have massively front loaded contracts with Pronger earning 525000 the last two years and Briere earning 3,000,000 and 2,000,000 in his last two years. If they Flyers were to buy them out, would it be a fraction of the their cap hits that would count against us? Or is it a fraction of what they are earning those last two years? If its the latter, then really, neither of those contracts are bad at all.
I think there is definitely something wrong with the make-up of the team, but I'm not throwing Richards or Carter under the bus...though I have always thought Carter was not essential (as in, if someone would give us a great package for him, I'd be open to the possibility.)

I just think losing heart and soul players who knew their jobs like Lappy, Gagne, Asham, etc had a negative impact, and we'd be better off consolidating our top 2 lines into more solid offensive units and shifting our third/fourth lines to defensive roles. Doesn't mean I'm throwing anyone under the bus, I just don't think having 3 offensive lines actually works to win a championship.

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05-06-2011, 08:15 PM
  #47
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I think there is definitely something wrong with the make-up of the team, but I'm not throwing Richards or Carter under the bus...though I have always thought Carter was not essential (as in, if someone would give us a great package for him, I'd be open to the possibility.)

I just think losing heart and soul players who knew their jobs like Lappy, Gagne, Asham, etc had a negative impact, and we'd be better off consolidating our top 2 lines into more solid offensive units and shifting our third/fourth lines to defensive roles. Doesn't mean I'm throwing anyone under the bus, I just don't think having 3 offensive lines actually works to win a championship.
Its hard for me to believe that because I think they showed as much heart in the sabres series as anything they did last year. Battling through such inconsistent goaltending. Starting two big games with horrible goaltending to tie it back up. Going up against a goalie on the other side who stole two games. And still winning the series...

I agree with you about missing some roleplayers though. The whole Asham situation was disappointing in the offseason. Could have gotten for basically nothing and they let him walk... They are definitely missing him now.

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05-06-2011, 08:43 PM
  #48
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Sometimes it makes me wonder...if our captain was as "cool" as him...would we have a Cup?

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05-06-2011, 09:59 PM
  #49
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Sometimes it makes me wonder...if our captain was as "cool" as him...would we have a Cup?
HE PARTIED!??

No wonder he got concussed. He'll never win again, because he used his time for something other than hockey.

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05-06-2011, 10:01 PM
  #50
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HE PARTIED!??

No wonder he got concussed. He'll never win again, because he used his time for something other than hockey.
Worst player in hockey.

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