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Rangers trade Ethan Werek to Phoenix for Oscar Lindberg

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05-09-2011, 04:21 PM
  #176
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Originally Posted by BlueshirtBlitz View Post
Lauri did have a good year. Great for him. You know who else had a very good year? Brian Boyle. So did Derek Stepan and Artem Anisimov. Our 3 bottom 9 centers, which is what Lauri is, are good. I'm happy for Korpedo that he's doing well in Phoenix. i liked him. Guess what? Some times trades don't work out, and when it's a bottom 6 player and people act like it's the end of the world it's absolutely ludicrous, considering our strong bottom 6.

And i'm not even going to touch your second point.
So, we give up a 3rd line player who is now 24 years old and had 40 points for a lazy piece of *****. Sounds like a dumb trade to me.

btw, we hope this kid will produce what Lauri has already done.

I am not devasted by losing Lauri, I am just saying we should have done better than Lisin.

That was as one sided as a trade gets. We give up a first rounder player who is forming into a solid player for nothing at all...great use of a chip.

Can you please touch my second point...

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05-09-2011, 04:24 PM
  #177
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Originally Posted by Orr Nightmare View Post
wow, really, you guys are so insightful.

Tell me who our backup was at the end of the season...Google him and everyone else in our system and tell me if we don't need depth.
Cuz Biron was injured. Biron is a great back-up. And the Rangers are looking into Viktor Fasth right now, so what is your point? And Scott Stajcer is playing really well. So what is your point? We clearly don't lack goaltending...

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05-09-2011, 04:24 PM
  #178
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Originally Posted by Orr Nightmare View Post
So, we give up a 3rd line player who is now 24 years old and had 40 points for a lazy piece of *****. Sounds like a dumb trade to me.

btw, we hope this kid will produce what Lauri has already done.

I am not devasted by losing Lauri, I am just saying we should have done better than Lisin.

That was as one sided as a trade gets. We give up a first rounder player who is forming into a solid player for nothing at all...great use of a chip.

Can you please touch my second point...
Lazy piece of ****? I didn't like Lisin, but I don't think you can question his work ethic. His hockey sense is just pathetically bad.

As for you second point, I think the organization's goaltending depth is fine for now. We have Lundqvist, Biron, Talbot, and Johnson. Unless you get two injuries to two capable starting goalies, which rarely happens, it's actually solid. Lundqvist/Biron is one of, if not the best, goalie duos in the NHL.

I could also see the Rangers drafting a Gibson bro in the 2nd round.

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05-09-2011, 04:26 PM
  #179
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Pretty sure someone on this board with knowledge of the player said Korpikoski wanted out.
Why did he want out?

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05-09-2011, 04:27 PM
  #180
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Why did he want out?
Crowded forward group, ice-time, maybe not connecting with Torts...

There are tons of speculative reasons.

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05-09-2011, 04:29 PM
  #181
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Originally Posted by HagelinForPresident View Post
Cuz Biron was injured. Biron is a great back-up. And the Rangers are looking into Viktor Fasth right now, so what is your point? And Scott Stajcer is playing really well. So what is your point? We clearly don't lack goaltending...
Oh, we are looking @ Fasth, i guess in your world that means he is ours.

When did Stajcer sign? He is playing so well that his team switched to a different goalie.

What is your point?

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05-09-2011, 04:31 PM
  #182
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Originally Posted by Orr Nightmare View Post
Oh, we are looking @ Fasth, i guess in your world that means he is ours.

When did Stajcer sign? He is playing so well that his team switched to a different goalie.

What is your point?
The point is that we have the best goaltender in the NHL and a good backup to him. Not every organization has 3-4 goalies who can be NHL starters. We're lucky we were able to get Biron for so cheap. We're not hurting for goaltending by ANY stretch of the imagination.

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05-09-2011, 04:33 PM
  #183
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Originally Posted by Steven Mastrosimone View Post
Lazy piece of ****? I didn't like Lisin, but I don't think you can question his work ethic. His hockey sense is just pathetically bad.

As for you second point, I think the organization's goaltending depth is fine for now. We have Lundqvist, Biron, Talbot, and Johnson. Unless you get two injuries to two capable starting goalies, which rarely happens, it's actually solid. Lundqvist/Biron is one of, if not the best, goalie duos in the NHL.

I could also see the Rangers drafting a Gibson bro in the 2nd round.
So, we have no problem wasting the 6th pick in a draft and then ship the guy away for nothing and now have to look at him on our most bitter rival.

Now, we have to waste another high end pick on a goaltender when maybe we should have just held onto what we have instead of giving guys a year or two to develop.

Look @ Detroit, Jimmy Howard was in the minors for years...

When you have Chad Johnson on your playoff roster, I find it hard to believe that we are in good shape depth wise.

Hank goes down and then you have Biron playing every game with Talbot or Johnson as the backup, are you fine with that?

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05-09-2011, 04:34 PM
  #184
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Originally Posted by Orr Nightmare View Post
So, we have no problem wasting the 6th pick in a draft and then ship the guy away for nothing and now have to look at him on our most bitter rival.

Now, we have to waste another high end pick on a goaltender when maybe we should have just held onto what we have instead of giving guys a year or two to develop.

Look @ Detroit, Jimmy Howard was in the minors for years...

When you have Chad Johnson on your playoff roster, I find it hard to believe that we are in good shape depth wise.

Hank goes down and then you have Biron playing every game with Talbot or Johnson as the backup, are you fine with that?
I have no problem with Montoya on the Island because Montoya is an incredibly average goaltender. We should be more upset we drafted him in the first place.

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05-09-2011, 04:35 PM
  #185
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Originally Posted by BlueshirtBlitz View Post
The point is that we have the best goaltender in the NHL and a good backup to him. Not every organization has 3-4 goalies who can be NHL starters. We're lucky we were able to get Biron for so cheap. We're not hurting for goaltending by ANY stretch of the imagination.
ok, but wouldn't it look better if we still had Montaya instead of 3 guys who never really had an impact on our team

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05-09-2011, 04:36 PM
  #186
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Originally Posted by Orr Nightmare View Post
Oh, we are looking @ Fasth, i guess in your world that means he is ours.

When did Stajcer sign? He is playing so well that his team switched to a different goalie.

What is your point?
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...php?pid=109647 Look at Stajcer's stats this year and tell me he isn't good. And last time I checked, depth which you said we don't have, is all around, not just signed players.

We have his rights, basically meaning he is part of our depth. Any player we draft is part of our depth. And Fasth obviously isn't ours, you don't have to state the obvious. But with Lundqvist starting, Biron backing-up and Stajcer playing well, we clearly have good depth.

Edit: oh and by looking into Fasth, they are clearly trying to add more depth

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05-09-2011, 04:37 PM
  #187
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ok, but wouldn't it look better if we still had Montaya instead of 3 guys who never really had an impact on our team
So you're making a big deal out of not having Montoya when we have an equal, if not better, goalie in Biron backing up Hank?

If Hank AND Biron goes down, Montoya is not going to help us stay respectable. Just like Johnson or Talbot wouldn't.

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05-09-2011, 04:38 PM
  #188
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Originally Posted by BlueshirtBlitz View Post
I have no problem with Montoya on the Island because Montoya is an incredibly average goaltender. We should be more upset we drafted him in the first place.
Trust me, I am not high on Montoya at all...but my point is...we do not give guys enough time to develop.

Werek will be a good player in the NHL.

I am not saying the kid we got isn't going to be a good player but Werek wasn't given a chance.

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05-09-2011, 04:38 PM
  #189
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Originally Posted by wolfgaze View Post
Pretty sure someone on this board with knowledge of the player said Korpikoski wanted out.
On the other hand people said Prucha slept with Renney's daughter on this board lol. Take EVERYTHING with a grain of salt hahaha

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05-09-2011, 04:39 PM
  #190
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Originally Posted by Orr Nightmare View Post
So, we have no problem wasting the 6th pick in a draft and then ship the guy away for nothing and now have to look at him on our most bitter rival.
You act as if it's a big deal that he's on the Islanders. It's not. He was a mediocre goaltender when we picked him, and still, he's a mediocre goaltender now.

Quote:
Now, we have to waste another high end pick on a goaltender when maybe we should have just held onto what we have instead of giving guys a year or two to develop.
Montoya has been moved twice - and was traded for a 6th. Obviously, the Rangers aren't the only ones who thought he was a lost cause.

Quote:
Look @ Detroit, Jimmy Howard was in the minors for years...
Jimmy Howard is a much better fundamental goaltender than Montoya.

Quote:
When you have Chad Johnson on your playoff roster, I find it hard to believe that we are in good shape depth wise.
Not really, considering the fact that Biron was injured in a freak incident. Johnson is fine as a backup when he's in a situation where he won't even sniff any important minutes.

Quote:
Hank goes down and then you have Biron playing every game with Talbot or Johnson as the backup, are you fine with that?
Biron as a starter for a few weeks wouldn't be the end of the world. You can't just hold onto players because a player at that position "could" get injured.

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05-09-2011, 04:40 PM
  #191
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Originally Posted by Orr Nightmare View Post
Trust me, I am not high on Montoya at all...but my point is...we do not give guys enough time to develop.

Werek will be a good player in the NHL.

I am not saying the kid we got isn't going to be a good player but Werek wasn't given a chance.
But this is simply untrue when we gave Brian Boyle a chance to prove himself. I understand what you're saying but I think you're making a big deal out of bottom 6 transactions that really aren't that big.

If this kid can bring his FO percentage here i'll put him on the 4th line right now.

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05-09-2011, 04:42 PM
  #192
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Originally Posted by HagelinForPresident View Post
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...php?pid=109647 Look at Stajcer's stats this year and tell me he isn't good. And last time I checked, depth which you said we don't have, is all around, not just signed players.

We have his rights, basically meaning he is part of our depth. Any player we draft is part of our depth. And Fasth obviously isn't ours, you don't have to state the obvious. But with Lundqvist starting, Biron backing-up and Stajcer playing well, we clearly have good depth.

Edit: oh and by looking into Fasth, they are clearly trying to add more depth
ok, if you say so.

but read this...

http://www.hockeysfuture.com/teams/new_york_rangers

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05-09-2011, 04:42 PM
  #193
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HagelinForPresident View Post
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...php?pid=109647 Look at Stajcer's stats this year and tell me he isn't good. And last time I checked, depth which you said we don't have, is all around, not just signed players.

We have his rights, basically meaning he is part of our depth. Any player we draft is part of our depth. And Fasth obviously isn't ours, you don't have to state the obvious. But with Lundqvist starting, Biron backing-up and Stajcer playing well, we clearly have good depth.
Stajcer has been up and down. He started off red-hot before the injury derailed his campaign, leading to the surgery that ended his regular season. He was brilliant in the playoffs until having a rough first two games in the Robertson Cup.

Until he demonstrates any semblance of consistency, we can't really count Stajcer as good depth. The injury is going to be a concern down the road as well. Having hip surgery is a huge deal for any hockey player, particularly a goaltender.

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05-09-2011, 04:43 PM
  #194
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Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
Stajcer has been up and down. He started off red-hot before the injury derailed his campaign, leading to the surgery that ended his regular season. He was brilliant in the playoffs until having a rough first two games in the Robertson Cup.

Until he demonstrates any semblance of consistency, we can't really count Stajcer as good depth. The injury is going to be a concern down the road as well. Having hip surgery is a huge deal for any hockey player, particularly a goaltender.
Maybe he'll be the next Timmy Thomas.

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05-09-2011, 04:44 PM
  #195
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Originally Posted by BlueshirtBlitz View Post
Maybe he'll be the next Timmy Thomas.
You never know. I didn't mean to imply that hip surgery is a death sentence for a goalie, but it's definitely a huge concern.

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05-09-2011, 04:45 PM
  #196
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An overlooked aspect of this is that the Rangers needed to sign him, or else lose him to re-entry in the draft. Considering the Rangers are approaching the max 50 contracts (assuming they cut bait with some of the expired contracts, and bring in Stajcer, Wilson, Campbell, possibly Maggio, I expect Thomas to get a contract), and they need to keep a spot open for Kreider, it makes sense that they bought some time here.

Lindberg is signed in SEL through 2012-2013 (he will be 21 at that point, turns 22 in October). There's plenty of time to sign him, unlike with Werek who needed to be signed in the next month.

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05-09-2011, 04:46 PM
  #197
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You never know. I didn't mean to imply that hip surgery is a death sentence for a goalie, but it's definitely a huge concern.
Oh I know, I was just kidding. Either way though, i'm not high on our goaltending depth at all. I'm an advocate of drafting Euro goalies later in the draft. However, with Hank and Biron at the front of the pack it turns a possible issue into a non-issue at all, IMO.

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05-09-2011, 04:47 PM
  #198
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You don't draft Werek because you expect him to be as talented as Thomas. You draft him because he's a ***** to play against, because he doesn't give up on plays, because he's reliable at both ends of the ice, and because he's smarter than most of his peers. I'm not going to let one season of struggles and injuries wipe away everything he did in the past. He exemplified leadership and smart, two-way play with a physical edge.

Yes, skating is very important in this league. More important than ever. But as we saw with Brian Boyle, skating is not impossible to fix. It's a lot harder to fix brains, but luckily, Werek already has that.

I can't imagine what you possibly saw that would have given you that impression, since he had a fantastic and stellar season the year we drafted him. But you said it yourself, you've not seen much of him.
That's a fair point of course, and I don't dissagree...

...My point is just, if you compare the overall talent level of Ethan Werek with the overall skill level of like a Artem Anisimov -- you have to agree with me that Werek is substansially behind Anisimov. And then when you see Anisimov, you see that why he is good at the NHL level, if he was a lot less talented he would have to be helluva good in other areas to make up for that. And while -- like you said -- Werek is tough to play against, clutch, aggressive and what-not, in the end, my impression of him was that he was pretty far from a good NHL player.

Like I said, I've not seen a lot of him, but just from the little I've seen of him, the wibe I got was that his attribute didn't add up to a NHL-caliber player. You need to remember that if you do not skate well in the NHL, its not enough to be very good, you have to be extremely good in other areas. And Werek wasn't even very good. If you can't skate, games will go by between you get a chance. Thats really the difference between the NHL, heck even the AHL these days, and junior hockey.


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05-09-2011, 04:47 PM
  #199
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Originally Posted by Orr Nightmare View Post
ok, if you say so.

but read this...

http://www.hockeysfuture.com/teams/new_york_rangers
Ok, I agree with the fact that we have no set in stone "future" goaltender. But Hank is only 29 and goalies have good durability. We still have time to find/draft a future goalie, it doesn't necessarily need to be addressed now.

Also you wouldn't be wasting high draft picks on goalies, I think Lundqvist going 205th overall just proves that where a goalie is drafted has no bearing on how good they turn out to be.

We can pick goalies with our 5th, 6th, or 7th round picks and we will more than likely get one that turns out to be a solid future NHL goalie

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05-09-2011, 04:51 PM
  #200
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Originally Posted by Steven Mastrosimone View Post
You act as if it's a big deal that he's on the Islanders. It's not. He was a mediocre goaltender when we picked him, and still, he's a mediocre goaltender now.



Montoya has been moved twice - and was traded for a 6th. Obviously, the Rangers aren't the only ones who thought he was a lost cause.



Jimmy Howard is a much better fundamental goaltender than Montoya.



Not really, considering the fact that Biron was injured in a freak incident. Johnson is fine as a backup when he's in a situation where he won't even sniff any important minutes.



Biron as a starter for a few weeks wouldn't be the end of the world. You can't just hold onto players because a player at that position "could" get injured.
What happens after next year and Biron is a free agent?

I just see a baron system in terms of goaltending and we have been very lucky that Hank hasn't gotten hurt.

This has nothing to do with Montoya but they just give guys time to develop.

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