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Jaromir Jagr

View Poll Results: Do you think Jaromir will be back with the NYR (after retiring) in some capacity?
Yes, as a representative of the organization 11 8.66%
Yes, as a guest at special Ranger events 57 44.88%
No, Sather has permanently burned that bridge 68 53.54%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 127. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
05-09-2011, 12:53 PM
  #126
Bleed Ranger Blue
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Dont get me wrong, I love Jagr as a player, and I enjoyed watching him here (although I can certainly understand the argument regarding how his reemergence fooled management into believing this team was closer to truly contending than it really was).

But anyway, for those of you who have followed him throughout his career, do you really think "cheap contract" or "limited role" are terms that he'd be happy with?

I bet he enjoyed playing here, but I also bet he loved making $9M+ in actual dollars and being able to do whatever the hell he wanted to do a lot more.

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05-09-2011, 12:53 PM
  #127
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Originally Posted by Sting36e View Post
Those contracts don't happen if the team actually rebuilt instead of acquiring Jagr and signing his friends. I have nothing against Jagr. He's probably the greatest European player of all time. But he shouldn't have been on this team, and I'll never understand this attachment Ranger fans have for him. I, for one, think it's a shame that he's the holder of some important team records, especially when he achieved those records in a season full of statistical anomalies.
Why just pick out one season? The New York Rangers are an Original Six team and you can point to entire generations of hockey and deem them "statistical anomalies." The 2005-2006 season ranks 37th all time in goals per game. Many of the seasons 37 and lower include seasons in which Mario Lemiuex and Wayne Gretzky were putting up tremendous scoring numbers. Does that mean that we need to rethink the value of their achievements in light of league averages?

The season Adam Graves scored 52? 1993-1994. 31st all time in league wide goals per game. More scoring that season than in the season Jagr achieved his record. So I guess both of those records don't count?

I see your point about the rebuild. I don't see you're point about Jagr having the Rangers scoring record.

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05-09-2011, 02:44 PM
  #128
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I think Jagr comes back to the NHL only where his presence might help a team win a Cup. Probably a year or two in Pitt if anything. There he could save himself for playoffs and still be ~ PPG.

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05-09-2011, 04:26 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by Czech Your Math View Post
I think Jagr comes back to the NHL only where his presence might help a team win a Cup. Probably a year or two in Pitt if anything. There he could save himself for playoffs and still be ~ PPG.
Would he still be at a point per game though? He is in the KHL, but that's a far cry from the NHL. Obviously a deep offensive team like Pittsburgh would help inflate his numbers, but I don't think he'd see enough minutes to score like that. He's 39, 40 by next ASG. He has slowed down quite a bit.

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05-09-2011, 07:19 PM
  #130
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Would he still be at a point per game though? He is in the KHL, but that's a far cry from the NHL. Obviously a deep offensive team like Pittsburgh would help inflate his numbers, but I don't think he'd see enough minutes to score like that. He's 39, 40 by next ASG. He has slowed down quite a bit.
Honestly if Jagr was still playing in the NHL I'd see him being good for about 60 points. I still think he could control the puck like he usually does and outright dominate at times, but I don't see him putting up the points of his younger days. Also if you read his quotes, he sounds like *if* he comes back to the NHL he doesn't want to be the "guy" seems like he'd rather be a second line type who sees occasional first line duty at this point in his career, but he does not sound like he wants to be a franchise player anymore.

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05-09-2011, 07:33 PM
  #131
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Can't wait to watch Jags play on Wednesday morning

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05-09-2011, 09:19 PM
  #132
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bring him back to NY I'm all for it, id rather pay him a few mil more then sign prospal

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05-09-2011, 09:34 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
Would he still be at a point per game though? He is in the KHL, but that's a far cry from the NHL. Obviously a deep offensive team like Pittsburgh would help inflate his numbers, but I don't think he'd see enough minutes to score like that. He's 39, 40 by next ASG. He has slowed down quite a bit.
On a team like Pittsburgh, he would be over a PPG. The guy is an absolute monster physically and on the PP, with a little bit of help, he would be masterful still.

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05-10-2011, 09:42 AM
  #134
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On a team like Pittsburgh, he would be over a PPG. The guy is an absolute monster physically and on the PP, with a little bit of help, he would be masterful still.
Exactly.

Even with the Rangers, they have enough secondary scoring that Jagr could be a PPG player here to.

Players like Dubinksy, Gaborik and Callahan would benefit immensely from Jagr's presence.

The question is Jagr still willing to accept being the main guy?

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05-10-2011, 09:52 AM
  #135
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Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
On a team like Pittsburgh, he would be over a PPG. The guy is an absolute monster physically and on the PP, with a little bit of help, he would be masterful still.
What people don't realize is that numbers do not translate directly from the KHL to NHL.

It doesn't mean if you score 50 Pts in 50 games in the KHL that it means you are automatically under a PPG in the NHL because of the "perceived lower quality of play" in the KHL.

The KHL is a completely different game. It is lower scoring and penalties are not called as stricktly as they are in the NHL.

The ice surfaces are larger and require more skating and therefore less time on the ice because of fatigue.

Jagr however has been playing over 21 minutes a game the last 3 years in the KHL.

If you watch him play in this World Championship, you can clearly see he still is a world class player and NHL caliber and not the 50-60 Pts ranger but rather a player capable of being PPG easily.


Last edited by livewell68: 05-10-2011 at 09:58 AM.
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05-10-2011, 12:24 PM
  #136
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Jagr is not coming back to the NHL.

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05-10-2011, 12:32 PM
  #137
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Originally Posted by Radek27 View Post
Jagr is not coming back to the NHL.
You have a source for this?

Are you Jagr? Are you his trainer, agent?

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05-10-2011, 12:43 PM
  #138
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Originally Posted by jags6868 View Post
You have a source for this?

Are you Jagr? Are you his trainer, agent?
The fact that he's 39 tells me this.

The fact that he just signed another contract to play in the KHL tells me this.

And yes he said as much when he left the Rangers. His plan was to play till he felt he couldn't anymore in the NHL then finish his last few seasons playing in Europe. This is exactly what he has done so why would I think now anything is different? Do you have anything that would suggest this is an option for him?

If so what team would want him?

How much would he want? He makes good money in the KHL.

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05-10-2011, 02:43 PM
  #139
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3Four3 View Post
You're okay with Prospal coming back but you're not okay with this organization trying to see if he still has something to offer?

We gave Fedotenko a shot and he did "splendid" come playoff time. "Oh, but he was 'awesome in the regular season!" 25 points?!
Neither are demanding the type of contract Jagr would.

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05-10-2011, 03:11 PM
  #140
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Originally Posted by jags6868 View Post
Exactly.

Even with the Rangers, they have enough secondary scoring that Jagr could be a PPG player here to.

Players like Dubinksy, Gaborik and Callahan would benefit immensely from Jagr's presence.

The question is Jagr still willing to accept being the main guy?
Thats not the question. In fact, the question is probably completely the opposite.

Hes going to be 40 years old, so whether he can even still produce consistently in the NHL or not, the main question is will he be willing to accept being paid NOT as the main guy.

People can wax poetic about how he loved playing in New York, how exciting it was to watch him, blah, blah, blah. Well, he left because of money. 30 million in untaxed KHL money, to be exact. Hes also a guy thats been NOTORIOUS throughout his career as a malcontent if things aren't going the way he wants them to. Thats a HUGE red flag with a coach like Torts.

So, to me, the question isnt whether Jagr will accept being the "main guy" on this team - the question is if hes willing to not be.

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05-10-2011, 05:02 PM
  #141
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Thats not the question. In fact, the question is probably completely the opposite.

Hes going to be 40 years old, so whether he can even still produce consistently in the NHL or not, the main question is will he be willing to accept being paid NOT as the main guy.

People can wax poetic about how he loved playing in New York, how exciting it was to watch him, blah, blah, blah. Well, he left because of money. 30 million in untaxed KHL money, to be exact. Hes also a guy thats been NOTORIOUS throughout his career as a malcontent if things aren't going the way he wants them to. Thats a HUGE red flag with a coach like Torts.

So, to me, the question isnt whether Jagr will accept being the "main guy" on this team - the question is if hes willing to not be.
He left for the money? I'm sorry but if memory serves the Rangers walked away from him. He decided if he wasn't going to play for NY he would go KHL. He pretty much said this the whole season when asked about his contract situation. NYR or KHL.

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05-10-2011, 05:07 PM
  #142
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Seriously, how do we have a thread with 140 posts in it?

Don't get me wrong I would LOVE to have Jags back but don't you think it became pretty clear his intention was to stay in the KHL when he signed that 1 year contract extension with Omsk.

We need to move on from this. I know we all have this affection for Jagr because he basically saved the franchise post-lockout, we also need to accept the fact that he won't be back in the NHL.

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05-10-2011, 07:31 PM
  #143
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He left for the money? I'm sorry but if memory serves the Rangers walked away from him. He decided if he wasn't going to play for NY he would go KHL. He pretty much said this the whole season when asked about his contract situation. NYR or KHL.
Im sure the Rangers were the ones to walk away, as soon as they heard his demands. It wouldnt be any different this time around.

Jagr is a proud guy - nothing wrong with that, but no way in hell he comes here without the stature of being paid top dollar. Again, he made $30M tax free in the KHL over the last 3 seasons. That made the decision pretty easy.

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05-10-2011, 08:36 PM
  #144
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Seriously, how do we have a thread with 140 posts in it?

Don't get me wrong I would LOVE to have Jags back but don't you think it became pretty clear his intention was to stay in the KHL when he signed that 1 year contract extension with Omsk.

We need to move on from this. I know we all have this affection for Jagr because he basically saved the franchise post-lockout, we also need to accept the fact that he won't be back in the NHL.
He signed last year. He has not signed anything this year. The reports that surfaced were rumors and are mostly dated from last season.

At the moment Jagr is a free agent in the KHL and his contract expired.

Plekanec was quoted saying that right now Jagr is only focusing on the World Championship and hasn't decided wha he's going to do.

When the season was ending, Jagr had said that he was done with the KHL and that it was going to either be Kladno or the NHL.

Where are these reports that Jagr signed in the KHL again?

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05-10-2011, 08:39 PM
  #145
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He signed last year. He has not signed anything this year. The reports that surfaced were rumors and are mostly dated from last season.

At the moment Jagr is a free agent in the KHL and his contract expired.

Plekanec was quoted saying that right now Jagr is only focusing on the World Championship and hasn't decided wha he's going to do.

When the season was ending, Jagr had said that he was done with the KHL and that it was going to either be Kladno or the NHL.

Where are these reports that Jagr signed in the KHL again?
Honestly, who cares?

Do you honestly think Jagr is going to come here for 1 year/3 million?

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05-10-2011, 09:54 PM
  #146
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Honestly, who cares?

Do you honestly think Jagr is going to come here for 1 year/3 million?
I can really see him coming back for one more year in the NHL and that's it.

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05-10-2011, 10:23 PM
  #147
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The ship has sailed, Jagr isn't coming back. You saw how he dogged it before he left, how would Torts handle that? Forget it, maybe if Renney was still coach.

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05-10-2011, 11:54 PM
  #148
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What people don't realize is that numbers do not translate directly from the KHL to NHL.

It doesn't mean if you score 50 Pts in 50 games in the KHL that it means you are automatically under a PPG in the NHL because of the "perceived lower quality of play" in the KHL.

The KHL is a completely different game. It is lower scoring and penalties are not called as stricktly as they are in the NHL.

The ice surfaces are larger and require more skating and therefore less time on the ice because of fatigue.

Jagr however has been playing over 21 minutes a game the last 3 years in the KHL.

If you watch him play in this World Championship, you can clearly see he still is a world class player and NHL caliber and not the 50-60 Pts ranger but rather a player capable of being PPG easily.
I still hold to my 60 point prediction if he were to comeback and my reasons are this (and they have nothing to do with KHL stats since as we all know the case of Marcel Hossa proves them pointless):

1) he's older. he needs more recovery time. he can't play 25 minutes a night consistently in an NHL schedule anymore, that's just not smart. less minutes = less points

2) he'd still be a dominant player but a lot of dominant players are not PPG players. Marian Hossa is a dominant player in the same mold as Jagr (puck possession, good balance, great wrist shot, big but not overly physical, and a magical passer/stickhandler), but he rarely is a PPG player...Hossa hasn't been PPG since the last time Jagr was PPG in the NHL as a matter of fact...2006-07.

3) his last season in the NHL, he was a 70 point player. OK that was under Tom Renney and playing with poor linemates but it was also 3 seasons ago and Jagr's skills are bound to have declined proportionally with age. I bet he could still dangle and look like his old self, but I just don't see the results being there night in and night out if he were to come back. So still holding to 60-65 points.

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05-10-2011, 11:59 PM
  #149
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Is Jagr the king of double talk? He's been out of the NHL for 3 years now and it seems every year he's making statements about potentially returning to the NHL and then re-upping in the KHL.

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05-11-2011, 12:05 AM
  #150
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You guys think Gaborik without an elite center is a problem? Jagr at this stage would be 1000 times worse.

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