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Overthinking the Power Play?

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Old
10-14-2003, 05:47 AM
  #1
PineJockey
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Overthinking the Power Play?

I'm worried about our powerplay. Not the usual worry about how bad it is, but worried because of all of the attention that is being placed on it in practice. I know it sounds ridiculous to say that it shouldn't be emphasized in practice but hear me out.

I wonder if all of the attention placed on it in practice (and in the media) has guys doing way too much "thinking" out there instead of just playing. It looks like they are afraid of making mistakes rather than trying to make plays. This is usually the result of over-coaching and trying to get players to run some sort of system. As soon as you put too much emphasis on a system then you can have problems. I think I'm starting to agree with Bowman that these guys are good enough to score when they have a man advantage so the coaches should just put out the right people and get the heck out of the way. In Dryden's book he talks a lot about how Lafleur was the worst on the team in running the powerplay in practice. The guy just could not run the system without totally screwing it up, which was apparently hilarious for the other players - he played totally on instinct.

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10-14-2003, 05:53 AM
  #2
thome_26
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I copmletely see your point. But there has to be some direction for the players out there. They have to know what his team-mate will do if he passes to one player and the other to another player. But what they have them doing on the powerplay is the same patheticly laughable thing they did last year. They move the puck VERY VERY VERY slowly, they're either to picky about a shot or rush the shot because fans are screaming their ignorant faces off (I hate when fans yell SHOOT every time a guy has 1/2 a second in the offensive zone on the powerplay!!!!).

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10-14-2003, 10:29 AM
  #3
LoudmouthHemskyfan#1
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Our problem actually has nothing to do with once we get into the zone. Our problem is we have an absolutely HORRENDOUS powerplay break-in. We need to be flying to that puck off of HARD dump-ins, or skating it deep. None of this flip it and wait or turn-sideways-at-the-blueline garbage anymore.

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10-14-2003, 10:43 AM
  #4
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I also think there's something to be said about practising the *mechanics* of it so that the player can react without thinking about the "how" to do something but thinking more about which play to make. And that would include the all-important part about gaining the zone...

Besides, I think we here (at least) would be going *completely* crazy if we discovered that they weren't practising the power-play at all, after an awful 0-for-9 game!

Bart

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10-14-2003, 11:51 AM
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barto
Besides, I think we here (at least) would be going *completely* crazy if we discovered that they weren't practising the power-play at all, after an awful 0-for-9 game!
LOL. Too true. Damned if you do and damned if you don't, I guess.

To be fair, though, it was a single game. Vancouver was 0-for-8 on that same game, yet I think their powerplay is going to be fine.

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10-14-2003, 12:03 PM
  #6
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And yesterday against Columbus, the Nucks were 0-4 and yet no one whines that their powerplay sucks.

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Old
10-14-2003, 12:54 PM
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilers89
And yesterday against Columbus, the Nucks were 0-4 and yet no one whines that their powerplay sucks.
2002-2003
Vancouver powerplay percentage.. 20.7 Third in the league.

2002-2003
Edmonton powerplay percentage... 14.5 19th in the league.

They have the proven track record. We don't. It's as simple as that.

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Old
10-14-2003, 01:09 PM
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by momentai
2002-2003
Vancouver powerplay percentage.. 20.7 Third in the league.

2002-2003
Edmonton powerplay percentage... 14.5 19th in the league.

They have the proven track record. We don't. It's as simple as that.
Add to that the fact that this is the OILERS message board, where fans (mostly) of the OILERS come to discuss things that, for the most part, relate to the OILERS. If we wanted to talk about the CANUCKS going "ofer" on their powerplays, we'd go to the CANUCKS board.

Besides that obvious fact, who gives a rat's @ss about the Canucks powerplay woes? The longer their powerplays in the can, the better our chances of climbing in the standings.

Here's hoping they go "ofer" for a long time

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10-14-2003, 01:33 PM
  #9
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I firmly believe in practicing a system till you can do it without thinking about it. You'll have more (and better) scoring opportunities, if you can rely on your teammates working the system with you. (yes, that includes the breakout pass)

If MacT was just hammering PP play into them over and over again, and the boys were not seeing any results, then perhaps they tune him out. Since they've already experienced some success, I think the boys are particularly attentive pupils, who want to continue to improve.

MacT and Simmer are doing a good thing.

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Old
10-14-2003, 01:47 PM
  #10
thome_26
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MacT sucks as a PP coach. Simpson hasn't improved it much IMO. Puck movement is still VERY slow and the plays they do make you could tell from the last row in commonwealth what they are doing before they do it. I agree that having a set PP is best. Look at the senators. It's usually fairly the same (haven't watched'm yet this yaer though as I've gotten no games avail! ) But they would have Bonk get the puck on the halfboards - he'd move slowly into the middle and if the high PKer went after him the puck when to the blueline where he came from creating more time and space. If the Low PKer came after him the infamous pass down-low and then the cross Ice pass to Havlat was used. If niether PKer attacked - then he skated in and got a good shooting lane and took a good shot with two guys right near the net. The best powerplay in the league they have IMO (the numbers can be decieving - as they don't have a Lidstrom or a Modano or any of them that make a HUGE difference, although Hossa is showing signs!). The OIlers PP is absolutly pitiful. It disgusts me. I hate it.

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10-14-2003, 02:02 PM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thome_26
MacT sucks as a PP coach. Simpson hasn't improved it much IMO. Puck movement is still VERY slow and the plays they do make you could tell from the last row in commonwealth what they are doing before they do it. I agree that having a set PP is best. Look at the senators. It's usually fairly the same (haven't watched'm yet this yaer though as I've gotten no games avail! ) But they would have Bonk get the puck on the halfboards - he'd move slowly into the middle and if the high PKer went after him the puck when to the blueline where he came from creating more time and space. If the Low PKer came after him the infamous pass down-low and then the cross Ice pass to Havlat was used. If niether PKer attacked - then he skated in and got a good shooting lane and took a good shot with two guys right near the net. The best powerplay in the league they have IMO (the numbers can be decieving - as they don't have a Lidstrom or a Modano or any of them that make a HUGE difference, although Hossa is showing signs!). The OIlers PP is absolutly pitiful. It disgusts me. I hate it.
You know this is really getting sickning. Everything Edmonton does sucks according to some fans. It's been two friggin games and already this team gets criticized for everything they do. Anaheim has lost 3 games and won 0 and nothing is said. I hate all this criticizm that fans are putting on the Oilers. Is it all necessary? I don't think so. You know what I really hate. All the criticizms that is thrown at the Oilers coaching staff. I hate it. I hate it. I hate it. The criticizm will only make the team play worse because it sure doesn't help. Give it a break already. It's only 2 friggin games.

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Old
10-14-2003, 02:14 PM
  #12
thome_26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilers89
You know this is really getting sickning. Everything Edmonton does sucks according to some fans. It's been two friggin games and already this team gets criticized for everything they do. Anaheim has lost 3 games and won 0 and nothing is said. I hate all this criticizm that fans are putting on the Oilers. Is it all necessary? I don't think so. You know what I really hate. All the criticizms that is thrown at the Oilers coaching staff. I hate it. I hate it. I hate it. The criticizm will only make the team play worse because it sure doesn't help. Give it a break already. It's only 2 friggin games.
If anything I am a homer. I over-value and am to easy in my opinion on the team more often then not. But I speak only the truth. It's two games plus 82 games from last year - their powerplay has no direction since Carter left - they had a bit when they tried to set him up for the one-timer.

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Old
10-14-2003, 02:19 PM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thome_26
MacT sucks as a PP coach. Simpson hasn't improved it much IMO. Puck movement is still VERY slow and the plays they do make you could tell from the last row in commonwealth what they are doing before they do it... The OIlers PP is absolutly pitiful. It disgusts me. I hate it.
C'mon thome, you can't possibly expect the PP to drastically improve in just 2 games.
"It's a work in progress." - MacT
We sucked, big time, last year and it's going to take a lot of practice and game play to change that this year.

How about we make a little wager?
If our PP finishes the year in the bottom 15, I'll eat my words. If we're in the top 15, you eat yours.

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Old
10-14-2003, 02:20 PM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LoudmouthHemskyfan#1
Our problem actually has nothing to do with once we get into the zone. Our problem is we have an absolutely HORRENDOUS powerplay break-in. We need to be flying to that puck off of HARD dump-ins, or skating it deep. None of this flip it and wait or turn-sideways-at-the-blueline garbage anymore.
Or the patented Niniimaa "carry the puck just across the blueline, stop, try and make a drop pass to a rushing forward, turnover the puck and watch the 3 on 1 odd man rush going the other way".

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10-14-2003, 02:21 PM
  #15
Ryno
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilers89
You know this is really getting sickning. Everything Edmonton does sucks according to some fans. It's been two friggin games and already this team gets criticized for everything they do. Anaheim has lost 3 games and won 0 and nothing is said. I hate all this criticizm that fans are putting on the Oilers. Is it all necessary? I don't think so. You know what I really hate. All the criticizms that is thrown at the Oilers coaching staff. I hate it. I hate it. I hate it. The criticizm will only make the team play worse because it sure doesn't help. Give it a break already. It's only 2 friggin games.
a question for you...

Do you copy and paste every post? Seriously, that's all I've ever heard from you, "Poor Kevin this", "Poor MacT that", "Kevin can't do anything right", (and, of course, my favorite) "This team gets criticized for eveything they do".

Well boo frickin' hoo!

Kevin's a big boy, he can handle any criticism that comes his way. You don't take a job like his and not expect to come under public scrutiny. You wanna know what else? MacT, Simmer, Huddy, Moores... they can all handle it too. To state that criticism will only make the team play worse is laughable at best, and downright ridiculous and absurd at worst. Ever hear the term "Constructive Criticism?" Well, consider yourself schooled

Now, before you play the martyr and comeback with some post about how everyone hates you, just like Kevin and the Oilers, stop and think about what you're posting. I don't hate you. I don't even know you. Nobody on this board hates you. In fact, I would venture a guess that nobody even knows you. But seriously, IMO you'd earn a lot of credibility back if you'd post something other than the whole "I Love Kevin" routine all the time.

There must be a few things you don't like about the Oilers? I mean, they aren't PERFECT in your eyes, right? C'mon, tell ol' Ryno here what's buggin ya about the Oilers. It's okay, it's good to let off the steam. Think of this as Oilers group therapy; the only difference is I 'm not charging ya $200 bucks an hour.

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Old
10-14-2003, 02:25 PM
  #16
momentai
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr_Gonz0
Or the patented Niniimaa "carry the puck just across the blueline, stop, try and make a drop pass to a rushing forward, turnover the puck and watch the 3 on 1 odd man rush going the other way".
That was never Janne's style of the powerplay. He wouldn't give up a 3 on 1 the other way.

A more ideal description would be a pass to the point and leaving Janne to bobble the puck and have it skip over the blueline just as we had momentum.

But given that... I'd take Niinimaa back in a second with no questions asked.

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Old
10-14-2003, 02:37 PM
  #17
thome_26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IceDragoon
C'mon thome, you can't possibly expect the PP to drastically improve in just 2 games.
"It's a work in progress." - MacT
We sucked, big time, last year and it's going to take a lot of practice and game play to change that this year.

How about we make a little wager?
If our PP finishes the year in the bottom 15, I'll eat my words. If we're in the top 15, you eat yours.
sure, I'm up for fun bets. And I must add that I hope that you are right! I would LOVE, absolutely LOVE to eat my words on this one. I hope upon hope that you make me eat my words! Don't get me wrong, I think there is potential, but you can tell just by what they have them trying to do that it isn't going to get better - unless they try something new (which they didn't last year)

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10-14-2003, 02:42 PM
  #18
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As per other posts, it IS only two games into the season. Personally, I'd wait to see the trend of their play over the first ten games or so before I'd begin to get anxious about anything.

Let 'em play a few first.

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Old
10-16-2003, 03:04 AM
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thome_26
I agree that having a set PP is best. Look at the senators. It's usually fairly the same (haven't watched'm yet this yaer though as I've gotten no games avail! ) But they would have Bonk get the puck on the halfboards - he'd move slowly into the middle and if the high PKer went after him the puck when to the blueline where he came from creating more time and space.
(First off, I don't disagree with you - in fact, I agree. Get a few set plays and practise them. Practise them til everybody does it instinctively.)

A few years ago, everybody (not necessarily here, I wasn't here then, but I'm going to guess it wasn't much different) was criticising the power play because it always wound up with Weight on the half-boards, and "all" that had to be done is block the passing lanes. (Yeah, and "all" you have to do to win a hockey game is to score more than the other guy does.) Last year it was bad because the puck went to Carter at the hashmarks for the one-timer. Maybe that's bad, maybe not - but Carter scored a fair few goals from that one-timer, and Weight threaded a fair number of needles that led to excellent scoring opportunities.

I just want to remind everybody what happens when the Oilers have a set system.

For myself, I think the problems on the PP are just the same as the ones they have playing even strength: they keep getting caught in the neutral zone and turn the puck over. Forwards are stopping at the blue line and waiting for the third guy to catch up. Low percentage passes are being made, and even decent ones are being missed.

I don't know how to fix that - I'm not a coach (but see my first paragraph). Hopefully Simmer and MacT can teach the kids how forwards like to receive passes at speed. Wonder if it's too late to hire Paul Coffey as an assistant coach. He could probably
them.

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10-16-2003, 03:05 AM
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thome_26
If anything I am a homer. I over-value and am to easy in my opinion on the team more often then not. But I speak only the truth. It's two games plus 82 games from last year - their powerplay has no direction since Carter left - they had a bit when they tried to set him up for the one-timer.
hah, that's what I get for posting before reading all the other posts. I wonder what Izzy's one-timer is like? He's big enough to sit at the hashmarks. Or perhaps Torres... anybody!

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10-16-2003, 03:06 AM
  #21
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Unfortunately, Coffey is the power play consultant in Phoenix.

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