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For those that think the Habs are a bad drafting team.

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Old
05-24-2011, 12:47 PM
  #76
Melvin Udall
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Nobody is saying that the habs are a bad drafting team. Most people are saying that they're 1st rounders could have been much better and that they are mediocre at developing their players.

The end-result though, as a sign of a drafting record that could be better, is that they had to buy to entirely reload their offensive power and paying big money to do so. Had to trade for an underachieving centerman who was already overpaid for their inability to get a centerman EVERYBODY was asking the team to get in so many years.

Strangely, the 3 greatest news this team has are named Price, Subban and Pacioretty. 3 draft picks. Way more than any guys we ended up buying. Draft is crucial and lately, we have to deal with not a whole lot of draft picks to let Timmins and his crew work their magic. Which this is not Timmins fault.

So an overall work in progress as far as this team is concerned. Good moves, not so good ones. So clearly not a bad drafting team, but wouldn't call them genius either. 'Cause at one point, you need the results to prove how genius you were. And that result has to come within the team.
Good post Whitesnake!

Overall the Habs have not been terrrible at drafting, but not nearly good enough to develop a Cup competitor.

Although in 2007 Timmins had a real good draft (wish Habs had kept McDonagh).

2009 + 2010 too early to tell how well they drafted.

I agree with you 100%.....the Draft is indeed crucial - for reasons you have pointed out.

One of my concerns is....Gauthier doesn't seem to have a problem trading 2nd + 3rd round draft chioces for
rental players




What if this is............as good a s it gets?


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05-24-2011, 12:56 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Melvin Udall View Post
Good post Whitesnake!

Overall the Habs have not been terrrible at drafting, but not nearly good enough to develop a Cup competitor.

Although in 2007 Timmins had a real good draft (wish Habs had kept McDonagh).

2009 + 2010 too early to tell how well they drafted.

I agree with you 100%.....the Draft is indeed crucial - for reasons you have pointed out.

One of my concerns is....Gauthier doesn't seem to have a problem trading 2nd + 3rd round draft chioces for
rental players




What if this is............as good a s it gets?


And I agree
I don't GM's like trading 2nd and 3rd rounders on rental players, but you can't really argue with the contributions of Moore and Wisniewski. LA paid 3 times the price for Penner and Wisniewski gave us 2-3 times the overall production.

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05-24-2011, 12:58 PM
  #78
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Vokoun was horrible as an Hab.

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05-24-2011, 01:12 PM
  #79
Melvin Udall
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Originally Posted by Mathradio View Post
Vokoun was horrible as an Hab.


Vokoun played 1 game for the Habs....was later taken in the expansion draft by Nashville!

Can't see how you can get an accurate assessment of a player after 1 game?




What if this is...as a good as it gets?


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05-24-2011, 01:13 PM
  #80
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Vokoun was horrible as an Hab.
He played one period with the NHL club, but he was a pretty good prospect...we had Theo and Thibeault at the time so he was the one not protected in the expansion draft.

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05-24-2011, 01:25 PM
  #81
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Pretty timely cause I was reading the latest hockey news mag (I believe it was the draft edition one) and the Habs always were in the top 5 of home grown talent in the line up (like up to 17 player in 2007-2008). It dropped a bit over the past two seasons.

FYI also the Habs have had the most success in the entire league drafting in the second round...

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05-24-2011, 01:28 PM
  #82
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He played one period with the NHL club, but he was a pretty good prospect...we had Theo and Thibeault at the time so he was the one not protected in the expansion draft.
That one game was against the Flyers at the height of the Legion of Doom line that regularly destroyed us like no other possibly in the history of the Habs.

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05-24-2011, 01:48 PM
  #83
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I don't think we are a bad DRAFTING team. I think that the DIRECTION of the team has been geared towards speed and skill without much regard to size until recently. I think it was done sequentially. Meaning we gathered as much speed/skill first, then tried to supplement with size.

I don't think a mid-round team ever has that luxury. You have to take the best player available that falls to you. And when you get a shot at a player with size/speed/skill, you have to roll the dice when all else is fairly equal. Cuz those are one in a million.

The Kostitsyn vs Getzlaf hindsight problem is case-in-point with many fans. They are both similar in size, and we were tempted into going for Kostitsyn's release. But he doesn't have the agility to have different release points, whereas Getzlaf has proven that his stickhandling and the WAY he uses his size more than makes up for any agility issues. Plus he's a mean sob.

In the same draft, we passed up on one of the most agile, multi-release shot players in recent draft history in Parise (don't tell me we could not have outbid Lamoriello... come on...). Now how do you explain this?

We're trying to hit the Datsyuk home run and go from there, which is not the way to go imo. At least not in the first round.


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05-24-2011, 03:55 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Nobody is saying that the habs are a bad drafting team. Most people are saying that they're 1st rounders could have been much better and that they are mediocre at developing their players.
See I don't get this. Why do those people feel that way? This list below is very good when you put it in context. You really can't blame the drafting here. Sure you can cherrypick better players in most years but that's almost always the case. And you can definitely cherrypick many more bad choices than good ones that happen immediately after our picks.

00: Ron Hainsey (13th) Marcel Hossa (16th)
01: Mike Komisarek (7th) Alexander Perezhogin (25th)
02: Chris Higgins (14th)
03: Andrei Kostitsyn (10th)
04: Kyle Chipchura (18th)
05: Carey Price (5th)
06: David Fischer (20th)
07: Ryan McDonagh, Max Pacioretty
09: Louis Leblanc
10: Jarred Tinordi

It's too soon to know anything about any of these players after 2006 so let's forget about them.

In 2000 we had two mid round picks. One panned out to be a good NHL player and the other didn't. Its a crapshoot on getting a good NHLer at this point and take a look at the rest of the field that year. There is the odd good player (Justin Williams) but that's about it. Hainsey was a good pick for where he went. He's been a pretty solid NHL player. Hossa seemed to have some talent but never put it together. In both cases we aren't talking high picks so if people are disapointed they should re-evaluate their expectations.

2001 we got two very good players. Komisarek was excellent until his fight with Lucic and then dissappeared. Once again though, look at that draft year. He's a very good pick for where he went. As for Perezhogin, count me among the group that sees development as the problem there. We totally mishandled this kid, he was good and the scouts deserve zero blame here. Carbo should be shot for how he handled him. Either way, he was 25th overall so you shouldn't expect much to begin with.

2002. Once again, Higgins is much better than the average 14th overall pick and was great until mashing up his ankle. Then he inexplicably turned into the man who couldn't buy a goal. He's certainly not a bad pick for where he went either. Once again, the scouts got it right. He showed all kinds of promise and should've been a perpetual 30 goal man for us. What happened to him I'll never know.

2003. This is the one that everyone points to as Exhibit A. Personally, I think AK has all the tools to be a superstar. He didn't put it together and had the misfortune of being compared against probably the deepest draft since 1979. If people want to complain about this so be it but I really don't blame the scouts here either. He's still a 25 goal scorer taken 10th overall. In most years, that would be very good. Even for 2003, it's really not that bad. He's still a good player.

2004. Another mid round pick. It's early in Chips' career but it looks like he was taken too high. I saw him play in Hamilton and thought he'd be great... obviously I was wrong on him too because I thought he'd win a Selke someday.

2005. Huge win (thanks to us getting ridiculously lucky in the lottery and lucking out on a top 5.) No need to talk about Price.

2006. Bust. Again though, you're talking about 20th overall. It's not that uncommon here.

It can always be better, but we're much better than average. Esp when you consider how well we do in the later rounds. If people want better players in the first round, we'll need to draft higher. We've had three top ten picks this decade and all three turned out to be good players. And our only top five looks like the next superstar. I don't have any problem with our drafting at all. We've done really, really well for ourselves.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
The end-result though, as a sign of a drafting record that could be better, is that they had to buy to entirely reload their offensive power and paying big money to do so. Had to trade for an underachieving centerman who was already overpaid for their inability to get a centerman EVERYBODY was asking the team to get in so many years.
And that's what got me so upset. We should've just stuck to the draft. We didn't have to make that horrible move. Nevermind the fact that we're stuck with Gomez, how bad will this trade look in 5-10 years from now when McD is in his prime?

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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Strangely, the 3 greatest news this team has are named Price, Subban and Pacioretty. 3 draft picks. Way more than any guys we ended up buying. Draft is crucial and lately, we have to deal with not a whole lot of draft picks to let Timmins and his crew work their magic. Which this is not Timmins fault.
Exactly. Our best players are the ones we've drafted and I expect that it will continue to be this way. That's why we should've traded for more picks rather than getting stuck with the overpaid guys we have now. It would've hurt short term but we'd have been better off in the long run.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
So an overall work in progress as far as this team is concerned. Good moves, not so good ones. So clearly not a bad drafting team, but wouldn't call them genius either. 'Cause at one point, you need the results to prove how genius you were. And that result has to come within the team.
I think a lot of those problems would've been solved with higher picks. Notice that on average the higher we drafted in the 1st round, the better the player is? It's almost linear and Price (5th) is our best by far. Meanwhile the guys who got drafted 18th or later haven't done much. This isn't coincidence. There will be the odd later 1st rounder who will outperform (here's hoping that it's MaxPac) but by and large the earlier picks will do much better.

We've got great scouting and we've done relatively well in the 1st round for where we've drafted. We've also done extremely well (relative to other clubs) in the later rounds. I just wish we could've given our scouts more high picks to work with because then we'd probably have some real superstars in our lineup.
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Originally Posted by dcyhabs View Post
I lived in Toronto when Boyes was lighting it up in the AHL. The headlines were "what can we get for him" and the fan discussions were "what can we get for him." The team went all out to win then and kept nothing for the future. It is no surprise that after the core of the late '90s early '00s team aged out there was no one to take over. Few fans can complain because most fans wanted to win then and blow draft picks.

Note that if those Leafs teams had managed a few wins more in the playoffs it would have been worth it.

Cereda is the only definite bust on that list, Tlusty still has time. It's not like most of the pre-2005 picks were that high, either.
The Leafs peddled really hard trading away picks and prospects in an effort to take short cuts and it killed them. Running to stand still is what I used to say, but now it's like they've run to go backwards. Definitely not the roadmap to follow. Which is why I was so glad that we didn't add Briere. Unfortunately though, we still wound up getting stuck with Gomez so...


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Old
05-25-2011, 10:07 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Nobody is saying that the habs are a bad drafting team. Most people are saying that they're 1st rounders could have been much better and that they are mediocre at developing their players.
Disagree. You cannot go around saying "what if . . ." forever. You will always find guys picked after yours that became better players. Projecting players beyond the first 3-4 in the usual draft -- yes, 2003 is an anomaly, but more on that -- is never a certainty.

As for 2003, did you all forget that Corey Perry didn't go until 28? A whole pile of teams (Hugh Jessiman?) blew that one.

What has happened, though, is that I think the Canadiens have gotten much more careful in the first round after the disaster that was 1985-2000. They draft a player at that spot who is destined to play in the NHL. They are drafting for certainty in the 1st round. The one time they didn't do that was with Fischer, but if you recall that was a terrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrible draft year top-to-bottom! The problem of 1985-2000 was drafting for perceived need every year. We needed a big left winger who could score: Mark Pederson, Terry Ryan. We needed a big centre: Matt Higgins, Eric Chouinard, Jason Ward. We need a big right winger: Turner Stevenson, Lindsay Vallis, Jose Charbonneau. We had to have a big mean defenseman: Brent Bilodeau, Eric Charron, Brad Brown.

The only time they really drafted the best player was Koivu. We'll never know how good he could have been b/c of all the injuries and all the terrible linemates. Know this: as a 2nd year player he was leading the league in scoring WELL INTO THE SEASON only to have the 1st of many career shortening and altering injuries. Funny, but he was the best player available, not the big, bad man that the fans and pundits were yelling about. Funny how it's always people on this board and on TSN who yell for those guys, too.

The players the Canadiens have drafted in the 1st round have been NHL players, with one exception. Chipchura's ceiling fell a lot with his tendon injury -- remarkable he can skate as well as he does -- but he's hanging on. Hossa, Perezhogin, were also 2nd picks in the 1st round and you can gamble a touch on those. The latter is certainly an NHL player and the former could have been with a work ethic to match the rest of his set. Overall, I'm happy.

I also think they've done tremendously well in later rounds b/c you can gamble.

PS Want to see a track record of futility in the 1st round, check out Boston. Beyond the can't miss of Joe Thornton, they have been terrible for over 20 years!

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05-25-2011, 10:08 AM
  #86
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Still doesn't make up for this

88: Eric Charron
89: Lindsay Vallis
90: Turner Stevenson
91: Brent Bilodeau
92: David Wilkie
93: Saaaaaakuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu!!!!!!!!!
94: Brad Brown
95: Terry Ryan
96: Matt Higgins
97: Jason Ward
98: Eric Chouinard
99:
Don't remind me of the nineties. It is one of the main reasons why we have been so bad in the last 15 years or so. The organization has only turned around a couple of seasons ago.

The Habs are good at drafting NHLers but two things stand out in my mind. The first is the fact that we cannot develop our players properly. The second is that we have problems integrating them on the team and lose patience quite quickly with some of them. Riberio for Niinimaa comes to mind. What is really frustrating is seeing that the team is an elite forward away or a couple of star forwards away from being perennial Cup contenders.

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05-25-2011, 11:38 PM
  #87
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Anyone still bent out of shape because we didn't move up in the 2007 draft to snag Angelo Esposito, and therefore had to settle for Max Pacioretty?

Or the big and famous Kevin Veilleux vs the small black d-man.... P.K. Subban...

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05-26-2011, 08:45 AM
  #88
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I remember 110% after that draft. Pissed we picked McDonagh over Esposito and pissed we picked Pacioretty over Perron.
I remember going over the list and having a gut feeling McD would drop far enough for us to grab him and that we would.

Was happy about it until they traded him. For a bit thought maybe he'd be a bust but nope, turned out to be a solid player. Oh well.

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05-26-2011, 11:22 PM
  #89
Melvin Udall
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I remember going over the list and having a gut feeling McD would drop far enough for us to grab him and that we would.

Was happy about it until they traded him. For a bit thought maybe he'd be a bust but nope, turned out to be a solid player. Oh well.

Hey,

Look at the bright side - HABS got Gomez for him (and others)....LOL!




What if this is....as good as it gets?


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05-26-2011, 11:39 PM
  #90
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Disagree. You cannot go around saying "what if . . ." forever. You will always find guys picked after yours that became better players. Projecting players beyond the first 3-4 in the usual draft -- yes, 2003 is an anomaly, but more on that -- is never a certainty.

As for 2003, did you all forget that Corey Perry didn't go until 28? A whole pile of teams (Hugh Jessiman?) blew that one.

What has happened, though, is that I think the Canadiens have gotten much more careful in the first round after the disaster that was 1985-2000. They draft a player at that spot who is destined to play in the NHL. They are drafting for certainty in the 1st round. The one time they didn't do that was with Fischer, but if you recall that was a terrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrible draft year top-to-bottom! The problem of 1985-2000 was drafting for perceived need every year. We needed a big left winger who could score: Mark Pederson, Terry Ryan. We needed a big centre: Matt Higgins, Eric Chouinard, Jason Ward. We need a big right winger: Turner Stevenson, Lindsay Vallis, Jose Charbonneau. We had to have a big mean defenseman: Brent Bilodeau, Eric Charron, Brad Brown.

The only time they really drafted the best player was Koivu. We'll never know how good he could have been b/c of all the injuries and all the terrible linemates. Know this: as a 2nd year player he was leading the league in scoring WELL INTO THE SEASON only to have the 1st of many career shortening and altering injuries. Funny, but he was the best player available, not the big, bad man that the fans and pundits were yelling about. Funny how it's always people on this board and on TSN who yell for those guys, too.

The players the Canadiens have drafted in the 1st round have been NHL players, with one exception. Chipchura's ceiling fell a lot with his tendon injury -- remarkable he can skate as well as he does -- but he's hanging on. Hossa, Perezhogin, were also 2nd picks in the 1st round and you can gamble a touch on those. The latter is certainly an NHL player and the former could have been with a work ethic to match the rest of his set. Overall, I'm happy.

I also think they've done tremendously well in later rounds b/c you can gamble.

PS Want to see a track record of futility in the 1st round, check out Boston. Beyond the can't miss of Joe Thornton, they have been terrible for over 20 years!
Interesting points. Speaking of the 2003 draft, one of the poorer picks was Fleury at #1, and to think the Penguins actually traded up to get him. I can name several goaltenders the Penguins could have taken that year or in subsequent drafts who would have done just as well. In the meantime they might have had one more top six forward or top four forward witheir #1 pick.

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05-27-2011, 11:21 AM
  #91
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Pretty timely cause I was reading the latest hockey news mag (I believe it was the draft edition one) and the Habs always were in the top 5 of home grown talent in the line up (like up to 17 player in 2007-2008). It dropped a bit over the past two seasons.

FYI also the Habs have had the most success in the entire league drafting in the second round...
Subban is the most important piece of them.

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Originally Posted by bipolarhabfan View Post
Don't remind me of the nineties. It is one of the main reasons why we have been so bad in the last 15 years or so. The organization has only turned around a couple of seasons ago.

The Habs are good at drafting NHLers but two things stand out in my mind. The first is the fact that we cannot develop our players properly. The second is that we have problems integrating them on the team and lose patience quite quickly with some of them. Riberio for Niinimaa comes to mind. What is really frustrating is seeing that the team is an elite forward away or a couple of star forwards away from being perennial Cup contenders.
Don't forget: Montreal is a pressure cooker also.

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05-27-2011, 08:21 PM
  #92
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Disagree. You cannot go around saying "what if . . ." forever. You will always find guys picked after yours that became better players. Projecting players beyond the first 3-4 in the usual draft -- yes, 2003 is an anomaly, but more on that -- is never a certainty.

As for 2003, did you all forget that Corey Perry didn't go until 28? A whole pile of teams (Hugh Jessiman?) blew that one.

What has happened, though, is that I think the Canadiens have gotten much more careful in the first round after the disaster that was 1985-2000. They draft a player at that spot who is destined to play in the NHL. They are drafting for certainty in the 1st round. The one time they didn't do that was with Fischer, but if you recall that was a terrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrible draft year top-to-bottom! The problem of 1985-2000 was drafting for perceived need every year. We needed a big left winger who could score: Mark Pederson, Terry Ryan. We needed a big centre: Matt Higgins, Eric Chouinard, Jason Ward. We need a big right winger: Turner Stevenson, Lindsay Vallis, Jose Charbonneau. We had to have a big mean defenseman: Brent Bilodeau, Eric Charron, Brad Brown.

The only time they really drafted the best player was Koivu. We'll never know how good he could have been b/c of all the injuries and all the terrible linemates. Know this: as a 2nd year player he was leading the league in scoring WELL INTO THE SEASON only to have the 1st of many career shortening and altering injuries. Funny, but he was the best player available, not the big, bad man that the fans and pundits were yelling about. Funny how it's always people on this board and on TSN who yell for those guys, too.

The players the Canadiens have drafted in the 1st round have been NHL players, with one exception. Chipchura's ceiling fell a lot with his tendon injury -- remarkable he can skate as well as he does -- but he's hanging on. Hossa, Perezhogin, were also 2nd picks in the 1st round and you can gamble a touch on those. The latter is certainly an NHL player and the former could have been with a work ethic to match the rest of his set. Overall, I'm happy.

I also think they've done tremendously well in later rounds b/c you can gamble.

PS Want to see a track record of futility in the 1st round, check out Boston. Beyond the can't miss of Joe Thornton, they have been terrible for over 20 years!
And it's not about "what if" forever 'cause yes, everybody knows everybody could have picked a better player every year. Yet, it's about the overall talent of your team and your overall progression. Flyers are not progressing because they don't have a goalie...but needless to say that only with guys like Richards, Carter and Giroux, they have been able to build a relatively great corps of forwards and were at one point relatively cheap. Add a goalie to that team, and there great picks look much better. Yet, even without a goalie, they had a Cup final not so long ago. Yes, Pronger has also something to do with that.

Everybody knows great players were forgotten....tons of teams did the same thing and all but yet, you have to draw a conclusion at some point and after 7 years of Gainey-Timmins drafting, I'm pretty sure it's a fine analysis. Analysis that says that those guys recognizes NHL talent....but never were able to address that big centerman we needed or the superior talent we could have had.....though Price should fit in that spot. And sure is Subban. But as of now, there are no REAL tangibles proofs as far as position in the standings or playoffs performances. Yes, this team improved over the Réjean Houle's team. So yes there is improvement...but not sure that you can mention how a team does incredibly well when they have improved from freakin Réjean Houle. Though some would like to forget that André Savard started the job that Gainey took over but that's another story. Our #1 centerman was still drafted not during the Gainey era. But because of the lack of awareness for that position, the Gainey era centerman's name is Scott Gomez. And I believe that's a problem as far as the draft is concerned. When you have to buy your offensive core, in a cap world, it has to mean that you've missed the boat in more than 1 occasion. Now, I als mentioned it's not ALL about the draft. 'Cause MY favorites, the guys I kept whining about, have ALL been drafted by Timmins.....McDo, SKost, Grabs, Lats, Streit, all great draft picks with the potential of being GREAT players were let go from some reasons. So development is also a BIG part of the equation.

Then, I'm pretty sure I've said we're not awful but we're not genius either. Which fits your bad track records of Boston and some other teams, 'cause if we're not awful, it means others were. And yes, there are worst teams....but I didn't say the contrary. Though chances are with Kessel, their future at the center position is secure with Seguin....and they'll get another great player this year. Add Joe Colborne who while traded will certainly become a good player. The rest looks meh...for sure....just like other teams which makes them worst than us....If we are not the worst, it means other are.

But all and all, it's not about "We missed that guy in 2004" or "we missed that guy in the 3rd round in 2007"...it's about looking at the overall shape of team and realizing that until now we have as key players guys like Price an Subban who are totally looking as great picks....but we will need results to prove it. MaxPac could also be that guy but it still remains to be seen. Can TOTALLY prove it...but we can't say it did already.

But I believe there is a difference between the 90's "go bigger" syndrom and what how it could have been addressed in 2000. Why? 'Cause at one point you thought that the ONLY concern was to get bigger. Nobody seemed to thought about foot speed, agility, hockey sense and all.....Something which none of those players had. Mind you, some of those players were also pencilled to go around that spot so if going with AKost 'cause he was pencilled to go high is an excuse, so is going with guys we went with in the 1990's....'cause chances are the Habs didn't go with Terry Ryan while this guy was just supposed to go in the 9th round wasn't he?

So it's not always about being big. I did have Getzlaf as my favorite in 2003 but guess who was next? Parise. Kosty was 3rd on my list. I didn't have Carter nor did I have Perry or Richards or Kesler. My point as far as that draft was concerned is that there were some legitimate concerns as far as Kosty was concerned. Hockey sense being one of them. Overall play while nobody had any concerns over his offensive talent, was named top 5 pure offensive talent of the draft, the other aspects of his game was a big question mark. At that time, not only 2003 was mentioned as a safe draft but also a safe draft with potential stars in it. I don't think it was the kind of year to risk it. Chipchura? Well surely I guess his injury was a problem, but geez the guy never did anything offensively in the W. And even after that draft, Timmins was already mentioning that he was penciled as a 3rd centerman...type of player you pick in the 1st round? But yes, it wasn't a great draft....I liked Green...and Korpikoski. 2005? Great draft and great gamble in Price. 2006...if we would treat the Q the way Detroit treats Sweden...we would NOT have let Giroux pass. And if we would have concentrated in getting bigger and talent at the center position, we would not have let Berglund pass by. I can tell you that one of the reasons Berglund was not chosen by the Habs is that at one point before he was picked, he had the choice between moving to play with a better team or stayed near his home and help his local team to which he chose to do. Timmins didn't appreciate it and called it a sign of not wanting to progress. Other scouts called it loyalty. So we decided to go with a total boom or bust, was known that way then. 2007....great 1st round. McDo WILL be a good player....so will MaxPac. When you have 2 picks in 1 round, you need to do what Anaheim did or what Philly did...Getzlaf/Perry, Richards/Carter...would McDo/MaxPac be those types of players...possible they do. But we won't see it here with McDo, a shame based on who we got for him. 2009....we will see. I was a Leblanc fan. Loved other players....remains to be seen if Leblanc can be top 6. Remains to be seen if Tinordi can be top 4. I'm NOT going to bash those picks. Way too soon, can't believe some are doing it but.....there is some questions you can ask. A team like the Habs who clearly prefers the US over any other leagues has to have the advantage over some of the other teams. So you start wondering how can they not have liked what guys like Kreider or Coyle brings to the game. And that we would have CLEARLY needed.

But I like I also mentioned....it's also about development, something Timmins doesn't have the last word. Not the worst, not genius. And that's more an organization appreciation than a Timmins one. 'Cause if Grabs, Lats, SKost, Streit are still Habs...with or without 1st rounder wonders....Timmins looks MUCH better. But it all goes with end results, progression in the regular standings, not continual 8th place battles and playoffs performances. We did reach the 3rd round last year.....thanks to a 9th rounder in 2003....

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05-31-2011, 09:24 PM
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Do we have a good record with UFA prospects?

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05-31-2011, 09:52 PM
  #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
I can't stand it when people bring up the development nonsense. This team spends a ton of time/money on player development and if a player never develops, then the player simply never had it to begin with. Guys like Ryan, Wilkie, Bilodeau, Chouinard simply couldn't skate. Fischer has the intellect of a bag of hammers and was the running joke at the draft combine.

Short of a trip to the Wizard of Oz, there wasn't any hope in developing any of these players.

Fischer = Straw Man (No brain)
Latendresse = Tin Man (No heart)
Chouinard = Lion (No courage)
Ribeiro = Dorothy (You know why)
Perezhogin = Toto........The Wicked Witch (KHL) took him away.
Really ? Tell me more about that. I so hate that pick I could finally have a good laugh at it...

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