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habs willing to move down to gain a 2nd rd pick

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Old
06-01-2011, 04:33 PM
  #1
shayne
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habs willing to move down to gain a 2nd rd pick

17th up for grabs if they could pick up a 2nd rd pick, any thoughts

i think the leafs would do it, any other teams interested

i would think moving down 5-8 spots and gaining a pick would be decent as long as they still get a decent kid in the 1st, i have heard that 15-25 are pretty interchangable depending on team needs

the habs have done this in the past as well as move up and pay the same kinda price(last year with tinordi)

i think they would move down if they could still get phillips or jensen and pick up maybe a phillip danault or xavier ouellet

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06-01-2011, 04:34 PM
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Phion Keneuf
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29th + 39th for 17?

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06-01-2011, 04:35 PM
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St.Louis puts in a phone call.

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06-01-2011, 04:40 PM
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TSA0402
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Assuming Ottawa is all over this like white on rice.

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06-01-2011, 04:43 PM
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Krnage
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2rd for dominic moore

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06-01-2011, 04:47 PM
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Stassino
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Move up 4 spots to grab a mid 1st rounder at the cost of a 2nd.. this only happens draft day if their is something avail that suits our needs, if not .. it's not a good trade situation

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06-01-2011, 04:48 PM
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Cody Franson and both of our seconds (38 and 52) for your first and the RFA rights to Andrei Kostitsyn

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06-01-2011, 05:04 PM
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shayne
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29th is too far down where is the philly pick?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phion Keneuf View Post
29th + 39th for 17?
the philly pick and the 39th might work unless a better offer comes up

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06-01-2011, 05:05 PM
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shayne
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what picks does the sens hold?

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Originally Posted by TSA0402 View Post
Assuming Ottawa is all over this like white on rice.
what choices are you offering?

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06-01-2011, 05:06 PM
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jmelm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shayne;33356464[B
]17th up for grabs if they could pick up a 2nd rd pick, any thoughts[/B]i think the leafs would do it, any other teams interested

i would think moving down 5-8 spots and gaining a pick would be decent as long as they still get a decent kid in the 1st, i have heard that 15-25 are pretty interchangable depending on team needs

the habs have done this in the past as well as move up and pay the same kinda price(last year with tinordi)

i think they would move down if they could still get phillips or jensen and pick up maybe a phillip danault or xavier ouellet

Do you actually have a source for this, or is this just your own idea?

And I've heard the opposite about those picks being interchangable. In fact, I spoke with Kyle Woodlief from RedLineReport yesterday, and he said that there are 3 clear top-tiers of players and it drops off quickly after about 14-15 (i.e. top 8, next 3 or 4, next 3 or 4, then way down).

Now, of course, that's just his opinion and each team will have their own opinion. Soassuming that one, two or three other players creep up into the top 15 picks or so, Montreal may be able to get a MUCH better player at #17 than at, say, #23 or #25.

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06-01-2011, 05:11 PM
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shayne
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that is exactly what i would like...

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Originally Posted by TSA0402 View Post
Assuming Ottawa is all over this like white on rice.
17th for the 21st and 35th pick

works for me, does it work for the sens..make it happen

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06-01-2011, 05:13 PM
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danishh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shayne View Post
17th for the 21st and 35th pick

works for me, does it work for the sens..make it happen
histrorically that's too expensive, and in this draft where the feeling is ~14-45 is a big jumble of practically equivalent picks, even more so.

The Chicago pick is a better fit.

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06-01-2011, 05:24 PM
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Brodeur
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Of the teams picking behind you and picks they have in the top three rounds:

Chicago (18, 36, 43, 69, 78)
Edmonton (19, 31, 62, 73)
Phoenix (20, 50)
Ottawa (21, 35, 48, 60/61, 66)
Anaheim (22, 53, 65, 82)
Pittsburgh (23, 54, 83)
Detroit (24, 55, 84)
Toronto (25, 29, 39, 85)
Washington (26)
Tampa Bay (27, 58)
San Jose (28, 59)
Vancouver (29/30, 60/61, 89/90)
St. Louis (32, 41, 46, 71, 87)

And then here are some examples of what picks in 15-20 range have gotten in previous years.

Panthers traded 2010 first round pick (#15-Derek Forbort) to Kings for 2010 first round pick (#19-Nick Bjugstad), 2010 second round pick (#59-Jason Zucker) on 2010-06-25

Blue Jackets traded 2009 first round pick (#16-Nick Leddy), 2009 third round pick (#77-Matthew Hackett) to Islanders for 2009 first round pick (#26-Kyle Palmieri), 2009 second round pick (#37-Matt Clark), 2009 third round pick (#62-Anders Nilsson), 2009 fourth round pick (#92-Casey Cizikas) on 2009-06-26

Predators traded 2008 first round pick (#15-Erik Karlsson) to Senators for 2008 first round pick (#18-Chet Pickard), 2009 third round pick (#70-Taylor Beck) on 2008-06-20

Ducks traded 2007 first round pick (#16-Colton Gillies) to Wild for 2007 first round pick (#19-Logan MacMillan), 2007 second round pick (#42-Eric Tangradi) on 2007-06-22

Canadiens traded 2006 first round pick (#16-Ty Wishart) to Sharks for 2006 first round pick (#20-David Fischer), 2006 second round pick (#53-Mathieu Carle) on 2006-06-24

Flyers traded 2005 first round pick (#20-Kenndal McArdle) to Panthers for 2005 first round pick (#29-Steve Downie), 2006 second round pick (#41-Cory Emmerton) on 2005-07-30

Just some measuring sticks, but realistically it just comes down to how badly a team wants to move up.

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Old
06-01-2011, 05:25 PM
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Iamok
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danishh View Post
histrorically that's too expensive, and in this draft where the feeling is ~14-45 is a big jumble of practically equivalent picks, even more so.

The Chicago pick is a better fit.
x2. For 4 spots, I'd rather stay at 21st than give up the 35th.

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Old
06-01-2011, 05:26 PM
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TSA0402
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It would have to be 21 and 48. Honestly I wouldn't even do that but I can see Murray pulling the trigger.

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06-01-2011, 05:30 PM
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Brodeur
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TSA0402 View Post
It would have to be 21 and 48. Honestly I wouldn't even do that but I can see Murray pulling the trigger.
It all depends, it's impossible to tell without knowing who's available. It's conceivable that somebody ranked #10 on Ottawa's list is unexpectedly available at #17. In which case, 21/48 doesn't seem like such a bad price.

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06-01-2011, 07:02 PM
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shayne
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awesome analysis...based on your work i hope...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brodeur View Post
Of the teams picking behind you and picks they have in the top three rounds:

Chicago (18, 36, 43, 69, 78)
Edmonton (19, 31, 62, 73)
Phoenix (20, 50)
Ottawa (21, 35, 48, 60/61, 66)
Anaheim (22, 53, 65, 82)
Pittsburgh (23, 54, 83)
Detroit (24, 55, 84)
Toronto (25, 29, 39, 85)
Washington (26)
Tampa Bay (27, 58)
San Jose (28, 59)
Vancouver (29/30, 60/61, 89/90)
St. Louis (32, 41, 46, 71, 87)

And then here are some examples of what picks in 15-20 range have gotten in previous years.

Panthers traded 2010 first round pick (#15-Derek Forbort) to Kings for 2010 first round pick (#19-Nick Bjugstad), 2010 second round pick (#59-Jason Zucker) on 2010-06-25

Blue Jackets traded 2009 first round pick (#16-Nick Leddy), 2009 third round pick (#77-Matthew Hackett) to Islanders for 2009 first round pick (#26-Kyle Palmieri), 2009 second round pick (#37-Matt Clark), 2009 third round pick (#62-Anders Nilsson), 2009 fourth round pick (#92-Casey Cizikas) on 2009-06-26

Predators traded 2008 first round pick (#15-Erik Karlsson) to Senators for 2008 first round pick (#18-Chet Pickard), 2009 third round pick (#70-Taylor Beck) on 2008-06-20

Ducks traded 2007 first round pick (#16-Colton Gillies) to Wild for 2007 first round pick (#19-Logan MacMillan), 2007 second round pick (#42-Eric Tangradi) on 2007-06-22

Canadiens traded 2006 first round pick (#16-Ty Wishart) to Sharks for 2006 first round pick (#20-David Fischer), 2006 second round pick (#53-Mathieu Carle) on 2006-06-24

Flyers traded 2005 first round pick (#20-Kenndal McArdle) to Panthers for 2005 first round pick (#29-Steve Downie), 2006 second round pick (#41-Cory Emmerton) on 2005-07-30

Just some measuring sticks, but realistically it just comes down to how badly a team wants to move up.
toronto moves the 25th and 29th for the 17th or the sens move the 21st and 35th for the 17th

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Old
06-01-2011, 07:11 PM
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shayne View Post
toronto moves the 25th and 29th for the 17th or the sens move the 21st and 35th for the 17th
As the others mentioned, 21/35 seems a bit high for 17 based on the previous deals, 21/48 might be more realistic.

It was rumored that Toronto was talking to Chicago about moving 25/39 for 18. That sort of swap would be similar to NYI in 2009.

It's all relative, we never quite know how highly a particular player might rank on a team's board. If somebody had Patrik Berglund in their top 10 in 2006, they would have been laughed at on the prospects board. St. Louis did, and they tried feverishly to trade up to get him. Nobody was interested in dealing down however until the Blues called up the Devils.

On the flipside, the Habs could be shopping #17 and Ottawa could conceivably have a list of five available guys that they had ranked evenly which would give them little motivation to move up.

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Old
06-01-2011, 07:14 PM
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habs03
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barrytrotzsneck View Post
Cody Franson and both of our seconds (38 and 52) for your first and the RFA rights to Andrei Kostitsyn
This looks really really good, only if you take Spacek tho

I could see this happening, PG said many times that he feels that outside the top 10-15 picks, the rest of the 1st round is an extension to the 2nd round. Plus Trevor Timmins and Ryan Jankowski are really good with late picks.

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Old
06-01-2011, 07:21 PM
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Stjonnypopo
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This is something that only happens draft day. If there's someone we want at 17 we would definitely take him but if the guy we want is a few picks out then I could see this happening.

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Old
06-01-2011, 10:30 PM
  #21
TSA0402
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21st and 35th for 17th? If you want to act that way...

Counter:

21st + Boston 2nd Overall

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06-01-2011, 10:37 PM
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Jeffrey Lebowski
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Chicago won't want to move up only one spot unless it comes dirt cheap. With the way this draft sounds, a player you like at #17 might be available in the second round.

I think picks #25-30 + #45-50 would be fair for #17 this year.

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Old
06-01-2011, 10:39 PM
  #23
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I'd do 21 + 59 for 17. I don't think it'd be worth it to do 21 + 48 or 21 +35.

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Old
06-01-2011, 10:41 PM
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barrytrotzsneck View Post
Cody Franson and both of our seconds (38 and 52) for your first and the RFA rights to Andrei Kostitsyn
If they were closer together I'd potentially do this. Or one was 33, or so.

Habs prospect pool isn't the best. They should really keep their first, but then again, we suck in the first round.

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Old
06-01-2011, 10:48 PM
  #25
Krnage
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trade your first round for Tanguy

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