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The Flyers & Columbus' 8th Overall pick

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Old
06-10-2011, 10:30 AM
  #176
Hollywood Couturier
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Good luck getting Larsson. The Oilers aren't trading the first overall. Colorado doesn't need another Center. Florida meh. And the Devils sure as hell aren't being dealt Carter.

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06-10-2011, 10:35 AM
  #177
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Oilers are listening to offers for their 1st though....also you can't discount mutliple player and team deals.....Flyers can absolutely land 1 or 2 but yes it would take Carter. We could get Columbus' 8th and swap it some other kind of deal. I think not much analysis is going into the very real likelihood of a mutiple team deal at the draft.

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Edmonton Oilers GM Steve Tambellini has been ‘talking out loud’ about the possibility of trading the 1st overall pick in the 2011 NHL draft. “I’ve had a few calls of people kicking the tires of how they can help me make the Oilers a better team,” Tambellini told reporters. “For me to move the No. 1 pick would have to be something exceptional. This is a huge building block again.” Staples thinks that if they were to trade the 1st pick, they would still need to pick in the top 5 or 6. The Oilers top scout sees Ryan Nugent-Hopkins and Adam Larsson as a cut above the rest (Jonathan Huberdeau, Dougie Hamilton, Gabriel Landeskog or possibly Sean Couturier).

http://blogs.edmontonjournal.com/201...ding-top-pick/

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06-10-2011, 10:36 AM
  #178
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Originally Posted by Hollywood Cannon View Post
Good luck getting Larsson. The Oilers aren't trading the first overall. Colorado doesn't need another Center. Florida meh. And the Devils sure as hell aren't being dealt Carter.
If Larsson falls to the Devils I'm going to be pissed.

Not to mention the gloating texts I'm going to receive from my friends.

I hope anyone takes Larsson before he goes to NJ.

But yeah...we're not moving into the top 5. I doubt we even see the top 15. Carter's not gonna get moved.

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06-10-2011, 10:37 AM
  #179
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I don't understand why Larsson and the Oilers isn't just completely perfect. He's exactly what they need on defense.

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06-10-2011, 10:43 AM
  #180
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Carter and Columbus

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A crescendo is building as the calendar creeps toward the two most important stretches on the NHL off-season schedule -- the entry draft and free agency. After making news the last two days, the drumbeats are getting louder around the Blue Jackets, with a bigger flurry possible.
On Tuesday, the Philadelphia Flyers acquired the rights to goaltender Ilya Bryzgalov from the Phoenix Coyotes with the hope of signing Bryzgalov to a long-term contract before he hits free agency on July 1.
If the Flyers sign Bryzgalov -- they don't tend to mess around on these things -- they'll need significant salary cap relief. They already have $58.5 million committed to salaries for the 2011-12 season with still a few players to resign, and Bryzgalov is likely to make at least $6 million per season.
Talks have simmered between Blue Jackets GM Scott Howson and Philadelphia GM Paul Holmgren for more than six months now -- they last chatted at the NHL scouting combine two weeks ago -- and a Bryzgalov signing could be the trigger.
Sources have indicated to The Dispatch that the Blue Jackets would trade a roster player, quite possibly winger Jake Voracek, and their first-round pick (No. 8 overall), to the Flyers for veteran center Jeff Carter.
Carter is signed through the 2020-21 season at $5.27 million per season according to capgeek.com. Of those two numbers, it's the term -- 11 more seasons -- that would scare off some clubs, but the Blue Jackets have reached a point where they need to start taking measured risks.
He's a proven top-six center, which remains a roster need. He's a proven scorer, with 115 goals the last three seasons. At 6-foot-3, 205 pounds Carter could give the Blue Jackets a formidable 1-2 punch with captain Rick Nash, which they're currently missing. He is a player who has gone where few in the Blue Jackets dressing room have ventured -- deep in the Stanley Cup playoffs.
The Blue Jackets would be reluctant to trade Jake Voracek, their first-round pick in 2007 and the first draft pick made by Howson when he took over as general manager. Howson has always held Voracek -- his potential, really -- in high regard.
But a player of Carter's caliber won't come easy. Howson already has stated a desire to move the No. 8 draft pick for immediate help.
Obviously, this trade is not guaranteed to go down. Certainly, the Flyers will talk to other clubs about trades, and consider many options to get their salary structure in line with the NHL's projected salary cap.
But The Dispatch has confirmed talks between Howson and Holmgren, and it's something to keep an eye on as the NHL entry draft draws nearer.
Sources tell The Dispatch that the Blue Jackets have also discussed the No. 8 pick with the Edmonton Oilers. Who's the target? Howson has long coveted winger Ales Hemsky, despite his recurring bout with injuries, but it's unlikely it would be a straight-up deal. The Oilers, in the second year of a massive youth movement, are said to be trying to unload defenseman Tom Gilbert
From : http://blog.dispatch.com/cbj/2011/06...and_more.shtml

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06-10-2011, 10:45 AM
  #181
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDoom View Post
Oilers are listening to offers for their 1st though....also you can't discount mutliple player and team deals.....Flyers can absolutely land 1 or 2 but yes it would take Carter. We could get Columbus' 8th and swap it some other kind of deal. I think not much analysis is going into the very real likelihood of a mutiple team deal at the draft.
I probably should have included "to us". I don't think Carter gets it done for the first overall. Obviously the Flyers aren't going to add either. At the same time however trading Carter for a top pick in the draft won't really relieve the cap problem at hand. Hall's cap hit last year was $3.75M and Seguin got $3.55M.

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06-10-2011, 10:47 AM
  #182
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Originally Posted by Hollywood Cannon View Post
I probably should have included "to us". I don't think Carter gets it done for the first overall. Obviously the Flyers aren't going to add either. At the same time however trading Carter for a top pick in the draft won't really relieve the cap problem at hand. Hall's cap hit last year was $3.75M and Seguin got $3.55M.
Drafting Larsson would mean we could flip Carle out for a later 1st as well...

Pronger - Larsson
Timonen - Coburn
Meszaros - Gustafsson

JVR - Giroux - ???
Hartnell - Briere - ???
Nodl - Richards - Versteeg
Powe - Betts - ???

Bryzgalov
Bobrovsky

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06-10-2011, 10:48 AM
  #183
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So, with all the talk of Carter to Columbus for #8 pick and voracek/russell dealings.. Do you think Homer gets a deal done?

and

Do you think Jeff Carter's numbers over the past two seasons falling because the constant trade rumors with him are throwing him off his game?

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06-10-2011, 11:25 AM
  #184
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Originally Posted by Pwnz0rs View Post
So, with all the talk of Carter to Columbus for #8 pick and voracek/russell dealings.. Do you think Homer gets a deal done?

and

Do you think Jeff Carter's numbers over the past two seasons falling because the constant trade rumors with him are throwing him off his game?
Since the only players who have put up more goals in the last 3 seasons combined are Stamkos, Crosby, and OV, I don't think so.

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06-10-2011, 11:33 AM
  #185
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Since the only players who have put up more goals in the last 3 seasons combined are Stamkos, Crosby, and OV, I don't think so.
And Marleau but yeah, I agree. Carter isn't the 45-50 goalscorer people seemed to think he was after his career year 2 years ago. He is still a 35-40 goalscorer and those are still pretty hard to find.

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06-10-2011, 11:37 AM
  #186
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And Marleau but yeah, I agree. Carter isn't the 45-50 goalscorer people seemed to think he was after his career year 2 years ago. He is still a 35-40 goalscorer and those are still pretty hard to find.
Given more ice time he might routinely break 40 goals. I was bored and poking around in stats the other day, and I believe he is playing something like 3 minutes less per game than he was when he had his monster season.

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06-10-2011, 11:48 AM
  #187
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Given more ice time he might routinely break 40 goals. I was bored and poking around in stats the other day, and I believe he is playing something like 3 minutes less per game than he was when he had his monster season.
less penalty killing

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06-10-2011, 11:53 AM
  #188
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Originally Posted by go david krejci 430 View Post
less penalty killing
That would do it.

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06-10-2011, 11:57 AM
  #189
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That would do it.
yeah and with people wanting Konopka on this team and with the possibility of Rinaldo on this team our PK could get a workout.

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06-10-2011, 11:57 AM
  #190
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yeah and with people wanting Konopka on this team and with the possibility of Rinaldo on this team our PK could get a workout.
They might as well only practice shorthanded.

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06-10-2011, 12:06 PM
  #191
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They might as well only practice shorthanded.
we would hear the "that was a bs call, the refs are out to get us" more often

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06-10-2011, 12:46 PM
  #192
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i think the konopka supporters (i would be in that group) see him as an upgrade over shelley or rinaldo, not an addition to them. konopka is basically shelley with faceoff skill. rinaldo is basically a less disciplined and faster shelley. i'm too lazy to check, but i think rinaldo would be cheaper than shelley too. zenon would likely cost about as much on a fair contract as shelley.

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06-10-2011, 01:03 PM
  #193
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PhillyCurt12 View Post
i think the konopka supporters (i would be in that group) see him as an upgrade over shelley or rinaldo, not an addition to them. konopka is basically shelley with faceoff skill. rinaldo is basically a less disciplined and faster shelley. i'm too lazy to check, but i think rinaldo would be cheaper than shelley too. zenon would likely cost about as much on a fair contract as shelley.
Rinaldo is more like a Carcillo, not a Shelley. Konopka I think will get more than what he is worth this off season and I wouldn't want to give him anything more than 900k.

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06-10-2011, 01:26 PM
  #194
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Originally Posted by flyersfan187 View Post
Rinaldo is more like a Carcillo, not a Shelley. Konopka I think will get more than what he is worth this off season and I wouldn't want to give him anything more than 900k.
well carcillo is a faster less disciplined shelley too. i left him out since it's probably a safe assumption that he won't be around next year.

edit: also, carcillo doesn't look completely out of place on a scoring line. from what i've heard about rinaldo, he does not have 20 goal potential (which i believe carcillo does have if he gets the minutes and decent quality line mates)

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06-10-2011, 02:09 PM
  #195
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PhillyCurt12 View Post
well carcillo is a faster less disciplined shelley too. i left him out since it's probably a safe assumption that he won't be around next year.

edit: also, carcillo doesn't look completely out of place on a scoring line. from what i've heard about rinaldo, he does not have 20 goal potential (which i believe carcillo does have if he gets the minutes and decent quality line mates)
Rinaldo has less scoring ability than Carcillo, without question.

BUT, please show me what Carcillo has ever done to show that he has the potential to get 20 goals in a season. Hell, show me that he can get 20 in two ****ing seasons. He's been on Richards' line more than he ever deserved in the past year and a half or two years, and has shown sweet * all.

Sorry, Carcillo rant over. I hope he finds a home somewhere far away from the Flyers. He should never have been a Flyer in the first place, and I hope he has a nice life and/or career elsewhere.

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06-10-2011, 02:12 PM
  #196
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Hungry hungry SanFilippo's take

Quote:
UPDATED: Spoke to another Flyers executive who denied these talks took place.

He said that a lot of teams - including the Columbus Blue Jackets - have called asking about Jeff Carter.

"Just like everyone else they were told no," the exec said.

While conversations between Paul Holmgren and Columbus GM Scott Howson have taken place, this executive said it was "nothing on that level."

That could be interpreted as a smaller deal with the Jackets could be in the works, or that the executive was trying to divert attention away from a bigger deal.

Quote:
According to several sources in multiple cities, Flyers general manager Paul Holmgren has spoken several times with Columbus Blue Jackets G.M. Scott Howson about a possible deal before the June 24th entry draft.

The deal would have the Flyers trading Jeff Carter to the Blue Jackets for restricted free agent Jakob Voracek and the Blue Jackets first round draft pick which is eighth overall.

Mathematically this makes sense. Carter's $5.25 million salary cap hit would be shed to make room for the big money Bryzgalov is looking for (rumored to me in the neighborhood of $30 million over five years).

Meanwhile the Flyers would have a lottery pick in a draft in which they have very few selections, and would acquire the 21-year-old Voracek, who just completed his entry level contract that finished with a cap hit of $1.27 million (including bonus money).

Voracek is an interesting piece to the equation because he plays the wing - an area of need for the Flyers - is durable, having missed only five games in his three NHL seasons, and has put up good offensive numbers for a young player:

2008-09: 9-29-38
2009-10: 16-34-50
2010-11: 14-32-46

The Flyers would simply have to offer Voracek a qualifying offer of 105 percent of his 2010-11 salary - which is $826,875 - because it is based on the actual salary ($787,500), and not the cap hit that includes bonus dollars.

However, while that all sounds good numbers-wise, the big question is, does this have a realistic chance of happening?

Outside of Philadelphia the belief is yes, as NHL folks affiliated with two other teams - one in the Eastern Conference and one in the Western Conference - think this deal could go down anytime in the next 16 days.

However, here in Philadelphia, it is being shrugged off as simply a rumor.

"(It) isn't true," said one Flyers' executive who declined to elaborate further.

And it might not be. There are a lot of people in the organization who really like Carter and what he brings to the Flyers. However, when asked last month about what the offseason might bring, the same executive told me:

"We will get a goaltender. Whether it's by trade or through free agency we will get a goaltender."

And when I asked how they planned to afford said goalie, the response was:

"Sometimes you have to give up something of value to get something of value."

Source: http://anthonysintheroom.blogspot.com/

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06-10-2011, 02:15 PM
  #197
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Originally Posted by CharlieGirl View Post
Rinaldo has less scoring ability than Carcillo, without question.

BUT, please show me what Carcillo has ever done to show that he has the potential to get 20 goals in a season. Hell, show me that he can get 20 in two ****ing seasons. He's been on Richards' line more than he ever deserved in the past year and a half or two years, and has shown sweet * all.

Sorry, Carcillo rant over. I hope he finds a home somewhere far away from the Flyers. He should never have been a Flyer in the first place, and I hope he has a nice life and/or career elsewhere.
Carcillo is a tad bit better version of Dale Kushner offensively. At most a 15 goal guy..actually he's a lot better than Dale Kushner offensively but his game reminds me of that guy!


Last edited by FreshPerspective: 06-10-2011 at 02:41 PM. Reason: clarification
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06-10-2011, 02:55 PM
  #198
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Carcillo had a 13-goal season, which meant that he was destined to be a top line player. Even though 5 of those 13 goals were in the last two games of the season. Also, scored in a game against the Flyers, which at times means that he gets shortlisted as a guy who we overpay in trading for later on and we hear "this is a guy we've always liked, but not until someone else drafted them."

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06-10-2011, 03:42 PM
  #199
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PhillyCurt12 View Post
well carcillo is a faster less disciplined shelley too. i left him out since it's probably a safe assumption that he won't be around next year.

edit: also, carcillo doesn't look completely out of place on a scoring line. from what i've heard about rinaldo, he does not have 20 goal potential (which i believe carcillo does have if he gets the minutes and decent quality line mates)
Carcillo isn't anything like Shelley. Carcillo is a pest and Shelley is an enforcer. Carcillo also does not seem to have 20 goal potential in my eyes. Carcillo at his best is probably a checking line pest that gets the other teams taking penalties. The bad thing about the Flyers though is that they don't run a true checking line so he doesn't fit too well on this team outside of being on the fourth line.

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06-10-2011, 04:58 PM
  #200
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Originally Posted by DrDoom View Post
Hungry hungry SanFilippo's take







Source: http://anthonysintheroom.blogspot.com/
Interesting. I think the Philly exec saying nothing is happening with Carter very well may just be posturing. It wouldn't really be a smart move to act as though you have to deal him. The Flyers at least want to appear as though they are in the driver's seat (which they pretty much are, at least in regards to Carter). I'd be cool with a deal for the 8th and Voracek, though I would like something else thrown in too. I have no idea if they would go for it but, I would be psyched on something like this:

TO CBJ
Carter
Carle

TO PHI
Voracek
Pahlsson
#8 pick

Maybe a little throw in of another pick from CBJ? Is that too much? But just check this team out...

CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
James Van Riemsdyk ($1.654m) / Mike Richards ($5.750m) / Kris Versteeg ($3.083m)
Scott Hartnell ($4.200m) / Daniel Briere ($6.500m) / Ville Leino ($2.750m)
Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Samuel Pahlsson ($2.650m) / Jakub Voracek ($1.270m)
Darroll Powe ($0.725m) / Blair Betts ($0.700m) / Andreas Nodl ($0.850m)
/ / Jody Shelley ($1.100m)

DEFENSEMEN
Chris Pronger ($4.921m) / Andrej Meszaros ($4.000m)
Kimmo Timonen ($6.333m) / Oskars Bartulis ($0.600m)
Braydon Coburn ($3.200m) / Erik Gustafsson ($0.900m)
Danny Syvret ($0.600m)

GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.525m) / Brian Boucher ($0.925m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $62,400,000; CAP PAYROLL: $61,988,094; BONUSES: $850,000
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $411,906

Give whoever we take with the 8th pick a year to develop in the AHL (or let him play if he fits under the cap). Send Bob down to develop and sign a Boosh-esque guy (not necessarily Boosh, but someone of that caliber). Could even waive Shelley to make room for Bob. Thoughts? Probably a pipe dream, but that is a damn scary team.

EDIT: Also according to that article, Voracek's salary would actually be like $400k less so more money could be saved than I had originally thought (if that article is true, of course).

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