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Brad Richards News Part IV

View Poll Results: Will Richards Sign In NY?
Yes 118 53.15%
No 64 28.83%
Kesler Did It 40 18.02%
Voters: 222. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
06-11-2011, 05:53 PM
  #101
Tony D63
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dude comon now..

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06-11-2011, 05:59 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by AXN View Post
Richards won a stanley cup with the Rangers coach in Tampa Bay. His ex players really play well for him. Look at Prospal and Fedotenko. Stansny has not won anything yet.
Gomez and Drury have won in the past. How did that work out for you?

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06-11-2011, 06:02 PM
  #103
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Gomez and Drury have won in the past. How did that work out for you?
**** that, Kris Draper has 4 rings. I think he should be our #1 center.

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06-11-2011, 06:07 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by hpNYR View Post
Gomez and Drury have won in the past. How did that work out for you?
Richards is a better player than Gomez and Drury.

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06-11-2011, 06:11 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by SomebodySaveKreider View Post
Richards is a better player than Gomez and Drury.
You missed the point..

The guy was saying since Richards has won a cup in the past and Stastny hasn't in his young career; that makes Richards a better choice. My response was Drury and Gomez have won in the past too.

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06-11-2011, 06:17 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by hpNYR View Post
Gomez and Drury have won in the past. How did that work out for you?
How many 90 point seasons did they have?

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06-11-2011, 06:18 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by hpNYR View Post
You missed the point..

The guy was saying since Richards has won a cup in the past and Stastny hasn't in his young career; that makes Richards a better choice. My response was Drury and Gomez have won in the past too.
Oh then thats a weak argument he made.

There are a lot of reasons to choose Richards over Stastny (imo), but thats not the reason I'd choose one over the other.

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06-11-2011, 06:19 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
How many 90 point seasons did they have?
You also missed the point. Trying reading the posts before you pick your spots.

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06-11-2011, 06:35 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by hpNYR View Post
You also missed the point. Trying reading the posts before you pick your spots.
A lot of people are having trouble picking up on what exactly your point is supposed to be. But yea, I guess its us.

Stastny vs. Richards is a much more worthwhile debate considering theyre on the same talent level.

Bringing Gomez and Drury into the conversation makes little sense considering they are a tier or two below. As someone else pointed out, Kris Draper has plenty of cups too.

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06-11-2011, 06:41 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
A lot of people are having trouble picking up on what exactly your point is supposed to be. But yea, I guess its us.

Stastny vs. Richards is a much more worthwhile debate considering their on the same talent level.

Bringing Gomez and Drury into the conversation makes little sense considering they are a tier or two below. As someone else pointed out, Kris Draper has plenty of cups too.
Only small minded bird brains will have difficulty picking up what I'm saying.

He posted that since Richards has a ring he's automatically the better choice over Stastny. First off, that's not true at all. Rings do not decide if a player is better than another. Which is why I said Drury and Gomez have rings too. Comprende my little canary? Secondly -- it's not fair to Stastny to even compare the two players. One is well into his career while the other isn't even in his prime yet. I wouldn't be shocked at all if Stastny does end up having the better career when it's all said and done.

Personally, I'm a fan of Stastny more than Richards. However, for this club getting Richards without giving up assets is probably the best choice; if possible.

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06-11-2011, 06:41 PM
  #111
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Just remember the mantra on the main forums guys,

If Richards signs with the Rangers, he'll be an overpaid bust like Drury/Gomez

If he signs another team (Tampa, Toronto, Nashville, Kings, Sabres), he'll be awesome and make that team a cup contender.

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06-11-2011, 06:43 PM
  #112
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
And what are those other options? Ive seen you bring up Stastny, whose cap hit approaches what Richards would be, not to mention the king's ransom of assets it would cost to get him, pretty much gutting the current team.

I mean, you've already sold Richard's abilities and game extraordinarily short, but thats a different argument for a different day.

Im more interested to hear about these other options you're talking about.
Stastny will make about a million less a season and have less term in case it doesnt work out.

The Rangers aren't one player away. They are three or four. While Richards makes them better on paper, I dont think signing him to a long-term deal is right for the organization right now.

If you go by the last few years, the Rangers have done a great job drafting and acquiring assets through trades.

The UFA method has been a disaster. I have more faith in Sather getting what is best for the team via trading for a guy like Stastny or Carter or Malkin with the assets he's stockpiled rather than throw a bunch of money at 31-year-old veteran who has openly admitted he wants to be in a low-key atmosphere.

On July 1st, if Richards signs elsewhere, i won't lose any sleep over it. In fact, I'll be a little relieved.

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06-11-2011, 06:44 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
How many 90 point seasons did they have?
Brad Richards still has as many 90 pts seasons as Danny Briere (95 pts once, and one season were he projected to score almost 100...).

In the end, we could talk back and forth on this subjects for years. 95% of the time it doesn't seem like anyone really understands what the other one is saying et c.

But I am kind of "allergic" to this whole "Richards is better then Drury and Gomez" talk -- because I am 100% sure that it is not about that at all.

Scott Gomez was darn important and instrumential in a couple of Cup wins for NJD. Chris Drury has played some darn good hockey over the course of his career too, and been very important for his team. Redden put up the stats for Ottawa. Are you denying that?

No matter if Brad Richards now is better then Gomez was for NJD or Chris Drury was for Colorado or Wade Redden for Ottawa -- its a fact that Gomez, Redden and Drury didn't do sheit for us. Especially Drury and Redden. We didn't get anything really, besides a lockerroom presence. Nothing. If Richards were 20% better then Drury, it is still of little help when Drury scores 1 goal and 4 assists in a season if you get what I mean.

We signed Redden as a top 30 scorer among D's in the NHL. 6'2. North American. No attitude problems. Sure we paid a lot, but we it shouldn't have been that risky, right? Yes it was. We got a AHLer.

If you want to defend signing Richards, tell me why he will not come here and give us nothing, unlike Redden and Drury -- if you get what I mean.

Like I am in favor of getting Richards if we can get him for a fair price. But it has nothing to do with him playing a tad better for Dallas then Scott Gomez did for NJD. Nothing.

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06-11-2011, 07:00 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by Ola View Post
Brad Richards still has as many 90 pts seasons as Danny Briere (95 pts once, and one season were he projected to score almost 100...).

In the end, we could talk back and forth on this subjects for years. 95% of the time it doesn't seem like anyone really understands what the other one is saying et c.

But I am kind of "allergic" to this whole "Richards is better then Drury and Gomez" talk -- because I am 100% sure that it is not about that at all.

Scott Gomez was darn important and instrumential in a couple of Cup wins for NJD. Chris Drury has played some darn good hockey over the course of his career too, and been very important for his team. Redden put up the stats for Ottawa. Are you denying that?

No matter if Brad Richards now is better then Gomez was for NJD or Chris Drury was for Colorado or Wade Redden for Ottawa -- its a fact that Gomez, Redden and Drury didn't do sheit for us. Especially Drury and Redden. We didn't get anything really, besides a lockerroom presence. Nothing. If Richards were 20% better then Drury, it is still of little help when Drury scores 1 goal and 4 assists in a season if you get what I mean.

We signed Redden as a top 30 scorer among D's in the NHL. 6'2. North American. No attitude problems. Sure we paid a lot, but we it shouldn't have been that risky, right? Yes it was. We got a AHLer.

If you want to defend signing Richards, tell me why he will not come here and give us nothing, unlike Redden and Drury -- if you get what I mean.

Like I am in favor of getting Richards if we can get him for a fair price. But it has nothing to do with him playing a tad better for Dallas then Scott Gomez did for NJD. Nothing.
Wade Redden was just a disaster, but Drury and Gomez came here and played to their career averages their first couple of seasons. They were just 4-5M dollar players that we gave 7+.

Now, when a talent comes along thats worth that kind of money, some of the fanbase feels the need to waste this opportunity because we overpaid a couple of guys in the past. Its a bizarre way to think, and it would be a huge missed opportunity at this juncture. Perhaps most importantly, there is a much stronger core in place than there was 4 years ago.

Does anybody legitimately think Stepan and Anisimov will develop into #1C's? And if we have to trade for someone at that position, it would involve giving up a key piece of the aforementioned core.

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06-11-2011, 07:06 PM
  #115
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I, myself, am not of the thinking that Richards is going to be a PPG player every year here -- his career average of points per season is roughly 70ish. If we sign him for 5 years, and he has seasons of, let's say, 85, 75, 70, 70, and 60 points, which I think is what would happen, I'd be fine with giving him a maximum of $7M a year -- I also think that people are expecting a bit too much out of Richards. He could have another 90 point season, sure, but I think he also could have another 70 point season as well, and I don't think people in NY would be happy with that type of production for the projected cap hit that Richards will carry.

I want Richards -- but my expectations for him aren't as high as most.

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06-11-2011, 07:12 PM
  #116
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i'd take stastny over richards any day of the week and twice on sunday...and if the option was one or the other i'd take him. but thats not the option and i'm deathly afraid of what kind of package the avs would ask for in return for him. i'm thinking it will cost us 2 of our 'untouchables'.

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06-11-2011, 07:13 PM
  #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Boyle View Post
I, myself, am not of the thinking that Richards is going to be a PPG player every year here -- his career average of points per season is roughly 70ish. If we sign him for 5 years, and he has seasons of, let's say, 85, 75, 70, 70, and 60 points, which I think is what would happen, I'd be fine with giving him a maximum of $7M a year -- I also think that people are expecting a bit too much out of Richards. He could have another 90 point season, sure, but I think he also could have another 70 point season as well, and I don't think people in NY would be happy with that type of production for the projected cap hit that Richards will carry.

I want Richards -- but my expectations for him aren't as high as most.
If he signs here, I'd like the PP to be in the top 10 or 12 and he average about 75 points a season.

You have to wonder about Gaborik too. He's stated he's used to having off years and that he's always rebounded, but his body might be breaking down more than we'll ever know.

Best case scenario is that Richards-Gaborik become the new Nicholls-Gartner. When those two clicked, they made the Rangers a very good team and a tough matchup.

Still, I dont think he is worth more than 7.5 and no more than 4 or 5 years.

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06-11-2011, 07:15 PM
  #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Boyle View Post
I, myself, am not of the thinking that Richards is going to be a PPG player every year here -- his career average of points per season is roughly 70ish. If we sign him for 5 years, and he has seasons of, let's say, 85, 75, 70, 70, and 60 points, which I think is what would happen, I'd be fine with giving him a maximum of $7M a year -- I also think that people are expecting a bit too much out of Richards. He could have another 90 point season, sure, but I think he also could have another 70 point season as well, and I don't think people in NY would be happy with that type of production for the projected cap hit that Richards will carry.

I want Richards -- but my expectations for him aren't as high as most.
This I agree with. The other thing about Richards is that he makes the entire group of forwards better simply because the roles are more defined. No more questions about which of Anisimov or Stepan are the #1. No more temptation to move Dubinsky back tot he middle. There is certainly a trickle down effect involved here as well.

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06-11-2011, 07:16 PM
  #119
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Wade Redden was just a disaster, but Drury and Gomez came here and played to their career averages their first couple of seasons. They were just 4-5M dollar players that we gave 7+.

Now, when a talent comes along thats worth that kind of money, some of the fanbase feels the need to waste this opportunity because we overpaid a couple of guys in the past. Its a bizarre way to think, and it would be a huge missed opportunity at this juncture. Perhaps most importantly, there is a much stronger core in place than there was 4 years ago.

Does anybody legitimately think Stepan and Anisimov will develop into #1C's? And if we have to trade for someone at that position, it would involve giving up a key piece of the aforementioned core.
Thank you.

Far too many posters are pointing out the Drury/Gomez/Redden signing as if they have anything to do with a potential Richards signing. They have zero to do with it. If Drury and Gomez came here and scored 120 points each, would you expect the next big FA signing to come here and score 120 points? Of course not. Then, why do so many of you think that the production of past FA signings have ANY BEARING AT ALL on this one?

I understand "learning from mistakes" but the mistake isn't to go hard to fill your biggest need. It's just not to give out massive overpayments to mediocre players. Richards is elite. The only way the correlation could be made is if you were comparing Drury getting 7 mil to Richards potentially getting 9-10 mil. Richards getting 7 or 7.5 or even 8 per year is barely overpayment, if at all.

It would be a monumental mistake to not go hard for him out of FEAR that stems from completely unrelated past moves that didn't work out. We don't have time to develop a center from the draft. Lundqvist's going to be 30 in a couple years. We can no longer afford to look fondly to "next year" or "in a few years." The time IS now. We need to make a move to help us compete with the Flyers, Penguins, and Bruins of the East. Richards is the best option. If we don't get him, I'll be very worried about whatever plan B may be, especially if plan B is standing pat and waiting til next year, wasting yet another mentally draining year of Lundqvist's ability to carry a team.

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06-11-2011, 07:17 PM
  #120
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Originally Posted by German Way of War View Post
If he signs here, I'd like the PP to be in the top 10 or 12 and he average about 75 points a season.

You have to wonder about Gaborik too. He's stated he's used to having off years and that he's always rebounded, but his body might be breaking down more than we'll ever know.

Best case scenario is that Richards-Gaborik become the new Nicholls-Gartner. When those two clicked, they made the Rangers a very good team and a tough matchup.

Still, I dont think he is worth more than 7.5 and no more than 4 or 5 years.
He'll get more years, less of a cap hit.

Listen, I would love to have Stastny...hes on Richards' talent level and is much younger.

But the cost it would take to get him would make if more of a lateral move. We're talking one of Dubinsky/Callahan/Staal, a top prospect, and a high draft pick to get something like that done.

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06-11-2011, 07:21 PM
  #121
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Thank you.

Far too many posters are pointing out the Drury/Gomez/Redden signing as if they have anything to do with a potential Richards signing. They have zero to do with it. If Drury and Gomez came here and scored 120 points each, would you expect the next big FA signing to come here and score 120 points? Of course not. Then, why do so many of you think that the production of past FA signings have ANY BEARING AT ALL on this one?

I understand "learning from mistakes" but the mistake isn't to go hard to fill your biggest need. It's just not to give out massive overpayments to mediocre players. Richards is elite. The only way the correlation could be made is if you were comparing Drury getting 7 mil to Richards potentially getting 9-10 mil. Richards getting 7 or 7.5 or even 8 per year is barely overpayment, if at all.

It would be a monumental mistake to not go hard for him out of FEAR that stems from completely unrelated past moves that didn't work out. We don't have time to develop a center from the draft. Lundqvist's going to be 30 in a couple years. We can no longer afford to look fondly to "next year" or "in a few years." The time IS now. We need to make a move to help us compete with the Flyers, Penguins, and Bruins of the East. Richards is the best option. If we don't get him, I'll be very worried about whatever plan B may be, especially if plan B is standing pat and waiting til next year, wasting yet another mentally draining year of Lundqvist's ability to carry a team.
With the way this team is run, UFA's are going to have to be part of the plan - particularly to obtain the top-end talent needed to truly compete in the NHL.

If you want to "stay the course" thats fine, but realize the course seems to be continously battling for the 8th seed, drafting in the low teens, and stockpiling 2nd and 3rd liners.

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06-11-2011, 07:27 PM
  #122
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i'd take stastny over richards any day of the week and twice on sunday...and if the option was one or the other i'd take him. but thats not the option and i'm deathly afraid of what kind of package the avs would ask for in return for him. i'm thinking it will cost us 2 of our 'untouchables'.
People fall in love with all of our prospects, but they fail to realize that the reason why you stockpile picks is to acquire young world-class talent when they are in their peak years.

I look at the Nordiques. They traded three straight No. 1 overall picks (Sundin, Nolan and Lindros) to becomes Cup contenders.

I mean, they traded Sundin for Wendel Clark, and then traded Clark for Lemiuex. They traded Nolan for Ozolinsh. They traded two young regulars and the best young goalie prospect in the league for Roy

That's like us trading Stepan for Selanne and Kreider for Liles.

They are ballsy, ballsy moves, but as in the case of the 1996 Avs it worked out.

I know it sounds nice to have all 18 skaters and the 2 goalies we Ranger-bred players. But it doesnt work out that way.

A lot of people on this board need to realize that being a perennial Cup contender will cost you assets. You dont build Cup contenders with a yearly blockbuster UFA signing.

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06-11-2011, 07:28 PM
  #123
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Some good debates going on here, for a change.

Seriously....

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06-11-2011, 07:31 PM
  #124
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I know it sounds nice to have all 18 skaters and the 2 goalies we Ranger-bred players. But it doesnt work out that way.

A lot of people on this board need to realize that being a perennial Cup contender will cost you assets. You dont build Cup contenders with a yearly blockbuster UFA signing.
I never understood why people here think that having a "fully homegrown" team is even a significant fact. It means nothing. I don't care if none of the players were drafted by this organization -- as long as they win.

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06-11-2011, 07:33 PM
  #125
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The difference here is if we trade the assets for Stastny or whoever, then who's our second line? They'll want Dubinsky, or AA, or Cally, or Stepan, or Staal.

If you could do Kreider and McIlrath for a 1st line center, so be it. But that's not going to happen and we don't have the type of team where trading the assets that teams would actually want would do any good for us.

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