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[CBJ/MTL] Wisniewski's rights for a Cond. 7th (5th if he signs in CBJ) (post #302)

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06-15-2011, 12:43 AM
  #26
SB164
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Another thing that I've noticed about JW that's gone unmentioned so far is his ability to take the puck into the opposing zone (especially on a PP). He does it quite slowly, but it's very effective. Basically, when he's got the puck on his stick in the neutral zone/offensive zone, he shows patience and poise.

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06-15-2011, 07:51 AM
  #27
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Lets just say the team that gets The Wiz should be pretty happy. I see him being a potential 20g D on a good team. I don't remember but did any D even break 15 last year?

If you don't expect Rafalski but rather expect James Wisniewski you'll be fine. James has his own assets that he brings to the table. If you're expecting a similar or better version of Rafalski not going to happen. They aren't the same player.

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Originally Posted by Dharvey33 View Post
Rafalski is-was a lot better than wisniewski will ever be. Wisniewski is a very gifted offensive dman with a good offensive hockey sense and a hard shot at the point. He has got a good vision and a decent first pass.

That's the good. The bad he is pretty slow for a guy his size i think, Pk and Gorges are a lot faster than him. Can hit sometimes but not often enough for me. Tends to turnover the puck when his pressured a bit like Bergeron did ( he is better than Bergeron overall no doubt). Will make a dumbass at least once per game and it can be very costly.

Not a great positioning on the ice and doesn't have a great timing for cutting passes of.

So he is pretty good on the offense but is decent at best on the defense. And i like him al ot but players like hamrlik or Gill or even Subban all outplayed him on the defensive aspect. He was just a bit better than Spacek in his own zone. Say what you want about harmlik but he saved his ass a lot this year.
At least on average last year especially for us he was practically a PPG D so those mistakes when they would cost you often wouldn't be so bad, and then of course we have Price to neutralize those mistakes.

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06-15-2011, 07:56 AM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neofury View Post
Lets just say the team that gets The Wiz should be pretty happy. I see him being a potential 20g D on a good team. I don't remember but did any D even break 15 last year?

If you don't expect Rafalski but rather expect James Wisniewski you'll be fine. James has his own assets that he brings to the table. If you're expecting a similar or better version of Rafalski not going to happen. They aren't the same player.
The wings will be getting an upgrade if that's who they sign, Wisniewski is better than Rafalski has been the last 2 years.

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06-15-2011, 08:05 AM
  #29
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Will you guys please stop telling the Detroit fan that Wizniewski is a good puck-moving Dman, he's not! He's excellent at making that 1st pass to start off plays, but when is it that you see Wiz carrying the puck from blue line to blueline like Subban does?

Speaking of Subban, I will miss the Subban-Wiz combo on the pp,such a treat top watch...

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06-15-2011, 08:35 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Konnan511 View Post
Wow, you guys are awesome on the feedback. So he doesn't take stupid penalties then? Do you all know where or why or how that even got started then?
You do realize this guy is a junior scout who's been assigned to research Wiz. With the Wings, I would not be surprised. It would be like them to assign a junior to get on the board as some 'fan' and proceed to pump us for info...why not? A little extra info from some fairly knowledgeable fans can't hurt. I'd do it myself if I was GM.

Check it out. The guy just keeps asking more questions...like he has nothing better to do?

Next time we get these requests, just tell the guy our player is totally ****.


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06-15-2011, 08:38 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxpac View Post
Will you guys please stop telling the Detroit fan that Wizniewski is a good puck-moving Dman, he's not! He's excellent at making that 1st pass to start off plays, but when is it that you see Wiz carrying the puck from blue line to blueline like Subban does?

Speaking of Subban, I will miss the Subban-Wiz combo on the pp,such a treat top watch...
Many times a game, especially on the PP.

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06-15-2011, 08:46 AM
  #32
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Quit sniffing around our Wiz. You guys want Markov. He is durable, trending upward on his development curve, and likely to be a step faster this year.

Wiz is soft, takes dumb-penalties, and his production increase was as a result of playing on the PP-1 wich was really carried by a rookie (who may or may not have struggled before his arrival). Plus, he can't handle it when the going gets rough.

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06-15-2011, 09:11 AM
  #33
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well he can't skate backwards which is bothersome.

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06-15-2011, 09:22 AM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxpac View Post
Will you guys please stop telling the Detroit fan that Wizniewski is a good puck-moving Dman, he's not! He's excellent at making that 1st pass to start off plays, but when is it that you see Wiz carrying the puck from blue line to blueline like Subban does?

Speaking of Subban, I will miss the Subban-Wiz combo on the pp,such a treat top watch...
A good puck moving dman is someone who can get the puck out of their own zone efficiently, which means a good first pass. You just said he isn't one, but then state that he is one.

2 on 1, Wiz just pretty much falls to the ice and hopes. 3 on 2 Wiz looks completely lost if the player with the puck is coming down on his side.

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06-15-2011, 09:28 AM
  #35
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I really wish the Habs would re-sign Wiz to play on Markov's right side. I know some say his play is redundant of Markov's but lately the trend is for Markov to get injured.

If I'd be a Detroit fan I'd be interested in Wiz too. He is a PMD IMO. His shot goes without saying. He does have some defensive deficiencies and some erratic passing but he's still relatively young. He'd be best paired with a responsible d-man like this past year. He was very effective with the Habs and very instrumental in picking up the slack after Markov's injury.

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06-15-2011, 09:47 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neofury View Post
Lets just say the team that gets The Wiz should be pretty happy. I see him being a potential 20g D on a good team. I don't remember but did any D even break 15 last year?

If you don't expect Rafalski but rather expect James Wisniewski you'll be fine. James has his own assets that he brings to the table. If you're expecting a similar or better version of Rafalski not going to happen. They aren't the same player.
Five. Dustin Byfuglien, Lubomir Visnovsky, Brent Burns, Nick Lidstrom and Shea Weber.

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06-15-2011, 10:13 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by SlappyMcGee View Post
Five. Dustin Byfuglien, Lubomir Visnovsky, Brent Burns, Nick Lidstrom and Shea Weber.
Subban netted 14 also. Close but no cigar.

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06-15-2011, 10:38 AM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #57 View Post
Offense B+
Defense C+
PP A
PK he can play decent.. he's a smart player knows how to play defense... just isn't that good at it... C+..

Best assement here.

I can also add that Wiz really stepped it up in the playoffs and became much more involved. He played very well, and in my opinion, saved his season.

In the regular season, he seemed to avoid getting physically involved and only wanted to make cross zone breakout passes. The % of interceptions of those passes was way too high. It looked like he only wanted to make highlight plays. Points or not, he was simply a liability on everything but the PP.

With a Markov, or another good all around 30 year old D, the Habs do not need Wiz, considering the play of Subban and return of Gorges. The limited role of shooter on the PP can be taken up by Subban or possibly Weber, because for Weber it's now or never as a regular everyday D with the Habs.

Truth is Markov is a much better D in every way except the shot from the point. Whomever gets Markov is the winner.

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06-15-2011, 10:46 AM
  #39
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All I can say is that I really hope he can fit under the cap (and would want to sign) here. i really have a bad feeling that boston would try to grab him. seriously.

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06-15-2011, 12:05 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bsl View Post
You do realize this guy is a junior scout who's been assigned to research Wiz. With the Wings, I would not be surprised. It would be like them to assign a junior to get on the board as some 'fan' and proceed to pump us for info...why not? A little extra info from some fairly knowledgeable fans can't hurt. I'd do it myself if I was GM.

Check it out. The guy just keeps asking more questions...like he has nothing better to do?

Next time we get these requests, just tell the guy our player is totally ****.

Uh what? A junior scout? Must be nice on that pedestal of yours.

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06-15-2011, 12:23 PM
  #41
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http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Steve...ttle/139/36400

Excellent article on Wiz.

I agree with everything he said. Make it work PG.

What everyone seems to forget, is our offense is driven by our defense.

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06-15-2011, 12:25 PM
  #42
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He has something called ''Swag''.

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06-15-2011, 12:41 PM
  #43
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He blocks shots with his eye lid and he looks awesome in habs jersey.

WE MUST KEEP HIM

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06-15-2011, 03:09 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Konnan511 View Post
I hear he takes stupid penalties at terrible times and his mean streak also comes from frustration at times.

So basically everyone agrees he is an ideal mobile offensive defenseman, who pinches too often and has the occasional brain fart who also has a mean streak while playing sub-standard to standard defense?

PS, thanks for all the replies! The more replies the better as well since I maybe watch one game of his (Habs) a season.

So Offense is about a B to B+?
Defense is a C- to C?
PP is about a B+ to A-?
Pk is an F? lol


What about his hockey sense and poise (which someone touched on)? Do you think it'd be a bad move to use him as a top pairing DMan instead of a 3/4 guy?
He's toned down his retaliation a lot since Chicago/Anaheim. Makes solid hits every now and then (Kronwall-lite.. very lite). He's young too so he can still benefit from an experienced partner. You put him on the PK when your top 2 PKers are in the box
Defense is actually underrated. I'd say B-, but I'll guarantee he skates by the puck in his own zone once in the game. The thing about him though is that he usually makes up for it and gets it back/blocks it/whatever. He's a system guy too. Not too mention I've seen him crash the net a couple of times on the offense.

Overall, I'm pissed that he most likely won't be on our team.

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06-15-2011, 03:23 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by Habsolument90 View Post
Overall, I'm pissed that he most likely won't be on our team.
You and me, both.

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06-15-2011, 03:27 PM
  #46
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I doubt that he will be available for 4 years at 4.5 mil per year. At that price you sign him and trade him if he becomes expendable(Markov healthy, Subban and Weber develop) in 1-2 years. If the Habs won't sign him at 4.5 mil/year or less it's a mistake.

I think as a UFA his price will be around 5.5 to 5.75 depending on how many top d-men are still there July 1st.

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06-15-2011, 03:36 PM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post
if he ends up going to Det as a replacement for Rafalski, I think you guys will be a bit disapointed (especially if you have to outbid everyone else for his services and end up paying 5M+).

Wiz is a solid top-4 dman B/C of his aggressive play on the PP and his overall offensive production. Unlike Rafalski, who to my estimation was both a solid point producer AND a very good positional dman who offset his physical limitations with skill/poise, Wiz seems to me as a guy who is still getting by thanks to a relatively one-dimensional skill set combined with a very solid competitive edge.

he plays with aggression and intensity, and he has a pretty good feel in the offensive zone, but ultimately he is sub-par in his defensive-zone coverage and defensive transition game. He needs to play with an edge to be effective, but that intensity also leads him to overcommit far too often defensively, which lead to pretty troublesome breakdowns in his own end.

not the kind of player you want to see playing vital minutes in a must win game...

his offensive contributions certainly cover up some of his shortcomings, and he is by all means a very solid top-4 player... just not in the same caliber as a Rafalski, even though he's primed to get paid that way this offseason.

if he is willing to take less than "market" value, I'd be shocked to see him leave montreal since he claims to love it here, but I'd see Detroit as one of the few other teams he'd go to at less than 5M$, in which case he would be a solid addition (imo, 4M would be his fair price point, but 50pt UFA dmen don't generally go that cheap).
Good way of putting it, that's how I'd explain Wisniewski as well.

He's a solid #3-4 guy, that under his current cap hit was a luxury. I think Wisniewski will run into the same problem a lot of UFA's do, in that if he ends up signing around 5M or more he will enter a zone where expectations may not be met regularly and he could become a scape goat. I'd say Wiz's real world value is between 4-4.25M, but he's likely to get the "UFA Luxury". I fully agree with the other posters that it would be criminal to see Wiz walk from Montreal at that price tag and see Spacek return next season. We'll see how it plays out I guess.

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06-15-2011, 08:08 PM
  #48
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WIZ should be back, dump Spacek if it's about the $$$.

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06-15-2011, 08:59 PM
  #49
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Personnaly, I believe it's a freaking no-brainer.

We should sign him as an insurance policy against Markov's potential weakness. In the meanwhile, we have the most fearsome offensive blueline of the NHL (which will support a somewhat lightweighted offense), and we have a solid currency to exchange to another team if he proves to be superfluous.

The end. If we don't sign him, and Markov is badlucked again, we shall curse the sky until Toronto wins the Stanley Cup, mark my words.

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06-15-2011, 09:05 PM
  #50
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Originally Posted by SolkaTruesilver View Post
Personnaly, I believe it's a freaking no-brainer.

We should sign him as an insurance policy against Markov's potential weakness. In the meanwhile, we have the most fearsome offensive blueline of the NHL (which will support a somewhat lightweighted offense), and we have a solid currency to exchange to another team if he proves to be superfluous.

The end. If we don't sign him, and Markov is badlucked again, we shall curse the sky until Toronto wins the Stanley Cup, mark my words.
Spending 5+ mil on an insurance policy instead of adding a needed top 6 winger doesn't sound logical to me.

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