One thing I wanna add, regarding Datsyuk and Zetterberg. Both play LW AND C when they're together. Babcock usually uses Datsyuk in the middle, but when Zetterberg is healthier he used him at center. Whoever has the legs going, that guy plays center. If one of them is dominating on face-offs, that guy plays center. They're interchangeable, AND as has been already pointed out, it's easy for them to play together because Zetterberg is a natural LW. And dare I say Datsyuk is more versatile than Malkin.
BUT, when Datysuk and Zetterberg are on separate lines, they NEVER play wing. Datsyuk played wing in the playoffs due to injury. When healthy, nobody else on Detroit is playing first or second line C other than No. 13 and No. 40.
SO for the 1 billionth time, I have no issue if Bylsma wants to load up Crosby's line by inserting Malkin on it now and then. If one day our roster evolves to the point where we're better off with Crosby and Malkin together a la Detroit, great. Until then, 1 and 1A should be Crosby and Malkin. Forget about this hybrid Malkin-Staal thing. Staal doesn't need Malkin to be a MAJOR asset, and Malkin doesn't need Staal to win an Art Ross and Hart.
If you commit as a team to three top-notch stud centers, where two may be the best in hockey and the third could be the best third-line C in the game, then commit to it.
If Malkin's playing wing, then I would even support the idea of trading Staal for a winger.
One thing I wanna add, regarding Datsyuk and Zetterberg. Both play LW AND C when they're together. Babcock usually uses Datsyuk in the middle, but when Zetterberg is healthier he used him at center. Whoever has the legs going, that guy plays center. If one of them is dominating on face-offs, that guy plays center. They're interchangeable, AND as has been already pointed out, it's easy for them to play together because Zetterberg is a natural LW. And dare I say Datsyuk is more versatile than Malkin.
BUT, when Datysuk and Zetterberg are on separate lines, they NEVER play wing. Datsyuk played wing in the playoffs due to injury. When healthy, nobody else on Detroit is playing first or second line C other than No. 13 and No. 40.
SO for the 1 billionth time, I have no issue if Bylsma wants to load up Crosby's line by inserting Malkin on it now and then. If one day our roster evolves to the point where we're better off with Crosby and Malkin together a la Detroit, great. Until then, 1 and 1A should be Crosby and Malkin. Forget about this hybrid Malkin-Staal thing. Staal doesn't need Malkin to be a MAJOR asset, and Malkin doesn't need Staal to win an Art Ross and Hart.
If you commit as a team to three top-notch stud centers, where two may be the best in hockey and the third could be the best third-line C in the game, then commit to it.
If Malkin's playing wing, then I would even support the idea of trading Staal for a winger.
ANYTHING to get Malkin back to 2C.
You've said this, and I believe jmelm has said that he "wouldn't care if a 200 yard old barn had to play RW as long as Malkin was a center." It's mind boggling really.
It sounds as if you two want Malkin at center because you have some glorification of centers, and have no consideration what would be best for the team. Even if Malkin is less effective as a winger, he'd still be a top 5 winger in the league. Having a complete top 6 is what would help this team the most, allowing guys like Tangradi, Jeffrey, and Letestu who have some good offensive potential follow in behind and allow them to grow.
You've said this, and I believe jmelm has said that he "wouldn't care if a 200 yard old barn had to play RW as long as Malkin was a center." It's mind boggling really.
It sounds as if you two want Malkin at center because you have some glorification of centers, and have no consideration what would be best for the team. Even if Malkin is less effective as a winger, he'd still be a top 5 winger in the league. Having a complete top 6 is what would help this team the most, allowing guys like Tangradi, Jeffrey, and Letestu who have some good offensive potential follow in behind and allow them to grow.
Wasn't the "200 year old barn playing wing" one of many excuses as to why Malkin wasn't playing up to his playoff MVP potential? In other words, wasn't Malkin having "crap wingers" - even though he played in his natural spot - the thing that was holding him back?
I can't ****ing believe this debate is still going on. It's not even the
glorification of Malkin playing the middle - but the exaggerated opinion that Staal playing center on a third line is what brought us the Cup. "Strength down the middle" has become bar none the most annoying phrase on this board.
Whereas Malkin playing the middle elevated both Talbot and Fedetenko, it wasn't Staal playing center that elevated Cooke and Kennedy. EVERY line Tyler Kennedy plays on is effective, and Matt Cooke is Matt Cooke no matter who he plays with. The third line just did what a third line should do: be a pain in the ass, wear down opponents and keep the puck in the other team's zone. It wasn't because Staal was that extra wild card no other team has that brought the team success in '09.
This messianic obsession with Malkin absolutely having to play center is boggling to me.
You've said this, and I believe jmelm has said that he "wouldn't care if a 200 yard old barn had to play RW as long as Malkin was a center." It's mind boggling really.
I said nothing of the sort! I said 200 year old out house, not barn.
In all seriousness, that was just a joke and some hyperbole indicating my enthusiasm for Malkin to go back to centre. But obviously, I want him to have elite wingers. I'm not satisfied with Nick Johnson (aka outhouse)
Quote:
Originally Posted by JTG
It sounds as if you two want Malkin at center because you have some glorification of centers, and have no consideration what would be best for the team. Even if Malkin is less effective as a winger, he'd still be a top 5 winger in the league.
Obviously, I agree with you that Malkin could be a top 5 winger in the league, but then again, Staal could be a top 20 winger in the league. For me, it is not an issue of having a problem moving one of our centres to wing -- in fact I support the idea. I just feel that the drop-off of Malkin to wing versus Staal to wing is much greater. Staal had his most productive season on Malkin's wing, while Malkin has played his worst hockey when moved to the wing position (even if he's still better than 95% of wingers).
Quote:
Originally Posted by JTG
Having a complete top 6 is what would help this team the most, allowing guys like Tangradi, Jeffrey, and Letestu who have some good offensive potential follow in behind and allow them to grow.
Agreed, and this is why I have proposed the idea of having Staal play LW with Malkin and keeping Cooke & TK together with Jeffrey. Jeffrey is a great substitute for Staal and can play a very similar role on that line.
But I'm not convinced that all 3 of those guys have the same ability or should be playing the same role. I really think Jeffrey is superior in every way to Letestu, so if one of those guys can't transition to the wing, I think we have a log-jam at the centre position. If that proves to be the case and all our centres are healthy, then I consider Letestu trade bait if there is a decent return to be had.
Tangradi, unlike Jeffrey, has not dominated the AHL to the point that he doesn't have anything further to gain by being there. I would love to see him earn a spot on the big club, but I don't think anything should be handed to him if he doesn't earn it. He is still young & waiver exempt and can be sent down if needed. Also, a lot of people are saying he should be playing RW on one of the top 3 lines when the reality is that he may or may not be able to be effective at that position.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MtlPenFan
Whereas Malkin playing the middle elevated both Talbot and Fedetenko, it wasn't Staal playing center that elevated Cooke and Kennedy. EVERY line Tyler Kennedy plays on is effective, and Matt Cooke is Matt Cooke no matter who he plays with. The third line just did what a third line should do: be a pain in the ass, wear down opponents and keep the puck in the other team's zone. It wasn't because Staal was that extra wild card no other team has that brought the team success in '09.
Agreed 100%, which is why I've been such a big fan of TK for a few years now and begging for him to be put on the PP and more offensive situations. That is also why, like I say above, if we can get another RW via UFA, I would like to see a Cooke-Jefrey-Kennedy line. But I would be equally happy if Kennedy played on one of the top 2 lines if we found a suitable replacement for him that made our third line a continued strength for our team.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MtlPenFan
This messianic obsession with Malkin absolutely having to play center is boggling to me.
The obession with Staal absolutely having to be the centre on a line with Malkin is what is what bothers me the most. Geno>Staal, and therefore Geno should play his natural position and Staal play wing.
The obession with Staal absolutely having to be the centre on a line with Malkin is what is what bothers me the most. Geno>Staal, and therefore Geno should play his natural position and Staal play wing.
In other Pens news, it's being reported that head coach Dan Bylsma will NOT be flying out to Elk Point, Alberta, or Sarnia, Ontario, to ask Mark Letestu or Dustin Jeffrey if they will be ok to try to switch to RW next season.
