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The Trade Proposal Thread ‎2011 (part 6)

View Poll Results: Who would you trade for Kyle Turris?
Brendan Gallagher 1 3.57%
Nathan Beaulieu 0 0%
Lars Eller 1 3.57%
Alexander Avtsin & Michael Bournival 2 7.14%
Louis Leblanc & Yannick Weber 4 14.29%
Two first round picks 0 0%
One first round and two (or three) second round picks 0 0%
Nope! Ain't gonna do it. 20 71.43%
Voters: 28. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
06-17-2011, 09:45 AM
  #176
S Bah
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Unless you are talking high end UFA's, players rights are usually not worth a whole lot...I think Bouwmeester brought back a 3rd rounder. The only UFA's we have that could garner a pick are Markov and Wisniewski, I wouldn't trade either until one of the two is signed.
I believe the Habs will listen to all interested parties in regards to their UFA's,Gauthier has no problem making the tough decisions.Particularly when it presents an opportunity that could solve a position where the Habs have needs in the near future.Mika Zibanejad comes to mind a player that could join the Hamilton Bulldogs this season or possibly Gabriel Landeskog or Sean Couturier,players with a possibility of making the Habs out of training camp.

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Old
06-17-2011, 09:49 AM
  #177
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Originally Posted by S Bah View Post
I believe the Habs will listen to all interested parties in regards to their UFA's,Gauthier has no problem making the tough decisions.Particularly when it presents an opportunity that could solve a position where the Habs have needs in the near future.Mika Zibanejad comes to mind a player that could join the Hamilton Bulldogs this season or possibly Gabriel Landeskog or Sean Couturier,players with a possibility of making the Habs out of training camp.
You are dreaming in colour...the Habs don't have a pick to draft those guys and won't part with the assets required to move up to the top 4-8 picks in the draft. The Habs at this point are more worries about the present than the future so weakening next year's team for help in 3-4 years makes no sense. That's not to say they don't want to keep adding good young players, but at most they might move up 3-5 spots to get a Beaulieu, Scheifele or McNeill type if they really like them like with Tinordi last year.

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06-17-2011, 10:02 AM
  #178
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
You are dreaming in colour...the Habs don't have a pick to draft those guys and won't part with the assets required to move up to the top 4-8 picks in the draft. The Habs at this point are more worries about the present than the future so weakening next year's team for help in 3-4 years makes no sense. That's not to say they don't want to keep adding good young players, but at most they might move up 3-5 spots to get a Beaulieu, Scheifele or McNeill type if they really like them like with Tinordi last year.
In Color and High Definition anything else is boring,now that said I'll leave the trades to the GM and his staff.I'm sure the possibilities of making a trade to move up have been discussed by them and it certainly is within the realm of possibilities to acquire the 5th pick if they so desired.Naysaying is very easy to do,accomplishing ideas that are difficult to comprehend is what the GM's and their scouts are paid for.

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Old
06-17-2011, 10:59 AM
  #179
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Originally Posted by S Bah View Post
In Color and High Definition anything else is boring,now that said I'll leave the trades to the GM and his staff.I'm sure the possibilities of making a trade to move up have been discussed by them and it certainly is within the realm of possibilities to acquire the 5th pick if they so desired.Naysaying is very easy to do,accomplishing ideas that are difficult to comprehend is what the GM's and their scouts are paid for.
Trading up from 17th to 5 would cost Eller Pacioretty Plekanec Subban or Price and they won't move those assets.

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06-17-2011, 02:43 PM
  #180
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Analyzer suggested this in the main trade board... i think it's exactly the kind of move we need to make:

1- Trade down in the first round for another team's first (20-25 range) + a 2nd

2- Trade first (20-25) to Chicago for Brouwer + 70th overall pick


so we end up with Brouwer, a late 2nd, and an early 3rd in exchange for the 17th overall... I'd say it's a worthwhile asset move.

Brouwer gives us a nice top-9 addition, adding both some goal scoring and grit.

2nd and 3rd, with Timmins draft record, have almost as much a chance of turning into a decent player as the 17th overall does.

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06-17-2011, 02:54 PM
  #181
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Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post
Analyzer suggested this in the main trade board... i think it's exactly the kind of move we need to make:

1- Trade down in the first round for another team's first (20-25 range) + a 2nd

2- Trade first (20-25) to Chicago for Brouwer + 70th overall pick


so we end up with Brouwer, a late 2nd, and an early 3rd in exchange for the 17th overall... I'd say it's a worthwhile asset move.

Brouwer gives us a nice top-9 addition, adding both some goal scoring and grit.

2nd and 3rd, with Timmins draft record, have almost as much a chance of turning into a decent player as the 17th overall does.
Would it not be more simple to draft a good young player #17 and just sign a UFA that may cost 1 mil more on the cap...Upshall Laich etc?

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Old
06-18-2011, 09:48 AM
  #182
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They'd probably find a way to match it, but this would at least make the Rangers' cap situation even tougher, and would maybe force a trade that would get us a quality player: offer Anisimov an offer sheet at $1.9mil per year, the same one Bobby Clarke offered Kesler. Wait until after the draft, so that the 2nd round pick in compensation would be the 2012 pick that we still own.

Hopefully the rest of the NHL gets in on this with offer sheets to Dubinsky (Leafs?) and Callahan. If the Rangers are going to sign Richards, might as well go after them.

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Old
06-18-2011, 10:20 AM
  #183
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Originally Posted by Roulin View Post
They'd probably find a way to match it, but this would at least make the Rangers' cap situation even tougher, and would maybe force a trade that would get us a quality player: offer Anisimov an offer sheet at $1.9mil per year, the same one Bobby Clarke offered Kesler. Wait until after the draft, so that the 2nd round pick in compensation would be the 2012 pick that we still own.

Hopefully the rest of the NHL gets in on this with offer sheets to Dubinsky (Leafs?) and Callahan. If the Rangers are going to sign Richards, might as well go after them.
You can't offer sheet anyone until July 1, they are not considered RFA until then, that is when their contracts expire.

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06-18-2011, 10:23 AM
  #184
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Originally Posted by NLHabsFan View Post
You can't offer sheet anyone until July 1, they are not considered RFA until then, that is when their contracts expire.
I didn't know that, thanks!

So yeah, with Drury's buyout being voided and the Richards signing imminent, the opposition should swoop in on the Rangers like vultures in July.

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06-19-2011, 09:55 AM
  #185
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I don't think we have enough parts to secure a top ten pick this year, but we should definitely look into acquiring some first rounders from teams for next year if at all possible.

Look at teams who have weak goaltending, or who think they're making a playoff run this year and see if you can get their picks off of them before they become more valuable.

The problem with this of course is that you still need to give up a solid player for them to consider.

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06-19-2011, 02:06 PM
  #186
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Would it not be more simple to draft a good young player #17 and just sign a UFA that may cost 1 mil more on the cap...Upshall Laich etc?
with the habs drafting record over the past decade, combined with our needs and cap situation, I see Brouwer + 2nd (36 or 43) + 70th overall as better for the organization than 17th+Upshall/Laich @ UFA premium.

if you look at the players we've drafted in the 15-20 range vs the players we've nabbed in the 2nd/3rd round, especially under Timmins, we do pretty much just picking in the first as we do in the 2/3, so getting 2 picks vs 1 works for me from the pov of stocking our prospect pool.

as an RFA, and coming off of a so-so year, Brouwer won't be getting much of a raise, I'd say probably no more than 1.5-1.75M cap hit, compared to 3-4M+ for Upshall or Laich... and I think Brouwer would give us roughly similar contributions to both players. Next year, assuming he's had a good year, we are then in a better position to give him a deal similar to what Upshall/Laich will get this year.

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Old
06-19-2011, 04:15 PM
  #187
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Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post
with the habs drafting record over the past decade, combined with our needs and cap situation, I see Brouwer + 2nd (36 or 43) + 70th overall as better for the organization than 17th+Upshall/Laich @ UFA premium.

if you look at the players we've drafted in the 15-20 range vs the players we've nabbed in the 2nd/3rd round, especially under Timmins, we do pretty much just picking in the first as we do in the 2/3, so getting 2 picks vs 1 works for me from the pov of stocking our prospect pool.

as an RFA, and coming off of a so-so year, Brouwer won't be getting much of a raise, I'd say probably no more than 1.5-1.75M cap hit, compared to 3-4M+ for Upshall or Laich... and I think Brouwer would give us roughly similar contributions to both players. Next year, assuming he's had a good year, we are then in a better position to give him a deal similar to what Upshall/Laich will get this year.
I find that's pretty flawed logic...just because we have traditionally drafted better in the 2nd round vs late 1st that we should suddenly start trading down to round 2.

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Old
06-19-2011, 08:21 PM
  #188
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roulin View Post
They'd probably find a way to match it, but this would at least make the Rangers' cap situation even tougher, and would maybe force a trade that would get us a quality player: offer Anisimov an offer sheet at $1.9mil per year, the same one Bobby Clarke offered Kesler. Wait until after the draft, so that the 2nd round pick in compensation would be the 2012 pick that we still own.

Hopefully the rest of the NHL gets in on this with offer sheets to Dubinsky (Leafs?) and Callahan. If the Rangers are going to sign Richards, might as well go after them.
Thing is there's a GM code (real one, not Laraque code). If you decide to offer-sheet, then be ready to get your RFAs offer-sheeted. I don't wanna see Price being a part of that and we end up paying him 7-8mil because we matched someone's offer-sheet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
I find that's pretty flawed logic...just because we have traditionally drafted better in the 2nd round vs late 1st that we should suddenly start trading down to round 2.
I think what he's trying to say is: since we draft well in the 2nd round, 2 picks in that range would be better than 1 @ 17.

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06-19-2011, 11:12 PM
  #189
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Originally Posted by Habsolument90 View Post
Thing is there's a GM code (real one, not Laraque code). If you decide to offer-sheet, then be ready to get your RFAs offer-sheeted. I don't wanna see Price being a part of that and we end up paying him 7-8mil because we matched someone's offer-sheet.
First, well done with the Laraque jab!

Nonetheless, I don't agree with you regarding offer sheets. There have been 6 offer sheets signed since the lockout, not including the Kessel situation. Only once was a "revenge" offer sheet signed - a barely significant, 1.25m 1yr offer to Steve Bernier, in response for the Backes offer sheet. The rest were all made to players belonging to teams that had not themselves pursued RFAs.

Unlike the Rangers' situation, I believe the Habs will be planning next offseason around signing Price. They will have already budgeted around 5m/yr for him. I don't believe another team would make the space in their budget to offer the 6.5m/yr or so it would take to tempt Price, on top of being willing to sacrifice the draft picks necessary (1st, 1st, 2nd, 3rd). If a team is willing make those sacrifices to pursue Price, I don't think any good will the Habs could accrue by not making offer sheets of their own would dissuade them.

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06-20-2011, 12:20 AM
  #190
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Unlike the Rangers' situation, I believe the Habs will be planning next offseason around signing Price. They will have already budgeted around 5m/yr for him. I don't believe another team would make the space in their budget to offer the 6.5m/yr or so it would take to tempt Price, on top of being willing to sacrifice the draft picks necessary (1st, 1st, 2nd, 3rd). If a team is willing make those sacrifices to pursue Price, I don't think any good will the Habs could accrue by not making offer sheets of their own would dissuade them.
They don't need to. They just need to have their picks. It's a well-known fact that we are not letting go of Price at all in the foreseeable future. At Price's lowest points in his career, they still traded Halak before him. I think the org would even make a few trades to fit in Price's matched contract if it comes down to that. And that's something that can set us back a couple of years.

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06-20-2011, 04:53 AM
  #191
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With the glut of defencemen the Habs have the rights for I would try to garner some kind of draft pick(s) for Roman Hamrlik,Brent Sopel,Alex Picard and Paul Mara along with Benoit Pouliot.Surely the Habs can get some type of asset(s) for these players.A second round pick is better than nothing at all,Gauthier has got his work cut out for him this week.It would be nice to have a full set of picks,one per round at least.

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06-20-2011, 05:37 AM
  #192
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Originally Posted by S Bah View Post
With the glut of defencemen the Habs have the rights for I would try to garner some kind of draft pick(s) for Roman Hamrlik,Brent Sopel,Alex Picard and Paul Mara along with Benoit Pouliot.Surely the Habs can get some type of asset(s) for these players.A second round pick is better than nothing at all,Gauthier has got his work cut out for him this week.It would be nice to have a full set of picks,one per round at least.
Low end UFA's right won't get you anything...not sure if we can get anything for Picard, Pouliot is probably worth a 3rd to 5th. Hamrlik maybe a late pick if we are lucky.

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06-20-2011, 09:10 AM
  #193
Miller Time
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
I find that's pretty flawed logic...just because we have traditionally drafted better in the 2nd round vs late 1st that we should suddenly start trading down to round 2.
?

what's flawed is your interpretation.


Obviously trading down from the 1st to the 2nd on it's own makes no sense, but that certainly isn't what I'm suggesting.

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06-20-2011, 11:03 AM
  #194
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Gomez to FLA


F Scott Gomez




Rights to RFA Steve Bernier
Conditional Pick 2011


This for MTL to free up cap space, and FLA to hit cap floor. Also Gomez may have a decent season in FLA with the bright sun and not much media.
Tell me what you think,

( I am probably going to get burned on this one... )

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06-20-2011, 11:05 AM
  #195
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To Florida:
- Scott Gomez
- 2011 1st pick
- 2012 2nd pick

To Mtl:
- No one

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06-20-2011, 11:05 AM
  #196
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Twice?

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06-20-2011, 11:07 AM
  #197
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I'd rather keep Gomez if Bernier is in the trade.

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06-20-2011, 11:09 AM
  #198
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Originally Posted by Travis Moen View Post
To Florida:
- Scott Gomez
- 2011 1st pick
- 2012 2nd pick

To Mtl:
- No one
This is ridiculous. As has been said plenty of times before, Gomez can be traded. Stop watching RDS.

We won't get much in return, but teams below the floor will be interested in him.

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06-20-2011, 11:21 AM
  #199
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This is ridiculous. As has been said plenty of times before, Gomez can be traded. Stop watching RDS.

We won't get much in return, but teams below the floor will be interested in him.
You're too optimistic.

He has a negative value. I don't think any team would take him unless we sweeten the pot, cap-floor teams included.

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06-20-2011, 11:35 AM
  #200
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Travis Moen View Post
To Florida:
- Scott Gomez
- 2011 1st pick
- 2012 2nd pick

To Mtl:
- No one
That might be about what it would take. But there's no way I'd trade away Gomez as "negative value" this year. There are too few quality UFA's available for me to feel like we'd have a good chance at upgrading the team. Just getting Gomez to bounce back as a decent #2 guy for us would be sufficient, and he might do that. Meanwhile, we badly need to keep our picks to help re-stock a depleted system.

At this point, I wouldn't give up Gomez alone for "no one". Our team is just too thin up front atm, and really, it doesn't seem like there is much cap pressure either. The team has lots of options, especially if Wisniewski can't be re-signed.

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