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Jagr interested to play in Montreal pt2

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06-19-2011, 11:22 PM
  #976
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capgeek CapGeek

We're hearing the #NHL salary cap will be set between $63.5 and $64 million, but it's not set in stone just yet.

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06-19-2011, 11:29 PM
  #977
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Originally Posted by SB164 View Post
capgeek CapGeek

We're hearing the #NHL salary cap will be set between $63.5 and $64 million, but it's not set in stone just yet.
Add to that:

TSNBobMcKenzie Bob McKenzie
I'm told the upper limit of the 2011-12 NHL salary cap will be $64 million. The lower limit, or floor, will be $48 million.

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06-19-2011, 11:40 PM
  #978
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Add to that:

TSNBobMcKenzie Bob McKenzie
I'm told the upper limit of the 2011-12 NHL salary cap will be $64 million. The lower limit, or floor, will be $48 million.
This



followed by this


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06-20-2011, 12:05 AM
  #979
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watch and tell me you still don't want him

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06-20-2011, 12:19 AM
  #980
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watch and tell me you still don't want him


I really don't know when I'm going to start writing things again. I like this whole posting pictures gig.

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06-20-2011, 12:39 AM
  #981
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"Guys, it's not easy to play there," Jagr said. "You practice a lot harder than in the NHL. On the big ice you have to skate. I play a lot on the big ice. Sometimes I will play on two lines. I think if I decided to come back, I'm think I'm going to be a better player than before I left."

"I think after those two years I spent in Russia I'm going to be a better player than I was before I left," Jagr said. "I know that. I found that out the year during the lockout. I was playing the whole year in Russia and I came back and I had probably the best year I had in New York."
From. http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=518295

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06-20-2011, 12:57 AM
  #982
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You are one sided here Jagr had a better carreer because of the injuries but Forsberg if he could have stayed healthy would have had the edge in points. The only player wich playmaking (playmaking not scoring or anything else) abilities was of the level of Forsberg was Gretzky.

If you talk about carreer points and everything you say Jagr is the best. But when you talk about The complete package you talk Forsberg. Played way more tough than Jagr much more playmaking abilities more hockey sense and vision and had the faculty to make player around him better wich Jagr had trouble with.

Forsberg is arguably the better player you won't make me change my opinion and neither do you.
Jagr led the league in assists 3 times, Forsberg only did it once.

Jagr had 83 assists in 1998-99 playing mostly with Hrdina and Miller while Forsberg was playing on a team comprised of Sakic, Drury, Hejduk...

Jagr had as many assists as Straka (2nd in team scoring) had points. In fact Jagr had 16 more assists than Forsberg did.

I have already done a thread 2 years ago comparing the two during their primes. In their primes Forsberg averaged 0,90 assists a game while Jagr averaged 0.88. They were very close.

In terms of toughness, Forsberg was very tough, one of toughest players of all time but he was nowhere near as tough or strong as Jagr.

Jagr didn't hit or play in your face but he was a bull and even with 2 6'5, 240 lbs guys draped all over him he would still score goals or set up teammates.

What people don't realize is that Jagr finished top 3 both in goals and assists in the same season 6 times in his career.

The only winger in the history of the game who had more assists was Howe with just 50 more in over 500 more games.

Forsberg's playmaking ability gets overrated.

The tier in playmaking is

1. Gretzky, Lemieux and Orr

2. Oates, Jagr, Thornton, Francis, Forsberg, Sakic, Howe.

Jagr and Forsberg were equal playmakers.

Jagr though was far superior in goalscoring. I don't care if you're injured or not, when your career high in goals is 30 and you hit that number 3 times, you shouldn't be considered better than a player who won 5 Art Ross and hit 30 goals or more 15 times (in a row).

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06-20-2011, 01:01 AM
  #983
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Please, Jagr

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Old
06-20-2011, 01:16 AM
  #984
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Part 4?? We're like 1000 posts away from Part 4!!! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!
doin' my part.

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Pro posting.

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06-20-2011, 01:21 AM
  #985
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The giveaway between him and Pleky on the last goal is orgasmic!


Me = impressed.

I am speechless..

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06-20-2011, 01:22 AM
  #986
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doin' my part.



Pro posting.
someone 'shop jagr head on the guy on the left. the guy with the stack of money on his head lol

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06-20-2011, 01:59 AM
  #987
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It was pointed out earlier, but I'm most impressed by the first goal of those highlights. Long, powerful strides and the defenseman couldn't catch him; looks like the man can still move very well.

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06-20-2011, 02:10 AM
  #988
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Originally Posted by jags6868 View Post
Jagr led the league in assists 3 times, Forsberg only did it once.

Jagr had 83 assists in 1998-99 playing mostly with Hrdina and Miller while Forsberg was playing on a team comprised of Sakic, Drury, Hejduk...

Jagr had as many assists as Straka (2nd in team scoring) had points. In fact Jagr had 16 more assists than Forsberg did.

I have already done a thread 2 years ago comparing the two during their primes. In their primes Forsberg averaged 0,90 assists a game while Jagr averaged 0.88. They were very close.

In terms of toughness, Forsberg was very tough, one of toughest players of all time but he was nowhere near as tough or strong as Jagr.

Jagr didn't hit or play in your face but he was a bull and even with 2 6'5, 240 lbs guys draped all over him he would still score goals or set up teammates.

What people don't realize is that Jagr finished top 3 both in goals and assists in the same season 6 times in his career.

The only winger in the history of the game who had more assists was Howe with just 50 more in over 500 more games.

Forsberg's playmaking ability gets overrated.

The tier in playmaking is

1. Gretzky, Lemieux and Orr

2. Oates, Jagr, Thornton, Francis, Forsberg, Sakic, Howe.

Jagr and Forsberg were equal playmakers.

Jagr though was far superior in goalscoring. I don't care if you're injured or not, when your career high in goals is 30 and you hit that number 3 times, you shouldn't be considered better than a player who won 5 Art Ross and hit 30 goals or more 15 times (in a row).
Perhaps you missed it, but I'll re-post it

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
I think Jagr was better than Forsberg, but not by that much and Jagr wasn't stronger. I don't really know how ''bigger'' falls into a skill category either..
Forsberg had the potential to become one of the greatest hockey players of all time. It's very unfortunate that his injuries kept him away from the game so much.

Just so you know, their scoring ratios were pretty identical during the regular season, Jagr averaged a 1.256 ratio while Forsberg hit 1.25. Pretty darn even if you ask me.
There's a bigger difference in the POs however, and Forsberg gets the edge with 1.13 as opposed to Jagr's 1.07.
On the international scene, their pace is again identical.

I give the edge to Jagr because he's been healthier throughout his career and therefore played 500games+ more than Forsberg. He's also had unbelievable years with 62G 149Pts.

So ya, Jagr was better, but one can definitely debate which had the better skillset. It's certainly not as one sided as you make it sound.


Forsberg playmaking skills were not overrated, that is a very foolish and ignorant thing to say, and Jagr was not any tougher than him, at all.
Forsberg could have two guys on him and create a play or beat them out to score just as well as Jagr. Not only that, but he could completely destroy them in a check.
I would give him the edge in the toughness department, without any doubt.
Something else that I'd favor Forsberg with is the defensive side of the game. He was even regularly used to kill penalties. He was a much better two way player than Jagr, there's no debate there either.

Overall however, I'll give the edge to Jagr. The main reason why is he's played over 500 more games than Forsberg. Otherwise, it's awfully tight.
Gretzky is still known to most as the greatest player of all time, but I'm sure Lemieux would have destroyed most of his records had he been healthy.
Forsberg always had to deal with injuries. If he hadn't, he'd still be playing and his numbers would be very close to Jagr's.

Also, you say Jagr got 83 assists playing with Miller and Hrdina. This is a false statement. He got his assist being centered by Straka. He played, on average, 9min more per game than Hrdina/Miller, so it's simply wrong.
You're also wrong about Forsberg. He didn't play most of his time with Sakic, nor Hejduk. His linemates are similar to the ones Jagr had. Maybe some were better, like Claude Lemieux or Kamensky, but trying to diminish Forsberg's play by saying he had better linemates (and making a false statement that Jagr spent his time with crappy ones) is very disrespectful of Forsberg's talent and accomplishments.
He played with Sakic on the PP or when they trailed, and some occasional shifts, very much like Crosby/Malkin and even Lemieux/Jagr.

They have extremely similar scoring ratios, with Forsberg having a clear edge in the POs, and he has suffered from recurring injuries throughout his career.

I think you need a little refreshment of how Forsberg used to play, because you either barely ever watched him, or simply forgot.
(Note that this is coming from a guy that give Jagr the edge over Forsberg.)



Last edited by Kriss E: 06-20-2011 at 02:17 AM.
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Old
06-20-2011, 04:10 AM
  #989
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Marc de Foy reports in the journal de mtl that Jagr is not coming to mtl, article was released today someone plz provide link I'm at work doing the night shift.

The jist is though his agent is former mtl defenceman petr svoboda, says there has been brief contact with PG who said he would get back to him after deciding on hamrlik!!!! , mentions of detroit and pittsburg being interested, he mentions 12 teams are interested in Jagr

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06-20-2011, 05:08 AM
  #990
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Originally Posted by giovannicanella View Post
Marc de Foy reports in the journal de mtl that Jagr is not coming to mtl, article was released today someone plz provide link I'm at work doing the night shift.

The jist is though his agent is former mtl defenceman petr svoboda, says there has been brief contact with PG who said he would get back to him after deciding on hamrlik!!!! , mentions of detroit and pittsburg being interested, he mentions 12 teams are interested in Jagr
... I don't know if I can take this seriously, Hamrlik has clearly lost a step and the entire discussion PG had was reshaping a more mobile and brutal defense to play against. Hamrlik goes against that,

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06-20-2011, 05:14 AM
  #991
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Marc de Foy reports in the journal de mtl that Jagr is not coming to mtl, article was released today someone plz provide link I'm at work doing the night shift.

The jist is though his agent is former mtl defenceman petr svoboda, says there has been brief contact with PG who said he would get back to him after deciding on hamrlik!!!! , mentions of detroit and pittsburg being interested, he mentions 12 teams are interested in Jagr

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06-20-2011, 06:54 AM
  #992
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Sakic was my favorite player, but he and Forsberg didn't always play together. It's very similar to Malkin/Crosby.
Both were centers of their own line and occasionally put together, especially if trailing.

I agree though, I put JJ ahead, but not by a ton.
I agree, I know they didn't always play together, other than PP time ect, my point was Sakic was the more accomplished player on the Av's, not Forsberg, as much as I loved him, the wreckless, take no prisoners style he played, contributed greatly to his shortened career.

He had a ton of skill for sure, but if we were rating them in an All time sense, there would be quite a bit of separation between Jagr and him, and likely quite a bit Between Sakic and Forsberg as well. I know we weren't rating rating this based on anything like that, just find it interesting that Jagr was likely miles ahead in that regard.

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06-20-2011, 07:09 AM
  #993
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Perhaps you missed it, but I'll re-post it





Forsberg playmaking skills were not overrated, that is a very foolish and ignorant thing to say, and Jagr was not any tougher than him, at all.
Forsberg could have two guys on him and create a play or beat them out to score just as well as Jagr. Not only that, but he could completely destroy them in a check.
I would give him the edge in the toughness department, without any doubt.
Something else that I'd favor Forsberg with is the defensive side of the game. He was even regularly used to kill penalties. He was a much better two way player than Jagr, there's no debate there either.

Overall however, I'll give the edge to Jagr. The main reason why is he's played over 500 more games than Forsberg. Otherwise, it's awfully tight.
Gretzky is still known to most as the greatest player of all time, but I'm sure Lemieux would have destroyed most of his records had he been healthy.
Forsberg always had to deal with injuries. If he hadn't, he'd still be playing and his numbers would be very close to Jagr's.

Also, you say Jagr got 83 assists playing with Miller and Hrdina. This is a false statement. He got his assist being centered by Straka. He played, on average, 9min more per game than Hrdina/Miller, so it's simply wrong.
You're also wrong about Forsberg. He didn't play most of his time with Sakic, nor Hejduk. His linemates are similar to the ones Jagr had. Maybe some were better, like Claude Lemieux or Kamensky, but trying to diminish Forsberg's play by saying he had better linemates (and making a false statement that Jagr spent his time with crappy ones) is very disrespectful of Forsberg's talent and accomplishments.
He played with Sakic on the PP or when they trailed, and some occasional shifts, very much like Crosby/Malkin and even Lemieux/Jagr.

They have extremely similar scoring ratios, with Forsberg having a clear edge in the POs, and he has suffered from recurring injuries throughout his career.

I think you need a little refreshment of how Forsberg used to play, because you either barely ever watched him, or simply forgot.
(Note that this is coming from a guy that give Jagr the edge over Forsberg.)

I don't agree that Mario would of destroyed Gretzky records at all, it's a stupid hypothetical that has no basis in reality and certainly can't be proven. I defend Gretzky like no other on these boards, because people go out of their way to try and downplay his accomplishments.

Adjusted points were created to try and normalize his results. The best way to judge is based on how they dominated their peers and Gretzky was ridiculous. There is no way anyone would of destroyed his records, not possible. Perhaps tie, or maybe even beat slightly, but destroy, not a chance in hell.

I seen threads about how Gretzky got all his assists from measly secondary assists ect to try and discredit him. When the facts are he had over 1000 primary assists, and who says secondary assists aren't as important as the primary anyways? Those trying to marginalize the greatest player of all time.

Just my little rant, not really directed at you kriss as I know you weren't really doing any of these things, but I do take exception to those who think anyone would of destroyed Waynes records.

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Old
06-20-2011, 07:24 AM
  #994
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Originally Posted by giovannicanella View Post
Marc de Foy reports in the journal de mtl that Jagr is not coming to mtl, article was released today someone plz provide link I'm at work doing the night shift.

The jist is though his agent is former mtl defenceman petr svoboda, says there has been brief contact with PG who said he would get back to him after deciding on hamrlik!!!! , mentions of detroit and pittsburg being interested, he mentions 12 teams are interested in Jagr
http://fr.canoe.ca/sports/nouvelles/...20-021057.html

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06-20-2011, 07:32 AM
  #995
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Time to shut this down. Pt 3 will be up in a minute.

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