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2009 Re-draft has Erixon up 13 spots, Kreider 2

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06-22-2011, 12:07 AM
  #101
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The one ranking that stood out to me was Ryan Ellis at #6. What has he done exactly to jump up that high? Then again, I remember Button putting him in a similarly high position last year.

I haven't heard much on Ellis and his development, but I don't recall him really taking his game up a notch.

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06-22-2011, 12:10 AM
  #102
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Originally Posted by ocarina View Post
The one ranking that stood out to me was Ryan Ellis at #6. What has he done exactly to jump up that high? Then again, I remember Button putting him in a similarly high position last year.

I haven't heard much on Ellis and his development, but I don't recall him really taking his game up a notch.
Ellis has done nothing but great things since he showed up in the OHL as a 16 year old. Nobody has a better resume then him. However, he is small, and if you're going to be small as a defenseman, you better be fast. He is quite slow for a player of his stature.

Worst case scenario he becomes a dominant power play QB. Best case he is able to play a regular shift to go along with that. I think his future is pretty much set in stone.

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06-22-2011, 12:13 AM
  #103
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Originally Posted by ColonialsHockey10 View Post
Ellis has done nothing but great things since he showed up in the OHL as a 16 year old. Nobody has a better resume then him. However, he is small, and if you're going to be small as a defenseman, you better be fast. He is quite slow for a player of his stature.

Worst case scenario he becomes a dominant power play QB. Best case he is able to play a regular shift to go along with that. I think his future is pretty much set in stone.
I remember watching him during the WJC's a couple years back and thinking "he's way too predictable on the PP, all he does is walk the blueline and shoot." Has he improved on that at least?

He strikes me as one of those guys who is an incredible junior player, but might not be able to make it work at a higher level for the reasons you've stated (poor skating for a small guy).

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06-22-2011, 12:14 AM
  #104
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I also must quip and the sheer ridiculousness of re-drafting a draft that's not even 1 year past. unless they plan to revist how they redrafted every year to compare like how they make pre-season cup predictions and compare them to their pre-playoffs predicitions and then finally against the actual results.

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06-22-2011, 12:21 AM
  #105
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Originally Posted by ocarina View Post
I remember watching him during the WJC's a couple years back and thinking "he's way too predictable on the PP, all he does is walk the blueline and shoot." Has he improved on that at least?

He strikes me as one of those guys who is an incredible junior player, but might not be able to make it work at a higher level for the reasons you've stated (poor skating for a small guy).
Especially with Nashvilles depth, I think he'll be on the 3rd pair for the foreseeable future, while getting top PP time with Weber. He's not bad defensively in the OHL, he's actually somewhat good, but as previously mentioned, he has all the wrong skills as weaknesses for an NHL defenseman.

As for his predictability, his shot will be lethal at the next level, and while his passing isn't like Del Zotto in it's accuracy, like McCabe, he just feels more comfortable on the power play than most. He always knows what to do on the man advantage, he's just an expert. Even when McCabe was sucking on the power play (which he pretty much did all the time), we were still more effective with him the not. They know how to create space for themselves and the forwards. And, playing with Weber he is going to have to pass, because Nashville's kryptonite on the power play will be no secret, cover the points.

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06-22-2011, 12:25 AM
  #106
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Craig Button is an idiot, and that's despite the fact that I agree with a number of the "changes" he made in the 2010 draft.

If you pooled together all of the commentators/"analysts" on TSN, NHL Network and Versus/NBC, you'd find it difficult to decide which one of them is the biggest and most useless moron, but Craig Button is most definitely a top contender. Not quite as mindnumbingly boring or excruciatingly longwinded as Craig MacTavish, but even less informative.

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06-22-2011, 12:25 AM
  #107
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Agreed, n8. Quite the ridiculous exercise.

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06-22-2011, 12:34 AM
  #108
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Originally Posted by n8 View Post
MDZ-McI seems like a classic Leetch-Beuk pairing.
where? the ECHL? lol

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06-22-2011, 12:36 AM
  #109
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Originally Posted by n8 View Post
I also must quip and the sheer ridiculousness of re-drafting a draft that's not even 1 year past. unless they plan to revist how they redrafted every year to compare like how they make pre-season cup predictions and compare them to their pre-playoffs predicitions and then finally against the actual results.
It's been 1 year since last year's draft, at least one season. It's been 2 seasons since the one I posted

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06-22-2011, 12:36 AM
  #110
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Originally Posted by Brian Boyle View Post
Tavares easily has 50 goal potential. His hockey sense and offensive zone awareness is shockingly good. And those hands. Oh my god, those hands, those hands guys, those hands.

I don't know. He needs to work on his skating if he's ever going to get 50

edit: Duchene has an amazing wrister and an amazing snap shot. He's really awesome in close. They have different qualities to them, and whether or not Tavares has had to overcome more developing on Long Island, Duchene is the better hockey player now and probably at the end of their careers. It's not by much, and I'm sure at the end of the day it's pretty much a coin flip type deal. Both have had average linemates and have mirrored each others productivity...I'm a little biased because I like guys that play the game Duchene does, he's high octane, whereas Tavares leans more on hockey sense and patience


Last edited by RangerFan10: 06-22-2011 at 12:46 AM.
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06-22-2011, 01:06 AM
  #111
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I'm the opposite. Hockey sense is by far the most important aspect of a players game, imo.

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06-22-2011, 01:10 AM
  #112
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Originally Posted by RangerFan10 View Post
where? the ECHL? lol
what? try when. like in 4-5 years - when judging these drafts would make sense.

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Originally Posted by RangerFan10 View Post
It's been 1 year since last year's draft, at least one season. It's been 2 seasons since the one I posted
I can count. My point is that it's far too early to tell with these players. Zdeno Chara played his first NHL season at the age of 20. He bounced up and down from the farm so he didn't play his first full NHL season until he was at the age of 23. He was good by then but it wasn't until the age of 24 when he got traded to the Sens (lol Yashin) did he have his first SOLID season. Sauer is looking great despite starting at the age of 23. Bieksa's first full season was at 25. Orpik at 23. Hamhuis at 22. Marc Staal didn't even start until he was 21. Meanwhile, McIlrath JUST turned 19. He's got at least 2 more seasons to go IMO. If he takes more, I'm fine with that as well. He's going to be one of those players who we'll have to wait and see the results on; all this to my original point - it's way too early to be doing such a exercise. pre-draft journalistic masturbation if I am permitted to be so colorful about it. Because he was a #10 pick, some people think he has to cash out for the organization last season.


Last edited by n8: 06-22-2011 at 01:57 AM.
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Old
06-22-2011, 01:32 AM
  #113
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I dunno, I think Duchene is a pretty smart player. He's better than his brains would predict because of his skating and energy, but he wouldn't stand out the way he does without his ability to process the game. He's no Datsyuk in that regard, but he's definitely above average.

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I'm the opposite. Hockey sense is by far the most important aspect of a players game, imo.
Yup. AFAIC, you don't truly understand the sport (and this applies to all team sports, not to mention most things in life) if you don't understand this one rudimentary concept. A pretty successful hockey man I had the pleasure of speaking to once told me that hockey sense, or whatever you want to call the mental aspect of the game that encompasses things like positioning, timing, and decision making is (and I am paraphrasing here) "the key to everything. As a coach, your worst nightmare, other than a player on your roster who has serious attitude or work ethic issues (which is a relative rarity at professional levels), is a player who doesn't understand where to be, when to be, and what to do when he's there. You cannot trust that player, and thus, in playing such a player, he becomes a risk that in almost every case is not worth taking."

Kudos to you, young man. You get it. So sad that so many do not.

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06-22-2011, 04:06 AM
  #114
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Rundblad broke records.
He also gave away the SEL Trophy by poor defensive play...

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06-22-2011, 07:03 AM
  #115
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Well, Skelleftea DOES have blue jerseys.
With blue you mean black and yellow.

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06-22-2011, 09:37 AM
  #116
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This is a great concept by TSN, however, they should definitely wait at LEAST 3-5 years before doing something like this. That being said, this redraft is still full of facepalms. Brayden Schenn over Evander Kane? I mean, I don't ride the Schenn train as hard as some others do, but Evander Kane is an established 40-50 point two-way player who will only get better. That'd be like someone saying they'd take a high potential center like Kadri over an established forward like Stepan. Sorry, I don't see it

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06-22-2011, 10:23 AM
  #117
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They should also not let Craig Button redo the drafts because he has no idea how to evaluate talent

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06-22-2011, 10:32 AM
  #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Boyle View Post
I'm the opposite. Hockey sense is by far the most important aspect of a players game, imo.
Then James Sheppard should be a star.

Hockey sense is only part of the puzzle.

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06-22-2011, 10:32 AM
  #119
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Originally Posted by ostrichsized View Post
This is a great concept by TSN, however, they should definitely wait at LEAST 3-5 years before doing something like this. That being said, this redraft is still full of facepalms. Brayden Schenn over Evander Kane? I mean, I don't ride the Schenn train as hard as some others do, but Evander Kane is an established 40-50 point two-way player who will only get better. That'd be like someone saying they'd take a high potential center like Kadri over an established forward like Stepan. Sorry, I don't see it
Disagree. I think its a more interesting exercise a year or two after a draft because all the players still have promise. If you wait 3-5 years you will basically have half the players be complete bums. How do you rank guys destined for a career outside of NHL hockey?

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06-22-2011, 11:15 AM
  #120
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Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
Then James Sheppard should be a star.

Hockey sense is only part of the puzzle.
BB said hockey sense is the most important part, but not all of it. You need to have some physical attributes to go along with your hockey sense otherwise while you'll know what to do in every situation but you physically will not be able to do so.


Last edited by Emptyvoid: 06-22-2011 at 12:38 PM.
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06-22-2011, 12:34 PM
  #121
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And he had Seguin over Hall.
Im not one to often agree with whatever an analyst says, but in this case the order seems justified. I see a lot more prolific skill in Seguin than i do Hall. Seguin can score lots of points and will, Hall may not even become a top line players. If he does he can be scary for sure but i would take Seguin over him right now. Plus 2009 draft seems right for the switches, however i think Cassien can still be an strong power forward and i wouldint move him down that much. Hedman had a very strong year and to say hes crazy to take him over Tavares is wrong. Hedman is looking to become the next Lidstrom and he showed some big guy snarl that would really complete his game.

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06-22-2011, 12:34 PM
  #122
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Coin flip, I think both are great defenseman. If you want offense go with Green, if you want to defend a lead pick Suter.
Coin flip? haha no way. Suter in a heartbeat.

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06-22-2011, 12:37 PM
  #123
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Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
Then James Sheppard should be a star.

Hockey sense is only part of the puzzle.
I'm saying that, essentially, it is the most important part of the puzzle. Obviously, you have to have some skill to succeed. But you can't be all skill, shown by Nik Zherdev, Wojtek Wolski, and Andrei Kostitsyn.

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06-22-2011, 12:38 PM
  #124
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Originally Posted by ostrichsized View Post
This is a great concept by TSN, however, they should definitely wait at LEAST 3-5 years before doing something like this. That being said, this redraft is still full of facepalms. Brayden Schenn over Evander Kane? I mean, I don't ride the Schenn train as hard as some others do, but Evander Kane is an established 40-50 point two-way player who will only get better. That'd be like someone saying they'd take a high potential center like Kadri over an established forward like Stepan. Sorry, I don't see it
Kane might be better now but to say hes going to better than Schenn is pure speculatory. Schenn could be a top line center just waiting to break through.

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06-22-2011, 12:40 PM
  #125
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Im not one to often agree with whatever an analyst says, but in this case the order seems justified. I see a lot more prolific skill in Seguin than i do Hall. Seguin can score lots of points and will, Hall may not even become a top line players. If he does he can be scary for sure but i would take Seguin over him right now.
For real?

Hall put up 42 points in 65 games as a teenager, in Edmonton.

The only reason Seguin is even being considered above Hall is because he won the cup, and even then, he was a miniscule part of that.

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