HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Philadelphia Flyers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Carter/Richards traded (Pt. 2); Quotes: Pronger (#100); Snider (#135); Carter (#954)

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
06-24-2011, 11:22 AM
  #76
trigzter
Registered User
 
trigzter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: PA
Posts: 400
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JLHockeyKnight View Post
Brayden Van<insert name of 8th overall pick here> could work too.
We could throw Jakub in the mix

trigzter is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 11:26 AM
  #77
Beef Invictus
Global Moderator
FAT SLOB
 
Beef Invictus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Centreville
Country: Lord Howe Island
Posts: 43,373
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CavemanLawyer View Post
Just as you like to do i shall do now - Source for that?
This is thoroughly documented. Try Google.

__________________
Down in the basement, I've got a Craftsman lathe. Show it to the children when they misbehave.
Beef Invictus is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 11:26 AM
  #78
drownedsailors
Registered User
 
drownedsailors's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Earth
Country: United States
Posts: 1,949
vCash: 500
Soooooo I guess I'm watching the draft.

drownedsailors is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 11:27 AM
  #79
Larry44
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 5,451
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CharlieGirl View Post
Does this number not scare the bejeebus out of you? It does me. Here's hoping no one gets the flu or minor injury and has to be off for a short period of time and an AHL'er has to be called up. I know, that rarely happens. Right?
I don't think the cap room will be that small going in.

If I had to bet, I'd say they'll trade Versteeg tonight, or else they'll just let Leino walk.

If you replace one of them, at over $3M, with Nodl/Read/Wellwood/Testwuide, etc, you end up with a couple million in cap room. They can also deal/waive Shelley and use Sestito/Rinaldo if it comes to that too.

The key is the top 5 D remain intact, with room to resign OD and we've got a veteran presence with the old D and Briere/Betts, oh, and we've got a great goalie.

Larry44 is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 11:28 AM
  #80
JVR21
G
 
JVR21's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Country: United States
Posts: 7,942
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff VanRichards View Post
Well I guess I'm gonna have to change my username...****
Just......van.

JVR21 is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 11:31 AM
  #81
rixXx
Registered User
 
rixXx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Calgary, AB
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 226
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry44 View Post
I don't think the cap room will be that small going in.

If I had to bet, I'd say they'll trade Versteeg tonight, or else they'll just let Leino walk.

If you replace one of them, at over $3M, with Nodl/Read/Wellwood/Testwuide, etc, you end up with a couple million in cap room. They can also deal/waive Shelley and use Sestito/Rinaldo if it comes to that too.

The key is the top 5 D remain intact, with room to resign OD and we've got a veteran presence with the old D and Briere/Betts, oh, and we've got a great goalie.
Why would you want to retain OD? By the end of the season, he looked horrendous. We need someone younger

rixXx is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 11:31 AM
  #82
Beef Invictus
Global Moderator
FAT SLOB
 
Beef Invictus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Centreville
Country: Lord Howe Island
Posts: 43,373
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by drownedsailors View Post
Soooooo I guess I'm watching the draft now.
Me too. It's been a while.

Beef Invictus is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 11:36 AM
  #83
Jester
Registered User
 
Jester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: St. Andrews
Country: Scotland
Posts: 34,075
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CavemanLawyer View Post
Just as you like to do i shall do now - Source for that?
What, for Carter discussing the fact that he didn't want to be traded? It was in the fleury of stuff yesterday somewhere. Of course, isn't that something you would bring up before you signed such a deal?

Jester is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 11:44 AM
  #84
neofury*
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Montreal, PQ
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,277
vCash: 500
Hey guys. Habs fan coming in peace. I just wanted to say that long term I think this deal is a win for the flyers. You get some good picks an incredible prospect, Simmonds who is a perfect Philidelphia flyers type player, he's going to be baller for you guys and become an instant fan favorite. You got the goalie your team has always needed. Add Voracek to your blueline... that is overpowered.

Also you got rid of a potential club hindering contract in Carter. 11 more years is a lot even at his reasonable cap hit. What if in 4 years he declines due to injuries etc. I know Bryz is signed long term but he's a good goalie.

Overall the Flyers may have gotten slightly less value than one would expect but they are a much better team today than they were the other day. Mark my words these two deals will go down in history. I see all 3 teams pretty much winning in this scenario. Only team I think who stands to lose is CBJ if those picks are boom picks and Carter declines and Voracek improves lol. That being said I have no doubt Richards will be a catalyst for LA and bring them to the next level.

These have been two exciting and crazy trades and I think no matter what it's an awesome time to be a Flyer. From an outsiders perspective the Flyers will be a scary team next year! Don't worry about the trades right now it looks like everybody wins.

neofury* is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 11:44 AM
  #85
Larry44
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 5,451
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Protest View Post
We will still be a playoff team next year, but this is poor management. I mean we literally bring in the missing piece to our cup hopes and then trade our best forwards for players who may take the next step this year, but have just a good a chance of not progressing at the rate we need.

It doesn't make sense to make these moves. They conflict each other, and conflict with the organization's philosophy. We're in limbo right now stuck between contender, and team on the verge of contending. I think there are other moves that are going to be made.
This is just like last year. At the end of the year, they did an assessment and said 'Gagne's got to go and we need another D.' So they asked Gagne to waive at the same time they got Hamhuis' rights, failed to get Michalek's, then got Meszaros.

This year, they looked at everything and decided that not only did they need a goalie, but they needed to get rid of Carter and Richards too - and take what they could get, still leaving room to sign Bryzgalov to what is a very reasonable cap hit.

I'm still in shock too, but when the truth all comes out, I think we're going to find out that these young stars had a sense of entitlement in the room that really rankled the veterans and was a more serious problem than most of us believed. Everyone discounted the media reports, but it may be that they got it right, then got shut down.

And it's obvious that Richards was not on the same page as Pronger or Laviolette, whose ringing lack of endorsement in the season ending 'our relationship is a work in progress' interview said volumes about what he really wanted to say - and he's saying the right things today. 'No, Mike wasn't a problem, we got along, etc.'

Believe what you want.

They have tried to wake Richie and Carts up several times. Remember when the Centre City stuff came out and Homer took them for a ride in his car to chat? Then he traded away their running mates: Upshall, then Lupul, let Asham walk, traded Gagne (a Richards' supporter in the room), but I guess Snider and Luuko felt it didn't work and they'd reached the last resort: the two stars had to go.

We'll see if it works.

Larry44 is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 11:44 AM
  #86
Protest
C`est La Vie
 
Protest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Deptford, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 4,620
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by IrishSniper87 View Post
I agree Jester that this is not how I would have done it, but what can you do?

For two 26 year old roughly 70 point centers we got a bunch of guys between 19-23 who are just entering their prime. Their prime isn't 2-5 years away. Carter and Richards emergence was 3 years ago in 08-09. That puts each of them at 23, the same age as Simmonds and Voracek.

This years regular season will be interesting, but I think the Flyers will be just as effective offensively.

The 2011-2012 Flyers as currently built are freaking deep and loaded with potential. They will certainly be contenders.
That's the only thing that is keeping me partially sane over this. These kids may be on the verge of 60-70 point seasons. Still though you traded a definite for an unknown. That doesn't make sense for a team in our position.

Also, even if they bring the offense we are missing two very valuable defensive players. I don't know if bringing in a couple defensive minded 3rd liners is going to make up that difference, but it may be a better idea than signing Leino.

The aging defense doesn't scare me as much because we have Mez, Coburn, probably a draft pick tonight, and cap money form Timonen and Hartnell to use in two years when we'll to need to beef up that position.

However, as we stand now we have taken a 2 or so year step back, and I'm not really sure why.

Protest is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 11:48 AM
  #87
neofury*
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Montreal, PQ
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,277
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Protest View Post
That's the only thing that is keeping me partially sane over this. These kids may be on the verge of 60-70 point seasons. Still though you traded a definite for an unknown. That doesn't make sense for a team in our position.

Also, even if they bring the offense we are missing two very valuable defensive players. I don't know if bringing in a couple defensive minded 3rd liners is going to make up that difference, but it may be a better idea than signing Leino.

The aging defense doesn't scare me as much because we have Mez, Coburn, probably a draft pick tonight, and cap money form Timonen and Hartnell to use in two years when we'll to need to beef up that position.

However, as we stand now we have taken a 2 or so year step back, and I'm not really sure why.
I disagree because I feel the signing of Bryz is underrated. I feel he will steal you games and ultimately make this deal worthwhile.

Pronger, Voracek, Timo etc on the back end, that's a sweet D to put with Bryz and for offense as well. Then you have Simmonds who you guys will love I'm sure. I have a feeling Flyers fans will be pleasantly surprised once the puck drops

neofury* is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 11:49 AM
  #88
ilovetheflyers8
Registered User
 
ilovetheflyers8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: D.C.
Country: French Guiana Independentist
Posts: 4,892
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JLHockeyKnight View Post
Brayden Van<insert name of 8th overall pick here> could work too.
Van Wayne the 8th.

ilovetheflyers8 is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 11:52 AM
  #89
KimiFerrari
Messi Is God
 
KimiFerrari's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Montreal, Qc
Country: Argentina
Posts: 3,818
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by neofury View Post
I disagree because I feel the signing of Bryz is underrated. I feel he will steal you games and ultimately make this deal worthwhile.

Pronger, Voracek, Timo etc on the back end, that's a sweet D to put with Bryz and for offense as well. Then you have Simmonds who you guys will love I'm sure. I have a feeling Flyers fans will be pleasantly surprised once the puck drops
Voracek is a forward, wth are you talking about?

KimiFerrari is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 11:52 AM
  #90
Hollywood Couturier
Moderator
#NoHonorForConnor
 
Hollywood Couturier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: South Jersey
Country: United States
Posts: 20,690
vCash: 500
Hey look, my username came true...

__________________

"I Came Here To Bury Caesar, Not Praise Him" - Roy Halladay
Hollywood Couturier is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 11:52 AM
  #91
Jester
Registered User
 
Jester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: St. Andrews
Country: Scotland
Posts: 34,075
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by neofury View Post
I disagree because I feel the signing of Bryz is underrated. I feel he will steal you games and ultimately make this deal worthwhile.

Pronger, Voracek, Timo etc on the back end, that's a sweet D to put with Bryz and for offense as well. Then you have Simmonds who you guys will love I'm sure. I have a feeling Flyers fans will be pleasantly surprised once the puck drops
We got good players back, but they aren't guys that are going to be leading the way immediately. I also think Giroux has become very overrated. Very good player. Franchise center? Not necessarily. I don't think Richards or Carter were necessarily that either, but the depth offset our lack of a Crosby.

Jester is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 11:54 AM
  #92
DenverBoone
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 898
vCash: 500
I hope Bryz doesn't go DiPietro on us.

DenverBoone is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 11:57 AM
  #93
CharlieGirl
Get well soon Kimmo
 
CharlieGirl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Kitchener, ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 30,025
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollywood Cannon View Post
Hey look, my username came true...
LOL -- okay, you win this one!

CharlieGirl is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 12:00 PM
  #94
StevensCakeBakerBacker
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Country:
Posts: 1,294
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 10KeithLeClair25 View Post
Nodl on a 3rd line checking line, isn't a bad thing, and I don't give a **** that we got to keep those three. Carle blows defensively, Versteeg is an overpaid 3rd liner, and Leino is probably going to get a fat contract he doesn't deserve. While these moves may be great in the future, next year the Flyers won't be as good as they could have been.



Ed Snider has a history of treating players and coaches awfully and these trades probably will affect are ability to sign other players in the future. If I'm Giroux, no way in hell am I taking a long term home town discount to play for this team
I definitely see the logic in that, but you're forming that opinion without knowing the full story. Maybe Giroux knows that this deal was something that had to happen because of stuff going on the fans don't know about. There has to be more to this story.

StevensCakeBakerBacker is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 12:03 PM
  #95
Beukeboom Fan
Registered User
 
Beukeboom Fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 11,861
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester View Post
I like the belief that "it's business" as a justification for classless behavior. As if all business decisions are classy by definition.

You CAN make classless business decisions, ya know? Like signing a below market, decade-long contract with someone and then trading them before the deal goes into effect. Definition of classlessness.
Is it possible that some of that falls on Richards? The team committed to him, and expected him to mature, which from an outsider's perspective didn't seem to happen. I don't think that the organization WANTED to have to trade Richards at a firesale type of price, but they felt it was necessary.

All's I know is that I see two possiblities:
1) Holmgren is a meth-head who is certifiably crazy

or:

2) The Flyers organization KNOWS something that we as fans do not about Mike Richards.

I think #2 makes a hell of a lot more sense than anything else that people are throwing around.

Beukeboom Fan is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 12:06 PM
  #96
Hollywood Couturier
Moderator
#NoHonorForConnor
 
Hollywood Couturier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: South Jersey
Country: United States
Posts: 20,690
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CharlieGirl View Post
LOL -- okay, you win this one!
Little did I know back then. I'm a prophet.

Hollywood Couturier is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 12:11 PM
  #97
FlyerSithLord
Registered User
 
FlyerSithLord's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Tinicum
Country: United States
Posts: 2,084
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to FlyerSithLord
This time a year ago, we were all talking about how we were a goalie away from the stanley cup. We have one bad 2nd half of a season, struggle in the playoffs, a playoff in which our goaltender was terrible and now Richards/Carter needed to go?

I know that HF has a tendency to overreact, but what team trades their two top stars two seasons removed from almost winning the stanley cup. If they were such cancers, how come it didn't effect the team in the playoffs in 2010?

I freely admit I'm a bit biased since Richards was my favorite player, but it's amazing how some people will turn on a player once he is traded. I'll always be a flyers fan regardless of who is on the team, but it doesn't mean I have to think every move they make is a good one. In 3-4 years, these guys we acquired may be on the levels of Richards and Carter, but then what about the defense?

FlyerSithLord is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 12:14 PM
  #98
OriginJM
watch out im smart
 
OriginJM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 4,958
vCash: 500
Quote:
Jakub Voracek on coming to Philadelphia: “I was pretty happy. I hear only great things about the Flyers organization and it’s an honor to play there. I’m pretty excited.”
cool

OriginJM is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 12:14 PM
  #99
El Emperor
Registered User
 
El Emperor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Woodstown, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 1,303
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beukeboom Fan View Post
Is it possible that some of that falls on Richards? The team committed to him, and expected him to mature, which from an outsider's perspective didn't seem to happen. I don't think that the organization WANTED to have to trade Richards at a firesale type of price, but they felt it was necessary.

All's I know is that I see two possiblities:
1) Holmgren is a meth-head who is certifiably crazy

or:

2) The Flyers organization KNOWS something that we as fans do not about Mike Richards.

I think #2 makes a hell of a lot more sense than anything else that people are throwing around.
Seriously... getting one of the best prospects in the NHL is firesale price?

I'm just as mad about one of my favorite players leaving, but that was not firesale price. Firesale price would have been what we got with Gagne last year.

El Emperor is offline  
Old
06-24-2011, 12:15 PM
  #100
MiamiScreamingEagles
Global Moderator
A Fistful of Dollars
 
MiamiScreamingEagles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 41,451
vCash: 1455
Pronger's transcript, Q&A conference call from earlier today

Courtesy: http://nhlhotstove.com/pronger-react...carter-trades/ and http://www.the700level.com/06/24/11/...58&feedID=9063

What was your reaction to yesterday’s events?

“I think when you make a move like that to get a goalie and you’ve got to pay him, you’ve got to get the money somewhere. Time and again in the salary cap era, you’ve got to give to get. Unfortunately for us, those two guys were traded. It sucks as a teammate. You hate to see guys go. They were for all intents and purposes the face of the franchise for four of those six years, if not for the six years they were here. I’m sure it’s tough for them. The Philadelphia Flyers, it’s all they really know. I’ve gone through it a number of times, and sometimes a move is healthy for you.”

Were you able to reach out to Jeff or Mike?

“I’m going to give them a call today. Having gone through it a number of times, you kind of need a day to gather your thoughts and kind of get your wits about you. It’s certainly not an easy thing. I think it makes it a little bit easier that they’re both single and don’t have to lug around kids and logistically and that stuff, but it’s still very tough to be traded and I’m sure both of them have mixed emotions.”

Is the team closer to winning a Cup now?

“I don’t know. I haven’t really thought about that too much. I just heard about the trades last night so I haven’t really put a whole lot of thought to it, I’m up in the bush with my kids, fishing. I haven’t put the Xs and Os together – I’m sure you guys have looked at it seven ways from Sunday and tried to figure out who wins or loses. At the end of the day, as I said before, having been traded a number of times, it’s always difficult. They both played their hearts out in Philly, but sometimes as I said, you’ve got to make tough decisions and you’ve got to make moves, and sometimes it may hurt and may feel like you’re making your team worse to make it better.”

Does this team have a better locker room today?

“I don’t know. I don’t really know those other guys they brought in. I played against Wayne Simmonds for one or two years when I was in Anaheim, but other than that, when you play on the East Coast, you don’t really play the West very often, and vice-versa. When I was coming out here I didn’t really know many of the guys here, because I’d played in the West pretty much my whole career. I can’t really speak to that right now, having no luxury to know any of the three guys we picked up.”

Did you think there was a problem in the room?

“I don’t think anybody would say a year ago when we went to the Stanley Cup Final that there was a chemistry problem. [That year] I think our play was very inconsistent, and we were trying to find ourselves as a team with a new coach and a new system. I think the players were trying to find where they needed to be and how we needed to play to be successful as a group. Last year, you’re coming off a tough defeat in the Stanley Cup Final in overtime, we got off to a good start, and nobody seemed to think we had a problem then. As the season wore on, for whatever reason, we just didn’t turn that corner and continue to get better and peak at the right time. That’s disappointing, and it’s tough. I don’t think there was necessarily a rift, I think we just needed more life in the locker room. It all has to do with your play on the ice. If you’re playing well on the ice, there’s never any questions as to who’s doing what or is there a rift, does this guy like that guy, and all of the rest of the stuff that gets thrown out. If you play well on the ice, nobody wants to write about that because everything’s going good.”

Do you want to be the captain?

“You know what, I haven’t put much thought in it to be honest with you. This is all very, very fresh to a lot of us. Obviously I’d have to talk to Homer and Lavi and see what their thoughts are, and kind of go from there. You don’t nominate yourself. I’ve never been part of a team where somebody nominates himself. I think that may be a little bit premature to start talking about stuff like that. It’s one day after two huge trades on our team and in the history of the Flyers, so I don’t think that’s in anybody’s minds right now.”
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ +++++++++++++++

http://www.csnphilly.com/06/24/11/Pr...260&feedID=695

Quote:
Pronger said he would attempt to contact both former Flyers today.

“I think when you make a move like that to get a goalie and you’ve got to pay him, you’ve got to get the money somewhere,” Pronger said. “Time and again in the salary cap era, you’ve got to give to get. Unfortunately for us, those two guys were traded.

“It sucks as a teammate. You hate to see guys go. They were for all intents and purposes the face of the franchise for four of those six years, if not for the six years they were here. I’m sure it’s tough for them. The Philadelphia Flyers, it’s all they really know. I’ve gone through it a number of times, and sometimes a move is healthy for you.”

Pronger was asked about assuming the captaincy now that Richards is gone. A source told CSNPhilly.com that Pronger, who was a captain in St. Louis and Anaheim, will be offered the “C.”

“You know what, I haven’t put much thought in it to be honest with you,” Pronger said. “This is all very, very fresh to a lot of us. Obviously I’d have to talk to Homer [Paul Holmgren] and Lavi [Peter Laviolette] and see what their thoughts are, and kind of go from there.


Last edited by MiamiScreamingEagles: 06-24-2011 at 08:29 PM.
MiamiScreamingEagles is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:42 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2015 All Rights Reserved.