HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Evgeny Grachev traded to STL for pick #72

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
06-25-2011, 12:30 PM
  #76
azrok22
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,450
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnCenafearsTheRock View Post
I'm not upset that we cut bait on Grachev. What I am upset about is that we got a mere 3rd rounder for him. Really Sather? You couldn't get anything more? I highly doubt that
These comments never make any sense to me.

You're right, Edmonton probably called up Sather and said, "would you like the 1st overall for Grachev" but Sather declined because he preferred the 72nd from St. Louis.

azrok22 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:31 PM
  #77
Colt Seavers
Registered User
 
Colt Seavers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 544
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Drinking from the firehouse is a common saying. It means trial by fire, a big jump up in competition in this case. Its bizarre to me that people have never heard that phrase before and even more bizarre that you'd take it as if hes an alcoholic or something.
Yeah, I'd never heard that expression. Heard of 'Firewater' though... and with the mention of 'risking draft stock' or whatever...makes enough sense. Sometimes kids like to drink.

Colt Seavers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:31 PM
  #78
Rangerfans
Registered User
 
Rangerfans's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,097
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
Mismanage? They did not mismanage him at all. He just wasn't as good as we thought.
Thank you, Jonathan. Thank you.

I couldn't agree more. He has been given plenty of chances to crack the NHL.

He has failed to do so every time.

Yes, I understand he is 20 or 21 years old. But I have faith in our development program and believe we know what we're doing. I wish him well, but I don't mind this AT ALL.

Rangerfans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:32 PM
  #79
BrooklynRangersFan
Change is good.
 
BrooklynRangersFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Brooklyn of course
Country: United States
Posts: 10,514
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
Sather made this move on his zone???????Schoenfeld didn't have any input. He sees Grachev all the time. Clark and Gorton didn't have any input. They run the personnel department.
Not sure if you're talking to me, RB, but what I meant about this not being a "Sather special" is that I think we lost this trade (and I'm used to Sather winning trades).

Regardless of how good we think Fogarty will be, the trade itself was Grachev for a 3rd round pick (in a weak draft no less). I would've expected to get a lot more value. Hey, I'm a huge Grachev fan, so I'm obviously biased, but simply from a value standpoint I thought it was a bad deal.

BrooklynRangersFan is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:33 PM
  #80
Anthony Mauro
DB Hockey
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 6,665
vCash: 500
Great asset management. Great pick. I like Fogarty alot. He is a guy who is always around the puck.

Cutting bait on Grachev doesn't hurt us

Anthony Mauro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:33 PM
  #81
YoungD4
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 170
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Grachev is the poster boy for an overhyped prospect on this board.

....and another one bites the dust.

He was rated high on our prospect ranking from Hockey futures, so i dont think its the fans that were that high on him

YoungD4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:33 PM
  #82
Rangerfans
Registered User
 
Rangerfans's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,097
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnCenafearsTheRock View Post
I'm not upset that we cut bait on Grachev. What I am upset about is that we got a mere 3rd rounder for him. Really Sather? You couldn't get anything more? I highly doubt that
After Filatov only got a 3rd, I am pretty happy with this.

Rangerfans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:34 PM
  #83
NYRSchrute217
Registered User
 
NYRSchrute217's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 4,534
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
Nobody liked the Stepan pick, nobody likes this trade. Lulz.
I really like the kid we got. Reminds me of Stepan being a Minnesota HS kid with impressive numbers

I just wish we didn't give up on Grachev so soon..

NYRSchrute217 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:34 PM
  #84
GAGLine
Registered User
 
GAGLine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 9,316
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
Mismanage? They did not mismanage him at all. He just wasn't as good as we thought.
Clark and Gorton admitted they should have left him in juniors rather than bring him to the AHL at 19. Maybe we have different definitions of the word "mismanaged".

GAGLine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:34 PM
  #85
TomLaidlaw
Registered User
 
TomLaidlaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Transylvania
Country: Romania
Posts: 3,177
vCash: 500
Steven Fogarty, sounds like a dentist.

TomLaidlaw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:34 PM
  #86
Bleed Ranger Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 15,070
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by azrok22 View Post
These comments never make any sense to me.

You're right, Edmonton probably called up Sather and said, "would you like the 1st overall for Grachev" but Sather declined because he preferred the 72nd from St. Louis.
Agreed. Am I missing something? The only value Grachev had was from Ranger fans that overrated him basically from the beginning.

As far as Im concerned, we were lucky to get a 3rd for him.

Bleed Ranger Blue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:34 PM
  #87
SERE 24
LGR
 
SERE 24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 9,842
vCash: 500
Filatov was worth the #66. Grachev the #72. Was Grachev worth Filatov? Because I'd have taken that gamble 10/10 times.

I realize it wasn't a possibility, in all likelihood, but I'm a little bummed about this move overall. Grachev is going to pan out to be a decent player still, I believe.

SERE 24 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:34 PM
  #88
ecemleafs
Registered User
 
ecemleafs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New York
Posts: 10,648
vCash: 500
considering we have a 24 year old dubinsky at LW and Kreider and Hagelin as LW prospects grachev was obviously deemed expendable.

ecemleafs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:35 PM
  #89
Janerixon
Registered User
 
Janerixon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 3,730
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SML View Post
One thing I will give Sather credit for is his ability to sniff out a dog when he sees one. The problem is, he can only spot them after we own them. He had some terrible ones in Edmonton. But I can hardly remember a situation where Sather cut bait on a guy and turned out to be wrong about him. Once Sather hits the eject button on a guy, they usually are finished.
I was furious when we traded for Lindros giving up on Brendl... look at how well that one worked out for Pavel. Only the Korpikoski trade really sticks in my mind of us giving up a kid and getting a straight dog back is Lisin who has no hockey IQ at all. I really am not too surprised with this move, I wish we could have gotten more back for Grachev, but maybe they are really really high on Fogarty?

Janerixon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:35 PM
  #90
GAGLine
Registered User
 
GAGLine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 9,316
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomLaidlaw View Post
Steven Fogarty, sounds like a dentist.
Or a rock star. Put me in coach.

GAGLine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:36 PM
  #91
RGY
(Jagr68NYR94Leetch)
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Long Island, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 8,398
vCash: 500
This trade makes me thing Hagelin/Thomas have a chance at making the team out of camp.

Now if sather signs a Jussi Jokinen or makes some sort of move, maybe Jagr (one can dream) then it might be a different story.

RGY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:36 PM
  #92
Dagoon44
Registered User
 
Dagoon44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 4,968
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Dagoon44 Send a message via Yahoo to Dagoon44
Ok time for me to gloat and chime in here.. I called him bustchev 2 yrs ago for a reason he is a floater who avoided contact and traffic as much as possible his work sucked and he never ever got his hands dirty SaTHER and Torts cut the floater and he was way over rated good job guys

Dagoon44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:36 PM
  #93
Beacon
Sent to HF Minors
 
Beacon's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 8,517
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vitto79 View Post
To be honest if it was a battle between Hagelin and Grachev I would think Hagelin has the edge at making the team because he is a two way player

sucks to give up on Grachev. The Sangs trade was similar and that looks pretty good right now. So time will tell

Russians are just on the down slide. Filatov got a 3rd too

That's what I thought. I always thought Hagelin stands a better shot to make the NHL, though I was still hoping Grachev could develop into a Matteau-like tweener.

I guess the staff did not think he stands a chance to make it with Hagelin and Kreider ahead of him. Maybe they just thought he will never make it at all, regardless of the depth chart.

We essentially moved a #3 in 2008 for a #3 in 2011. Oh well, if we keep our hits (Stepan) and trade our misses (Grachev, Sangs), it's not bad asset management.

I actually argued for this (trading players when you soured on them, but before they lost all value) on two occasions on this board, and both times did not gather much support among others here.

Beacon is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:37 PM
  #94
EvilCorporateLawyer
Very slippery slope
 
EvilCorporateLawyer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Country Roads
Country: United States
Posts: 74,714
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to EvilCorporateLawyer
Quote:
Originally Posted by Manhattan Blue View Post
Great asset management. Great pick. I like Fogarty alot. He is a guy who is always around the puck.

Cutting bait on Grachev doesn't hurt us
Exactly. We get a third for a third. You don't see that often at all.

Grachev had similar value to Filatov. We drafted fine there since we didn't lose an ounce of value on the pick.

__________________
"Of course giving Sather cap space is like giving teenagers whiskey and car keys." - SBOB
"Watching Sather build a team is like watching a blind man with no fingers trying to put together an elaborate puzzle." - Shadowtron
"Used to be only Twinkies and cockroaches could survive a nuke. I'd add Habs to that. I'm convinced the CH stands for Club du Hypocrisy." - Gee Wally
EvilCorporateLawyer is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:37 PM
  #95
SupersonicMonkey*
DROP THE PUCK
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: USA
Country: United States
Posts: 16,229
vCash: 500
Reminds me of Andrew Yogan.

High potential.

The trade was basically lateral. Grachev fell on the depth chart, he was a former third round pick, Rangers traded him to a place where he may get a better chance, and pick a player with a lot of upside.

Not a bad move.

SupersonicMonkey* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:38 PM
  #96
Colt Seavers
Registered User
 
Colt Seavers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 544
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by broadwayblue View Post
You are so off base it's hilarious.

By the way, have any of you heard of this site that you can search for things you don't know about? lol
Sorry Guy! I'd never heard the expression but try not to lose any sleep over my most egregious gaffe!
It's all going to be ok. Really.

Colt Seavers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:38 PM
  #97
azrok22
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,450
vCash: 500
By moving Grachev, we've just cleared $70,251 off our summer cap! Brad Richards will be ours!

azrok22 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:38 PM
  #98
Jumbo*
TARGET: ACQUIRED
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 16,720
vCash: 500
Terrible just TERRIBLE.

How the hell do you give up on one of your top prospects who has tons and tons of potential? He should have been given another year at the least but we tossed him away for now an even bigger question mark. Just makes no sense any way you put it.

And if thats all sather could have got, a 3rd rounder in a weak draft, then he SHOULDNT have made the trade. Could have used him as a part of a bigger trade down the line.


The draft is suppose to make your prospect cabinet better, not make it worse. This move did not make it better.

And im not saying he is going to be a 30G scorer, im saying he should have been given up at yet, especially for such a weak return.

Jumbo* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:39 PM
  #99
Beacon
Sent to HF Minors
 
Beacon's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 8,517
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
Oy. This is going to come back to bite us, I'm positive.
I usually agree with nearly everything you write, but what are the odds it would bite us? Let's say he becomes a nice third liner, is that really biting us?

Beacon is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
06-25-2011, 12:39 PM
  #100
EvilCorporateLawyer
Very slippery slope
 
EvilCorporateLawyer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Country Roads
Country: United States
Posts: 74,714
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to EvilCorporateLawyer
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Healthy Scratch View Post
Terrible just TERRIBLE.

How the hell do you give up on one of your top prospects who has tons and tons of potential? He should have been given another year at the least but we tossed him away for now an even bigger question mark. Just makes no sense any way you put it.

And if thats all sather could have got, a 3rd rounder in a weak draft, then he SHOULDNT have made the trade. Could have used him as a part of a bigger trade down the line.


The draft is suppose to make your prospect cabinet better, not make it worse. This move did not make it better.


If all he could get was a third in a weak draft, it means he didn't have much value.

EvilCorporateLawyer is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:07 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.