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Grade the draft and the picks

View Poll Results: Draft grade
A 23 18.11%
B 74 58.27%
C 24 18.90%
D 2 1.57%
F 4 3.15%
Voters: 127. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
06-25-2011, 07:24 PM
  #51
Blazephr
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i give this draft a C. Just not a lot to work with as far as the talent that was available to them after the top 10 were spent.

I'm trying to figure out why the heavy emphasis on centers. There's a glaring hole in the system for wingers, especially R/W. Does the apparent need for centers reflect on a player like Anisimov? Perhaps, they have doubts about him ever improving on face-offs? Are they toying with the idea down the road of moving Stepan to the wing?

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06-25-2011, 07:33 PM
  #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blazephr View Post
i give this draft a C. Just not a lot to work with as far as the talent that was available to them after the top 10 were spent.

I'm trying to figure out why the heavy emphasis on centers. There's a glaring hole in the system for wingers, especially R/W. Does the apparent need for centers reflect on a player like Anisimov? Perhaps, they have doubts about him ever improving on face-offs? Are they toying with the idea down the road of moving Stepan to the wing?
Miller apparently plays all three forward positions, and prefers to play RW. Fogarty has also played on the wing. McColgan is a RW by trade. So really, the only "pure" center drafted is St. Croix, who most project as a winger down the road anyway.

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06-25-2011, 07:37 PM
  #53
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I gave it an A, but this may be skewed because for a while it felt like the Rangers were drafting off of my own personal big board.

Quote:
15 - JT Miller, A. As mentioned earlier, I love this kid. Tenacity is off the charts. Impressive skater, playmaker, and shooter. I agree with Gordie that everything about his game screams Center. Still compare him to Ryan Kesler.

72 - Steven Fogarty, A-. Moderate risk, very high reward. A deft playmaker with slick hands and a lethal shot in a 6-2, 200 lbs package. Add in a strong work ethic and you have the potential for greatness. We would have taken him at 45/57 as well, according to Gordie's latest interview.

106 - Michael St. Croix, B+. Another guy I had rated higher. Skill is there, work ethic is there. Solid value and room for upside.

134 - Shane McColgan, A-. He is on the smaller side, but there is no way this kid should have slipped so far. Character is off the charts - this kid is a gamer, just check out his playoff stats. Very skilled and very gritty. Style compares to Mike Richards.

136 - Samuel Noreau, C+. I admittedly don't know a ton about this kid but he is a hulking RH defenseman who is as physical as they come. Could develop into the kind of solid 6/7 guy that teams need down the stretch.

172 - Peter Ceresnak, C. Similar to Noreau, I don't know a ton about him. I hope that he works out better than the Rangers' last picks out of Slovakia, but he could certainly turn into a reliable defensive dman.
Add in Erixon...and wowza. A++ material.

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06-25-2011, 07:38 PM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blazephr View Post
i give this draft a C. Just not a lot to work with as far as the talent that was available to them after the top 10 were spent.

I'm trying to figure out why the heavy emphasis on centers. There's a glaring hole in the system for wingers, especially R/W. Does the apparent need for centers reflect on a player like Anisimov? Perhaps, they have doubts about him ever improving on face-offs? Are they toying with the idea down the road of moving Stepan to the wing?
Miller was heavily scouted by the Rangers. Clark confirmed that "everyone" (assuming the entire front office) went out to see Miller play throughout the year and the consensus was he was the guy.

A thing about Miller is that he can and has played all forward positions.

So, he can be a winger he can be a center. Although, Clark says Miller's game and skill are that of a center.

So, there is versitility there if needed.

We need centers as bad as wingers. In general we needed to add high upside forwards. That fit club philosophy criteria. They did address that in this draft.

We hopefully get Richards and that helps a ton.

Kreider on his way next year.

We are in good shape moving forward.

Interesting you bring up Stepan to the wing. It was talked about earlier in his career that he may eventually move to the wing. But hes such a smart player and his game fits as a center.

Youre right Anisimov and Stepan really need to improve on faceoffs. Thats a big weakness for this team.

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06-25-2011, 07:50 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blazephr View Post
i give this draft a C. Just not a lot to work with as far as the talent that was available to them after the top 10 were spent.

I'm trying to figure out why the heavy emphasis on centers. There's a glaring hole in the system for wingers, especially R/W. Does the apparent need for centers reflect on a player like Anisimov? Perhaps, they have doubts about him ever improving on face-offs? Are they toying with the idea down the road of moving Stepan to the wing?
Drafting isn't about what's on the team now. It's about what's in the system. There's not a lot of center depth in the system right now. Our best forward prospects are Kreider, Thomas, Hagelin, and Fasth. All wings. Prior to the draft, Lindberg and Bourque (who I'm not too high on) were the only centers in our prospect pool of any note.

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06-25-2011, 08:03 PM
  #56
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Can't get too excited. In a draft that everyone says was weak, to come away thinking many of these picks are legit and will make it is an over reach. I like Miller and Fogarty. What troubles me with Fogarty is that our guys had him rated much much higher. So the question that begs to be answered is how is that?

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06-25-2011, 08:04 PM
  #57
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i remember reading kyles red line report last fall and he had mccolgan as a faller a few times. didnt like his lack of size and inability to score this past season.

he also had st croix as a riser, though he mentioned he was not a favorite of his but could not deny his high end skills. this kid would be my dark horse gem out of this entire draft. his upside is pretty high.

noreau had one mention as a guy with limited skills and skating but some fury in his fists and a tough as nails customer. given last years wwf draft and all the tough guys we decided we needed to make us a "tough team to play against" , im kinda surprsed we would go with another goon type player rather than a keeper or a high end offensive boom/bust type player.

dont know enough about forgarty to have a decent take other than i do remember a few mentions of him in some of the ushl stuff i read occasionally. he was always referred to as a big guys with skills. looking forward to this kid. seems like a really smart pick in the same mold as a miller and kreider.

miller is an easy player to like and a safe bet to play top 9 minutes for us in perhaps 2 years. there were others i liked more but i can see why they fell in love with this kid.

one thing i can share about him, when i saw him play with the usntdp against cornell in ithaca last fall, he stood out as a big, strong power type player that has good speed and played hard on both ends. the big red manhandled them 6-0 that night but miller looked like a pro type prospect with his size and wheels

erixon is not flashy but hes reliable and smart and has a pro game now with few holes. his decision making is pretty high end so i wouldnt expect him to have much difficulty making the transition to the pros.

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06-25-2011, 08:29 PM
  #58
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I'm interested in the C grades. What are your grading criteria?

I gave the team an A based on who they selected where... given the limitations of this draft. By my grading criteria, you judge based on what they did with the opportunities presented. So, for example, last year I would've given the team a very poor grade due to the fact that they took McIlrath when Tarasenko (and, to a lesser extent, Fowler) was available. This year, I give them a very good grade for doing what they did with the talent available.

So, if you gave the team a C/C-, are you grading them on the prospects acquired on an absolute scale (i.e. none of these kids is going to be a Stamkos so the draft isn't that good)? Or were you legitimately unhappy with each pick IN CONTEXT because you thought there were better options available?

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06-26-2011, 03:01 AM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Plato View Post
Haha

You've got to love the Devils fan who came in and voted "F."
You'd think they would be more concerned with their old, soft team with goaltending and cap problems.

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06-26-2011, 01:23 PM
  #60
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No concerns whatsoever. Team just drafted the best defensive prospect in the planet.

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06-26-2011, 01:27 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Devils9 View Post
No concerns whatsoever. Team just drafted the best defensive prospect in the planet.
For the love of God, get a rescue crew and get him out of there! Really, if you've just drafted a kid you'd expect to be able to keep him from continuing to pursue his summer part-time coal mining job.

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06-26-2011, 01:34 PM
  #62
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No concerns whatsoever. Team just drafted the best defensive prospect in the planet.
Your fanbase continues to amaze me. You make the Canadian teams on this board look like mature adults.

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06-26-2011, 01:41 PM
  #63
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Went with a B. Easily could be an A draft though.

JT Miller, before the draft he wasn't on my top 3, but was someone who I said I'd be fine with us drafting. After drafting him, I'm a bit more sold on the kid and a bit embarrassed I didn't see him as our obvious choice. Skill, grit, playmaking, two way, character. Kid has it all. Clear Gordie Clark and Rangers draft pick. He'll be with the Rangers within 2 years, one of the most NHL ready prospects in the draft. A-, couldn't have done much better without moving up.

Steven Fogarty, a big high school phenom like Kreider and Stepan, I'm excited to see how he performs next season. Very complete player despite his competition. B.

Michael St. Croix, my favorite pick of our draft considering position. We got a guy who absolutely oozes skill, filthy playmaker and scorer. If puts on some muscle we got ourselves possibly the steal of the draft. A.

Shane McColgan, what would a Ranger draft be without a mighty mite? Kid can score, steps it up at the right times, was looked at as potential first rounder last year. A good handful of people I know are very high on Shane, I'm happy the Rangers are too. B+

I wasn't so happy about the Samuel Noreau pick, we drafted for toughness last year, and with all our defensive depth and toughness that we already possess I highly doubt this kid ever sees time in the big show. At least with us. D.

Don't know much on Peter Ceresnak, but good size, and I've only heard good things. C.

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06-26-2011, 02:48 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
I'm interested in the C grades. What are your grading criteria?
Pretty simple: They bought into the "this draft blows" nonsense.

Many of the people throwing out low grades are the same ones who came into the draft thread in the middle of last week and said, "So, I don't follow prospects. Who are we looking at?" Hard to take them seriously now.

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06-26-2011, 03:10 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
So, if you gave the team a C/C-, are you grading them on the prospects acquired on an absolute scale (i.e. none of these kids is going to be a Stamkos so the draft isn't that good)? Or were you legitimately unhappy with each pick IN CONTEXT because you thought there were better options available?
I gave the Rangers a C. I did think there were better players that could have been picked at almost every selection. However, that's not why they get a C grade from me. Although I would have gone in a different direction, I thought the Ranger picks were reasonable in most cases. They got the C from me because C for me means average and I think that most teams came out of the draft with as many questions about their picks as the Rangers did.

For me the tone was set with the Miller pick. I had him rated a few spots lower so it's not like I thought the pick was crazy but when his name was called on Friday, it was a bit deflating. There's more than one person who questions whether he'll be more than a role player or defensive specialist in the NHL. Picking at 15, I want more upside in my pick.

BTW - I initially thought it was right to exclude Erixon when judging this draft but, in retrospect, I think Erixon should be factored in. If the Rangers had 2 second rounders in this draft this draft would have looked a lot different.

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06-26-2011, 03:20 PM
  #66
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I gave the Rangers a C. I did think there were better players that could have been picked at almost every selection. However, that's not why they get a C grade from me. Although I would have gone in a different direction, I thought the Ranger picks were reasonable in most cases. They got the C from me because C for me means average and I think that most teams came out of the draft with as many questions about their picks as the Rangers did.

For me the tone was set with the Miller pick. I had him rated a few spots lower so it's not like I thought the pick was crazy but when his name was called on Friday, it was a bit deflating. There's more than one person who questions whether he'll be more than a role player or defensive specialist in the NHL. Picking at 15, I want more upside in my pick.

BTW - I initially thought it was right to exclude Erixon when judging this draft but, in retrospect, I think Erixon should be factored in. If the Rangers had 2 second rounders in this draft this draft would have looked a lot different.
Interesting - thanks for the feedback. Care to share your feedback on the individual picks - or at least who you would rather have taken in each case?

Also, does your grade change if you DO factor in the Erixon trade?

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06-26-2011, 10:46 PM
  #67
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Miller: A-. Very good, solid pick. Love the Kesler comparisons and work ethic. Was a little bit disappointed at first but the pick is growing on me. Definitely a solid bet for an NHL career, and a "safe" pick which in this draft means something.

Fogarty: A. Really loved this pick. High upside. Good size and hands. He could reach Jason Arnott talent level (without the slapshot) but he's a long term project to get there and certainly no sure thing. But I like the high risk/high reward nature of the pick.

St. Croix: B-. Not completely sold. This pick has high upside but I don't see him developing the size to become a top 6 player which is what he pretty much needs to be. I can't rate the pick too poorly though because he fell a lot when he became available, so he is still good draft value, and you never know...maybe he exceeds expectations.

McColgan: B. Like the pick but I don't think he's big enough, nor do I think his scoring will translate as well. I like his work ethic, so he'll have to mold himself into more of an energy/forecheck forward if he's going to make it in the NHL, but I don't see him as a top 6. Could turn into a decent scoring 3rd or 4th line player.

Noreau: D. Didn't like this pick. Another defenseman enforcer is not really needed. Team has plenty of young defensemen anyway, so this is basically a draft for organizational depth. I'd be surprised if he makes the NHL.

Ceresnak: B+. Liked this pick a lot. Great value for late rounds, and upside as a physical puck moving defenseman in the mold of a Volchenkov perhaps. Underrated shot. Some have compared him to Jan Hejda. His real value may not have been understood by many teams because of the team he played most of his games for this past season.

Overall: B

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06-26-2011, 10:58 PM
  #68
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Why would people consider Erixon in this? He was traded to us 3 weeks ago, that didnt happen at the draft.
Why would people not consider Erixon in this? If we didn't deal for him we would have had 2 second round selections, and those players would be part of this analysis. Erixon is as much a part of this draft class as anyone else we selected.

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06-26-2011, 11:20 PM
  #69
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Look at the Devils and Flyers trolls who voted the draft an F.

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06-26-2011, 11:46 PM
  #70
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Look at the Devils and Flyers trolls who voted the draft an F.
Hfboards should require people to register as fans of their favorite team in order to vote on that team board's polls. You should only be allowed to have one and only be allowed to change it once a year.

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06-27-2011, 12:21 AM
  #71
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I gave it a B. I love the Fogarty and McColgan picks, and I like the Miller and St. Croix picks. Can't believe they picked Noreau instead of Friberg, but whatever. Can't win them all.

But I remember saying, when the Erixon trade happened, that I was disappointed that we were left without a second rounder and getting flamed a ton for it, which was hardly surprising. It's not that I don't want Erixon or that I think we lost the trade. We won the trade easily. It's a great deal, but I still side with my original point. Clendening, Khohklachev, Nieto, Ritchie, Sproul, Prince, Kucherov, Edmundson, Rask, Jaskin, Salomaki, Karlsson...****, I hate him, but even Saad. Some of these guys, particularly the first two, could easily have been first round picks. I think it's a damn shame we couldn't come away with a guy like Khokhlachev in this draft considering he dropped to the second round, or even a Prince.

****ing Bruins. That's a steal for them.

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06-27-2011, 01:47 AM
  #72
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No concerns whatsoever. Team just drafted the best defensive prospect in the planet.
Coo story.
They always reward an incompetent season with a high draft pick, so congrats on that "accomplishment."
Run along now.

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06-27-2011, 02:35 AM
  #73
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I think either Miller or Fogarty will become a very good third liner. That will make the draft acceptable.

Then I hope one of the two small life become impact players. If that happens, the draft is a runaway success. But even if both little boys fail, if we can get a top-shelf third liner out of Miller or Fogarty would still be good on a weak draft.

I think there is a high likelihood that either we get a great third liner or we get a small scorer. Or both. Good draft.

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06-27-2011, 04:28 PM
  #74
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have to say that this is a classic D draft until some of the long term project players pan out.

THe NYR brass did nice in getting Erixon but they could've insisted that it be 1 2nd round pick and a 3rd from next season.

THey should've landed Miller in the 2nd round as he was basically available @45 no problem.

As for 15th....no brainer here McNeil has the size/ Faceoffs and speed to be a good #2/3 pivot right now in the NHL the way that 18 yr old o'Reilly was the for AVS recently. Really shocked that he fell that far down and the blackhawks lucked out getting him @18.

The Blueshirts could've also had Miller in the late first or early 2nd by way of swap as they had probably scouted him much more than most teams. Talking to several GM's over the weekend I didn't see too much focus on players that were NHL ready now outside of the obvious top 10 players which Miller clearly wasn't. HE's a classic inside info guy that other teams would consider in the mid-late second round...but I'm sure the NYR could've sent say....Gratchev+Williams to the Wild for the 40thpick to land Miller. that way they'd have 2 solid pivots in McNeil and Miller instead of just 1....SHame...the other picks are mostly projects and will probably net 1 solid NHL starting lineup player to surprise us all but the reality is that this Draft was more about getting 1 "safe" all around skater than it was about getting the usual drafting Hat trick of 3 good players in a draft.

they've could've gotten much more and aimed too low of just getting 1 key player. Time will tell but SAFE IS DEATH is the mantra that organizationally should be part of the Draft focus for the NYR now with a large spread of varied types of players and no elite star defenders or Playmakers waiting outside of the NHL.

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06-28-2011, 06:48 AM
  #75
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Originally Posted by RangerEsq View Post
I think either Miller or Fogarty will become a very good third liner. That will make the draft acceptable.

Then I hope one of the two small life become impact players. If that happens, the draft is a runaway success. But even if both little boys fail, if we can get a top-shelf third liner out of Miller or Fogarty would still be good on a weak draft.

I think there is a high likelihood that either we get a great third liner or we get a small scorer. Or both. Good draft.
You have the strangest outlook on prospects... because Miller and Fogarty have size they are 3rd liners, but the small guys can be 'impact players.' I'm not trying to be overly critical, but it seems like size and physicality make you look down on players...

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